The Cinemar Home Theater Construction Thread - Page 61 - AVS Forum
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post #1801 of 3084 Old 05-17-2012, 08:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Doug,

Thanks for the compliments.

Larry,

Any excuse to buy a new tool is a good one.

Mario


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post #1802 of 3084 Old 05-17-2012, 08:32 AM - Thread Starter
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I continued my construction of the D-Box platform at the moment athough it was difficult given my recent experience with them...I'll explain later.

Here are some of the details of my build with the two access doors to the actuators.



I stapled roofing felt to the top of the bottom layers to prevent any squeaking.




I stacked and aligned the layers together then screwed them together.


Access Panel Opening


I fit the bottom into the opening. This was the piece that I originally cut out. Then applied liquid nails to the top.



Then put the top piece into the opening and shot some brad nails from underneath to lock the pieces in place. Then flipped it over and started screwing them together making sure not to encroach in the area where the handles will be.


Then I measured and used a jig saw to cut the handle opening.


Handle installed


Finally, I had to mark all the center lines of the aluminum platform on the top side of the deck. The screws need to go through the middle slotted area of the aluminum extrusions. Hopefully my marks are pretty close, but there's not much room for error. After that, I started screwing the two layers together.


Mario


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post #1803 of 3084 Old 05-17-2012, 08:49 AM - Thread Starter
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So as I posted about a week ago, one of my actuators was not working. I was shocked to find out that D-Box wants a $1,000 plus shipping to Canada to repair the actuator.

I wasn't aware that them just sitting on the shelf could do any damage to them.

I unfortunately wasn't able to put the actuators through their paces when I bought the system so the warranty period had expired.

I'm not an expert, but it would seem like the leaking fluid would mean some type of rubber gasket or a seal has dried up over time and could be a couple dollars in parts.

While I realize the system itself is expensive, so are cars with a lot more moving parts, and I've been fortunate to not have any mechanical repairs costing a $1,000. [knock on wood]

Given they are the only place that can repair them that I'm aware of, it seems like they've got you cornered and are taking advantage of it's customers. Is anyone aware of any other options?

My biggest concern is getting the one repaired and then another one fails after it actually gets some use.

I thought D-Box would be a little bit more willing to work with me given that I haven't even been able to watch a full movie with the system.

Mario


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post #1804 of 3084 Old 05-17-2012, 09:10 AM
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That's pretty crappy customer service. How long ago did you buy them?


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post #1805 of 3084 Old 05-17-2012, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

I'm not an expert, but it would seem like the leaking fluid would mean some type of rubber gasket or a seal has dried up over time and could be a couple dollars in parts.

Is the actuator under pressure normally - like a gas-charged shock absorber in a car, or like a hood strut? If so, then rebuilding it yourself would never be realistic. On the other hand, if there's no pressure, does it look like it's held together with normal parts or is it welded or something? (o-rings, snap-rings, bolts, spring pins?) If you can take it apart with normal tools, I'm sure you can put it back together if you're careful, but finding the right seal may be impossible. The internet probably fails us here, as this is most likely proprietary design and repair diagrams will be unavailable - not to mention a list of component part numbers.

Can you post a few detailed images of the failed component?


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post #1806 of 3084 Old 05-17-2012, 11:04 AM
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I love your renderings and your progress is hard to keep up with. Keep it up.

When I look at the light tray, it looks like it should be placed a little lower than your ceiling just to give it some added depth. Just my two cents and I certainly wouldn't argue with your fantastic eye for this. (Please excuse my poor attempt to modify your pic.)
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post #1807 of 3084 Old 05-17-2012, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HopefulFred View Post

Is the actuator under pressure normally - like a gas-charged shock absorber in a car, or like a hood strut? If so, then rebuilding it yourself would never be realistic. On the other hand, if there's no pressure, does it look like it's held together with normal parts or is it welded or something? (o-rings, snap-rings, bolts, spring pins?) If you can take it apart with normal tools, I'm sure you can put it back together if you're careful, but finding the right seal may be impossible. The internet probably fails us here, as this is most likely proprietary design and repair diagrams will be unavailable - not to mention a list of component part numbers.

