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post #1 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 01:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Well, I wanted to get my layout drawing in a thread and figured it might be a good idea to start my build thread at the same time. The process will be slow right now but I'm getting very anxious to start it which means the itch will take over very shortly

Here is the layout of my planned speaker/seating/screen placement. Each square in the layout represents (1) foot...



I am not 100% sure what I will be doing for the LFE department but have a few ideas (THTLP or IB).

The room is gutted right now with a bare wooden floor suspended over concrete. The ceiling is a drop ceiling only 6.5 ft high. The right side wall and screen wall have the basement concrete walls behind them and the left and rear walls have the rest of the basement behind those. I believe the walls are made from 1/2 or 3/8 drywall over studs because the room was the previous owners man cave so I'm sure it's nothing special. I'm not sure if I should do another layer of drywall with greenglue in between or what, that's one of the areas where I you guys won't mind coming in to play. I don't need the room to be sound proof, although I'm sure it will help. Mainly, I just want the room to be a nice solid room for some nice solid surround sound

I plan on using a Panasonic 4000 projector throwing an image on a CIH screen and probably DIY 6.1 in-wall speakers (still in the air though). I guess I'm looking for things you see that might be a problem and things you think I am missing. I'm fairly new to the HT game but have been doing my research like crazy!

I'm looking forward to posting my progress and for any help you guys throw at me along the way. I will take pictures in the next few days of my actual room and we will go from there

To be continued...
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post #2 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 05:36 AM
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As shown your per chair width is 22.5 inches. Not sure what chairs you are planning but that seems really tight.

You have a 10.5 wide room less 3 ft for your aisles leaving 90 inches of width for four chairs.

If you want 4 comfortable HT seats you might consider running your space with the screen on one of the long walls and going with a 9.5 ft viewing distance.
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post #3 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 06:07 AM
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Big always has good comments.

When I saw your diagram in the other forum I noticed the very narrow chairs too. My room that you were in is 9 x 12 just for reference. I think if you do turn the room 90 degrees, you might only be able to go 5.1 since you won't be able to get the rear surround far enough away.

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post #4 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 06:26 AM
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If you must have 4 chairs across using your layout you may want to consider either new or used "real" theater seats. One resource is seatsandchairs.com.

This model is 92 inches wide for 4 seats.

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post #5 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 06:37 AM
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Couches work too...if you dont mind being snuggled up close to all your guests.

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post #6 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 09:57 AM
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Wow, you're freakin me out. I have exactly the same room dimensions and setup. Right down to the concrete walls, ceiling height and rest of the basement. It's like you've seen my actual basement. I've been hearing noises lately, but I just assumed it was chipmunks . I will be watching this thread with great interest. I am not quite ready to start on mine yet, but you can check out my layout in my thread. Subscribed. Good luck.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1287850
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post #7 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 02:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

If you must have 4 chairs across using your layout you may want to consider either new or used "real" theater seats. One resource is seatsandchairs.com.

This model is 92 inches wide for 4 seats.


No faith, lol. These are what I was planning to use for a row of 4...

http://seatsandchairs.com/home-theat...6&idcategory=4

I have done mucho planning and research, not saying everything is correct though ;-)

I will add more of my ideas tonight. Thanks for the feedback so far!
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post #8 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 04:29 PM
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That is a nice looking chair. I see they are on sale.

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post #9 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 04:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital_Chris View Post

probably DIY 6.1 in-wall speakers

You will probably want dipole surrounds since you will be sitting so close.
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post #10 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 06:12 PM
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You should also check the small theater build thread (look at my bottom sig) for other ideas. You might find more inspiration there.

I'd also echo the others' sentiment- forgo the 14ft throw and fire the panny from 10.5ft. It will make the room a lot more open in feel. The max screen size appears to be 92-97"

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post #11 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 06:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by victor-eyd View Post

You should also check the small theater build thread (look at my bottom sig) for other ideas. You might find more inspiration there.

I'd also echo the others' sentiment- forgo the 14ft throw and fire the panny from 10.5ft. It will make the room a lot more open in feel. The max screen size appears to be 92-97"

Victor

I will take a look around the small theater builds more, seeing others builds always gives me ideas

Also, do you mean the max screen size for my planned seating distance?
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post #12 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 07:05 PM - Thread Starter
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So it looks like I can sit around 10-11 ft, have plenty of room in the back, make my screen around 95" and maybe just do a set of 3 seats (so badly wanted 4 though). As far as sitting at 10 ft, I'm just afraid of seeing pixels like I would if I sat about 5-6 feet from my 58" plasma.. hmm.

The only things THX doesn't say is what size a CIH screen should be at a given seating distance

I think that by using the panny projector though, I might not have any problems, but still worried..
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post #13 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 08:01 PM
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I like sitting 1.12x the screen width from my 2.37:1 CIH screen. (130 inches from a 116 wide screen). Measured to the eyeball. I have a 1080P DLP and use a lens for 2.35, pixels are a non issue. One of the best recommendations on screen size is to get the projector and shine it on the wall. Play with various sizes until you are 100% certain of what size screen to buy/make.

