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post #631 of 1244 Old 10-12-2012, 06:03 AM
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I did my whole basement lighting with Insteon so I will drop a couple comments in here.

I would without question get some kind of programming device like the ISY. There weren't many options when I did my set up but it worked like a dream and was fun to play with.
Like Vanice indicated once you have that the way to go is build "Scenes". When I enter my basement I can choose my "Movie Time" button that ramps up the lights slowly from in a path to my theater leaving them at a level appropriate for picking out a movie or game. Then I have an other keypad next to the screen that brings all the lights down to "movie-watching" level.
My favorite "Scene" is a button by the basement door that turns off ALL the lights in the basement.

Limitations
This one is odd and can effect your install if you are using your keypadlinc to control a scene AND it is a dimmer/switch for a load/light AND that load/light is part of the scene you can't turn that load/light completely OFF using the scene. But you can effectively turn it off by setting the level to 1%.
My install has NOT been "bullet-prof". Of my 12 devices I have in my setup I have "lost" one dimmer and had to reset/reprogram two others. This is over a 3 years period both after surge/outages.

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post #632 of 1244 Old 10-12-2012, 06:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jroyv View Post

Limitations
This one is odd and can effect your install if you are using your keypadlinc to control a scene AND it is a dimmer/switch for a load/light AND that load/light is part of the scene you can't turn that load/light completely OFF using the scene. But you can effectively turn it off by setting the level to 1%.

This is interesting and will definitely be a problem for me as my keypad will control the main lights which will be a part of every scene. At least you have found a work-around. Have you noticed any hum from the lights running so low?


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post #633 of 1244 Old 10-12-2012, 06:42 AM
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Why Insteon over a 6 zone Grafik Eye?

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post #634 of 1244 Old 10-12-2012, 07:02 AM - Thread Starter
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I figure the Insteon components will be about $300 less than a 6-zone Grafik Eye. I also prefer the look of the Insteon 8 button keypad over the clunky looking Grafik Eye. I'm sure the Grafik Eye handles scenes a little better than the Insteon setup, but I'm not interested in complicated scenes.

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post #635 of 1244 Old 10-12-2012, 07:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaceman View Post

I figure the Insteon components will be about $300 less than a 6-zone Grafik Eye. I also prefer the look of the Insteon 8 button keypad over the clunky looking Grafik Eye. I'm sure the Grafik Eye handles scenes a little better than the Insteon setup, but I'm not interested in complicated scenes.

Exactly these things. It's quite a bit cheaper (and when you are budget cutting, it was an easy decision to make) and most people don't need any scene programming. I personally only ever turn my lights on or off when I'm entering or exiting the theater. I only ever turn on my rope lights when I just want to demo the room. The lights in general are the least used thing in the theater.

Then again, if you took your theater to the level of say...the Cinemar theater, I think I'd want my room on a live webcam feed in full demo mode 24/7 with all of the lights cycling etc to show off how awesome it is! I wouldn't settle for anything less than full out scene lighting! wink.gif


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post #636 of 1244 Old 10-12-2012, 02:18 PM - Thread Starter
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22 yards of Acoustex #60 Cocoa and 20 yards of FR701 Chocolate is on the way. Should arrive by next Thursday.

Experienced panel wrappers in the Southeast Texas area (or those willing to travel) are welcome to come polish their skills. # of beers is commensurate with experience.

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post #637 of 1244 Old 10-12-2012, 02:41 PM
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Wish I could come and help shoot some staples with you, but I guess I'm a little out of range


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post #638 of 1244 Old 10-12-2012, 06:54 PM - Thread Starter
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If you came from CA, I might even feed you, not just provide ice cold beverages. I made the drive from Northern CA when we moved here. It's not too bad.

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post #639 of 1244 Old 10-12-2012, 08:12 PM
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If I wasn't getting ready to move I would seriously consider it. Does the food offer extend to people coming from Atlanta? smile.gif. Can't wait to see the results, I bet it will be gorgeous!

Thanks,

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post #640 of 1244 Old 10-15-2012, 11:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spaceman View Post

If you came from CA, I might even feed you, not just provide ice cold beverages. I made the drive from Northern CA when we moved here. It's not too bad.


Promise him some Rudy's BBQ! That might do it. : )


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post #641 of 1244 Old 10-15-2012, 11:23 PM
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Promise him some Rudy's BBQ! That might do it. : )

I hope he doesn't promise YOU any BBQ during the mural work eek.gif

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post #642 of 1244 Old 10-15-2012, 11:30 PM
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Since the star ceiling was not in the original plan, I don't have the outlets in each coffer wired to run both rope lighting and black lighting independently. Ideally, I need to be able to turn black lights on and off while still allowing separate control of the rope lighting, but that isn't going to happen without some major rework. I'm currently leaning towards having only black lights in the coffers with no rope light.

Spaceman.... I am finally getting around to checking out your ceiling, as you asked me to do. I can't wait. It looks awesome!

