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post #211 of 961 Old 02-12-2011, 05:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Yeah, that's the one I'd like to use over the insulation behind my false wall - if the inspector is OK with the FR rating (701 small scale - not explicitly rated as E-84 class A). Duvetyn an Commando Cloth are basically the same thing, available in different weights/thicknesses - some places call it Duvetyn, others call the same thing Lightweight Commando Cloth. The lighter weights are better as far as the breath test.
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post #212 of 961 Old 02-16-2011, 02:12 PM - Thread Starter
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I had the building inspector come by on Monday to check progress (in particular the extra zone of lighting in the soffit that I pulled a supplemental permit for, and subsequently installed) and see what I need to do before I can call for final inspection. Its a different guy than before, apparently they switched up which areas of the city they each cover. Fine by me, this guy seems easier to work with, more patient in explaining things to me as a non-contractor. Had me a little worried at first though:

- soffit lighting: worried about the cans being mounted against a plywood ceiling (soffit bottom), vs. drywall; not sure if they will be allowed, due to CA Title 24 (energy efficiency requirements)
- fabric: specs for FR fabrics need to be reviewed
- closet door: needs to be a 20 minute (fire) door
- outlets buried inside the columns: need to be brought out to the column face or side
- general: need to review load calcs on all electrical

After some research on his end, and mine, and a follow-up phone conversation this morning:

- soffit lighting: I showed him the manufacturer's installation instructions, which explicitly state that mounting against a wood ceiling is OK (other parts can't touch wood, bottom of the can is OK), and he was fine with that part; also said that for whatever reason, I was fine re: the Title 24 concern - he asked if they're on a dimmer, they are, maybe that was part of it, dunno. So I'm good there, whew, I really wasn't looking forward to ripping those all out and replacing with LED equivalents and a transformer.
- fabric: turns out since the fabric in question is inside the room envelope (after the drywall is up), they don't care at all - it doesn't even need to be fire retardant - I'll still get fire retardant fabric though, for my own peace of mind, but won't need to worry whether its FR 701, or ATSM E-84 class A, IFR, PFR, FR, etc.
- closet door: I think he misinterpreted the code on this, I think he was applying the rule for a door between an garage and living space; this is between the HT and the HT closet; the other side of the closet is the garage,
separated by drywall / framing / drywall, which provides the required fire break. After I read the code, and challenged this (in as humble a way as I could), he put me on hold, and either reviewed the code or discussed with a colleague, and came back and said as long as I have 1/2" drywall on the garage side too (I have 5/8" on both sides), I'm fine.
- outlets: they're OK where they are as long as the access panels on the front of the columns are removable (they are), and the outlets are flush to the wall (which is something I need to fix - box extensions were added assuming they would be flush with 1" deep wall panels - need to replace those extensions with shorter mud rings and patch).
- general: he didn't mention the load calcs, maybe he was satisfied since the halogens are on a dimmer? I did verbally go over the load calc for the lighting zone, 10.8 amps for all lights combined.

So I think all I need to do before recalling for final is plug an unused slot in the subpanel and fix those outlets. Not bad! Well, unless he shows up next time and finds something else that he didn't notice last time, which I wouldn't be surprised at.
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post #213 of 961 Old 02-16-2011, 02:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Took the last couple days off work to get in some real work, HT work that is. I finished building the column face panels for all six columns:







Picture of the grill guides that attach the column face panels:



and almost finished adding furring strips to all the walls:



Here's one of the concealed outlets that I need to redo the mud rings on, to get the flush with the wall:



I'll be building 1" deep wall panels, sitting on top of 1/2" furring strips - loosely based on the GPowers plan, but wide panels (26" high, ~66" wide - although the width varies slightly due to column placement), built from two layers of 1/2" plywood (vs. 1/2" plywood + 1/2" MDF), and probably rounded off edges, vs. angled. Here's a couple in place, no routered edges yet and not mounted yet:



The 3 big panels on each wall section will be removable; the top and bottom pieces will be permanently attached, so I can add baseboard and crown if I decide to.

Tentatively planning on using ball/socket speaker grill guides to attach them, but maybe velcro. Have used the ball/sockets on my column faces, with no problems, but these panels are much larger, so will have to test it out on a panel or two.

Panels will house 1" OC 703 1/2" off the wall - or maybe 1.5" OC 703. But I'll defer adding the insulation until after I have carpet and furniture in, all the panels built, and have done measurements to see how much absorption I need.

I was waffling a little between doing full fabric frames and just painting it, and adding hung panels later on (fabric sticker shock) - but the fabric panel look is something I've wanted since the outset - once I screwed and liquid nailed down a few furring strips, there's no turning back!

Here's my brad nailer:



I figure I'll be working on these panels for about, oh, the next six months.

Edit: added pictures.
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post #214 of 961 Old 02-16-2011, 07:20 PM
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Brad,

So when you say all the walls I'm assuming you are including the screen wall too?

