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post #1141 of 1155 Old 02-12-2014, 12:51 PM
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Moggie - On your lighted frames, when viewed from the side, can you see the aluminum portion of the Spotlight frame? When I laid the Spotlight frame on my backer box it seemed to stick out like a sore thumb and will probably be worse once everything is painted black. Trying to decide if I want to cover it somehow so I'm curious what your experience was?
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post #1142 of 1155 Old 04-04-2014, 05:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanice View Post

Moggie - On your lighted frames, when viewed from the side, can you see the aluminum portion of the Spotlight frame? When I laid the Spotlight frame on my backer box it seemed to stick out like a sore thumb and will probably be worse once everything is painted black. Trying to decide if I want to cover it somehow so I'm curious what your experience was?

Sorry, been dealing with a family tragedy.

The aluminum is not visible because the frame I made has an overhanging lip that hides the side of the spotlight frame. A couple of other ideas come to mind:

1. You could route a slight recess and set the aluminum frame into it. This couldn't be very deep because the frame would then not open, but even a slight recess would help.
2. Paint or use a couple of layers with a permanent black sharpie to make all the aluminum black. This would probably disguise it enough.

- Paul.

My "Old Vic" Theater Build | Screen Build | HT of the Month | Contest Win
My 8 year old daughter: "are contractors the people that mess up your house for money?"
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post #1143 of 1155 Old 04-04-2014, 09:46 PM
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Moggie,

Family tragedy ...
Thoughts and Prayers to you and yours!

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post #1144 of 1155 Old 04-05-2014, 07:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggie View Post

Sorry, been dealing with a family tragedy.

The aluminum is not visible because the frame I made has an overhanging lip that hides the side of the spotlight frame. A couple of other ideas come to mind:

1. You could route a slight recess and set the aluminum frame into it. This couldn't be very deep because the frame would then not open, but even a slight recess would help.
2. Paint or use a couple of layers with a permanent black sharpie to make all the aluminum black. This would probably disguise it enough.

- Paul.

Thanks for the response Moggie. I ended up wrapping the edge with electrical tape. I hope it stays over the long term.

Sorry to hear that Moggie. Prayers for you and your family.
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post #1145 of 1155 Old 07-17-2014, 10:45 PM
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Thanks for the reply moggie. Been away for a while with a new job. Got some free time again and looking forward to do some research again. Read your whole thread again for a start.
Actually I was looking for A/V and Automation (IR etc..) wiring if you have them .
Since I'm a novice for most of the equipments you used in the theater, I must do more reading and get familiar with them. Started to read some woodworking books though.
Have some experience with hand tools, but would have to buy some machines if I ever want to achieve a fraction of the quality of your work.

-Dan.
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post #1146 of 1155 Old 08-06-2014, 05:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggie View Post
Simon, I don't have the IR to the grafik eye up and running but I have a cat6 cable ready for that function. I'm actually using the newer QS version of the GE with has both an IR receiver and a hardwired IR input. I was planning on using the hardwire connection.

As an aside I haven't connected any of the IR yet because I'm still deciding on which way to go with automation. I think I'm just going to use one of the better programmable remotes (phillips proto probably) and a IR distribution system (Xantech) and a single remote switchable outlet. I think I can achieve all the automation I need with these components. That said, automation is the last thing on my todo list!

Edit: I reread your last post and it seems you are using the hardwired connection. I'm sure I read Xantech as a compatible IR device in Lutron literature...
Moggie.. Have some questions.
This is about automation. Just trying to figure out how you did it and I draw a diagram depicting the automation components. (Please see the attached photo)
Am I getting it right or something's missing?
And the questions assuming diagram is correct.
1. I think you connect the Integra directly to the access point with a Cat5 cable so that your iRule remote comunicate with it through IP. Is that correct?
2.How do you control other media components? (ie. Projector, Bluray Player.. etc.) Do you have IR emitters from Global cache to each component?
3.Also wall station has the capability of controlling media components or does it control only the lighting? (I think grafik-eye system doesn't have the capability to control AV components)

I might have more questions on other areas, and will ask them as they come.
Thanks

-Dan
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post #1147 of 1155 Old 08-06-2014, 04:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi Dan,

There is one big missing component in your drawing -- I have IR control of every device. To achieve this I have a IR sensor mounted above the screen (behind the black cloth) and another in the little "control room". This sensors are connected to a Xantech IR amplified distribution block and I use the 8 outputs to connect to every device. The reason for this is that it allows me to control the theater from any of the original remotes whilst in the room. I rarely use this ability now but it was very useful whilst programming iRule.

In addition to the IR distribution I have a GlobalCache IP2IR receiver to allow iRule to generate IR codes. Now, this would have been sufficient but for better reliability and to get feedback I directly wired IP capable components to my ethernet hub (which is connected to my wireless router). When programming iRule I configured both the GlobalCache IP2IR and the direct IP wired units (like the Integra processor) as gateways. Where I could I used IP codes so that I could exploit feedback (Integra) and IR for the rest.

