"Reel Time" Build Log-14' Scope, 9.7 17,000W Transducer Audio, Dedicated Stadium Room - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 368 Old 10-23-2011, 01:23 PM - Thread Starter
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With drywallers coming Fri, 10/21, I had to get the room all ready and make sure I had everything before they covered it all up! Since MississippiMan still needs to come and install all the transducers, they are only cutting the drywall pieces and temporarily mounting them wherever the transducers are going. That way the transducers can be installed and we can mount the boards up for testing.

Entry Foyer

I lined all the of the little entry foyer coming into the HT with OSB and sealed all the gaps. I will get GG and a layer of 5/8" on top from the drywallers.



Rear Channels

Electric all in and conduit running with wiring for subs and channels. Lutron GE remote outlet next to entrance of HT.



Bump Electric

Ran electric and box at top of each bump that will be hidden by crown and provide juice for rope lighting. In the second shot you can see the box for the step lighting. Since the two bumps on each side straddle the step, I added an outlet at the base of each for a small downlight when it gets dark.





Projector/Hush Box Fan

Installed a Panny inline 150CFM fan to draw the hot air produced from the projector out of the soffit and send it outside.

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post #62 of 368 Old 10-23-2011, 01:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Now we're cooking. With that last post I hit my 3rd page!! Now if I only had views!

Well, the guys came back on Friday (10/21) and hung the last of the drywall. Finisher came at the end and began his work. The main step to complete is getting the front wall perfectly finished to accept the painted screen from MississippiMan when he comes up the first part of November. The finisher will do what he can to maximize his time, but we can't finish everything until the audio is all set.

Getting the final dry wall up over all of those studs really changed the whole look and feel of the room. You really start to get a sense of what it's going to look like. It's amazing how a 20'x30' room and start to look small too!

View from the Family Room looking in



Down the left wall



Rear wall



Right wall



Front wall and the room



Looking to the front from back wall showing the projector hush box coming down from the soffit. Tried to play with the angles a bit to match the wall bumps.



Looking up at the ceiling from the front of the room. A 10'x15' fiber optic star ceiling will go in there from FOSI. It's due in a few weeks.



Just a different shot of the rear. Lights on side of projector box will have eyeballs to drop the light down over the counter bar row.

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post #63 of 368 Old 10-23-2011, 01:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Based on all the great feedback and references seen here on AVS, I contacted Roman at rtheaters.com and discussed seating. After a lot of helpful information I decided to bite the bullet and go with his new line of chairs - the Fusion Collection. I chose the higher Escape line in brown leather. I went with a curved row of four individuals chairs for the front row and a curved row a love seat and two chairs on each side for the second row.

I should have them here in November.

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post #64 of 368 Old 10-23-2011, 01:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Limited on space and with a lot of equipment to house for the HT itself and centralizing all the house equipment, I went with the Middle Atlantic Slim-5 37U racks. I can put two of these side by side and hold everything with some future expansion space.

I'm going to build a custom rollout for them from the AV closet and have a door in front of them matching the entry door on the other side of the room. I went ahead and purchased the custom panels for equipment that wasn't rack mounted. I don't want to see the equipment from the room all the time, but when I open the door I want it to look very neat and professional. I'll trim all around it so it looks like it's built in.

I ordered all the MA rack and options with Chris' help at customavrack.com.
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post #65 of 368 Old 10-23-2011, 06:05 PM
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I just know that multi piece Screen wall is gonna be perfectly flat....right?

I don't think I've ever seen it done quite like that before, when the object is to have as few joints to deal with as possible.

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #66 of 368 Old 10-23-2011, 07:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post

I just know that multi piece Screen wall is gonna be perfectly flat....right?

I don't think I've ever seen it done quite like that before, when the object is to have as few joints to deal with as possible.

Don't worry MM. The boards are 12' wide with two of them. We could not get 16' wide boards with only an order of 2. Not much commercial construction going on so they aren't laying around.

I've told them it has to be perfectly smooth and flat. He said he is going to finish the whole board and that would be the best.
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post #67 of 368 Old 10-24-2011, 07:17 AM
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Don't worry MM. The boards are 12' wide with two of them. We could not get 16' wide boards with only an order of 2. Not much commercial construction going on so they aren't laying around.