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post #14 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 08:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the diagram, but how do I read the numbers? The diagram doesn't quite make sense to me... Sorry, I don't meant to seem to ignorant :-/

Alright, I've done a little more thinking. It would be a stretch from what I originally planned but shouldn't be toooo bad to pull off .... I COULD extend the rear wall out to around 18', that should leave me plenty of room for (2) rows of (3) seats, I just got to make sure that the projected image will clear heads in the back row. I think I'm going to order (1) seat for now so I can do some mockups, get an idea for how high the riser would have to be, etc.

Tomorrow I should be able to post some pics of my room and surroundings
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post #15 of 300 Old 11-17-2010, 08:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital_Chris View Post

but how do I read the numbers? The diagram doesn't quite make sense to me... Sorry, I don't meant to seem to ignorant

the diagram is a 2.39:1 screen reference. Then w= width and h=height.

sitting 1.2 x screen width from the screen seems to be the sweet spot. I sit a tad closer.
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post #16 of 300 Old 11-19-2010, 10:13 PM - Thread Starter
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I still don't understand what the width and height dimensions are for and if they're in feet or meters... either way, I don't have much leeway anyway so my seating and screen size is limited

Since I'm throwing around the idea of extending the rear wall out about 4 feet in order to fit 2 rows, what is the basic setup for the rear surrounds? (Not the 6th speaker, but the side/rears). Would it be above and slightly behing the rear viewers heads? I would like the surround effects to be similiar in both rows, it it possible?

Tomorrow I will also post up the shots I took of my room. Stay tuned
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post #17 of 300 Old 11-20-2010, 05:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital_Chris View Post

I still don't understand what the width and height dimensions are for and if they're in feet or meters

Look at Big's picture again. This shows how far the sweet spot is away from the screen wall based on how big the screen is.

His example is for a screen that is 2.39:1. Meaning for every inch tall the screen is, it is 2.39 inches wide (you probably understand that part).

Look at the 20th Century Fox ideal. 1.21 w 2.89 h

All that is saying is that the distance from the face of the screen to your eyeball should be 1.21 times the width of the screen or 2.89 times the heigth. They will both come out to the same number if you are using a 2.39 screen.

If you screen is 100 inches wide (note actual width, not diagonal measurement) than according to Centruy Fox, you would want your eyeball 121 inches from the screen.

You can then reverse this if you have a set seating distance and want to figure out a screen size. If your eyeballs will be 9' (108") from the screen then you would take 108/1.21 = 89.3" wide screen.

Most important: 1.21 is 20th Century's idea of ideal and may not be yours. (It isn't mine). I would HIGHLY suggest getting a projector that allows for some zoom and view it on a wall before buying a screen.

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post #18 of 300 Old 11-21-2010, 12:08 AM - Thread Starter
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So the numbers provided are for multiplying them to the screen size to get your seating distance. Understood, thank you
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post #19 of 300 Old 12-05-2010, 02:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok, so I'm about ready to start ripping that back wall down and extending the room a bit. But, before I do, I wanted someones opinion on if that would definitely be an ok idea or not. I just don't want the new size room to be acoustically "worse" than before or have it harder to place my speakers to sound right for both rows. Right now it's about 14 x 10.5, the new size will be about 18 x 10.5

Any thoughts?
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post #20 of 300 Old 12-05-2010, 02:32 PM
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As long as you are not taking down a load bearing wall, I think you will be better off space-wise and sound-wise, IMO. Makes sense to maximize your room when you will be putting a bunch of work into it.

Current HT: HTPC-->Epson 5010 projector-->135" screen, BFM TLAHs x7 & THT
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post #21 of 300 Old 12-05-2010, 04:11 PM - Thread Starter
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No, it's not a load bearing wall. I just want to make sure I'm not making it into a "no-no" shaped room (example, square room). I also want to make sure that the room isn't too long for it's width and that I can still setup a good surround sound field in it.
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post #22 of 300 Old 12-13-2010, 02:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Well it looks like my room will be an appropriate size according to a calculation I found of W = 1.6 x H and L = 2.6 x H. My ceiling will be about 7' so a width of 10.5' and length of 18' should work out well. I'm kind of relieved. Now I can have 2 rows of 3 seats :-)

I'm also thinking of swapping the room around and have my screen on the opposite wall, then I can do some IB's below the screen.

Hmm..
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post #23 of 300 Old 01-10-2011, 01:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Quick update!

Today I started gutting the room. I took down the drop ceiling so I can do sheetrock instead for a taller room, removed all of the old sheetrock and insulation from the walls to remove some old wiring and prepare for new. I also plan on taking down the wall this week and put up the new.

Here are a few of my current ideas and questions...

