Yes Dear, I'm down here working on your craft room!! - Page 29 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 5Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #841 of 857 Old 07-18-2014, 07:28 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
KNKKNK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: AZ
Posts: 859
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Liked: 64
Future home to ~ 760# of speaker............

Most of framing in......
Installed 2 layer of linacoustic with 3 mil poly on front wall



Then one layer of 5/8 X DW
Second layer MDF with GG...



Added another layer of 5/8 DW with GG on top of MDF for a 1 3/4" baffle face..



1" linacoustic on the baffle




Still Need to add 3 mil poly and another layer of linacoustic to finish the face of the baffle....

With the exception of the screen wall.. that pretty much wraps up the construction of the what I'll call the "Hard Build" of the room.. No More Drywall... No more OSB... No more Green Glue.... No more cleaning the gun... No more saying "another layer".... Woo Whooo....

On another note, I originally planned for a 12' wide 2:40... Lately I've been considering 12' wide CIA probably 2.05 .. So im compiling the list of pros and cons... The cost diffrential for the screen/ masking panels is a small uptick comparitively speaking, although I would probably leave the top and bottom panels in place 95% of the time.. I think it would get me closer to the IMIN look when wanted.... other than pushing the lumens requirement ($$) higher, I'm not seeing any other show stoppers.. I have the riser height for second row line of sight.... interested in anyone else's opinion on CIA vs CIH... is it worth it for the ~ 10" of additional height? What are the other pros and cons?

Brad
Jonny5nz likes this.

My Basement HT Construction ~ Faster than the speed of Dark

"I've cut that piece 3 times and its still too short..."
KNKKNK is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #842 of 857 Old 07-18-2014, 07:51 AM
AVS Special Member
 
HopefulFred's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 2,689
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 94 Post(s)
Liked: 183
The baffle wall is looking strong. Nice!

On CIA vs CIH, I think it mostly comes down to whether or not you are a traditionalist. I am - at least to some extent - so CIH feels right to me. If you want the immersion with 16:9 and IMAX type content, go for it.

Maybe there's a gotcha in one of these ideas, but I doubt it. Is the taller screen going to lead to moire because of fabric tilt? Will the top/bottom masking look awkward or out of place on scope setup? Does the mask interfere with speaker placement? Are you spending big bucks or powered 4-way masking that you wouldn't otherwise?
HopefulFred is online now  
post #843 of 857 Old 07-18-2014, 08:33 AM
Senior Member
 
kmhvball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Mason, Ohio
Posts: 211
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by KNKKNK View Post
Still Need to add 3 mil poly and another layer of linacoustic to finish the face of the baffle....

Brad
Looking awesome, I am jealous of the progress!!

I heard that a 5 or 6mm layer was better, potentially helping bit with bass in some fashion.

I have also seen lots of the 3mm post...

Any idea whether the thickness really makes a difference?

Last edited by kmhvball; 07-18-2014 at 10:06 AM. Reason: revised confusing wording..
kmhvball is online now  
post #844 of 857 Old 07-18-2014, 09:21 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Mfusick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Western MA
Posts: 21,404
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
Liked: 649
Strong update and progress report!

-

"Too much is almost enough. Anything in life worth doing is worth overdoing. Moderation is for cowards."
Mfusick is online now  
post #845 of 857 Old 07-18-2014, 12:08 PM
AVS Special Member
 
DavidK442's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Kelowna, BC Canada
Posts: 1,058
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 20 Post(s)
Liked: 63
Quote:
Originally Posted by KNKKNK View Post

On another note, I originally planned for a 12' wide 2:40... Lately I've been considering 12' wide CIA probably 2.05 .. So im compiling the list of pros and cons... The cost diffrential for the screen/ masking panels is a small uptick comparitively speaking, although I would probably leave the top and bottom panels in place 95% of the time.. I think it would get me closer to the IMIN look when wanted.... other than pushing the lumens requirement ($$) higher, I'm not seeing any other show stoppers.. I have the riser height for second row line of sight.... interested in anyone else's opinion on CIA vs CIH... is it worth it for the ~ 10" of additional height? What are the other pros and cons?