Make sense?

- Paul.

PS The wall station is just controls the lighting at the door. I use the iPad for everything including lighting when in the theater.

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Last edited by Moggie; 08-09-2014 at 09:13 AM. Reason: Added postscript
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post #1148 of 1155 Old 08-10-2014, 10:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggie View Post
Hi Dan,

There is one big missing component in your drawing -- I have IR control of every device. To achieve this I have a IR sensor mounted above the screen (behind the black cloth) and another in the little "control room". This sensors are connected to a Xantech IR amplified distribution block and I use the 8 outputs to connect to every device. The reason for this is that it allows me to control the theater from any of the original remotes whilst in the room. I rarely use this ability now but it was very useful whilst programming iRule.

In addition to the IR distribution I have a GlobalCache IP2IR receiver to allow iRule to generate IR codes. Now, this would have been sufficient but for better reliability and to get feedback I directly wired IP capable components to my ethernet hub (which is connected to my wireless router). When programming iRule I configured both the GlobalCache IP2IR and the direct IP wired units (like the Integra processor) as gateways. Where I could I used IP codes so that I could exploit feedback (Integra) and IR for the rest.

Make sense?

- Paul.

PS The wall station is just controls the lighting at the door. I use the iPad for everything including lighting when in the theater.
Thanks Paul.
I'm having a hard time understanding automation system. Web is full of information of different systems and components that doesn't make it easier.
I did some addition to my original sketch based on your reply.
But still I can't understand why you said that Xantech Amplified Connecting Block is an essential part of your control system if you don't use it much. If Im understanding it correct, Xantech connection block is needed only as an IR relay, but as long as you use iRule I don't see much use of it.
Or you are connecting the IR gateway and Xantech connection block connected (Red dashed line on the second attachment) so that iRule signal codes relayed to each individual component (through IR Gateway->Xantech Block).?

And if you don't mind can you give me an instance how you start the theater to watch a movie from,
1. A file stored on the NAS
2. Bluray player.

Sorry for asking lot of questions.
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post #1149 of 1155 Old 08-11-2014, 06:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Dan, firstly, no problem asking questions. I'm sorry I wasn't clearer.

The second illustration you posted is very close to what I set up. The only addition is that I have three inputs to the Xantech IR distribution block: two IR sensors as well as one of the outputs on the Global Cache IP2IR.

So why did I need the Xantech?

Well, firstly all my components are not in line of sight from within the theater. The projector and automated lens lift is in a hush box, the Oppo in the closet area, the rest of the components outside the room. The automated screen masking doesn't have a IR sensor so has to be direct wired as does the GE lighting unit. I think I have 7 units to control with IR. The Global Cache IP unit has 3 outputs only one is amplified (I recall) thus it was not convenient to wire IR emitters to 7 devices in multiple locations. The Xantech performed this role. If your layout is different and don't need the 7 IR transmitters wired to different locations you might be able to get away without this.

Why did I need IR control of everything?

Technically I don't now that everything is setup with iRule. The Oppo, projector and processor are all IP controlled, reducing the number of IR devices to 4. However, during the setup phase and when delving into obscure part of the remote that I have never duplicated in iRule I need(ed) to use the original remotes. Having a base IR distribution solves these problems.

What is a typical procedure to watch a movie?
1. Make popcorn ;-)
2. Hit the movie button on my iRule/iPad. This sequences just about everything: lighting mode, turns everything on, defaults to the Dune media player input, etc. Dune automatically starts up with the Zappitti interface.
3. Hit the "movie" mode lighting button once everyone is seated.
4. Browse Zappitti movie catalog which are all movies ripped to my NAS (to the piracy watchdog committee: I also own these blue rays) via iRule.
5. Select the movie.

[if not a 2.35:1 movie I have to hit one more button to get back to 16:9 aspect ration because my masking and anamorphic lens defaults to this mode during power up]

I really want to automate some pre-movie music but haven't got round to that yet.

To watch a bluray (which is rarer because I usually rip to NAS first), steps 4 & 5 would be replaced with:
4. Switch to Oppo via iRule
5. Hit Oppo play, skip, skip, play, skip, skip, skip, ...., then play (you know the forced bluray preview crap).

The only additional control I might use during the movie is to use the Intermission/Resume macros I set up, or change audio mode.

Clearer?

- Paul.

PS Forget to mention that as iRule sends control codes to perform the macros described in the sequences above, it will use different paths to send the codes. E.g. to control the processor it uses IP directly, to control the automated masking it exploits the Global Cache IP2IR which is fed to Xentech and distributed via cat 5 to masking motors, etc.