Now, as I mentioned to you by email, I have found two sets of rope lights that emit black light. And, I believe that both are dimmable. If they are both dimmable, then you cold have both the black and other color rope lights on the same circuit and turn them both an and dim them both at the same time. Now, I realize that the black lights with the other colors might not create the same effect for you, but it is a thought.

Here are the problems that I am running into with both sets of black lights. The first problem is with the light emitted from one set. The best light to charge up the paint is 365nm and this one set of rope light lets off 405nm. And, since I cannot get the company to return my many calls and emails (I hesitate even mentioning that here since I have had the hardest time keeping up with emails and phone calls myself). I did finally talk with the owner, who is very difficult to work with. I asked for 45 feet to test out (to be sure it works) and he wasn't happy with such a small order. But, he took my name, address and phone number and was going to get back with me... but that was 2 weeks ago. Nothing yet.

The other rope light, or strip lights emit black light at 365nm, which would be perfect, but again, I wanted to test it out to be sure it was powerful enough to suggest to others (for your coffered areas it would be perfect)... but they wanted close to $500 for the 45 feet. Now, I have no problem spending money to test things out... but it's kind of hard to shell out $500 just to do a test. So, I am still trying to get the company to sell me a couple feet. So far it's been difficult.

Again, if you start out with the black tube lights in your coffered areas, you can always (I am assuming) change them out to rope lights later. Correct? Anyway, just a thought.


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post #643 of 1244 Old 10-17-2012, 12:01 PM - Thread Starter
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I just ordered my Insteon gear (minus the custom etched buttons for the keypad) and am starting to think about how I'm going to mount everything in the column (2 dimmers, 2 switches and 1 keypad). Can someone explain to me or point me to a thread that shows the correct (code-compliant) way to mount the electrical boxes in a column that sits inside the drywall shell of the room? Do I need to use metal boxes? Does the exposed portion of wiring between the ceiling and the dimmer/switch need to be in metal conduit or do I just need to make sure it is properly stapled? If I do the same as my riser, I'd stick with plastic boxes and simply staple all of the wires at the proper spacing. I'm just wondering if this is the right approach.

I'll have one line wire coming in to the column and 5 load wires leaving through 2 short sections of 1-1/2" conduit stubbed in through the drywalled ceiling. What is the best way to seal up the conduit once I make all of the wire connections, so I don't have holes open directly to the attic. Do I simply stuff insulation into the conduit around the wire bundle or should I use the expanding fireproof spray foam? I know if the boxes were in the wall, I'd need to spray foam the openings in the top plate. Would the same apply here?

The photo below is actually of one of the speaker columns, with a pull rope for speaker wire coming in through the ceiling. The column that will hold the dimmers and switches is similar, except there are 2 holes at the top instead of the 1 shown here.
IMG_0755.jpg

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post #644 of 1244 Old 10-17-2012, 03:30 PM
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If the column is 3-1/2" deep like the one you have pictured, you could just staple the wires to the 2x4 on both sides or on a single side with a stackit.

You can secure two cables with one staple and have two cables side-by-side, maintaining 1-1/4" distance between the cable and the edge of the stud.

You will want to run the cables through both holes (ie 3 through one and 3 through the other). If you were to run 5 though one hole you will have derating issues. There is no spec for the sealant you use. You could use caulk.

Metal or plastic boxes, whatever you prefer.

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post #645 of 1244 Old 10-17-2012, 03:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Tim View Post

If the column is 3-1/2" deep like the one you have pictured, you could just staple the wires to the 2x4 on both sides or on a single side with a stackit.
You can secure two cables with one staple and have two cables side-by-side, maintaining 1-1/4" distance between the cable and the edge of the stud.
You will want to run the cables through both holes (ie 3 through one and 3 through the other). If you were to run 5 though one hole you will have derating issues. There is no spec for the sealant you use. You could use caulk.
Metal or plastic boxes, whatever you prefer.
Tim

Thanks Tim!

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post #646 of 1244 Old 10-17-2012, 04:44 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm expecting delivery of my fabric some time tomorrow. In order to keep my time in JoAnn's to a minimum, I was hoping those with fabric panel experience could help with a recommended list of tools used in the measuring, cutting and wrapping of fabric. I already have the upholstery stapler and staples. I'm thinking of buying an 8' folding utility table as a work space and building some kind of cheap rack that would hold the roll of fabric and easily allow me to unroll it onto the the table. After that, I'm not sure the best way to proceed. What is the easiest way to measure and cut the fabric? Quality scissors or fancy rotary cutter? What's the best way to mark your cutting lines? I saw some chalk marking pencils and was thinking I could use those along with my framing square. The square is only 24" long though. Do I need a long T-Square? Any other tools that come in handy?

Obviously, I could ask the blue-haired lady at JoAnn's, but for some reason, I feel more comfortable asking my beer-drinking, ass-scratching, theater-loving brethren.