Brad
My room isn't even close to the level of perfection you are planning, but in my humble opinion Constant Area is the way to go. I don't understand why so few choose a screen ratio that optimizes both formats; possibly because they are height limited and want the largest picture possible, or maybe it is the added complication of 4-way masking.
I suppose if your viewing habits were limited to only wide screen movies and news reports the compromise of a 2.40 screen would be bareable. Limiting a 16:9 movie, sports or miniseries such as Game of Thrones to the height of a 2.40 screen is giving up too much in my opinion, though it appears that many would not agree.
The difference is significant enough for me that I manually change my projector every time based on the content.

I'm not sure why the lumen requirement would be higher for CIA. Perhaps I don't understand how an anamorphic lens works.

.
DavidK442 is online now  
post #846 of 857 Old 07-18-2014, 05:55 PM
AnalysisParalysis Analyst
 
TMcG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 2,480
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 95 Post(s)
Liked: 236
Quote:
Originally Posted by KNKKNK View Post
With the exception of the screen wall.. that pretty much wraps up the construction of the what I'll call the "Hard Build" of the room.. No More Drywall... No more OSB... No more Green Glue.... No more cleaning the gun... No more saying "another layer".... Woo Whooo....
Congrats on reaching this big milestone! Excellent work, as always. I especially like the fact you left enough room for the 15" bass modules to go with your P8s!

So what's next? Painting? Finish carpentry?
TMcG is offline  
post #847 of 857 Old 07-18-2014, 07:20 PM
AVS Special Member
 
J_P_A's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: L.A. - Lower Alabama
Posts: 3,899
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 106 Post(s)
Liked: 201
Wow! Looking great! How wide is your room, again? Can you just go wider on the screen until you reach the height limit? I now that's a compromise with image brightness, but just throwing it out there.
J_P_A is online now  
post #848 of 857 Old 07-18-2014, 08:43 PM
AVS Special Member
 
doublewing11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Timber Country!
Posts: 3,307
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 31 Post(s)
Liked: 189
CIA would be a great way to go.......for the longest time I planned on going that route, but chickened out. Definitely the best of both worlds if you plan to mask.

BTW, baffle wall looks great!
doublewing11 is offline  
post #849 of 857 Old 07-19-2014, 09:45 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
KNKKNK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: AZ
Posts: 859
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Liked: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by HopefulFred View Post
The baffle wall is looking strong. Nice!

On CIA vs CIH, I think it mostly comes down to whether or not you are a traditionalist. I am - at least to some extent - so CIH feels right to me. If you want the immersion with 16:9 and IMAX type content, go for it.

Maybe there's a gotcha in one of these ideas, but I doubt it. Is the taller screen going to lead to moire because of fabric tilt? Will the top/bottom masking look awkward or out of place on scope setup? Does the mask interfere with speaker placement? Are you spending big bucks or powered 4-way masking that you wouldn't otherwise?
Honestly the scope type viewing is hands down my favorite AR.. Thereason for the recent hair is primarily driven by the chase to recreate the IMAXlook in my little room, and a self preceived throw ratio issue...

Good thought on moiré question.. I guess that's one that Stewart or Seymourcould easily answer, but definitely falls in the additional research to dobox... The Acoustic Center of the mains have been set to between the 1/2 and5/8 point of the screen height, and I would keep the same center adding ~5" to both the top and bottom. The curved (manual) masks for the top andbottom from Seymour seemed reasonably priced @ < 500, they attach with magnetsI think, Havent priced any thing from Stewart, but I think the curved screen shuts the door on any remotely affordable automated masking solution.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidK442 View Post
I'm not sure why the lumen requirement would be higher for CIA. Perhaps I don't understand how an anamorphic lens works.
Quote:
Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post
Wow! Looking great! How wide is your room, again? Can you just go wider on the screen until you reach the height limit? I now that's a compromise with image brightness, but just throwing it out there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by doublewing11 View Post
CIA would be a great way to go.......for the longest time I planned on going that route, but chickened out. Definitely the best of both worlds if you plan to mask.

