The Cinemar Home Theater Construction Thread - Page 55 - AVS Forum
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post #1621 of 3106 Old 04-11-2012, 05:02 PM
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I'd go for the "L" also, but I think the actual difficulty with the section is that the chair rail matches the section on the left, while we want it to match the section to the right. If the chair rail were higher, the rectangle would probably look "right." I realize you've already hung the chair rail, so I say, "L."

Fred
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post #1622 of 3106 Old 04-11-2012, 07:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HopefulFred View Post

I'd go for the "L" also, but I think the actual difficulty with the section is that the chair rail matches the section on the left, while we want it to match the section to the right. If the chair rail were higher, the rectangle would probably look "right." I realize you've already hung the chair rail, so I say, "L."

Fred

Yeah. If it wasn't for accomodating sound treatments it would have been higher.
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post #1623 of 3106 Old 04-11-2012, 08:11 PM
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Straight, looks cleaner. All the rectangles flow better. L looks forced. Besides it's less cuts and you are the only one that's going to stress over this. Great room.

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post #1624 of 3106 Old 04-11-2012, 08:53 PM
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Just to be different, I vote for the angle one!
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post #1625 of 3106 Old 04-11-2012, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

Thanks for the vote. It looks like the "L"s are winning.

I actually did initially plan to align those heights of the moulding. But after looking at the 3D renders I didn't feel it looked right. It just felt like they were competing with each other. Not sure if it was the different size mouldings or larger space. I think it helps down play the walls and draw more focus to the detail on the columns.

Makes sense.
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post #1626 of 3106 Old 04-12-2012, 05:10 AM
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I always envisioned the rectangle. I think the L stands out and looks good but the rectangle looks good and blends into the room without drawing the eye away from everything else
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post #1627 of 3106 Old 04-12-2012, 08:14 AM
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2 boxes. Separated by the step.
----- -----------------------------------------------
|oo| |ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo|
|oo| |ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo|
|oo| -----------------------------------------------
|oo|
-----

Can't really get the lines lined up...

ETA: that's better.
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post #1628 of 3106 Old 04-12-2012, 08:57 AM
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+1 on the L.

Inspiring work!

Chris
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post #1629 of 3106 Old 04-12-2012, 04:50 PM
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I would also carry the "L" to the last section and not jump the middle section as to uniform the look. It won't look out of place.
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post #1630 of 3106 Old 04-14-2012, 06:22 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone for your feedback and suggestions.

I played around a bit more in 3D with some of the ideas tossed around and in the end went with the "L". I think the straight was more consistent if you see the room as a whole without anything in it...but once you add chairs into the mix, I don't think the eye will be able to notice that "one of these things is not like the other." Also, when it's all black, it won't pop out as much.

I also finished installing the receptacle's in the columns...not sure why I didn't do that sooner. Would have saved me running extension cords on occasion.





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post #1631 of 3106 Old 04-15-2012, 08:38 AM - Thread Starter
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I'd like to start to work on the door jamb but need a little assistance.

I found you can pick up 5 1/8" thick door jamb legs/headers at the big box stores.

If I stack two of these together with a 3/8" gap between I can cover the distance. I realize 3/8" may be further than I'd like for sound proofing; however, the gap falls on a 2x4 so I think it may actually be fine. Plus that gap will be covered with 1/2" thick moulding that goes from one jamb to the other. I plan to only attach that moulding to the theater side jamb.

I've tried to diagram for a better visual. My two walls are different thicknesses.

Any thoughts or issues with me going this route?

Top Down View:
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post #1632 of 3106 Old 04-15-2012, 08:56 AM
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I'm not following the issue entirely, but you might want to take a look at BIG's builds. He has addressed the issue of oversized doors several times.

BTW, you are a machine! The theater is looking great, and this is destined to be one of those threads that everyone refers to like Sandman's thread!

Dude, are you made of leprechauns? Cause that was awesome!

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post #1633 of 3106 Old 04-15-2012, 09:11 AM
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I'm not 100% certain I follow all your plans. Which side will the door work on - Theater, or Foyer?

