The Cinemar Home Theater Construction Thread - Page 22 - AVS Forum
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post #631 of 3081 Old 08-17-2011, 08:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

I assume the HVAC guy is using the Fan Relay terminal of the room thermostat (usually tied to a green wire) to control a new relay that will then switch the 120 VAC to the Fantech.

What kind of relay did he install? Needs to have a 24 VAC coil. One end of the coil gets tied to Fan, the other to C (transformer common).

You should be able to hear the relay click, and/or measure continuity across the contacts when it is energized.

The contacts side of the relay interrupts the black power lead feeding the Fantech motor, the white neutral lead gets tied directly to the house neutral return.

Roger,

Thanks for posting. I'm going to look at how it's currently wired. I know he has some type of relay in there but not sure of the details.
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post #632 of 3081 Old 08-17-2011, 08:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jharri01 View Post

Mario - congrats on the newborn!

Why did you decide to use 1 layer of OSB and Drywall? Most of the soundproofing sites were suggesting a double layer of thick drywall between a layer of Green Glue?

I thought it would be a little easier mounting the non-structural elements like chair rail, trim, columns, etc since you wouldn't need to find a stud.
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post #633 of 3081 Old 08-17-2011, 08:58 AM
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Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

i thought it would be a little easier mounting the non-structural elements like chair rail, trim, columns, etc since you wouldn't need to find a stud.

+1

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post #634 of 3081 Old 08-17-2011, 09:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Ted,

Does it make a huge difference if the theater door is 6-panel vs slab?
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post #635 of 3081 Old 08-17-2011, 10:04 AM
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How does the OSB compare to drywall with regard to mass and damping? It seems like there used to be some debate regarding the use of two different thicknesses of drywall in an attempt to change the resonant frequency. Does OSB+GG+DD have a similar affect?

Dude, are you made of leprechauns? Cause that was awesome!

The Plains Theater Has Begun
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post #636 of 3081 Old 08-17-2011, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

Ted,

Does it make a huge difference if the theater door is 6-panel vs slab?

Well, the thin areas on the 6-panel aren't great.

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post #637 of 3081 Old 08-17-2011, 10:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post

How does the OSB compare to drywall with regard to mass and damping? It seems like there used to be some debate regarding the use of two different thicknesses of drywall in an attempt to change the resonant frequency. Does OSB+GG+DD have a similar affect?

"Used to be" is the operative phrase. Since competent damping materials came along, the small benefit from using dis-similar materials went away. If using a product like Green Glue, go for as much mass as practical.

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post #638 of 3081 Old 08-17-2011, 10:17 AM
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The Googles says 5/8" OSB is 2.1 lbs/sf while 5/8" Drywall is 2.31 lbs/sf. Is this a significant difference from a sound isolation point of view?

Using OSB as the first layer seems like a great idea, and I've seen it done quite a bit for making the installation of the PJ easier.

Dude, are you made of leprechauns? Cause that was awesome!

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post #639 of 3081 Old 08-17-2011, 10:25 AM
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Not a big difference in mass. Definitely a good trade

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post #640 of 3081 Old 08-17-2011, 10:29 AM
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You are SMOKIN' today, Ted. As always, thanks for the info!

And now that I've completely highjacked this thread, great progress. Keep up the good work

Dude, are you made of leprechauns? Cause that was awesome!

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post #641 of 3081 Old 08-21-2011, 03:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Sorry to report no progress on the theater. I've had to divert resources to the rest of the basement.

I did clean up my Elk security panel yesterday until about 3am and got all the basement and theater sensors added. I'm almost maxed out at about 48 sensors that include, motion, glass breaks, sump pump sensors, ejector pit, doors/windows, etc.

Here's a before and after shot. Sorry about it being blurry, it was taken with my phone. I still have one cable I need to route to the basement alarm speaker that is hanging in the after shot.
I've got a couple glass breaks that are only showing as violated. I've double checked all the wires for continuity and they all pass. I've swapped the glass break with a motion and still get the same results. I switched it to another input on the ELK panel and that didn't work either. Running out of ideas on this one.