BTW, baffle wall looks great!
My room finished off at 14' 7 1/2" wide.. the opening between the drop ceiling and the stage is 90"
I plan on the front 2 - 6' sections of the wall to "angle in" towards the screen ~ 12" per side (all black fabric) So a 12' wide screen is about the widest I could go and keep my general plan... a 2.05 CIA would leave ~ 10" above and below.. while a 2:40 would leave ~ 15" above and below.

What I dont get yet, but need to, grasp is the differential in the mechanics/lens/zooming related to the trow ratios. etc between CIA and CIH and impact on brightness.

For a normal CIH/2:40/anamorphic setup the TR is based on the 16:9.
My projector location is fixed between ~ 19'6" and 20', so for a 12' wide 2:40 thats a 16:9 image width of 106, TR of ~2.25 (pushing the high end without expensive optional lenses).. in this scenerio.. the Alens uses all of the pixels for full brightness when it stretches to 2:40.

When calculating for CIA.. My "original assumption" (this is where I think I was wrong) is the TR is still based on the 16:9 image since that is what is native to the projector. So roughly a 124" wide 16:9 give a TR of ~ 1.94 (much better range) But then something different had to happen beside just Vstrecthing the image and sliding the lens into place to get to 2:40....
So now I'm operating under the assumption that CIA need to keep the same TR as CIH but it Zooms out for the full 16:9 coverage. In which case CIA would not help with being at the long end of the TR..
But I dont know the impact this zoom has on brightness due to the Iris openings etc..Help..

My Basement HT Construction ~ Faster than the speed of Dark

"I've cut that piece 3 times and its still too short..."
KNKKNK is offline  
post #850 of 857 Old 07-19-2014, 09:51 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
KNKKNK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: AZ
Posts: 859
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Liked: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMcG View Post
Congrats on reaching this big milestone! Excellent work, as always. I especially like the fact you left enough room for the 15" bass modules to go with your P8s!

So what's next? Painting? Finish carpentry?
Bass modules bought and paid for,, should be on the way...
I know if I built the wall and finished with out them I would never go back and put in..

Next?? The output flow from the "Imaginarium" is down to a trickle.. still many "design" issues to work out from the aesthetics view point.. may try the 64 or 128 bit Crayola rendering program...

My Basement HT Construction ~ Faster than the speed of Dark

"I've cut that piece 3 times and its still too short..."
KNKKNK is offline  
post #851 of 857 Old 07-19-2014, 10:20 AM
AnalysisParalysis Analyst
 
TMcG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 2,480
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 95 Post(s)
Liked: 236
Quote:
Originally Posted by KNKKNK View Post
Next?? The output flow from the "Imaginarium" is down to a trickle.. still many "design" issues to work out from the aesthetics view point.. may try the 64 or 128 bit Crayola rendering program...
Maybe I could put the TMcGoogle Sketchup design wizard to work.....

Glad to hear you went with the P815s right away. I had the chance to experience the full configuration in KBlaw2010's theater and the terms "effortless" and "incredible" kept coming to mind.
TMcG is offline  
post #852 of 857 Old 07-19-2014, 10:21 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
KNKKNK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: AZ
Posts: 859
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Liked: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmhvball View Post
Looking awesome, I am jealous of the progress!!

I heard that a 5 or 6mm layer was better, potentially helping bit with bass in some fashion.

I have also seen lots of the 3mm post...

Any idea whether the thickness really makes a difference?
Fantastic question... obviously the 5-6 mill would raise the cut off for the higher frequency absorbtion, but Im not sure the impact the thicker membrane would have on the absorbtion characteristics beyond that.. similar/thicker type membranes are used in many commercially available products..ie the original persorber used a 5 layer stack up ~ 15 mil layer and a thinner FRK type layer.. laminated between 3 layers of absorbtion... ARS has a reversible panel, that is a thicker panel/membrane laminated to absorbition which claims performance down to 100HZ with the panel side facing out these have all been measured and tested.

I've spent more time searching and reading BBC articles/ white papers/ patent applications/ gear slutz etc.. then I care to think about.. I just cant seem to find refrences or info on calculationg membrane thickness to behavior with existing wall impedance/resonance. So I'm defaulting to one of DE perscribed recepies rather than taking a gamble..