I've told them it has to be perfectly smooth and flat. He said he is going to finish the whole board and that would be the best.

Well OK then....

I want it to be a perfect Screen for you, so since I'm not doing the Drywall finishing, I must look to the level of what is "perfect" as is adjudged by someone else. Always makes me nervous because I can't remember a single time when someone else left me a wall to work with that upon inspection I didn't have to fix a few places.

But......If he does intend to skim coat the entire wall, that can bode well for the end result. That's what we did for calbear's 16' x 9' er
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post16751239

Of course that wall was built from scratch by me and a very helpful and adept Costa Rican...skim coated with an almost liquified Drywall compound, and "Mouse Sanded" to a almost glass smooth finish
If both before and after Priming the Finisher inspects the surface while it is flooded with angled light coming first from one side then another, any potentially visible defects should become very easily ascertained and corrected. Hopefully that will happen before priming because it becomes more difficult to repair such things after a sealing primer coat is applied.

It's an exciting time a'commin' fer shur! Not far off either.

BTW...now I can see why you told me you have plenty of room for the PJ and the Star Field Illuminator.

But where is the "Screen facing hole"?

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #68 of 368 Old 10-24-2011, 07:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks MM. I will keep a very close eye on the finishing of the screen wall. Yes, a complete skim coat.

The photos make the projector box look bigger than it is. That being said, it has plenty of room for the pj and illuminator.

I haven't put the front hole in yet as I will wait for the exact pj placement. Then do a nice trim around it.
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post #69 of 368 Old 10-24-2011, 07:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedTopDown View Post

Based on all the great feedback and references seen here on AVS, I contacted Roman at rtheaters.com and discussed seating. After a lot of helpful information I decided to bite the bullet and go with his new line of chairs - the Fusion Collection. I chose the higher Escape line in brown leather. I went with a curved row of four individuals chairs for the front row and a curved row a love seat and two chairs on each side for the second row.

I should have them here in November.

We have from roman the curved berk's with middle loveseat in 1st row, and dual loveseats in 2nd row. Loveseats are overlooked to often in family home theatre IMO.
Mostly just our family, we always use 1st row. 2nd row only used the occasional friends gathering, or if kids fighting and need separation, I'm sure that only happens to my family...

Enjoy the ht journey.
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post #70 of 368 Old 10-24-2011, 11:27 AM - Thread Starter
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We have from roman the curved berk's with middle loveseat in 1st row, and dual loveseats in 2nd row. Loveseats are overlooked to often in family home theatre IMO.
Mostly just our family, we always use 1st row. 2nd row only used the occasional friends gathering, or if kids fighting and need separation, I'm sure that only happens to my family...

Enjoy the ht journey.

Obviously since we ordered one row with a loveseat, we like the idea also. I'm always curious why we don't see more of them in HTs. I guess some don't want to sit right next to their spouse! With two teenage boys, we always have to keep them separated.

Our sweet spot will be the second row, so the love set unit goes there. We'll have the individual row of four and the back bar row for when we have guests over.

It's been a long, but fun and eventful. Glad to start seeing it come towards and end. Really looking forward to waking up on a Saturday and not working in there!
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post #71 of 368 Old 10-24-2011, 11:36 AM
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It's been a long, but fun and eventful. Glad to start seeing it come towards and end. Really looking forward to waking up on a Saturday and not working in there!

Shoot. You'll be waking up "IN" the Home Theater if your any normal HT enthusiast.

Friday Night Movie watchin' being what it is.......

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #72 of 368 Old 10-24-2011, 12:37 PM - Thread Starter
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post #73 of 368 Old 11-02-2011, 05:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Received my Middle Atlantic shipment, with two Slim-5 37U racks. I had to purchase the casters elsewhere as I needed them to be fixed and all MA sells is swivel. So I had to do some precise drilling.

Plan is to have them on a custom base (yet to be built) allowing them to roll out of the closet so I can access the backs and the closet itself. I'll have to make two pieces that I can remove and store that provides about 4' worth of travel.