Can you post a few detailed images of the failed component?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

So as I posted about a week ago, one of my actuators was not working. I was shocked to find out that D-Box wants a $1,000 plus shipping to Canada to repair the actuator.

I wasn't aware that them just sitting on the shelf could do any damage to them.

I unfortunately wasn't able to put the actuators through their paces when I bought the system so the warranty period had expired.

I'm not an expert, but it would seem like the leaking fluid would mean some type of rubber gasket or a seal has dried up over time and could be a couple dollars in parts.

While I realize the system itself is expensive, so are cars with a lot more moving parts, and I've been fortunate to not have any mechanical repairs costing a $1,000. [knock on wood]

Given they are the only place that can repair them that I'm aware of, it seems like they've got you cornered and are taking advantage of it's customers. Is anyone aware of any other options?

My biggest concern is getting the one repaired and then another one fails after it actually gets some use.

I thought D-Box would be a little bit more willing to work with me given that I haven't even been able to watch a full movie with the system.

A quick patent search may give you the information you need:

Method and apparatus for providing a motion signal with a sound signal using an existing sound signal encoding format

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7680451.pdf

Motion transducer efficient for small amplitude movements

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/6662560.pdf


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post #1808 of 3084 Old 05-17-2012, 02:37 PM
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I'm afraid those patent filings aren't going to do it - at least not for me. I can't see the detail that we would need to know if it's repairable/rebuild-able. This should be an entirely moot conversation, as D-Box should just be nice and fix it, but I understand you've had the product for years now - so technically any warranty you had will have expired, I'm sure.

Mario, it looks like you've got the SRP-530 platform, which doesn't seem to actually exist any more at the D-Box website. Do you have any direct links to information specific to the model you have? All I'm finding from them is pictures of the units designed to slide under seats - not below platforms. There is a picture and dead link to the SRP-530, which looks like what you've got, but leads nowhere. (I can't get the image out of the website - think it's flash or something, but it's labeled 530 and is at the bottom of this page)

If it's like this, I bet you could get into it, but you still have the problem of finding a new seal.


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post #1809 of 3084 Old 05-17-2012, 04:12 PM
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you have a 2000 reply thread on one of the top 3 audio video sites on the net and you own a home automation company.

my magical powers of prediction tell me d-box will take care of you eventually.

Maybe edit your first post in this thread to put a blurb about this.
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post #1810 of 3084 Old 05-17-2012, 04:51 PM
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I was thinking the same thing. Heck, I was thinking about contacting D-Box myself and giving them an earful and direct them to this thread, but I have zero "pull" with them and don't think that I would get anywhere. The best thing that we can do is make some awareness. I completely understand where they are coming from, but if the product wasn't used, then it seems like they would be interested in at least making it cost affordable for you. Maybe you pay shipping and a small repair charge like $50. I would wager that the parts and labor are close to that is all.

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post #1811 of 3084 Old 05-18-2012, 06:52 AM
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This is one of my all time favorite threads. I've even purchased some of the tools Mario uses after seeing how he used them in this thread.

Over 200k views for one of the most meticulously documented HT construction projects with frequent updates using hi-res images. D-box should be giving him a set of brand new equipment not just a replacement part!
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post #1812 of 3084 Old 05-18-2012, 07:01 AM
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That wood work up front is fantastic! I have something similar planned for mine if I can ever get that far along. I'll be referring back to this thread for sure. Keep up the great work!


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post #1813 of 3084 Old 05-19-2012, 08:31 AM
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No bids have been placed on this and it comes with 2 D-box actuators - Bid LOW

http://www.ebay.com/itm/d-Box-dBox-T...item3a7458c6ed
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post #1814 of 3084 Old 05-21-2012, 07:34 PM
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Mario: What software are you using to do your renders?


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post #1815 of 3084 Old 05-21-2012, 07:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GetGray View Post

Mario: What software are you using to do your renders?

I believe he is using Newtek's Lightwave3D software, at least that is what he was using at the beginning of his project.

Spaceman Theater Build


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post #1816 of 3084 Old 05-22-2012, 07:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys for all the reponses.