You're getting 5.125 inch jambs... so working from the foyer side, you'll have 5/8 drywall eating up 5/8 inch of your jamb, then 3.5 inches of 2x4 along the next section of jamb - that's 4.125. This leaves exactly 1 inch of foyer-side jamb to lay across the 1 inch gap between the walls. If you caulk the foyer-side jamb edge to the edge of the theater wall 2x4, you've sealed it without coupling the outer jamb to the inner wall. Then you leave the 3/8 gap, overlapped by moulding which is nailed to one jamb and caulked to the other. The theater-side 5.125 jamb then ends flush with your theater wall.

If what I've described is what you intend, I think you're good. Of course, I'm no expert and am just reiterating your plan in my words to be sure I understand. Like I said though, as long as the moulding and gaps are sealed only with caulk (like SilenSeal), I think you've got it. Depending on how the foyer jamb sits against the theater wall, you may want to even trim it down to assure they don't rub.
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post #1634 of 3106 Old 04-15-2012, 09:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HopefulFred View Post

I'm not 100% certain I follow all your plans. Which side will the door work on - Theater, or Foyer?

You're getting 5.125 inch jambs... so working from the foyer side, you'll have 5/8 drywall eating up 5/8 inch of your jamb, then 3.5 inches of 2x4 along the next section of jamb - that's 4.125. This leaves exactly 1 inch of foyer-side jamb to lay across the 1 inch gap between the walls. If you caulk the foyer-side jamb edge to the edge of the theater wall 2x4, you've sealed it without coupling the outer jamb to the inner wall. Then you leave the 3/8 gap, overlapped by moulding which is nailed to one jamb and caulked to the other. The theater-side 5.125 jamb then ends flush with your theater wall.

If what I've described is what you intend, I think you're good. Of course, I'm no expert and am just reiterating your plan in my words to be sure I understand. Like I said though, as long as the moulding and gaps are sealed only with caulk (like SilenSeal), I think you've got it. Depending on how the foyer jamb sits against the theater wall, you may want to even trim it down to assure they don't rub.

Yeah. That was the plan. The door opens into the theater side.
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post #1635 of 3106 Old 04-15-2012, 04:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Another question for the pros. I'm looking to finalize the screen size and aspect ratio.

I've maxed out my height at about 58" and was planning on going with a 2.35 aspect at a 136" wide.

I have some extra space on the sides where I could bump it to a 2.40 aspect to eat up the side space a bit more.

But my question is with the Panasonic AE4000U and how it handles switching between 2.35 and 2.40 content. Will it allow me to fill the screen in both scenarios?

Hopefully some of you AE4000U owners can offer some advice.

If need be, I can automate sending a Memory Load command based on the aspect ratio of each movie during movie selection.
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post #1636 of 3106 Old 04-15-2012, 05:36 PM
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I don't want to be the only person who responds in your thread today - people might imagine that I know what I'm talking about! That said; this conversation comes up pretty regularly in the CIH forum. The general consensus is that it doesn't matter. I want it to matter, because I want it to be perfect all the time - but the difference between the two ratios (and the accuracy of the editors and engineers who format the discs and packaging) make it a mostly moot point.

Even on a screen as large as yours, the difference won't be more than about an inch, I think. If you do the math, 2.35 is 817 pixels (rounded) and 2.40 is 800 - it's not a very large difference. (Okay, I did the math, and I expect it to be about 1.2 inches - 58 inches divided by 817 pixels is 0.07099 inches per pixel. 0.07099 inches per pixel multiplied by 17 pixels is right at 1.2 inches total. If you divide that top and bottom, it's hardly visible against good black velvet, so I'm told.) Here's a recent thread that dealt with this confusion.

I don't know for certain, but I thought that depending on the codec used for the disc/file the pixel count needs to be multiples of certain numbers (like 16) which may force the encoder into cropping to 800 or 816 regardless of the way the film was presented originally. Further complicating things (but not relevant to your current plan) is that a good anamorphic lens will expand to 2.37, or the equivalent of 810 pixels cropped...