I'm trying to figure out if I should do the furring strips and using finished trim to cover up the staple rows after the fabric is mounted...or take the easy way out and use fabricmate.

Leaning fabricmate. I can make a custom one for my electric panel and be done with it.


I'm thinking of ordering the Duvetyn as well...in the big width...

We should split a whole roll and you can ship me a 1/4 of it.
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post #215 of 961 Old 02-17-2011, 09:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HuskerOmaha View Post

Brad,

So when you say all the walls I'm assuming you are including the screen wall too?

The wall behind the screen is furred out with 2x2s, and will be covered with speaker cloth (just stapled on, and trim applied - no wall frames). The false wall I will cover with Duvetyn or Commando Cloth (need to test how opaque the Duvetyn is) covered wall frames that will be attached to the false wall framing.

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We should split a whole roll and you can ship me a 1/4 of it.

Lol, hopefully I don't need THAT much (that would be 75'). Plus I'm mixing fabrics, the walls will be something else - not sure what yet, maybe GoM, maybe something else if I can find a color/texture I like cheaper than GoM.
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post #216 of 961 Old 02-18-2011, 09:10 AM - Thread Starter
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Added pictures a couple posts up.
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post #217 of 961 Old 02-18-2011, 04:44 PM
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The speaker columns are turning out nicely.
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post #218 of 961 Old 02-18-2011, 05:09 PM
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Speaker columns are looking great. I cant wait to see how you plan to cover them and finish them as well as the wall treatments. Taking notes here.....

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post #219 of 961 Old 02-20-2011, 09:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon_B View Post

The speaker columns are turning out nicely.

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Originally Posted by Iusteve View Post

Speaker columns are looking great. I cant wait to see how you plan to cover them and finish them as well as the wall treatments.

Thanks guys - I can't wait to see how they turn out too! Guess I should actually get off my butt and order cloth and get them covered - too much exposed wood in the room, hope the fabric stage goes faster than the wood stage.
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post #220 of 961 Old 02-20-2011, 10:02 AM
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How are you planning on wrapping the columns?

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post #221 of 961 Old 02-20-2011, 02:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iusteve View Post

How are you planning on wrapping the columns?

The front panels will be black speaker cloth; the sides will also be fabric covered, some contrasting color - not sure what exactly yet - wall panels will be some medium tan/brown color, so need some accent color - perhaps dark brown consistent with ceiling and carpet, or perhaps a dark burgundy - any suggestions?
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post #222 of 961 Old 02-21-2011, 11:37 AM
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Let me know if you order that Duvetyn and how much you think you need....I'm trying to guess on how much "extra" to buy.....might as well have extra for any future stuff down the road I may change....

118" rolls, right?
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post #223 of 961 Old 02-21-2011, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Horstkotte View Post

The front panels will be black speaker cloth; the sides will also be fabric covered, some contrasting color - not sure what exactly yet - wall panels will be some medium tan/brown color, so need some accent color - perhaps dark brown consistent with ceiling and carpet, or perhaps a dark burgundy - any suggestions?

Color scheme? Me?? no way. Heck I am having a hard time envisioning a color scheme in my own space.

I was asking more to find out how you were planning to attach the fabric to those columns and still hide the staples? Especially on the vertial parts

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post #224 of 961 Old 02-21-2011, 07:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HuskerOmaha View Post

Let me know if you order that Duvetyn and how much you think you need....I'm trying to guess on how much "extra" to buy.....might as well have extra for any future stuff down the road I may change....

118" rolls, right?

Will do Greg - yeah most likely the wide cloth, so I can do the "behind the screen" wall without a seam.

I started using CutList to tally up how much material I need with a minimum of waste. Seen that program? I used it to lay out my panel cuts for the LP THT.

Quote:
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I was asking more to find out how you were planning to attach the fabric to those columns and still hide the staples

ah, got it. I am going to take down the columns (they attach to vertical rails on the walls via a few screws), remove the face panels, then on each side, I will staple the cloth to the back of the sides, wrap around the outside, over the front lip, and staple to the inside of that side - when the face panels are put back, they will cover those staples.
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post #225 of 961 Old 02-23-2011, 11:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Here are some pictures of the fabric frames as they stand (test fitted, but still need fine tuning on size, routing, and sanding). Note that the panels generally run the full width between columns, but the center braces make them look like smaller panels.

back:


front:



left:



right:



The panel for the Grafik Eye was a little tricky:



Wasn't sure what to do with the entry door frame - decided to mount a sheet (will be covered with black fabric) within the door frame, and flush mount the panels against the edge. If it turns out OK, I'll skip adding trim.