I sent D-Box an email last week asking them for instructions from the tech on how to repair the unit myself as well as seeing if I could elevate my situation to someone else there. That was last week Tuesday and I haven't heard back yet. I resent the email yesterday so hopefully I'll get a response.

I bought the system as a DEMO back in 2007 but if I'm not mistaken it was inspected by D-Box and given another year warranty. The actuator is actually their Odyssey XL line and designed for platform use. So different than the ebay auction. It may have actually been a DEMO system that D-Box lent out to a high-end store.



I wasn't looking for free service on the unit, but I thought the $1,000 repair fee was a hefty charge and plus given my situation of not having it officially installed in the theater, that it might have some weight. I've only found 2 or 3 people with issues on the forums. 2 of 3 had theirs repaired for free due to manufacturer assembly or something. I've sent the information to D-Box in hopes that they can honor the same for me...but like I said, I never heard back.

It was helpful to see those diagrams of the construction, but not enough to see what might it take to repair them.

GetGray,
I do use Newtek's Lightwave3D for the renders.

craig72,
Thanks for the compliments on the wood work.

Mario


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post #1817 of 3084 Old 05-22-2012, 07:10 AM - Thread Starter
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More exciting news.

The carpet is ordered. They are going to double-glue it down because of all the oak it ends up butting up to.

I also started putting the fabric up on the soffit. If you recall, I went through a couple different ideas of trying to get a seamless 45 edge in the corners. I ended up cutting a slot at a 45 in each corner so I could push the fabric up into the soffit and staple it above. So far it's worked as I expected although it takes a bit of time. I'm just hoping I can squeeze the second set of fabric through the same hole.


I'm dealing with 13' pieces of fabric. So to cut it easier, I just folded it in half. My roller "pizza" knife cut right through both pieces without a problem. I start pushing the fabric up through one end and stapling them down. Then draped it to the other end held up with a clamp.


Here you can see the corner seam - sorry it's dark. I lost a few lights during this phase:


I initially cut pie pieces in the fabric where the can lights went...but my holes were too tight with the fabric. So I had to trim the edges. I tried to staple as close to the edge as possible. There's not a lot of play with the can lights rim.








Mario


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post #1818 of 3084 Old 05-24-2012, 12:07 PM
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Mario,

When you attached your 3/4" OSB to the ceiling, did you use any special fasteners? My father in law brought up using washers as extra holding capacity. I don't think I need it but won't hurt either.

I going to end up doing 19/32" OSB as the first layer then 3/4" OSB and finally a layer of 5/8 sheetrock. This should be pretty substantial for soundproofing. I needed the 19/32" first layer to create a channel for the Fios and Cable runs that go through my theater.


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post #1819 of 3084 Old 05-24-2012, 12:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry M View Post

Mario,

When you attached your 3/4" OSB to the ceiling, did you use any special fasteners? My father in law brought up using washers as extra holding capacity. I don't think I need it but won't hurt either.

I going to end up doing 19/32" OSB as the first layer then 3/4" OSB and finally a layer of 5/8 sheetrock. This should be pretty substantial for soundproofing. I needed the 19/32" first layer to create a channel for the Fios and Cable runs that go through my theater.

Hi Larry,

I just used whisper clips/channels and then screws. No washers or anything.

You might need closer spacing (of the clips) if you are doing whisper clips with that extra layer.

I would check with Ted from Sound Proofing though for a definite answer.

Mario


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post #1820 of 3084 Old 05-24-2012, 01:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

Hi Larry,

I just used whisper clips/channels and then screws. No washers or anything.

You might need closer spacing (of the clips) if you are doing whisper clips with that extra layer.

I would check with Ted from Sound Proofing though for a definite answer.

I decided not to go with the clips and channels. It was pretty expensive to do when I added a layer of 3/4 MDF for the star ceiling. I decided the variance in price from an extra layer of OSB and Green Glue compared to clips/channels wasn't worth it. If I wasn't doing the star ceiling and the extra weight that it brings I would have probably did the clips/channels

And half serious, I had a dream of my theater ceiling falling on me and my wife because the clips let go


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post #1821 of 3084 Old 05-24-2012, 02:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry M View Post

I decided not to go with the clips and channels. It was pretty expensive to do when I added a layer of 3/4 MDF for the star ceiling. I decided the variance in price from an extra layer of OSB and Green Glue compared to clips/channels wasn't worth it. If I wasn't doing the star ceiling and the extra weight that it brings I would have probably did the clips/channels

And half serious, I had a dream of my theater ceiling falling on me and my wife because the clips let go

With the sub you went with you might have been better building a bunker out of concrete. That thing is gonna bring down the house.