I built out one of the racks completely. The other I'll just keep the base for now so I can test the "roll" of the structure I need to build.



Some custom faceplates and shelves for the non-eared components. It will be somewhat of a shame to have it all behind closed doors. But I don't want the sound or the lights. Still will look good (I hope) when the doors open up!



All the wires are pulled and ready to go. Sure does look like a mess in there. I need to clean them all up too since there's lots of green glue residue over them. Man that stuff is tacky.

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post #74 of 368 Old 11-02-2011, 06:41 AM
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Just discovered your thread. Very nice, love the stealthy entrance concept and execution. Enjoyable read so far.


Good luck

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post #75 of 368 Old 11-02-2011, 06:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Just discovered your thread. Very nice, love the stealthy entrance concept and execution. Enjoyable read so far.


Good luck

Thank you. We've told many visitors that we have a HT room somewhere and to go find it. Most don't. The real trick will be how well the soundproofing does to keep the sound as hidden as possible too!
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post #76 of 368 Old 11-02-2011, 12:50 PM
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Now we're cooking. With that last post I hit my 3rd page!! Now if I only had views!

Well, the guys came back on Friday (10/21) and hung the last of the drywall. Finisher came at the end and began his work. The main step to complete is getting the front wall perfectly finished to accept the painted screen from MississippiMan when he comes up the first part of November. The finisher will do what he can to maximize his time, but we can't finish everything until the audio is all set.

Getting the final dry wall up over all of those studs really changed the whole look and feel of the room. You really start to get a sense of what it's going to look like. It's amazing how a 20'x30' room and start to look small too!

Build looks awesome. I have a question though: With a build of this magnitude, why go with a painted screen? Wouldn't a AT screen be better or even a non AT screen.
No offense to MississipiMan, I don't mean to step on your toes, I am just asking.
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post #77 of 368 Old 11-02-2011, 01:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Build looks awesome. I have a question though: With a build of this magnitude, why go with a painted screen? Wouldn't a AT screen be better or even a non AT screen.
No offense to MississipiMan, I don't mean to step on your toes, I am just asking.

Thank you. I'm sure that MM will chime in and give his .02 on the matter. What got me going on the painted screen was CalBear's HT build (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=942954) and the 16' wide screen MM did for him. I've backed down from a 14' wide scope screen to a 12', but it's still a very large area to light up. I'm also strongly leaning towards a constant area setup, so a 16:9 12' wide screen is huge.

I've placed my full faith in MM that he can paint a screen with all his talent and paint formulas that will give me great results. I know he'll deliver. I also want to have this size screen, but not pay for a $20K+ projector to light it up.

An AT screen was something I wanted right off the bat, more specifically, a center channel with sound coming from the picture. Going the transducer route with the audio in the wall itself behind the painted screen, I'll have the same result.

I'm sure many will say that the transducer audit will never produce the sound from a standard high-end speaker setup. Again, I'll let MM answer all that!

Now that I've teed you up, Mr. MM.....
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post #78 of 368 Old 11-02-2011, 01:44 PM
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FWIW, I had a cheap DIY painted screen prior to my AT screen. Any differences in image quality were very slight. Redtop, have you seen an image on a 14' screen with some of the current projectors? Mine is a 14' AT with a lowly Panasonic AE4000, and it never crosses my mind that my screensize is outside of recommended spec. I think the arguements against extra large screens are overblown. Not only for brightness concerns, but also in terms of view angles and seating distances. My two cents...

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post #79 of 368 Old 11-02-2011, 01:51 PM - Thread Starter
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FWIW, I had a cheap DIY painted screen prior to my AT screen. Any differences in image quality were very slight. Redtop, have you seen an image on a 14' screen with some of the current projectors? Mine is a 14' AT with a lowly Panasonic AE4000, and it never crosses my mind that my screensize is outside of recommended spec. I think the arguements against extra large screens are overblown. Not only for brightness concerns, but also in terms of view angles and seating distances. My two cents...