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post #647 of 1244 Old 10-17-2012, 04:51 PM
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I understand (second hand) that tearing is superior to cutting. For marking, I couldn't say.


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post #648 of 1244 Old 10-17-2012, 05:06 PM
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When I was doing my soffit, I was dealing with very long pieces I needed to cut, so I made a "thingy" to hold the roll while I measured and cut - 2x2 + two plywood triangles at the ends:

IMG_0063.JPG

I just marked with a red crayon at the edge, and eyeballed it with crappy old scissors.

When I did my wall panels, it was easier to just roll it out on the carpet in the HT, mark, and cut.


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post #649 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 02:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks, Brad. I like your fabric "dispenser". Gonna have to give that a try. One of the 2 fabric bundles showed up today. Still might get the 2nd.

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post #650 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 02:14 PM
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I used a very flat 4 X 8 sheet of plywood as my measuring & cutting table. Measured each side and the middle, then used one of the edges of the plywood as a straight edge to mark the top of the fabric with chalk. Then used very sharp scissors to cut along the chalk line.
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post #651 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 02:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Finished with the 2nd coat on the ceiling. Besides touching up a few areas, I think I'm done. The black soffit is still a little wet, so hopefully it will lose some of it's sheen once it totally dries.

Towards screen wall
IMG_1078_zps2a8642e7.jpg

IMG_1079_zps01129c9f.jpg


Towards back wall
IMG_1075_zpsf87d5bfa.jpg

IMG_1068_zpsdbae5043.jpg

IMG_1067_zps77ffcb16.jpg

Black: Behr Interior Flat Enamel Mouse Ears
Light Brown: Behr Interior Flat Enamel Melted Chocolate
Dark Brown: Behr Interior Flat Enamel Bitter Chocolate

My two-tone fabric scheme for the walls matches the two browns on the ceiling.

Still need to paint the door as well as the trim on the walls. Was going to stick with the Mouse Ears, but switch to Eggshell for easier cleaning.

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post #652 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 03:18 PM
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Looking great man, keep the updates a com'n!

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post #653 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 03:46 PM
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sexy ceiling is sexy


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post #654 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 03:55 PM - Thread Starter
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sexy ceiling is sexy

Sexy ceiling was a pain to mask for the sprayer.

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post #655 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 06:57 PM - Thread Starter
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I have 11 recessed lights in the theater, 2 in the equipment closet and 2 in the media closet. I was planning on substituting LED bulbs for the traditional halogen floods, but after pricing them out, I'm not real excited about dropping $300-400 on light bulbs that won't be on very often. I like the idea of the LEDs being a lot cooler, but should this really be a concern if I'm either going to have them off or dimmed most of the time? Yes, it might get warm when I need to vacuum, but is it really worth spending that much money? What are you guys putting in your recessed housings?

I've been looking at the 2700k and 3000k versions of these:
http://www.1000bulbs.com/product/69929/LED-8R2027.html
http://www.1000bulbs.com/category/led-par20-lights/
http://www.1000bulbs.com/product/71767/LED-BR208W27.html
http://www.wholesaleled.com/products/7-watt-grnu-par20-led-warm-white-dimmable

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post #656 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 07:13 PM
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That ceiling is looking really nice!


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post #657 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 07:14 PM
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I have browns and beiges in my theater, too. The 3000k LEDs trash their colors. Get one and try it yourself, you'll see what I mean. The 2700k bulbs have for the most part been liars and are closer to 3000. One LED home depot carries has a decent temperature, but it has a 180 degree flood pattern, and is about $50 a bulb. I went with 50PAR20 halogens. I have about 16 of them in a 18x30 x9 room. Air Temperature hasn't been a problem.


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post #658 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 07:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by cdika17 View Post

Looking great man, keep the updates a com'n!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Horstkotte View Post

sexy ceiling is sexy
Quote:
Originally Posted by vanice View Post

That ceiling is looking really nice!

Thanks guys!

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post #659 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 07:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by GetGray View Post

I have browns and beiges in my theater, too. The 3000k LEDs trash their colors. Get one and try it yourself, you'll see what I mean. The 2700k bulbs have for the most part been liars and are closer to 3000. One LED home depot carries has a decent temperature, but it has a 180 degree flood pattern, and is about $50 a bulb. I went with 50PAR20 halogens. I have about 16 of them in a 18x30 x9 room. Air Temperature hasn't been a problem.

Thanks. I think I'll experiment with a few from HD once I have a wall full of fabric panels, since many of the bulbs are returnable. I have 3 can lights along each of the side walls. I can try a different bulb in each of the 3 cans for a side-by-side comparison.

Spaceman Theater Build


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post #660 of 1244 Old 10-18-2012, 08:34 PM
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wow that is simply beautiful, umm so Im still learning about all of this but does such a ceiling aid in sound? or is it more aesthetic appeal? does potentially hamper audio? I have been looking at various ceilings and different designs and Im just curious if they can play a hand in how the audio is heard?

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