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Last edited by Moggie; 08-11-2014 at 06:18 PM. Reason: Added PS
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post #1150 of 1155 Old 08-12-2014, 01:41 AM
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Thank you Paul. It's pretty clear now. Very detailed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggie View Post
What is a typical procedure to watch a movie?
1. Make popcorn ;-)
.......
That's funny. Not going to automate it?
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post #1151 of 1155 Old 08-12-2014, 03:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danwee View Post
That's funny. Not going to automate it?
I bet others have, but no, I'm still using the old fashioned big pot on the stove technique...

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post #1152 of 1155 Old 03-05-2015, 10:58 AM
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Question for you, Moggie


I am new for AVS and so it would not let me send you a message/email so I am asking here,



I have the same preamp and the same Klipsch subs with the 1000amp(do you use that?). If you are running audyssey what value does it come up with for speaker level on that SUB channel? if you do not run audyssey then what value did you calibrate the Sub amp level and DHC 80.1 preout Sub levels to? I have a Seaton HP and this sub with the KA1000 amp almost turned to the lowest level and still audyssey sets that Sub channel to -12db. I was wondering if you had this problem?

Thanks
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post #1153 of 1155 Old 03-09-2015, 04:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi gamest, sorry -- I haven't been on AVS this past week. Regarding your sub/amp question:

I do use the two Klipsch subs at the rear of the room to help balance but I don't use the Klipsch 1000amp. Originally I intended to but the unit went up in a puff of white smoke (literally) during early calibration. I replaced it with a Behringer EP4000 amp (using just one channel, the other is used for the tactile transducers in the seats).

I can't answer the Audyssey question because there are various components in the chain that can amplify / attenuate the LFE signal. Specifically I feed the sub output from the DHC80.1 to a Behringer DCX2496 EQ. This unit is programmed to split the signal into 3 streams (front IB subs, rear subs and seat transducers) each of which is EQ'd separately. By the time the signal reaches the amp it's level is already different from that of the DHC80.1. Then the amp has it's own gain control which I set to a fix position. I manually EQ'd and balanced the subs before I let Audyssey run so it didn't actually do much to the sub level. If for some reason it came out at one of the limits for adjustment then I would simply compensate for the gain somewhere else in the chain and rerun Audyssey. Of course, if Audyssey made this much change from my manual setup, either it is wrong or I didn't calibrate very well in the first place ;-)

Hope this helps.

- Paul.

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post #1154 of 1155 Old 03-11-2015, 09:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moggie View Post
Hi gamest, sorry -- I haven't been on AVS this past week. Regarding your sub/amp question:

I do use the two Klipsch subs at the rear of the room to help balance but I don't use the Klipsch 1000amp. Originally I intended to but the unit went up in a puff of white smoke (literally) during early calibration. I replaced it with a Behringer EP4000 amp (using just one channel, the other is used for the tactile transducers in the seats).

I can't answer the Audyssey question because there are various components in the chain that can amplify / attenuate the LFE signal. Specifically I feed the sub output from the DHC80.1 to a Behringer DCX2496 EQ. This unit is programmed to split the signal into 3 streams (front IB subs, rear subs and seat transducers) each of which is EQ'd separately. By the time the signal reaches the amp it's level is already different from that of the DHC80.1. Then the amp has it's own gain control which I set to a fix position. I manually EQ'd and balanced the subs before I let Audyssey run so it didn't actually do much to the sub level. If for some reason it came out at one of the limits for adjustment then I would simply compensate for the gain somewhere else in the chain and rerun Audyssey. Of course, if Audyssey made this much change from my manual setup, either it is wrong or I didn't calibrate very well in the first place ;-)

Hope this helps.

- Paul.
Yes thanks for the help, and that is what I thought you might have been doing. Sorry to hear about the original amp dieing like that, as THAT must have bean a spectral. I hope it will not happen to mine. I figured as much on how you controlled your DIY fronts and rear subs with some form of Deq system. I might do the same and will look into that.

I am just baffled as why Audyssey or the amp is thinking this is such a hot line or gain attenuation issue? Both should play well with each other being both meet THXU2 certs. I will be dialing in the Seaton HP in the back of the room along with Klipsch in the front. A bit of a reversal to what you have done. I wanted the mid bass of the Klipsch to mate with my front Atlantic Technology 450s and the lower deep bass in the back with the Seaton. I guess my last question is did/do you feel that Audyssey was even needed to be on? I mean, after doing all of your own calibration why use Audyssey? I did calibration back in the 90s(no computational tools like we have now) when it was a major pain and was hoping that Audyssey now was good enough, that I could let it do all the work. I am starting to think I will just invest the time and equipment and do it right. Anyways, thank you, and I will note you in my Build here soon. Your build inspired me in so many ways
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post #1155 of 1155 Old 06-24-2015, 07:45 AM
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Hey Moggie, how is the "Old Vic" treating you? Any plans to upgrade to Atmos?

-




Is it solipsistic in here, or is it just me?
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