1st, would it be a good idea to use XPS (blue board/pink board) or Polyisocyanurate vs cotton candy insulation? I heard it's a bit better for sound proofing and a hell of a lot less itchy when istalling

2nd, I have no idea where I am going to put the new door, was hoping for a few ideas once I post pics. My options are a bit limited but advice is welcome.

Last for now, I will skim through the construction ideas in the mean time, but the room right now is just 2x4's, 16 on center I think, and I don't have the option to do staggared beams on the other three walls but would it be a good idea to do a staggared setup on the new wall especially since my new plan for sub's is an IB setup?

I will post pictures this week, stay tuned!
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post #24 of 300 Old 01-10-2011, 05:29 AM
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Chris, rigid insulation is what you want against concrete basement walls because fiberglass there promotes mold growth. Fiberglass is used for sound isolation between staggered and double walls...and also between joists in the ceiling.

For example, in my basement I have rigid insulation against the concrete walls, then 2x4s an inch away filled with R11 fiberglass, then DD/GG, then I will have fiberglass on the inside walls for sound absorption.

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post #25 of 300 Old 01-10-2011, 06:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Good to know, the previous owners has the room built with fiberglass insulation all the way around when 2 of the walls are against concrete. So, do I need rigid insulation along with fiberglass on the concrete walls or just the rigid stuff? Also, when I do drywall, since 2 of the walls are against concrete, do I need to do the whole DD/GG/Clips on those 2 walls as well?
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post #26 of 300 Old 01-11-2011, 05:51 AM
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Against the concrete walls, you want the rigid foam glued right to the concrete. Then frame up a 2x4 wall 1" away from the foam. Use tapcons or the Ramset nails to secure the bottom (sole plate) 2x4. The top 2x4 is secured to your joists using DC-04s. This decouples the 2x4 wall from the concrete wall and your joists. You will not need clips/channels for the wall. Then use R-11 or R-13 in between the studs of the 2x4 wall and add DD/GG. The fiberglass is for dampening the air space and absorbing sound between the two walls. So, you want both rigid foam and fiberglass, but in different places.

On your other walls not against concrete, I'd call Ted. It depends if they are existing or not. You are best to remove at least the drywall from an existing wall so it can be decoupled with clips/channels since the framing is already attached to the joists.

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post #27 of 300 Old 01-11-2011, 09:35 AM
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I must have missed it, but why the change from 14' to 18' in length?

If you are going to use the Panny 4000, don't worry about seeing pixels. With the smooth screen (or whatever they call it) masking the pixels, you would be hard pressed to see SDE at anything other than truly absurdly close viewing distances.

I too like those red chairs. I actually wanted to add a number of those for our back row, but it was denied by the War Dept.

The name of your theater makes me think of the royal heckling anyone gets when their cell phone goes off in the middle of a movie at my place

-Suntan
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post #28 of 300 Old 01-11-2011, 11:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suntan View Post

I must have missed it, but why the change from 14' to 18' in length?

I'm going from 14 -18 ft so I can fit 2 rows of 3 seats. Originally I wanted to do a row of 4 even though I knew they would be a little close to the side walls for good surround but wanted more than 3 so I decided to make the room bigger in order to fit more than just a couple of seats

Quote:
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The name of your theater makes me think of the royal heckling anyone gets when their cell phone goes off in the middle of a movie at my place

-Suntan

Lol, damn cell phones ruin a good movie
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post #29 of 300 Old 01-11-2011, 11:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndreasMergner View Post

Against the concrete walls, you want the rigid foam glued right to the concrete. Then frame up a 2x4 wall 1" away from the foam. Use tapcons or the Ramset nails to secure the bottom (sole plate) 2x4. The top 2x4 is secured to your joists using DC-04s. This decouples the 2x4 wall from the concrete wall and your joists. You will not need clips/channels for the wall. Then use R-11 or R-13 in between the studs of the 2x4 wall and add DD/GG. The fiberglass is for dampening the air space and absorbing sound between the two walls. So, you want both rigid foam and fiberglass, but in different places.

On your other walls not against concrete, I'd call Ted. It depends if they are existing or not. You are best to remove at least the drywall from an existing wall so it can be decoupled with clips/channels since the framing is already attached to the joists.

You are NOT making this easy on me, lol. Since all of the walls are arleady up, I really don't want to be re-doing 3 walls when the original plan was just for one Do you really think it's necessary?

I did rip off all of the old sheetrock and insulation with in the last 2 days, they are bare and ready for new drywall.

I will post up pictures tomorrow so you (and everyone else) can have a better idea of what I'm looking at
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post #30 of 300 Old 01-12-2011, 05:35 AM
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My best advice is to call The Soundproofing Company and read everything on their website. They know what they are talking about and are a great resource. They will email you additional "instructions" on how to do all this.

Current HT: HTPC-->Epson 5010 projector-->135" screen, BFM TLAHs x7 & THT
Build log: DIY rotary sub for contemporary HT in 100 year old house?
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