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post #2251 of 2266 Old Yesterday, 04:36 AM
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Might do more harm that good. With a toggle rated over 400lbs I think the speaker would have to weigh about 150lbs before it was a real concern.

Pullout of a screw with .75" embedment is probably less than 200lbs (depends on wood species and it's too early to do math!). For comparison, 3/8 lag screw in typical sawn framing lumber is less than 400 lbs.

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post #2252 of 2266 Old Today, 08:07 AM - Thread Starter
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I Think I see what DW is getting at, and this is what I was originally thinking when I was considering using an MDF square glued and screwed to the wall. Spreading out the load like that puts more of the bolt loading into tension rather than only shearing.

That said, I've been reading up on these toggler bolts, and it looks like they far exceed what I need, and there would be two, and it's double 5/8 DW (as opposed to single 1/2"). I weighed and assembled V-8, and it clocks in at just under 20 lbs.

Another option is to flip the bracket around (use the TV part of the bracket against the wall and the wall part against the speaker). That way I get a wider footprint on the wall and I get to use four bolts rather than just two. The downside to that is I then have to use only two bolts into the speaker. Do people typically just put wood screws into MDF to hang speakers like this, or should I put a nut, bolt, and washer all the way through the box and try to seal it on the inside.

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post #2253 of 2266 Old Today, 08:57 AM
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I personally wouldn't trust a screw into MDF in this situation.

I would mark the holes on the outside, drill thru and install a hurricane nut. Then use a machine screw to fasten the bracket to the speaker.

You could use a nut and bolt, but that would mean you would have to remove the driver if you ever wanted to remove the bracket.

Tim
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post #2254 of 2266 Old Today, 09:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Good idea on the hurricane nuts!

Any thoughts on whether I should flip the bracket around?

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post #2255 of 2266 Old Today, 09:07 AM
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It probably makes more sense flipped around but in reality I doubt it matters.

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post #2256 of 2266 Old Today, 09:14 AM - Thread Starter
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I suspect it's built this way because they expect you to mount it to a 2x4, so the extra flange width would be wasted. I'm feeling like a plan is coming together I wish I'd worked this out before I put the drivers in, though. I hate taking the screws out of MDF and putting them back in.

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post #2257 of 2266 Old Today, 10:22 AM - Thread Starter
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I've never used these things before, so what do you guys think. T-nuts or hurricane nuts?

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post #2258 of 2266 Old Today, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doublewing11 View Post
If you're going to use toggles, wouldn't you want to use some hardwood for bracket base.....say 3/4" to set speaker mounting bracket? Router edge with some rollover or design. Does two things, stiffens wall to bracket attachment and strengthens sheer and pullout over larger area. I'd be hard pressed to use toggles on double layer of DW only.

Just saying.......
If you can't find a stud, I agree with DW above.

Or I would carefully cut a roughly 6x6 hole in the drywall (save removed pieces). Cut a piece of 3/4 inch plywood maybe 5 inch wide by 18 inches long. Put a drywall screw into the middle of the plywood (that's your handle) and slide it up into the wall. Adjust the plywood so you have the screw in the middle of your 6x6 hole. You will have roughly 6 inches above and below the hole. Now take a couple of drywall screws and drive them thru the drywall making sure to hit that plywood that's in the wall. Once the screws grab the plywood it will suck it down to the back side of your drywall. I would put 3-4 screws above and 3-4 screws below the hole and into the plywood. Note: if you have multiple layers of drywall, make sure you get long enough drywall screws to get into (or even thru) the plywood. Now remove the screw handle and put the saved drywall back into your hole that's blocked by the plywood. You can put a couple screws to hold the pieces in place. Repair the screw holes and cut lines with drywall compound. You will have a great area to hang the speakers and the weight should be well distributed.

Ps. Just don't tell your wife you're already cutting into the new drywall. They usually don't think that's funny.