My Basement HT Construction ~ Faster than the speed of Dark

"I've cut that piece 3 times and its still too short..."
KNKKNK is offline  
post #853 of 857 Old 07-19-2014, 10:33 AM
Advanced Member
 
cardoski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Beyond The Wall.
Posts: 658
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Liked: 76
Amazing build. I have a CIA screen and use masking, for my setup it gives me the best of both worlds as a CIH screen would be limiting in my space. I gained a lot of height when in 16X9, but don't ming loosing a little height with masking in place. I think it really comes down to the individuals space. If I had loads of space I would get a CIH. I wanted the highest screen possible for football/soccer and HDTV.

James Reid:D
cardoski is offline  
post #854 of 857 Old 07-19-2014, 12:54 PM
AnalysisParalysis Analyst
 
TMcG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 2,480
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 95 Post(s)
Liked: 236
Quote:
Originally Posted by KNKKNK View Post
The output flow from the "Imaginarium" is down to a trickle.. still many "design" issues to work out from the aesthetics view point.. may try the 64 or 128 bit Crayola rendering program...
Are you committed to flaring out the wall sections or are you also considering other designs that don't have this wall flare-out? I've hashed my way through a couple of quick sketches and that's a pretty important detail to know before I scan and post. Thanks Brad.
TMcG is offline  
post #855 of 857 Old 07-21-2014, 11:12 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
KNKKNK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: AZ
Posts: 859
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Liked: 64
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMcG View Post
Are you committed to flaring out the wall sections or are you also considering other designs that don't have this wall flare-out? I've hashed my way through a couple of quick sketches and that's a pretty important detail to know before I scan and post. Thanks Brad.

Commitment is such a strong word to me...

I've been laboring under the vision of creating a little "Imin" as you know:

http://

I think.. the ceiling tiers, the height of the riser, and planned angle of the wainscot goes a long way towards creating that illusion:

http://

Even now.. sitting on the riser with the ceiling tiers it has very much a stadium feel to the room.

My thought on the splays is that it would also help contribute to that amphitheater feel adding a 3rd dimension that also "forces" your attention to front and center.

The only details that have been build in already related to the splays have been the door.. which I set at 5 degrees and the HVAC feeds also set at 5 degrees.. Heres a sketch of the front of the room based on current thoughts.. I was going to reverse the direction of the front splays in comparison to the ones on the side wall...
http://

So I think its fair to say that I'm 80%+ committed to the "Concept" of the splays..
But as far as the details or execution I'm more in the 5% range..

Any ideas or comments are mucho appreciated..... I would like to see any other concepts or ideas you have...

Brad..


P.S. since the forum change it seems like I crash ~ 50% of the time when previewing posts, particularly one with pictures in them... aggravating as Hell.. this happen to everyone now?

My Basement HT Construction ~ Faster than the speed of Dark

"I've cut that piece 3 times and its still too short..."
KNKKNK is offline  
post #856 of 857 Old 07-21-2014, 12:39 PM
Senior Member
 
kmhvball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Mason, Ohio
Posts: 211
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 46 Post(s)
Liked: 38
Quote:
Originally Posted by KNKKNK View Post

P.S. since the forum change it seems like I crash ~ 50% of the time when previewing posts, particularly one with pictures in them... aggravating as Hell.. this happen to everyone now?
Sorry, no great ideas... I am going with a simple rectangle!

Mine was crashing all the time or getting hung up.. but, over the past 5 or so days, it hasn't been happening as much... maybe I am just getting lucky.
kmhvball is online now  
post #857 of 857 Old 07-21-2014, 01:29 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Mfusick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Western MA
Posts: 21,404
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 62 Post(s)
Liked: 649
Your pictures look great to me! Load fast I'm on my desktop with fast internet wired (120 down!) and with an i7 and GPU card

My laptop on wifi and my ipad sometimes struggle, I think it's just because of the new formatting. It's definitely better on my real PC than my other devices.

-

"Too much is almost enough. Anything in life worth doing is worth overdoing. Moderation is for cowards."
Mfusick is online now  
Reply Dedicated Theater Design & Construction

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off