And with MM's screen being a high-end painted one, I don't have any concerns at all. I agree with you on the arguments being overblown to some extent, but the facts still have to be considered when trying to project that large of an image. I want a good projector, but something I won't feel like shooting myself over in two years (max) when something better comes out for half the price. I'd rather be 95% happy now and save some $ for when 4K becomes affordable.

I've followed your build thread and can't remember how far back your first row viewing is. When I saw 14' wide from my 12' distance it seemed too much for my taste. In the prime second row at 18' it was good, but 12' wasn't bad at all and seemed to work better for the first row. When I then decided to go constant area, a 14' wide 16:9 was just ridiculous.

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I hope 12' wide is enough!

BTW - Great progress on your HT! Love the new entrance.
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post #80 of 368 Old 11-02-2011, 02:02 PM
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My front row is 12' from the 14' wide image. Yes, it would be too much as a prime seat, but it's not "bad" per se. My prime seat is at 19' and the third row is at 23'. I'm comfortable I hit the sweet spot for my seat. It's a little large for the front row and a little small from the back (well...not really).

All this talk, but I don't question you're going to be very happy with your choices!

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post #81 of 368 Old 11-02-2011, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedTopDown View Post

Thank you. I'm sure that MM will chime in and give his .02 on the matter. What got me going on the painted screen was CalBear's HT build (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=942954) and the 16' wide screen MM did for him. I've backed down from a 14' wide scope screen to a 12', but it's still a very large area to light up. I'm also strongly leaning towards a constant area setup, so a 16:9 12' wide screen is huge.

I've placed my full faith in MM that he can paint a screen with all his talent and paint formulas that will give me great results. I know he'll deliver. I also want to have this size screen, but not pay for a $20K+ projector to light it up.

An AT screen was something I wanted right off the bat, more specifically, a center channel with sound coming from the picture. Going the transducer route with the audio in the wall itself behind the painted screen, I'll have the same result.

I'm sure many will say that the transducer audit will never produce the sound from a standard high-end speaker setup. Again, I'll let MM answer all that!

Now that I've teed you up, Mr. MM.....

Thanks for the reply. If I understand correctly your statement, a painted screen light up easier versus other type of screen. And since you didn't want to spend too much on a PJ (I hear you on that), you went with the painted screen. Plus the painted screen should be cheaper than other type of screen (I hope nevertheless).
Well, I can't wait to see the result. MM, paint that screen already!!!!
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post #82 of 368 Old 11-02-2011, 07:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seigneur_rayden View Post

Build looks awesome. I have a question though: With a build of this magnitude, why go with a painted screen? Wouldn't a AT screen be better or even a non AT screen.
No offense to MississipiMan, I don't mean to step on your toes, I am just asking.

A fair question.....and one that weighs on the minds of anyone not familiar with the advances we have made in DIY screen building since I got involved with such "away back when". Besides that, I'm an old, retired Semi-Pro Soccer Player (1969 - 1978) so my Toes are tough, my Shins are heavily callused, and I still can ignore a Red Card long enough to take out the opposition if necessary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedTopDown View Post

Thank you. I'm sure that MM will chime in and give his .02 on the matter. What got me going on the painted screen was CalBear's HT build (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=942954) and the 16' wide screen MM did for him. I've backed down from a 14' wide scope screen to a 12', but it's still a very large area to light up. I'm also strongly leaning towards a constant area setup, so a 16:9 12' wide screen is huge.

I've placed my full faith in MM that he can paint a screen with all his talent and paint formulas that will give me great results. I know he'll deliver. I also want to have this size screen, but not pay for a $20K+ projector to light it up.

An AT screen was something I wanted right off the bat, more specifically, a center channel with sound coming from the picture. Going the transducer route with the audio in the wall itself behind the painted screen, I'll have the same result.

I'm sure many will say that the transducer audit will never produce the sound from a standard high-end speaker setup. Again, I'll let MM answer all that!

Now that I've teed you up, Mr. MM.....

...and I've hauled out my biggest Driver. I can knock 'em 300+ yards anytime I need to. Trouble is....my Short game sucks..... But that's OK. Nothing feels better than connecting off the Tee. Trouble is, I've been waiting to tee off for over a year.

