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Old 01-07-2016, 02:06 PM
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1) soffits inside drywall bunker allows recessed lights without backer boxes, improves sound attenuation of HVAC ductwork, and you can use as a chase for wiring. Bass traps is actually the last benefit.

2) I've done MDF, Drywall and Plywood. The secret to painting MDF is proper priming. It also resonates less than plywood. Use what you like. The cheapest route is probably drywall, see rawlinsway and lemonade
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Old 01-08-2016, 07:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frankabjr View Post
Damelon & Big,

I absolutely love the Bacon Race theater, and thank you for doing so much documentation of the build. Its great for the rest of us DIYers to get our courage and confidence up.

I do have a couple of questions for you as I am in the planning stages of converting a game room in my house into a theater, and am definitely a newbie at theaters & audio planning etc.

When you built your Soffits, I noticed that you built them inside the sound envelope as opposed to framing them up as part of your walls, and then covering them with drywall/GG/drywall(placing them outside the sound envelope).

1) I'm guessing you chose to put them on the inside of the soundproofing because of the decision to make the soffits bass traps. Now that the theater is done, how do you feel about that decision? In your opinion does using the soffit space as a bass trap work as well as you intended? Would you do it that way again?

2) When you built the soffit vertical panels(from ceiling nailer hanging down), and the light trays, you chose to make them out of MDF. Any particular reason for MDF choice? In my experience MDF can be difficult to paint and achieve a silky smooth look, plus it easily crumbles from trying to counter sink screw holes etc. I planned on borrowing some of your concepts for your guys soffits and light trays, but it was my intention to do the woodwork with finished plywood. I'm curious why that decision was made for MDF. I'm guessing material cost?

3) I don't have a requirement for a soffit in my space (No Pipes or ducts etc to hide), but I like the architectural look of it. I could get away with no soffit, just a light tray on the wall if I chose too. Having said that, my current plan is to create a soffit, based on your response to item#1 above. Plus, I think I would like to run all my romex and speaker wire in the soffit, and leave the light trays for nothing but LED strip lights, and possibly black UV flourescent tubes for a future painted star ceiling. I would love to hear your thoughts in regards to this?

Thanks,
Frank
Thank you so much for your compliments. It was a fun project to work on and I actually miss the work. It was a great time to be able to work on this project with BIG and be talking shop every day. It also moved at such a great pace that changes were consistently visible as we worked. We are happy to help!

1) You noted some of the primary reasons we did the soffit in my theater. It was the easy way to run HVAC ductwork based on the design of my ceiling beams. On top of that, mirror BIG's response. I couldn't really tell you if the bass traps in the soffit worked as expected (Since I can't really test it independently), but I will say that I love how my theater sounds. It did require a sub upgrade though. My old subs couldn't pump out enough bass for my theater initially. Once I changed, the result is some beautiful sounding bass!

2) We could have used Drywall. The primary reason of using MDF over plywood was both cost and how smooth it is. Since it was something that would be painted directly, any budget plywood would look terrible. You would have to use higher quality plywood to make painting easier. For the light tray, the MDF was needed due to the rounding of the edges. This could have been done with solid wood too, but would have been more costly. You are correct that it isn't the easiest to paint. Most of my MDF required several coats of paint (Especially the red color) to look decent. As BIG mentioned, Drywall would have been a cheaper option for just the parts that were vertical, but then we would have had to back it in places where we mounted the "L" wood pieces to connect the light try below it. All of the framing and "connector" pieces were wood. The MDF was only some of the paintable outward facing areas of the theater. (You can see we used this everywhere in the theater... columns, trim, etc) Could have used solid wood for the rest of it too but again, cost was a factor. Painting was a pain, even with primer. In the overall scope of the project though, it wasn't that much work.

3) So even without HVAC, a smaller light tray inside of the soundproofing means that all of your wiring and lighting would not require holes to be put into the shell. I did not have recessed lighting either. I used the soffit to run all of my cabling to the front, and there is a lot of room in there for some decently large conduit should you need to add wires in the future. I think even if I didn't need the soffit for HVAC I still would have made one. It just wouldn't have needed to be so big. Take for instance even the Fortress of Solitude/Curve Frenzy build. He had a very small light tray for the rope lights, and built his lights into his soffit itself. Where I had a large soffit and a much larger light tray. I've mentioned also before those micro-lights from de-kor. They are only about 1 cubic inch big and low voltage on top of that. You could run a ton of them in a tiny space to give accent lighting. They aren't super bright, but don't require any room. You can even recess them completely into a 2x4 with only the small wire pigtail sticking out the back. I love those little lights and have used them in multiple projects now. (Just not in my theater) If I used them in my theater though, I probably would have needed some primary recessed lights in the main ceiling area. Also, LED strip lights make the job a lot easier now too than old-school rope light in the light-tray.

