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post #61 of 574 Old 02-11-2012, 05:25 PM - Thread Starter
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A couple of questions about my framing. My plan is to have 16" OC for 2x3 wall and 24" OC for 2x4 wall. I thought I read this might help slightly with the GG's damping effectiveness by allowing a bit more flex - true?

My existing walls' top plate (up against foundation) have a gap to joists above with only a few nails to stabilize. I was planning on doing the same thing with the other walls that haven't been built yet.....or should I use RSIC 04 clips?

Thx...
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post #62 of 574 Old 02-12-2012, 03:02 PM
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235,

I'm not sure about your city, but here in Colorado, if a basement has a concrete floor most jurisdictions require basement walls to be "floating" walls. A floating wall in my area is built very similar to how you have described your walls; the wall is allowed to move up and down on nails if the basement floor heaves. This saves the rest of your building structure from buckling if you have expansive soils.

I only bring this up because if your existing walls were built this way, it might be for a reason. Be sure you check with your local code for any similar requirements.

That being said... I am a huge fan of RSIC 04 (or similar) clips. Going the extra step to be sure your walls are decoupled and "disconnected" from the overhead floor joists is a good thing. The nail method of your current walls might be a fairly good method of "decoupling", but I don't know - probably no testing stats on this. ????
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post #63 of 574 Old 02-12-2012, 04:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ScottJ0007 View Post

235,

I'm not sure about your city, but here in Colorado, if a basement has a concrete floor most jurisdictions require basement walls to be "floating" walls. A floating wall in my area is built very similar to how you have described your walls; the wall is allowed to move up and down on nails if the basement floor heaves. This saves the rest of your building structure from buckling if you have expansive soils.

I only bring this up because if your existing walls were built this way, it might be for a reason. Be sure you check with your local code for any similar requirements.

That being said... I am a huge fan of RSIC 04 (or similar) clips. Going the extra step to be sure your walls are decoupled and "disconnected" from the overhead floor joists is a good thing. The nail method of your current walls might be a fairly good method of "decoupling", but I don't know - probably no testing stats on this. ????

Yup, I think it's code here to leave the gap. The soil around here is heavy clay and expansion can be a problem. I guess I can thank the soil for giving me a decoupled outer wall In the 8 years since my house was built I haven't seen any movement so that's a good sign. I was thinking of just sticking to nails for the interior walls I need to build. Ted mentioned that the nails are still considered decoupled. Now I just need to decide how much of a gap I need. Given that my door sits under the beam, I'll need every bit of headroom I can salvage.
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post #64 of 574 Old 02-12-2012, 08:20 PM
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235,

In the picture you posted of your wall detail, you might have a small problem when you go to drywall the inside wall underneath the beam. See picture below. After going to all the trouble of decoupling your walls, you don't want to be faced with attaching your drywall to the non-decoupled beam...

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post #65 of 574 Old 02-12-2012, 11:03 PM - Thread Starter
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I was hoping the ceiling drywall could be used as a lateral brace to support those last few unsupported inches on the wall. I expect this section will be tucked away behind a soffit so failing the above approach I might be able to support the drywall from the inside out. If I added a 1x1 on the inside of the drywall for those last few inches and screwed into the drywall then that might work? I may have to sketch that one up if this plan doesn't work. Thoughts?

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post #66 of 574 Old 02-12-2012, 11:50 PM
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I think you might be okay to let that top section of drywall extend beyond the top plate of the wall, just make sure some well meaning drywaller or helper doesn't stick some screws into the drywall in the beam section. Also be sure that you don't accidentally push the drywall into the beam with a too-tight-fitting section of ceiling drywall. As long as neither of those things happen you might be fine with just putting some drywall adhesive into the corner joint to hold that top piece in place. Especially if you are doing soffits which will keep the area covered permanently, I think this would be fine. It is just an area that you will have to be extra careful of as you finish it.
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post #67 of 574 Old 03-18-2012, 11:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Just a link to a question I posted earlier outside my build thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1397808
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post #68 of 574 Old 03-24-2012, 05:20 PM
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Funny thing, I ran into this issue of space with my house main beam. I ended up building my staggered stud wall inside the main beam and losing a bit of space in the room. My room is just shy of 12' wide which made it easy to install carpeting, and about 22' long. By installing the wall inside the beam instead of under it, it allowed me to build a dedicated ceiling by adding ceiling joists between the floor joists from the wall inside the beam to the outside wall next to the foundation wall. I could tie the walls together with the new ceiling joists and isolate the room from the surrounding structure. This also solved the problem of having to use the isolation clips and had the added benefit of isolating the projector from the floor vibrations from above.