My personal plan is to use infinitely variable side masking and zoom+shift every image to full height. I expect that if the projector has enough memory slots, this is fairly straightforward. Dealing with the masking will be more complicated (and probably manual in my case), and knowing for sure where to set everything before the opening credits will be tough, for sure.

Hope that helps...

Fred
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post #1637 of 3106 Old 04-15-2012, 06:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

Another question for the pros. I'm looking to finalize the screen size and aspect ratio.

I've maxed out my height at about 58" and was planning on going with a 2.35 aspect at a 136" wide.

I have some extra space on the sides where I could bump it to a 2.40 aspect to eat up the side space a bit more.

But my question is with the Panasonic AE4000U and how it handles switching between 2.35 and 2.40 content. Will it allow me to fill the screen in both scenarios?

Hopefully some of you AE4000U owners can offer some advice.

If need be, I can automate sending a Memory Load command based on the aspect ratio of each movie during movie selection.

Hello Mcascio, i have a AE4000u and love the projector, my room is similar to yours in size (15'x24').The panasonic will auto two aspect ratios, however you can do other aspects but will have to go into the menu for those . If you have 58" max on height then you'll be limited as far as how wide you can go. For instance, my screen is 2.35 aspect, 126"wide by 54"high and border about 1.75" times two. In your case, if i understand correctly, you have 58" of height with extra only at the width. First you need to add about 4" for the border of the frame. So for 136" wide screen the height is actually 57.87". In my room the picture looks huge at 10.5 feet, you may wanna give the screen some more thought. Your build is outstanding you get very high marks. I seldom post anything but have been a forum daily reader from the very beginning of avscience since my friend Alan Gouger started it years ago. Hope this helps and keep the photos coming i love this very expensive hobbie, luckly my wife is on board. I really should post pictures of my theater.
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post #1638 of 3106 Old 04-16-2012, 03:43 AM
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As for door jambs.. After doing all that great woodwork I wouldn't use those door jambs from the big box stores.

I can imagine your door is going to be sizable, so I would pick up some 5/4 stock and make your own. Those lightweight pine finger-jointed jambs may work.. but why take a chance.

I'd take the router and rabbit them to create a sliding joint between the two walls. You could work in some ingenuity, like creating a slot to hold some silicon weather stripping. Or go with the tried and true base molding technique.

Bottom line is why compromise on the gateway to your theater. Would be kind of a bummer to have the door stick on the way into that great space.

I recently had to decide on aspect ratio and I just looked at my favorite blurays. I think you will probably find the same.. most are 2.39.

Tim
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post #1639 of 3106 Old 04-16-2012, 06:37 AM
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Your theater progress is unbelieveable and it's shaping up very nicely. Makes me want to do a little more to spruce up mine (still building).

I do have a question though. From the looks of the pictures, it doesn't appear that you have or are planning side and rear wall panels with OC703 (or equiv). Am I seeing this correctly? If so, how are you planning to deal with the reflections and echo?
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post #1640 of 3106 Old 04-16-2012, 06:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post

I'm not following the issue entirely, but you might want to take a look at BIG's builds. He has addressed the issue of oversized doors several times.

BTW, you are a machine! The theater is looking great, and this is destined to be one of those threads that everyone refers to like Sandman's thread!

Thanks. I'll see what he has done to see if I'm on track.

Wow. What a compliment to even be mentioned with the likes of Sandman's (Ruben's) thread.
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post #1641 of 3106 Old 04-16-2012, 07:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dragonleepenn View Post

Hello Mcascio, i have a AE4000u and love the projector, my room is similar to yours in size (15'x24').The panasonic will auto two aspect ratios, however you can do other aspects but will have to go into the menu for those . If you have 58" max on height then you'll be limited as far as how wide you can go. For instance, my screen is 2.35 aspect, 126"wide by 54"high and border about 1.75" times two. In your case, if i understand correctly, you have 58" of height with extra only at the width. First you need to add about 4" for the border of the frame. So for 136" wide screen the height is actually 57.87". In my room the picture looks huge at 10.5 feet, you may wanna give the screen some more thought. Your build is outstanding you get very high marks. I seldom post anything but have been a forum daily reader from the very beginning of avscience since my friend Alan Gouger started it years ago. Hope this helps and keep the photos coming i love this very expensive hobbie, luckly my wife is on board. I really should post pictures of my theater.