3b) As far as UV lights, mine do charge my whole ceiling, but they are also a good distance closer to the center of the room due to the larger soffits. If you just ran a small light tray and then ran UV lights around the edges of your theater, it is possible that UV tubes won't charge the center of your room. I have tubes running the entire way around my theater at the moment, and they charge the edges very quickly, but it takes longer to charge the middle. In the case that I had a small conduit-sized soffit and smaller light tray, they would be further away from the center and the middle of the room might not get much charge. In that case you would need an additional UV Cannon light or a temporary floor light to charge the stars. OR... just use fiber-optic lights.

Good luck to you on your project!!!
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Old 01-11-2016, 09:33 AM - Thread Starter
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Update: The Concrete company has started prep-work for the pool deck. Primarily where the pavilion goes, since it requires a small retaining wall and deep footers beneath it to support the weight of the fireplace and structure. Due to the rain, I haven't had a chance to take a picture of the work so far, but I'll try in the next day or two. The time-lapse camera doesn't have an angle on the area where they are doing the work so I can't really use that. Over the weekend I spent a lot of time refining the details of the plans. At least it is sunny, but it will be getting colder, so I still don't think it is likely that the patio itself will get poured until springtime. Who knows. I'll try to post pictures soon.
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Old 01-12-2016, 02:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Some photos!

What the Pool tanning deck and interior steps look like


The circular table area taking shape (Formerly where the fire-pit would go)


The Pavilion fireplace starting to be built! Along with the concrete backing wall and footers




Picture of the pool next to the palm tree where the concrete patio currently ends
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Old 01-13-2016, 06:20 PM
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Night Sky on theater ceiling

Can't believe I am just seeing these pictures!! At least I think I'm just seeing them. Either way... you did an awesome job of capturing a difficult picture, and one I am usually too tired to get once I'm finished. If I don't have these yet... can I get copies, and would you mind if I used them? So nice!

Hope you are still enjoying the mural.

Jeff


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Here are some of todays pictures. I have only adjusted the basics like sharpness, brightness, contrast but the Nikon program shows a different image than windows photo viewer so they end up a little darker. At least in these you begin to get some of that 3D effect









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Old 01-13-2016, 07:26 PM
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Are you installing a heater in your pool? You may have stated it but I missed it. I want to add one to ours. We love our outdoor pavilion area. Looking good!
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Old 01-13-2016, 07:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NightSkyMurals View Post
Can't believe I am just seeing these pictures!! At least I think I'm just seeing them. Either way... you did an awesome job of capturing a difficult picture, and one I am usually too tired to get once I'm finished. If I don't have these yet... can I get copies, and would you mind if I used them? So nice!

Hope you are still enjoying the mural.

Jeff
Of course you can use them! I shared the album with you (Should be in your gmail inbox)
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Old 01-13-2016, 07:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Are you installing a heater in your pool? You may have stated it but I missed it. I want to add one to ours. We love our outdoor pavilion area. Looking good!
We are. It is something overkill too. Like 400,000 BTU. Not that we will be heating it that much, but maybe a few degrees here and there, but can allow us to keep it open longer. Gas line still needs to be hooked up. It isn't far. Maybe 15 feet, but it is right under where all the construction traffic is. I will worry about that once the concrete is finished.

Super excited about the pavilion area myself. Problem is that I have to work during the day when they are there, and the plans we got, while great, didn't have all the measurements on them. (It was a cad file... but it was free after all) And in the end, the measurements weren't quite right. So I feel like I am constantly having to look over their shoulder to fix mistakes before they happen. The mason guys are great, it's trying to get the walls in the right places that are picky.