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Originally Posted by seigneur_rayden View Post

Thanks for the reply. If I understand correctly your statement, a painted screen light up easier versus other type of screen. And since you didn't want to spend too much on a PJ (I hear you on that), you went with the painted screen. Plus the painted screen should be cheaper than other type of screen (I hope nevertheless).

The ability of any screen, Mfg. or DIY, to "Light Up" is tied to both the PJs Lumen / Contrast output and the Screen's effective Gain /Surface properties. With DIY Screen making, and a knowing hand, a surface can be tailored to be exactly what is needed...size, gain, and positioning. All three being optimized for a given set of circumstances means optimal results. It's that simple...really.

And yes, you best believe it's a WHOLE lot less expensive. Ridiculously so. More Bang for Less Bucks has been the DIY Screen mantra since well before my own time on the Forum Boards. What I've always tried to do is make the quality even more representative of offering the most value while not compromising performance one whit...if not indeed making performance soar over the top of expectations.

Quote:


Well, I can wait to see the result. MM, paint that screen already!!!!

Actually, I can't hardly wait myself. I enjoy doing this sort of thing tremendously...primarily because I revel in the delight of seeing Jaws drop to knee level. Then at the end of it all, leaving someone so proud of his ownership means never having to say; "I'm sorry...that's the best you can expect from a DIY Screen." Instead, I hear; "I don't think I could have ever done better buying a Mfg. Screen anyway." Heady stuff...and the thing that satisfaction is really based upon. I Live or Die on the results of "every" such project, especially the ones reviewed on this Forum. So far.....no Obituary has been written.


Quote:
Originally Posted by RedTopDown View Post

And with MM's screen being a high-end painted one, I don't have any concerns at all. I agree with you on the arguments being overblown to some extent, but the facts still have to be considered when trying to project that large of an image. I want a good projector, but something I won't feel like shooting myself over in two years (max) when something better comes out for half the price. I'd rather be 95% happy now and save some $ for when 4K becomes affordable.

......and knowing that, I'm sticking with my suggestion of the Epson 5010

Quote:


I've followed your build thread and can't remember how far back your first row viewing is. When I saw 14' wide from my 12' distance it seemed too much for my taste. In the prime second row at 18' it was good, but 12' wasn't bad at all and seemed to work better for the first row. When I then decided to go constant area, a 14' wide 16:9 was just ridiculous.

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I hope 12' wide is enough!

You'll be happy at 12' wide (144" x 81" ) as that is a BIG screen by any standard. Almost 7' high.

FTR...I expect the "light Gray" Screen to top out at approx 1.7 gain "minimum", so at a projected Throw distance of 17.2' and with the 5010 on Normal Lamp output, I calculate a Foot Lambert reading of 22 fl. That's plenty to be able to run the Epson on Low Lamp during Dark Room 2D use, and bump back up to Normal for 3D presentations. I could paint a S-I-L-V-E-R like the one I did for calbear in '08 ......and I just might. That will bump up the expected gain to over 2.0

As for the Transducer installation, and how effective it will be at doing the job required, I'd prefer to let RedTop pass judgement upon his own review. (...It's not my place to sell anyone on the concept...I've never tried to do that...) ) And that WILL happen because with the system involved, as soon as the units are installed and we slap the Drywall up into place and screw them off, the system is ready for an initial shakedown. (...no pun intended...)

We'll have the Power
We'll have the Structure
We'll have the Drivers
We'll have the Subs
We'll have the Screen
We "better" have a PJ.

We absolutely better have the Beer

When the Drywall and Paint dust settles, and we fire up the Room "in the Raw" with no furniture or carpet in place, that will tell RedTop if his confidence was well placed...or was placed at the bottom of a well. His own words will be either the Song of Legends...or the Dirge that heralds my Demise.

Me? I'm not worried at all because I've been there, done all that just a few times before in the last 33 years and I ain't had to listen to any moaning or wailing as of yet. And RedTop has stepped up to the plate and determined to do things with no compromise at all.

That always makes things a lot easier...lemmie tell ya!