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post #2259 of 2266 Old Today, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J_P_A View Post
I've never used these things before, so what do you guys think. T-nuts or hurricane nuts?
Hurricane nut. Just be sure to put some PL or gorilla glue on it before you seat it. They will spin later on if there's no glue.

edit: I usually use 10-32. Finer thread is recommended where vibration may loosen.

Tim

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post #2260 of 2266 Old Today, 03:25 PM
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The hurricane nuts and t-nuts all make me nervous. I went with carriage bolts on some of my subwoofer boxes and I think they will be bullet-proof.

Decide how you want to mount the bracket to the back of the speaker cabinet - mark the holes. Drill for carriage bolts and then use a washer and nut on the outside of the cabinet to pull the carriage bolt into the cabinet wall - the head of the carriage bolt will be on the inside and you'll be left with studs protruding out the back to use for mounting the plate of the bracket. A drop of glue on the underside of the head of the carriage bolt will leave no doubt that it is air-tight, and the washer and nut left snug on the outside ensure it is a permanent fix. That would force the bracket off the back of the speaker cabinet by the 1/4" or so of the nut and washer... but that's the only downside I can see. Or your could skip the washer and nut and just permanently mount the bracket directly to the cabinet.

Of course you could do the same thing with standard bolts, but you would want an extra washer for the inside of the cabinet. This cat could be skinned in all sorts of ways. I just like coarse threaded bolts and washers so I can see what I'm doing when I start threads. If you're worried about vibration loosening them, might I recommend a lock-washer (split ring) or some thread-locking compound (overkill)? I would not use thread-lock on a carriage bolt - only on a bolt where I could get a tool securely on the head for removal.

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post #2261 of 2266 Old Today, 03:53 PM
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HF you are hardcore.

You used carriage bolts for mounting your drivers? I never really stopped to look, but they make carriage bolts that small in diameter?

Definitely another solid way to do things. I'm just a hurricane nut guy after seeing them used in the DIY speaker forum. Plus black cap screws look cool

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post #2262 of 2266 Old Today, 04:00 PM
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The black cap screws do look very cool. No argument there at all.

I used small 1/4-20 carriage bolts and acorn nuts for the drivers, and large 3/8 carriage bolts for my baffle repair.

Here they are, as current - still unfinished:
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post #2263 of 2266 Old Today, 04:03 PM
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Ok.. Acorn nuts look cool too!

1/4 would be a #14 screw.. iirc my itty bitty 15's would accommodate a #10 .

Still, I like the idea of a #10 bolt with acorn nuts. I had envisioned 1" of thread sticking out with some gnarly nut on there and was thinking "he did THAT to THOSE drivers?!" I should have known..

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post #2264 of 2266 Old Today, 04:15 PM
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Yeah, picking the right length is key to the outcome. J_P_A's application is a little less sensitive to that, since it will be behind the cabinet. I still think I might paint them with some black enamel or something before final installation - or maybe bronze or brass or something, depending on how the rest of the finishing turns out.

In regards to picking the right length - don't be flippant about all the bolts in the same bin being the same. I bought 16 after picking the right length, only to get home and find that two were only 3/4" instead of 1"
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post #2265 of 2266 Old Today, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Tim View Post
Hurricane nut. Just be sure to put some PL or gorilla glue on it before you seat it. They will spin later on if there's no glue.

edit: I usually use 10-32. Finer thread is recommended where vibration may loosen.

Tim
I'll second.................but I'd make sure hurricane nut and insert has small hole for pin nails. I used insert nuts with subwoofer build and had a few spin on me. Didn't give enough time to have glue set up. Second go around, gave full 48 hours for glue to set and was golden.
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post #2266 of 2266 Old Today, 08:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarence View Post
Togglers... snaptoggles. Easier and stronger than the classic toggle bolts.

See Hanging projector - resilient bars, no backer plate
Congratulations on passing your inspection!


I have used the toggler bolts several times in odd jobs with no issues. If unsure, test mount your bracket with a set into some scrap DW or a 2x4. I think you will be surprised how well they hold.

The Moving Pictures Theater Construction Thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1462881/th...ruction-thread

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http://www.avsforum.com/forum/61-are...l#post26079610
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