Hopefully my wife doesn't read the part about the ceiling falling because of the clips.

I can say having that OSB layer was awesome...especially with all the moulding I put up. I'm not too anxious to do the 6x6 foyer which I didn't put that extra OSB layer. It'll be especially difficult with fabric on the walls trying to find studs.

You might just put a little PL Premium in between some of the layers to give it that extra hold if you are worried. Although, you may check with Ted to see if the dampens the effects of the Green Glue.

Mario


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post #1822 of 3084 Old 05-24-2012, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcascio View Post

With the sub you went with you might have been better building a bunker out of concrete. That thing is gonna bring down the house.

Hopefully my wife doesn't read the part about the ceiling falling because of the clips.

I can say having that OSB layer was awesome...especially with all the moulding I put up. I'm not too anxious to do the 6x6 foyer which I didn't put that extra OSB layer. It'll be especially difficult with fabric on the walls trying to find studs.

You might just put a little PL Premium in between some of the layers to give it that extra hold if you are worried. Although, you may check with Ted to see if the dampens the effects of the Green Glue.

The Seaton Sub is really a beast...I'm trying to convince myself I need another 1 or 2 Maybe in 2.5 years after I get my MBA

I thought about the PL as well, but you're right I have to check with Ted first. I'll be ordering 4 pails of Green Glue so I intend to do a triple layer on the ceiling.


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post #1823 of 3084 Old 05-24-2012, 07:37 PM
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Mario,

Since you have the mini room after your theater door, are you doing anything to soundproof the door?


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post #1824 of 3084 Old 05-26-2012, 08:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry M View Post

Mario,

Since you have the mini room after your theater door, are you doing anything to soundproof the door?

Larry,

I'm just treating the door to the theater with products from The SoundProofing Company. I'll be installing the automatic door bottom and the door seals.

If I need to I can always add treatment to the second door from the bar area into the foyer.

Mario


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post #1825 of 3084 Old 05-26-2012, 09:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Finally finished up the soffit fabric. That was abit painful. I took all the light fixtures down and cleaned them up to get rid of the dust.

One tip I can pass on when installing fabric of this length and without an edge to wrap around is to staple about foot at a time. Staple on one edge pulling length-wise. Then staple the other side pulling width-wise. Initially I was just pulling length-wise when stapling both sides and later noticed the material was sagging in the middle a bit. I was able to stretch and add more staples to clean it up...but better to do it right the first time.



The corners ended up turning out really nice so I won't have to add any fabric covered boards to hide staples which was my initial goal.

Next step is to pick up all the soffit moulding, rip down, then prime and paint so I can hang that. That should just about wrap up all cutting in the room and the priming begins.

I've got a bit more sanding to do and then the final clean up.

Mario


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post #1826 of 3084 Old 05-26-2012, 02:44 PM
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The soffit looks great, Mario!

I don't envy you with all of that wood to prep, sand, etc.. It's going to look amazing when you finish, though.

Maker of the finest saw dust since 1980, give or take


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post #1827 of 3084 Old 05-27-2012, 07:36 AM - Thread Starter
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The soffit looks great, Mario!

I don't envy you with all of that wood to prep, sand, etc.. It's going to look amazing when you finish, though.

Thanks. I'm not looking forward to it either. The final stretch is the toughest mile.

Mario


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post #1828 of 3084 Old 05-27-2012, 07:45 AM
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Holy cow, that looks gorgeous! What a room!


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post #1829 of 3084 Old 05-27-2012, 11:08 AM
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Mario, what's the width of the drywall part of your soffit? And the width of the light tray?


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post #1830 of 3084 Old 05-27-2012, 07:37 PM
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Looks good as is...throw the projector and screen up and call it a day


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