The circular area where the fire pit was supposed to be had to be scaled down a little due to running out of room, and to where the electrical line was trenched behind it. Because of that, the wall from there to the staircase (to be built) was closer to the pool by a couple of feet. This was a cascading effect. The staircase needed 4'6" of space between the columns for the gate to fit, and the walkway down the stairs was supposed to be about 5' wide, but they trenched the footers to be 4'6" the whole way, before the stone was put on, so I need to adjust little things here and there. Would kill for a couple of days of working from home. This is really going to be the only rough part though, as once the walls are set it is all easy. Still, I also don't like them to work so hard in the wrong place. Wasted time and effort. I don't pay for the time due to mistakes, but I'm sure they don't want to be wasting their time.
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Old 01-13-2016, 08:17 PM
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The "Bacon Race" Theater / Patio / Bar Project

I understand completely about wanting to be there. Lucky enough we did a lot of work ourselves. Wife worked at home when they did a lot of work. I did a lot of video conference. Here's our little heaven. We spend more time in pavilion. I have full kitchen out there along with half bath and 75" tv.

Last edited by mike mcdaniel; 01-14-2016 at 08:50 PM.
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Old 01-14-2016, 05:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike mcdaniel View Post
I understand completely about wanting to be there. Lucky enough we did a lot of work ourselves. Wife worked at home when they did a lot of work. I did a lot of video conference. Here's our little heaven. We spend more time in pavilion. I have full kitchen out there along with half bath and 75" tv.Attachment 1183394
Wow! Now THAT is a pavilion. You an house a whole party under that! We aren't doing anything that upscale, just a fireplace with a covered roof. Only going to be 18x20 or so. I would have liked to put in a half bath somewhere outside but we decided it was too much work. It's great that you were able to do a lot of work yourselves and that your wife was home during construction.
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Old 01-16-2016, 06:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Some morning pictures. Fireplace and pavilion coming along quickly! Thing just keeps getting beefier lol. The back yard is like a dump right now due to construction. Can't wait for it to be finished.




Issue of the day. So on our plan we had a circular patio area butting up to the pool on the side opposite of the pavilion. Due to buried electrical conduit location, the radius of the circle had to be shortened, which is ok by me, but it does pose an issue. The wall doesn't connect to the place where the rock wall ends on the pool! Fortunately, the coping is not grouted yet or anything. I think the plan is to have the rock extended to meet the end of the wall. The other choice I would have would be to put a little piece of wall there. your thoughts?

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Old 01-16-2016, 07:37 AM
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Personally, I'd extend the rock wall to make it look as intended. Looks great BTW!
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Old 01-16-2016, 07:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Personally, I'd extend the rock wall to make it look as intended. Looks great BTW!
I agree. The masons are working today so I asked them if they would be able to just do it for me. (Instead of calling the waterfall guy and scheduling) Fortunately, they are the best workers on the team, and said "no problem, we can hook you up!". Really like how it is taking shape! Still hard to visualize it when it is done, even with the 3d renders I had.
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Old 01-16-2016, 03:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Some questions:

1) I want to mount hooks to the stone on the fireplace so that I can mount things like garlands in the winter, or something like a lantern at other times. In my head, I'd picture that they would sell iron hooks that just had a long flat piece of iron that you could just mortar into the wall while building. Like a 6" deep flat piece, instead of drilling into the wall when it is done. I want one on each side of the fireplace, and then maybe a decorative iron candle holder above the fireplace. What would you recommend I do? Just do it post-completion?

2) My pavilion has square stone bases on the columns, which are about 3' high, and then they are white vinyl which tapers from the size of the base and gets smaller as it gets to the ceiling soffit. So my question is, if I wanted to mount 2 sconce lights on the tapered portion, how would I do it? Most wall lights I see are fixed in place, so they would look like they are leaning back, unless I somehow un-tapered it under the back of the sconce. Thoughts?
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Old 01-16-2016, 08:11 PM
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Consider rust when you think about those hooks. As for the lights you will need to find or make a tapered mounting block. They make blocks for homes with tapered siding so maybe there is something out there. You might have to make something.
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Old 01-16-2016, 08:17 PM
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Wow! Everything is coming together and you are going to have a fantastic space to enjoy. I'd second the extending of rock wall where the gap is.

Keep the pics coming!