The closet door frame had to be handled a bit differently - I ran the furring (and will run the panels) up to the door frame, and will add an MDF strip to extend the door frame up to the panels.



not done with bottom panels (will add after carpet goes in, so I get the height right - or I guess I can do sooner, and leave it high, since I will need to add baseboard anyway):



A couple color schemes I'm considering - tan scheme, which is my front runner:



rust/red color scheme, which I also like - but I've seen so many red theaters, I think I'd prefer to have something different:



Testing to see if flash shows OC 703 / wood through fabric (Duvetyn) - doesn't appear to:



some GoM samples I'm considering (all are lighter than reality due to flash):



I would love to find a FR fabric GoM alternative in a similar color, but having a hard time coming up with on. Just really not looking forward to shelling out $1000 on fabric.
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post #226 of 961 Old 02-24-2011, 11:13 AM
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I am really interested to see your panels. From your photos of the walls you plan to hang them from the cross board. Is that correct?

Still not sure if I will do something similar or just go with a few 2'x4' acoustic panels on the wall between my pillars.
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post #227 of 961 Old 02-24-2011, 12:29 PM - Thread Starter
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I am really interested to see your panels. From your photos of the walls you plan to hang them from the cross board. Is that correct?

Not sure if by cross board you meant the vertical bracing in the big panels or the horizontal furring strips. The furring strips run exactly behind all the frames (except for the cross braces) - they will be attached in all four corners, and top and bottom at the mid way points (at least).
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post #228 of 961 Old 02-24-2011, 12:46 PM
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Keeping me on my toes, your not far behind me.

I was going to panel my doors, and I still may for v 2.0, but for now I am doing the same thing. Panel right to the edge of the jamb, and I am painting my jamb black, same as what I will paint the door.

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post #229 of 961 Old 02-24-2011, 12:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Yeah, I kind of prefer the look of the doors vs. trying to disguise them honestly - although it will be interesting to see what impact that may have on treatments in the rear of the room. I'll leave them untreated at least initially, and decide what I want to do if it is a problem - attach panels, or temporary movable panels, or who knows.

I need to paint the bit of the jamb black too - the plywood panels that cover most of the jamb will be covered with black fabric and then brad nailed / liquid nailed up. Problem is every time I think of painting the jamb, its late afternoon at least, and of course, I need to leave the doors open while the paint in the jamb dries (which of course I can't do overnight, since its open to the outside - need to have it dry before the dew point hits). Need to plan ahead better.
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post #230 of 961 Old 02-25-2011, 09:58 AM
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Looking good Brad! Still moving right along...

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post #231 of 961 Old 02-25-2011, 10:11 AM
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...
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Absolutely amazing! looking very good Brad.

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post #232 of 961 Old 02-25-2011, 10:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys for the kind words, and for continuing to check in on me.
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post #233 of 961 Old 02-25-2011, 02:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Finished 3 more panels during my lunch break (telecommuting today).

Only 9 more to go!

Then I get to trim them, sand them, route the edges, and finalize the installation! Not to mention add fabric and treatments.
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post #234 of 961 Old 02-27-2011, 08:21 PM
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Looks great Brad! Buy plenty of staples

If I had it to do all over again, I'd still hit that shot.
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post #235 of 961 Old 02-27-2011, 08:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Jeff! I sure am looking forward to the post sawdust and drywall dust everywhere stage - the HT and garage are a complete mess. When I took down the columns and wall panels to get them ready for fabric, I really started to run out of room to operate. The room looked naked without the columns up, I had really gotten used to them.

So I guess that box of 5000 staples I bought isn't going to last very long eh... Did you have any issues with plywood splitting when stapled into? I guess I'll find out soon.

I got my panels all routed and sanded, and I hung all but the back wall back up, using speaker grill ball and socket connectors (six per panel for the wide panels) - seem to hold OK, but I'll probably need to add a bit of Velcro too - but the grill guides should keep the panels lined up properly. Need to buy a few more packs though, almost out of them.
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post #236 of 961 Old 02-28-2011, 06:38 AM
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5000 staples probably won't getter done you shold have no issues with the ply blowin out. Also you may want to lay out a sheet of ply and wrap with plastic as a work surface when you are wrapping your frames. This allows for a slippery surface to spin the frames around when stapling and easy to keep clean.

Good luck!

Edit- Oh yea one more tip, get yourself some of those sticky 3M lint rollers. These work great to clean up the frame prior to hanging.

If I had it to do all over again, I'd still hit that shot.
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post #237 of 961 Old 02-28-2011, 08:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Jeff! I'll remember that wrapped plastic work surface idea. Where would I get that lint roller - Target maybe? I'll check the online stores...
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post #238 of 961 Old 02-28-2011, 08:23 AM
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Quote:
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Thanks Jeff! I'll remember that wrapped plastic work surface idea. Where would I get that lint roller - Target maybe? I'll check the online stores...

Yea target walmart etc. I actually just picked up a 3 pack from menards, i suspect home depot would have too. And these are Scotch and not 3M like i.mentioned

If I had it to do all over again, I'd still hit that shot.
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post #239 of 961 Old 02-28-2011, 11:45 AM
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Those lint rollers are a must, especially if you are using black fabric.

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post #240 of 961 Old 02-28-2011, 11:55 AM
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Works good on.my pool table too

If I had it to do all over again, I'd still hit that shot.
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