Thanks for taking the time to chime in. I already accomodated for the Seymour screen border which in their case is about 3.25" wide border x 2. In my post, I just left out the border and thought it would be easier just to deal with the actuall screen size instead.

I do think it's going to be bigger than I'm used to. But based on this forum and other user experiences, alot of people said they really liked it bigger than the norm. My theory is I can always mask the screen to a smaller size...but you can't go bigger without ordering another new screen.

You definitely should post pictures of your theater.

I'm assuming that since the AE4000u will autoscale up to sizes, which for most is probably 16:9 and 2.35/2.40 I just wanted confirmation that the AE4000U will set both 2.35 and 2.40 aspect movies to the same size...meaning, I could have both those aspects fill the screen and just bleed over into the black border and "hopefully" not see the inch or so video on that edge.

Like I said, worst case, I can program through my automation software to send a Memory Load command based on aspect. I always just try to find the easier route though first.
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post #1642 of 3106 Old 04-16-2012, 07:50 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BroncoSport View Post

Your theater progress is unbelieveable and it's shaping up very nicely. Makes me want to do a little more to spruce up mine (still building).

I do have a question though. From the looks of the pictures, it doesn't appear that you have or are planning side and rear wall panels with OC703 (or equiv). Am I seeing this correctly? If so, how are you planning to deal with the reflections and echo?

Thanks BroncoSport.

I have a roll of denim that I plan to attach behind the red fabric panels.

I'm pretty sure I'll be adding 4-6" of OC703 on the lower 24" of all the in-room columns to help with bass. Can anyone else comment on this?
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post #1643 of 3106 Old 04-16-2012, 10:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

I'd like to start to work on the door jamb but need a little assistance.

I found you can pick up 5 1/8" thick door jamb legs/headers at the big box stores.

If I stack two of these together with a 3/8" gap between I can cover the distance. I realize 3/8" may be further than I'd like for sound proofing; however, the gap falls on a 2x4 so I think it may actually be fine. Plus that gap will be covered with 1/2" thick moulding that goes from one jamb to the other. I plan to only attach that moulding to the theater side jamb.

I've tried to diagram for a better visual. My two walls are different thicknesses.

Any thoughts or issues with me going this route?

I think this is the preferred method. The 3/8" gap is bigger than ideal, but probably not a deal breaker. I don't think you will be able to bridge the entire 3/8" gap with acoustic caulk -- you'll probably have to use a caulk backer rod or something.

The room is looking great, Mario!

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post #1644 of 3106 Old 04-17-2012, 06:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Tim View Post

As for door jambs.. After doing all that great woodwork I wouldn't use those door jambs from the big box stores.

I can imagine your door is going to be sizable, so I would pick up some 5/4 stock and make your own. Those lightweight pine finger-jointed jambs may work.. but why take a chance.

I'd take the router and rabbit them to create a sliding joint between the two walls. You could work in some ingenuity, like creating a slot to hold some silicon weather stripping. Or go with the tried and true base molding technique.

Bottom line is why compromise on the gateway to your theater. Would be kind of a bummer to have the door stick on the way into that great space.

I recently had to decide on aspect ratio and I just looked at my favorite blurays. I think you will probably find the same.. most are 2.39.

Tim

Thanks Tim.

I was just hoping to save time and not reinvent the wheel. Sometimes it's just challenging getting straight wood and several trips back and forth.

I was thinking I could use their Oak jamb which I would be significantly stronger than pine.

I'm planning to use a 1 3/4" thick door with door seals and stops. I'm not thickening it further since I have the foyer and another door within 5'.