I used the green glue on one wall and the ceiling (two walls were next to foundation, one staggered stud wall was next to laundry room and one staggered stud wall was next to a salon I built for my wife).

For ventilation I had two 5" acoustically lined ducts supplying the space and two fan-assisted return air ducts from above the projector to remove heat and the equipment closet for the same purpose. The fan is an axial centrifugal fan made by Nutone (model ILF120). So far this has proven to work very effectively for removing heat and and is not noticeable during movie watching.

Considering your room is slightly larger than mine, I suspect a similar arrangement would work. Most people have inadequate return air from their spaces and I highly recommend using a fan with a variable speed controller. Keep balancing dampers as far from the diffusers as possible. If you use the round screw-in type diffusers, they will have to be as open as possible to minimize noise generated from excessive discharge velocity that occurs when they are closed too much.

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post #69 of 574 Old 04-12-2012, 12:44 PM
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How's the build going? Any updates?
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post #70 of 574 Old 04-13-2012, 09:39 AM - Thread Starter
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How's the build going? Any updates?

Made a trip south of the border and picked up my GG/Clips (thanks Ted/John for the great service and pricing), dricore and some R19. I like supporting local retailers but not to the tune of $1000+ in extra costs.

Most of my time lately has been figuring out my HVAC plans. Trying to factor in all the related issues with sound isolation, CFM, FPM, diffusers, NC20, etc.... is probably one of the most challenging design issues in the build. Since I'm planning on getting contractors to do the work I will continue with my sketchup obsession so that the details are properly documented. Will hopefully post those initial HVAC plans here this weekend.
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post #71 of 574 Old 04-13-2012, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 235 View Post

Will hopefully post those initial HVAC plans here this weekend.

Looking forward to it. HVAC has been rattling around in my brain for a week or two now. I haven't done any calculations, but I know that I'll bever have faith in my estimates. I've reverted to the fall-back position of "give as much capacity as I can afford" and hope it's "right" enough. So maybe your experience will shed some much needed light for me.
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post #72 of 574 Old 04-13-2012, 10:45 AM
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Did not want to link to old posts in this thread, but when reading Projector Central's reviews of Panasonic's projectors. Please read them very carefully. You will find them all slanted toward the Panny's. In the comparisom of the AE7000 vs the Sony HW30ES, P. C. talked about how the AE7000 might be a better choice over the HW30 because it was dimmer. That the HW30ES might be too bright for dedicated rooms. A lot of people gave them flack about that comparison, it was so obvious. I think it may have been revised some, but read the feed back at the bottom. http://www.projectorcentral.com/shoo...icture-Quality P. C. made it sound like a 58% increase in lumens (best image mode) did not really matter. Not saying the AE7000 is a bad projector, just saying to read carefully and check to see that what you are reading makes sense or seems biased. When shopping for a projector, I would only look at lumens in best image mode for 2D and then max lumen output for 3D. Also for 2D image quality, none of the LCD are quite up to LCOS yet.

The linked review talks about the more aggressive iris in the Sony. It is the Panny that has the more aggressive iris. The higher native contrast of the Sony allows them to use a less aggressive iris. Sony is know for having a nearly invisible iris. If you have questions or want to get into this more, just give us a call.

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post #73 of 574 Old 04-13-2012, 12:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Mike. It's not an old post to me given that I'm still focused on the room design and have barely touched on any of AV equipment needs .
Any PJ's that would satisfy the following:

- Throw distance approx 19'
- Auto zoom/shift capable for 16x9 to scope
- 130" wide scope AT woven screen
- 16fl or greater in best mode
- 3D capable

Thx
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post #74 of 574 Old 04-13-2012, 12:58 PM
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For a good HVAC solution, don't rule out a mini-split system. I am putting one into my theater and ran the lineset and wiring prior to drywall. I am also "hiding" the indoor unit in the rear sofit. The only minor concern is fresh air circulation.