BERFORE




AFTER
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post #642 of 3081 Old 08-21-2011, 04:06 PM
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AFTER

Well that is just damn sexy
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post #643 of 3081 Old 08-22-2011, 03:45 AM
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Looking good. Not sure if you are already doing the following, but my brother had a fully dedicated HT addition on his last house. His security had cameras everywhere and when someone came to the front door and rang the bell, the HT responded and switched to the front door camera and showed the video feed.

Or could switch to the multiple camera locations too.


Very useful For the pizza delivery guy when you are watching movies/sports.

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post #644 of 3081 Old 08-22-2011, 05:24 AM
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Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

Sorry to report no progress on the theater. I've had to divert resources to the rest of the basement.

I did clean up my Elk security panel yesterday until about 3am and got all the basement and theater sensors added. I'm almost maxed out at about 48 sensors that include, motion, glass breaks, sump pump sensors, ejector pit, doors/windows, etc.

Here's a before and after shot. Sorry about it being blurry, it was taken with my phone. I still have one cable I need to route to the basement alarm speaker that is hanging in the after shot.
I've got a couple glass breaks that are only showing as violated. I've double checked all the wires for continuity and they all pass. I've swapped the glass break with a motion and still get the same results. I switched it to another input on the ELK panel and that didn't work either. Running out of ideas on this one.

Mario,

Very nice cleanup job. Having installed a couple ELK M1s (I have one in my current house and love it), I was wondering what the white box at bottom-left sitting outside your cabinet is? It looks like the ethernet adapter box, but you have tons of wires going into it...

As for your problem with the glass breaks that aren't working... are you using EOL resistors? I don't see them in the pictures, but you may have hidden them along the lines. I tried setting up some zones (in my past house) without EOL and I had some "false" violated messages. When I added EOLs, the problems all went away.

Looking forward to more theater updates...
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post #645 of 3081 Old 08-22-2011, 12:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbraden32 View Post

Looking good. Not sure if you are already doing the following, but my brother had a fully dedicated HT addition on his last house. His security had cameras everywhere and when someone came to the front door and rang the bell, the HT responded and switched to the front door camera and showed the video feed.

Or could switch to the multiple camera locations too.


Very useful For the pizza delivery guy when you are watching movies/sports.

I actually took it one step further and had driveway sensors buried underneath the driveway before the it was poured so I can tell when vehicles are coming and going. When someone pulls in, all the touch screens switch to the driveway cam and a snapshot is recorded that I can review along with the time. I prefer this rather than switching what I'm watching on tv. A video is also recorded during this time. An email is sent to me letting me know as well. This is handy when you are away from home. Next step is to also attach the digital image captured in the email. Because our garage faces away from our house, we never really see anyone pulling into the driveway. So this has been a tremendous help. Outside lights turn on automatically when entering the driveway after sunset, and shut off when you close the garage door. Inside house lights light up as you open the mudroom door from the garage if it falls within a specified amount of time.

I'm using motion sensors in the kitchen to turn off lights and the plasma if no one is in the room after an alotted time. Saves lots of energy. I have a few other rooms that I need to automate this in as well. I've been seeing a lot of tvs in the house left on lately by the wife.

Currently I have callboxes at the doors. So it rings the phones. I need to automate it to switch the touch screens to the camera there but haven't had a chance to fully dig in to that since I need a device to measure the voltage within a range and then integrate it into the Cinemar automation system.

I haven't decided exactly what I'll do in the theater since I won't have a dedicated touch screen in the room. I guess if I'm expecting someone, I may bring in the iPad. I've also thought of an alert light or something to get my attention during the movie.

Here are some screenshots of my current security screens for the two levels.





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post #646 of 3081 Old 08-22-2011, 12:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by zax123 View Post

Mario,

Very nice cleanup job. Having installed a couple ELK M1s (I have one in my current house and love it), I was wondering what the white box at bottom-left sitting outside your cabinet is? It looks like the ethernet adapter box, but you have tons of wires going into it...