Regards,

RTROSE

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Now a Certified Carpet Counselor and Plumbing Counselor (Self given titles - pay no attention).
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Old 01-17-2016, 05:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Looks like we will be going to ElDorado stone again for our stone choice. Our fireplace is being modeled after one of their photos anyway. (See below) It will be a semi-irregular ledgestone. "Sequoia Rustic Ledge". Here are some sample photos of the stone, and another pic of the fireplace we're looking at. The masons will extend the rock wall for us.



Initially we thought we would go with the rustic ledgestone only for the fireplace, and then the "Warm Springs Top Rock" for the walls/Columns. I think it would blend with the rock wall behind the pool better, but not sure if I want to do both stone types



But the plan (at the moment) would be to use the Sequoia Rustic Ledgestone for everything, and just mix in some of the large beige stones from warm springs here and there.



Below, an example of the rustic ledge with some added large round rocks in random locations.

Last edited by damelon; 01-17-2016 at 06:30 AM.
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Old 01-17-2016, 05:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Consider rust when you think about those hooks. As for the lights you will need to find or make a tapered mounting block. They make blocks for homes with tapered siding so maybe there is something out there. You might have to make something.
Yeah, I'll have to look for those blocks. Otherwise we'll just get someone to shop something for us. The siding ones I've seen have the grooves for siding, but it is usually a large sawtooth sort of design, not a single angled plane on the back.

I don't think rust should be an issue. They just need to be painted with that black they use for fences and such. Iron will rust to be sure... but just need to make sure we don't scrape the paint off anywhere so it isn't exposed to air directly. Of course black painted aluminum or stainless steel solves that problem too.
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Old 01-24-2016, 08:58 AM - Thread Starter
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There was a slight delay in the pool project......

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Old 01-24-2016, 12:54 PM
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Looks like it's time to turn that pool heater on!

Regards,

RTROSE

FWIW I like the last pic where you show an example of the bigger stone mixed in. Has a very nice look to it.

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Old 01-25-2016, 05:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Looks like it's time to turn that pool heater on!

Regards,

RTROSE

FWIW I like the last pic where you show an example of the bigger stone mixed in. Has a very nice look to it.
Hah! I know right! (Except it isn't hooked up yet) A flamethrower would work!

I like the big stone mix in too, but that will be rare I think, because it would depend on finding large pieces that color match in another box. Hopefully we'll be able to do it here and there though, it breaks up the monotony a little.
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Old 01-25-2016, 07:50 AM
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Are you doing the Stone work yourself? Or a contractor?

-

"Too much is almost enough. Anything in life worth doing is worth overdoing. Moderation is for cowards."
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Old 01-25-2016, 10:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Are you doing the Stone work yourself? Or a contractor?
The masonry company doing the patio is doing everything. I just tell them when they are doing it wrong and to start over. Currently, I have to do that with part of the fireplace. The center area where the fire would go is a little too narrow. Would like it wider, but haven't been able to tell them yet due to snow.
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Old 02-18-2016, 04:32 PM - Thread Starter
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It has been a while since I have posted any updates. Most of the reason is due to the snow and cold we have had in the last few weeks. This week though the patio team is back at work! They have done a lot of work with the pavilion, and have started some stone work around the circular wall area. There has also been some substantial work done with the stair area along the side of the house.

Pavilion as it has been coming together. Note that the tapered portions of the columns aren't in the right places at the moment, nor are they painted. This will all start to transform in looks a lot soon!







Stairs are being defined and dug out





Some drainage pipes are being fitted



And some stone is starting to go up

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Old 02-19-2016, 12:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Update : After some discussions looks like we will have to do some more changes to the plan around the bottom of the staircase. The grading on the hill doesn't go with the plan to keep the part of the stair landing open on the side. The ground is just too high compared to where the concrete would be. Hard to really visualize a lot of these things until all of the pieces start getting put into place. Man, designing a theater in a fixed cubed space was so much easier than this!
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Old 02-19-2016, 07:50 PM
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Thumbs up, slow clap, now back to my spiced whiskey

-----------------------------------------------
Chase "Fetch"

Old Theater Build

New House Build
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Old 02-26-2016, 06:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Thumbs up, slow clap, now back to my spiced whiskey
Hope that whiskey kept you warm!