I remedied that problem by running two 6" flex ducts inside the left sofit and I will be installing a 6" hydroponics fan outside of the theater (in the furnace room) that will turn itself on automatically when the heat in my rack reaches a certain temp (using a thermostat in the top of the rack space). There are no less than 4 90 degree bends in this setup so sound isolation shouldn't be an issue and since the HVAC and fresh air setup aren't connected to the rest of the house's HVAC, I don't have to worry about sound transmission into the rest of the house. AND I will (and you will) need to run the AC in the winter, for the theater.
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post #75 of 574 Old 04-13-2012, 08:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 235 View Post

Thanks Mike. It's not an old post to me given that I'm still focused on the room design and have barely touched on any of AV equipment needs .
Any PJ's that would satisfy the following:

- Throw distance approx 19'
- Auto zoom/shift capable for 16x9 to scope
- 130" wide scope AT woven screen
- 16fl or greater in best mode
- 3D capable

Thx

That is a tough set of specs. If using 1.0 gain for the screen, the only projector under 20K that I know that can meet all of those requirements is the VW1000. The Benq W7000 (with the yet to be released software) meets all but auto zoom/shift. If you short throw mount a JVC RS45 it meets all requirements except for 3D. You would need to use lens memory to reduce the size of the image to get enough brightness for 3D, after much lamp use. The Panny does not come close, even short throw mounted for 2D or 3D brightness. The Epson 5010 meets all but auto zoom/shift.

Your best bet for what you want to do would be a W7000 and an A-lens.

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post #76 of 574 Old 04-17-2012, 07:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 235 View Post

Made a trip south of the border and picked up my GG/Clips (thanks Ted/John for the great service and pricing), dricore and some R19. I like supporting local retailers but not to the tune of $1000+ in extra costs.

Most of my time lately has been figuring out my HVAC plans. Trying to factor in all the related issues with sound isolation, CFM, FPM, diffusers, NC20, etc.... is probably one of the most challenging design issues in the build. Since I'm planning on getting contractors to do the work I will continue with my sketchup obsession so that the details are properly documented. Will hopefully post those initial HVAC plans here this weekend.

So wish i would of found this thread earlier. Having trouble finding GG in Wpg that isn't priced %200 more.

Gonna guess that you drove to ... Grand Forks, Fargo, Minneapolis? Where'd you pick up your supplies?

Nice thread, keep up the good work!
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post #77 of 574 Old 04-19-2012, 09:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Tree__77 View Post

So wish i would of found this thread earlier. Having trouble finding GG in Wpg that isn't priced %200 more.

Gonna guess that you drove to ... Grand Forks, Fargo, Minneapolis? Where'd you pick up your supplies?

Nice thread, keep up the good work!

Yup, local suppliers prices were way out of line. The soundproofing company ships UPS. I had them deliver to UPS customer service center in Grand Forks. Picked it up there on our way back from Minny. Worked great! Now I just have to file online for my ND tax rebate for another 7% savings
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post #78 of 574 Old 04-25-2012, 01:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Here are some sketches from the first iteration of my HVAC design. Not shown on these pics are where the 2 return flex ducts come together. I will have a variable speed inline fan on the return side that dumps into the main return plenum. The fan will draw from either or both of the 6" return ducts (low/high) coming from the room. Dampers for both 6" feeds would be located where they fork off from the fan. This should allow me to use high return when room needs cooling and low return when it needs heating. Feel free to poke holes


Overhead view:





Return view:





Supply view:

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post #79 of 574 Old 04-25-2012, 02:53 PM
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Someone got an 'A' in SketchUp class
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post #80 of 574 Old 04-25-2012, 03:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Someone got an 'A' in SketchUp class

....but I was hoping for A+
I can't count how many times I found things that just wouldn't work because of the level of detail I put into the sketches. Should save me lots time/$ when the build moves out of the virtual world.
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post #81 of 574 Old 04-25-2012, 07:04 PM
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I give you an A+! Question about your return (maybe I didn't read enough in detail because I was so mesmerized by your sketchup pictures): are your returns dumping into the basment or hooking up to the HVAC circuit? Are your soffits within the isolation shell, and if so are you doing DD/GG for the portions that are serving as return or supply lines?
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post #82 of 574 Old 04-26-2012, 12:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rs691919 View Post

I give you an A+! Question about your return (maybe I didn't read enough in detail because I was so mesmerized by your sketchup pictures): are your returns dumping into the basment or hooking up to the HVAC circuit? Are your soffits within the isolation shell, and if so are you doing DD/GG for the portions that are serving as return or supply lines?