Regarding the screen aspect, it turns out I don't have as much room to the left/right of the screen as I thought. I had forgotten about the crown moulding at the top.
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post #1645 of 3106 Old 04-17-2012, 07:39 AM - Thread Starter
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I built my first fabric frame last night and started the 2nd.

I also wrapped the fabric around the patch panel door frame. If I had to do it over again and didn't have to rework the wall, I would have made the whole red fabric panel swing open instead of the two separate pieces. Would have been a cool hidden door too.

I didn't document the first frame I built, but did the 2nd that I started.
I primed the visible side of the 1x2 select pine with some dark gray primer.


Then glued and screwed together using the Kreg pocket jig.


Before assembly, I made sure to use the width of one of my right angle rulers. It's about an 1/8" wide. This makes sure the fabric will fit in to frame.

A test fit before applying the fabric. I found out that I won't be able to remove the fabric panels once the side column trim goes up. So I'll just need to make sure I install them before I get to that step of the project.


I used 1/2" 18 ga staples to attach the fabric with my Porter Cable gun. I ordered a Porter Cable Upholstery Stapler US58 but the staples hadn't arrived yet. The 18 ga I think is too risky on the edge of MDF, but seemed to work fine going into both Pine and Maple.

Here's the two fabric panels I finished.




The patch panel frame didn't work like I expected as far as wrapping the inside rectangle cutout. I'm thinking because I pulled the fabric tight to the frame, it didn't allow me to get the fabric bank into the inside corners. So you can see some of the exposed wood. I'll have to pick up some 3/4" outside corner to cover it up.
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post #1646 of 3106 Old 04-17-2012, 07:45 AM - Thread Starter
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I was planning to use 3/4" oak for the threshold into the theater so the automatic door bottom can seal the room. This will match the bullnose and steps. Given it will be on concrete, do I just put down black roofing felt?
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post #1647 of 3106 Old 04-17-2012, 08:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

I was planning to use 3/4" oak for the threshold into the theater so the automatic door bottom can seal the room. This will match the bullnose and steps. Given it will be on concrete, do I just put down black roofing felt?


I am very interested to hear what type of a response you get for this question. I am at about the same spot, thinking of doing the same thing. I was going to use some PL Premium construction adhesive and glue it directly to the concrete floor. However, I recall someone (AndreasMerger?) mentioning that they tried it and the wood ended up warping on them.

I would also like to know the best way to approach this situation. I have been toying with the idea of using a stone or tile threshold - but I would rather use wood if possible.
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post #1648 of 3106 Old 04-17-2012, 08:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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I am very interested to hear what type of a response you get for this question. I am at about the same spot, thinking of doing the same thing. I was going to use some PL Premium construction adhesive and glue it directly to the concrete floor. However, I recall someone (AndreasMerger?) mentioning that they tried it and the wood ended up warping on them.

I would also like to know the best way to approach this situation. I have been toying with the idea of using a stone or tile threshold - but I would rather use wood if possible.

Yeah - I don't think it would be a good idea to put the wood directly on the concrete.

Perhaps use PL Premium on the roofing felt to the concrete. Then PL Premium again on the wood to the roofing felt.
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post #1649 of 3106 Old 04-17-2012, 10:05 PM
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mario - looking great. Couple questions; 1-do you have anything behind your fabric panels or just stretched over the frame? 2-are you planning to paint/stain the trim after your fabric panels are up??

Mike
Started the build...Theater With A View
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post #1650 of 3106 Old 04-17-2012, 10:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidK442 View Post


I PL'd my maple threshold directly to concrete in my basement almost 10 years ago and it hasn't budged, warped, discolored. I imagine the glue itself acts as a vapor barrier. As I understand it, maple is less moisture friendly than a true hardwood such as oak so can't see a problem.

Your theater build is inspiring by the way.

Humidity and moisture will vary from one basement to the next. So that may be why yours was unaffected. I'll probably go with the roofing felt against the concrete since it can't hurt.

Another option would be matching granite from my back bar.
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