As for your problem with the glass breaks that aren't working... are you using EOL resistors? I don't see them in the pictures, but you may have hidden them along the lines. I tried setting up some zones (in my past house) without EOL and I had some "false" violated messages. When I added EOLs, the problems all went away.

Looking forward to more theater updates...

Rob. Thanks for chiming in. That white box is the Elk PD9 Power Distribution Module. I have that being powered from the Elk itself...perhaps that's my issue? Although, I measured the power to the glass break and it appears to be getting 13.8 volts.
I'm not using EOL resistors. I didn't use them on any of the Glass Breaks on the first floor and they seem to work fine. Would I still need an EOL resistor even if all the other same brand glass breaks work fine?
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post #647 of 3081 Old 08-22-2011, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

Rob. Thanks for chiming in. That white box is the Elk PD9 Power Distribution Module. I have that being powered from the Elk itself...perhaps that's my issue? Although, I measured the power to the glass break and it appears to be getting 13.8 volts.
I'm not using EOL resistors. I didn't use them on any of the Glass Breaks on the first floor and they seem to work fine. Would I still need an EOL resistor even if all the other same brand glass breaks work fine?

EOLs definitely aren't a requirement... and the strange thing is, I started out NOT using them in my first ELK setup, and when I had some strange voltage stats on the ELK-RP software, I installed EOLs and the problems went away.

It could be a coincidence, or maybe the system just works better with EOLs.

I see that you have a wire running to your RS-232 port, are you running that to the ELK-M1XEP for use with ELK-RP? If you don't already use ELK-RP, I highly suggest it, but you are most likely using it based on the screenshots you just posted up.

What's your hardware backend for all that? It looks incredible!
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post #648 of 3081 Old 08-22-2011, 01:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi Rob,
I'm going to have to do a little more research on the EOL's or give a call to ELK directly to see what they think. I have some motion detectors on order that I want to connect as well...so I'm curious if I'll run into the same issues with them.

I do use the serial port for programming ala ELK-RP and also communication from my own company developed software that we offer to dealers and direct to consumers. Once programmed via Elk-RP, we can read in all the data and display it in a nice user friendly interface like you see above. We found many many years ago, all these companies were offering their own user interfaces; MainLobby, ties them altogether under a single unified interface making it much more user friendly. So you get access to security, cameras, video/audio switching, whole house distribution, lighting, thermostats, irrigation, energy monitoring, xm radio, etc. I don't want to turn this into an infomercial so I'll stop there. But I'm happy to answer any questions you have.

The hardware backend is the Cinemar MLS-3000.
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post #649 of 3081 Old 08-22-2011, 01:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbraden32 View Post

Looking good. Not sure if you are already doing the following, but my brother had a fully dedicated HT addition on his last house. His security had cameras everywhere and when someone came to the front door and rang the bell, the HT responded and switched to the front door camera and showed the video feed.

Actually, when I had the doorbell system tied in to the automation system, I used to play a variety of songs on the zoned Russound speakers outside. "Knockin on Heaven's Door" and "I Hear you Knockin" always got a chuckle.
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post #650 of 3081 Old 08-22-2011, 02:15 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post

The Googles says 5/8" OSB is 2.1 lbs/sf while 5/8" Drywall is 2.31 lbs/sf. Is this a significant difference from a sound isolation point of view?

Using OSB as the first layer seems like a great idea, and I've seen it done quite a bit for making the installation of the PJ easier.

I went with OSB for the first layer because it gives me more flexability in mounting. Also, if I miss the hat channel while putting up the second layer (which is drywall), I am not doomed to have a saggy ceiling.

Projector placing is also simplified.
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post #651 of 3081 Old 09-08-2011, 10:05 PM
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Very cool build. I'm glad I stumbled across your thread. It is always nice to find fellow HT enthusiasts in the area. I'm from the Kenosha/Racine area.

Keep up the great work!
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post #652 of 3081 Old 09-09-2011, 08:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Very cool build. I'm glad I stumbled across your thread. It is always nice to find fellow HT enthusiasts in the area. I'm from the Kenosha/Racine area.

Keep up the great work!