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #83 of 368 Old 11-02-2011, 10:08 PM
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A fair question.....and one that weighs on the minds of anyone not familiar with the advances we have made in DIY screen building since I got involved with such "away back when". Besides that, I'm an old, retired Semi-Pro Soccer Player (1969 - 1978) so my Toes are tough, my Shins are heavily callused, and I still can ignore a Red Card long enough to take out the opposition if necessary.


The ability of any screen, Mfg. or DIY, to "Light Up" is tied to both the PJs Lumen / Contrast output and the Screen's effective Gain /Surface properties. With DIY Screen making, and a knowing hand, a surface can be tailored to be exactly what is needed...size, gain, and positioning. All three being optimized for a given set of circumstances means optimal results. It's that simple...really.

And yes, you best believe it's a WHOLE lot less expensive. Ridiculously so. More Bang for Less Bucks has been the DIY Screen mantra since well before my own time on the Forum Boards. What I've always tried to do is make the quality even more representative of offering the most value while not compromising performance one whit...if not indeed making performance soar over the top of expectations.


Well retired soccer player, you have just scored a goal with that long post that I had to be benched from being tired after reading the post
I myself has a 120" 2.35:1 DIY screen but I used Wilson Art and I would definitely never buy a manufactured screen. But my eyes have always preferred the image projected on a WA or fabric better than on a painted screen. That is why I was asking.
That sentence about your tough toes made me laugh so hard!!!
Again, I can't wait so see that monster and you sir have skills
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post #84 of 368 Old 11-05-2011, 02:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Screen wall finished with full skim coat and sanded super smooth. Hopefully, MM will approve. A few coats of primer are next...

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post #85 of 368 Old 11-05-2011, 02:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Seats from Roman arrived. Opened and set up one of them. Sat in it and almost fell asleep. I guess that's a good sign!

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post #86 of 368 Old 11-05-2011, 02:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Today I put on two coats of primer on the screen wall and primed the AV closet. I'll need to sand the screen wall to ensure everything is really smooth and the one more primer coat.

In between primer coats, built the track system for the two Slim5 Middle Atlantic racks that will sit in the AV closet. I can only access the closet and the back of the racks by pulling them out four feet from their sitting position. So I created a track stand and then built a removable rollout track that connects to the stand. There's side rails on the outside of the outermost tracks to keep everything in position. These rails go right up against the fixed casters. I added adjustable feet to the removable rollout track to compensate for floor differences since it will sit on carpet.







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post #87 of 368 Old 11-05-2011, 03:49 PM
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Wow, I remember this from your other thread. I'm a constant lurker, but had to say that it is coming along quite well. I like some of your concepts, especially the screen, which after it's all done, I hope it will perform to your expectations...and if it does, hmmmm....maybe a project for myself to entertain (of course with a hired experienced mudder!). Keeping my eyes glued to this one!
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post #88 of 368 Old 11-05-2011, 05:52 PM
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Screen wall finished with full skim coat and sanded super smooth. Hopefully, MM will approve. A few coats of primer are next...


Well I'm pumped....sitting here in Atlanta on a hour layover between LA & Memphis. I can't think of anything better to see waiting for me than the Posted effort above. More work done already "on site" means more recreation time on site. (ie: BBQ & Beer)

The effort zo far seems more than worthy. The effort you've expended will reap ethe results we desire... not the whirlwind we want to avoid.

People... the Great Reveal is about to happen. So as stated...I'm really pumped. Being as jaded as I am that's sayin' sumpthin'!

To quote James T. Kirk;
"I'm laughing at the superior intellect"
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post #89 of 368 Old 11-08-2011, 08:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Okay, so it looks just like the last screen wall shot. BUT, it does now have three coats of primer on it! We're ready for MM, arriving on Friday!

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post #90 of 368 Old 11-12-2011, 07:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, MMan came into town Friday evening and we got started right away. First thing, prep the room to control the air and fumes. Put up a zip wall at the entry and then I was able to borrow an industrial exhaust system which just about sucks the air out of your lungs!

Lastly, we needed to build a 16' long platform so MMan could get to the whole wall. Yes, trash cans, but solid as can be.





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