Yeah A+
My current plan has the returns going to inline fan that blows into main HVAC circuit. I'm not sure if that's the best thing to do. Maybe I'll add the option to dump into adjacent room using dampers like I have planned for supply ducting.

Soffits are within the shell and are framed with 3/4 MDF. Might replace MDF with open framed fabric sections in bass-trapping sections.
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post #83 of 574 Old 04-26-2012, 12:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Here's a few more shots to better show soffits along with DD:

HVAC portion of front soffit (remainder of front soffit, screen wall and stage yet to be designed).





Rear soffit with opening for PJ:




Cut-away of rear soffit:

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post #84 of 574 Old 04-26-2012, 01:02 AM - Thread Starter
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One more to show plumbing and joist positioning:

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post #85 of 574 Old 04-26-2012, 04:30 AM
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Hi 235,

Havent had a chance to read it all yet so pardon if already posted, Are you gonna zoom or use a lens for scope?
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post #86 of 574 Old 04-26-2012, 09:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi 235,

Havent had a chance to read it all yet so pardon if already posted, Are you gonna zoom or use a lens for scope?

Haven't decided on any equipment yet but I think I'll be zooming Aren't those lenses thousands of dollars?
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post #87 of 574 Old 04-26-2012, 09:11 AM
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Haven't decided on any equipment yet but I think I'll be zooming Aren't those lenses thousands of dollars?


Yes theyre expensive. I just wanted to comment on your projector mounting in the rear soffit.

If your zooming, the projector lens elevation must fall within the projected image. It looks like your projector will be way up close to ceiling and in that case so will the top edge of your screen.
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post #88 of 574 Old 04-26-2012, 03:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes theyre expensive. I just wanted to comment on your projector mounting in the rear soffit.

If your zooming, the projector lens elevation must fall within the projected image. It looks like your projector will be way up close to ceiling and in that case so will the top edge of your screen.

Thanks for the feedback. Is it the top edge of the lens that needs to be at or below the top of the screen when zooming? Is this true for all PJ's or is it possible to have zooming and vertical shifting at the same time?
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post #89 of 574 Old 04-26-2012, 03:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 235 View Post

Thanks for the feedback. Is it the top edge of the lens that needs to be at or below the top of the screen when zooming? Is this true for all PJ's or is it possible to have zooming and vertical shifting at the same time?


I'm not aware of any that have power lens shift and memory. I'd plan on the whole lens its only a couple inches......

First step is deciding on screen size, then calculating optimum viewing angle which will determine height of screen top edge and the mounting elevation....
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post #90 of 574 Old 05-03-2012, 11:05 PM - Thread Starter
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So my HVAC plans have left a few lingering questions. Hopefully I can get some opinions on some of these:

1) I plan on an inline centrifugal fan (180-200 CFM with variable speed control) drawing from the 2 return ducts (dampers to select high/low register). The supply ducts have the option of drawing from the air handler or from an adjacent room via 2 powered dampers. In situations where the air handler is kicking out heat for the house but the room needs cooling then the supply will come from the adjacent room rather than the 90 degree heat from the furnace.
Should my exhaust fan dump directly into the main HVAC return or rather into an adjacent room? If a 200 CFM fan is blowing into the main HVAC return which already has lower pressure because main fan is ON then does it effectively become more than 200 CFM overall (logarithmic math maybe)?

2) At about 17', will my PJ be too far from an AT CIH screen (120-130") to provide enough brightness (will be zooming)? I know it depends on PJ but just wondering if I'm getting into a higher class of PJ just to satisfy mounting in rear soffit. If that's the case, I may consider mounting PJ from ceiling and adjusting return ducts for venting.

3) Can I leave the return opening next to the PJ wide open or do I need a register. Is the register just for aesthetics reasons? Any suggestions on diffusers for a supply run that is rectangular and 51"sq?

4) At 200 CFM the room would be getting about 6 exchanges per hour. Sound about right for a well insulated, windowless, basement, equipmentless, six peopleless...type of room-ish This would also give me just over 250 FPM at the diffusers.
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