Jailguy,

Thanks for reviving this thread. That is pretty cool to find other locals interested in the same passion.

I wish I could post some more cool photos of the theater development. But with the new baby, work and finishing up the rest of the basement it just hasn't happened.

I did make use of the theater seats though. They are serving as temporary couches until the theater is completed.







Just to prove I'm not being lazy though...The lower bath is now finished except for a few items.







My pride and joy!



I had them make the glass tile border the larger 2x2's to make it look like a film strip around the shower wall.
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post #653 of 3081 Old 09-09-2011, 10:56 AM
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I'm so jealous of your urinal!

I totally understand with the slow progress. I'm 2 1/2 years into my build and I still have a ways to go. I have a 5 year old and a 3 year old that take up most of my time, plus it is hard to be working in the basement in the summer when the weather is nice. I'm just excited that I had my carpet guy out to do a final measurement today.
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post #654 of 3081 Old 09-09-2011, 06:28 PM
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Love the urinal too...! My brother in law installed one in his basement, and let me tell you besides being cool, that's how my kid learned how to standup and pee...!

Love the vanity too, where did you get that from?

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post #655 of 3081 Old 09-09-2011, 06:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

Jailguy,

Thanks for reviving this thread. That is pretty cool to find other locals interested in the same passion.

I wish I could post some more cool photos of the theater development. But with the new baby, work and finishing up the rest of the basement it just hasn't happened.

I did make use of the theater seats though. They are serving as temporary couches until the theater is completed.







Just to prove I'm not being lazy though...The lower bath is now finished except for a few items.







My pride and joy!



I had them make the glass tile border the larger 2x2's to make it look like a film strip around the shower wall.

I'm so stealing your bath design! Any info about that sink that you can share?

The Zen Garden HT - Move Along...There is Nothing To See Here.
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post #656 of 3081 Old 09-09-2011, 07:00 PM
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Tell me more about the screen shots you shared for the Elk M1. I do have a few Elk alarm systems but I like what I am seeing. What keypads are you using? thanks
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post #657 of 3081 Old 09-09-2011, 07:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jailguy View Post

I'm so jealous of your urinal!

I totally understand with the slow progress. I'm 2 1/2 years into my build and I still have a ways to go. I have a 5 year old and a 3 year old that take up most of my time, plus it is hard to be working in the basement in the summer when the weather is nice. I'm just excited that I had my carpet guy out to do a final measurement today.

The urinal has been a big hit thus far. I'll really get to test it out once I finish the bar area. Still working on the final design for the front of the bar.

I pretty much missed this summer due to the theater and the basement. I finally got out and sanded and re-sealed our outdoor tables only to realize that the summer was over.

Carpet is a huge step!!!
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post #658 of 3081 Old 09-09-2011, 07:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Love the urinal too...! My brother in law installed one in his basement, and let me tell you besides being cool, that's how my kid learned how to standup and pee...!

Love the vanity too, where did you get that from?

We looked everywhere for a floating vanity. We eventually found one online:
http://www.modernbathroom.com
It's currently listed on the home page as Abba 48".

We ordered the granite vessel sink from there too.
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post #659 of 3081 Old 09-09-2011, 07:20 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm so stealing your bath design! Any info about that sink that you can share?

Steal away.

I listed the link above in my last post.
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post #660 of 3081 Old 09-09-2011, 07:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IGO2XS View Post

Tell me more about the screen shots you shared for the Elk M1. I do have a few Elk alarm systems but I like what I am seeing. What keypads are you using? thanks

The Elk is controlled using touch screens located around our home. I have a Cinemar AIO-Touch inwall touch screen and many other devices that allow me to view and control not only the Elk but just about everything else in the home.
There is one Elk keypad installed near the garage entry but it's not really used.

I've been developing our control software, Cinemar's MainLobby and MLServer, for almost 10 years now...man I can't believe it's been that long. The software really blossomed thanks to feedback from everyone here on the AVSForum.

I've personalized my install by integrating our house floorplan. I've just finished adding the lower level recently and placed all the lights onto the plan so I can see which lights are left on. Just click on the room to control any lights within that room.
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