--------------------------------

I should have a lot of picture updates coming very soon! It has been a really busy week for the patio company. They started pouring concrete for the steps yesterday, have completed about 75% of the rebar, and stoned off the existing walls. They will likely start on the walls against the stairs either today or next week, and pouring the patio itself should be next week. This morning is one of the last pool inspections, where they will make sure that the pool deck is grounded. (Doesn't amount to much, check if the copper wiring is fastened to the rebar properly) We approved the go-ahead for the pre-cast caps for the walls. It's odd, the colors turned out darker than I thought they would (see previous pictures of the Sequoia Rustic Ledgestone) - it is less uniform in color and has a lot of darker pieces in it. I'm wondering if they only picked out the more beige colors for the previous projects, or if it is just how the lighting hits it. In any case, it actually ties in to the rocks behind the pool much better because of this, and matches the darker colors in the stamped concrete very well. I had them run conduit for speaker wire through the patio, and purchased extra so I will be expanding my outdoor speaker layout from 5 to 7. This will also let me do a true surround setup for outdoor movies too, instead of the phantom center channel speaker I had before.
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Old 02-26-2016, 12:13 PM
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looking good d! i go into planning phase this summer i'm thinking. i can't put off the wife much longer. hence my theatre will prop sit again. i am having major issues with getting a layout on paper for the pool house though. i can't come up with anything interesting that's not huge.

ur fireplace looks awesome! i love our outdoor one. I'm so glad it's covered though. it's nice to sit out there when it's raining and cold and still be able to use it.

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Old 02-26-2016, 01:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jimim View Post
looking good d! i go into planning phase this summer i'm thinking. i can't put off the wife much longer. hence my theatre will prop sit again. i am having major issues with getting a layout on paper for the pool house though. i can't come up with anything interesting that's not huge.

ur fireplace looks awesome! i love our outdoor one. I'm so glad it's covered though. it's nice to sit out there when it's raining and cold and still be able to use it.

jim
Thanks. The picture updates will start showing a lot of progress in the next couple of weeks. I stress out too much when it comes to design planning. Always thinking of things I might forget! I've seen a lot of awesome pool houses, but you are right, they all are huge. A lot of people incorporate their bar, bathrooms, tvs, etc into their pool houses. They look like they would be six figures all on their own. We pretty much have everything outside that I'd want other than the bathroom. In a lot of ways, my basement IS my pool house. You can connect to it direct from the pool deck, it has tiled floors, bar, fridge, pool table, bathroom, etc. So I don't care so much if the come in there dripping wet, as long as they don't go into the theater or upstairs that way! hehe.

I love the fireplace too. It will look much better once the details are on. I thought the center area was a little small, I would have preferred it to be maybe a half a foot wider, but it is big enough for the fire, just aesthetically a little small. There will be a small hearth in front too, it will all be stone faced, the roof will be vaulted stained wood, and the soffits white PVC board. I'll have some sort of chandelier there, and some speakers, and will put clear vinyl curtains on it so it can be closed up in the winter and kept warm if we want to be outside.
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Old 02-26-2016, 01:23 PM
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Thanks. The picture updates will start showing a lot of progress in the next couple of weeks. I stress out too much when it comes to design planning. Always thinking of things I might forget! I've seen a lot of awesome pool houses, but you are right, they all are huge. A lot of people incorporate their bar, bathrooms, tvs, etc into their pool houses. They look like they would be six figures all on their own. We pretty much have everything outside that I'd want other than the bathroom. In a lot of ways, my basement IS my pool house. You can connect to it direct from the pool deck, it has tiled floors, bar, fridge, pool table, bathroom, etc. So I don't care so much if the come in there dripping wet, as long as they don't go into the theater or upstairs that way! hehe.

I love the fireplace too. It will look much better once the details are on. I thought the center area was a little small, I would have preferred it to be maybe a half a foot wider, but it is big enough for the fire, just aesthetically a little small. There will be a small hearth in front too, it will all be stone faced, the roof will be vaulted stained wood, and the soffits white PVC board. I'll have some sort of chandelier there, and some speakers, and will put clear vinyl curtains on it so it can be closed up in the winter and kept warm if we want to be outside.
the winter is one of the things i keep thinking about. i would love to use it in the winter but then that means closing in and heating since there'll be a kitchen and half bath. unless i kinda do like you and drain all the lines and only use the fire pit area. my basement is not a walkout so thats the only reason we are going the route we are. no way in hell kids are going through my kitchen to the bathroom wet. lol

jim
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