Placement Advice Needed - I-Beam runs parallel to Screen wall on low ceiling - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 10 Old 07-21-2012, 03:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Any advice would be much appreciated, as this is my 1st foray into the HT Projector experience. The HT is in a section of my basement that's the only logical area for the setup, and the dimensions are fine for my preferences. The ceiling is sheetrock, and somewhat lower than ideal, but my real dilemma is a structural I-Beam that sits 8" below ceiling height, parallel to the screen wall in the projection path (see diagram).

The accompanying diagram - although a bit elementary - should be relatively explanatory. I'll do my best to explain my preferred viewing parameters and include other factors that may be helpful in finding the best possible solution to this problem, but I believe my options are really limited.

1. My projector choices have been pared down to either the Epson 5010, BenQ-W7000, or the Panasonic-AE7000. I prefer a DLP unit, but placement flexibility is mostly limited in this price range.

2. The room is configured strictly for a ceiling mount, or a rear-wall shelf if needed, but I want to try to avoid the shelf mount. I'm aiming for a 120" screen, but may decide on a 2:35 (as big as would be feasable on a 12' wall). This would make the Panasonic my logical option, I believe.

3. My room is completely light-controlled, will have 2 rows of 3 HT Chairs, the back row on a 12" riser with a 7" step-up. I like to sit close, so the 1st row will be approximately 12' from the screen. The 2nd row of seats (excluding the riser step-up) will be under the soffit, but will not be used that often.







My current idea is to ceiling mount directly in front of the soffit with a short extension, to just barely clear the beam and place the image as high on the wall as possible. This would be about a 14' throw and feels like my best option. I want to avoid using Keystone and do the best I can with the Lens Shift and Zoom features. I've wondered about tilting the PJ slightly upward, but this would merit a lower mounting and possible image issues. I can also flush mount the pojector below the soffit, with a throw between 15-18', but this will be closer than I'd like to a back seat viewer. My last known option is to shelf-mount on the back wall, which would be a 19' throw and still only as high as the bottom of the soffit. I want to avoid this if possible.

Questions:

1. Are there any options I haven't thought of to make this work? I assume Vertical Lens Shift is my most important factor in choosing the projector.

2. With the beam sitting between 9' from the lens and 6.5' from the screen, would a PJ with an offset be helpful here? The Optoma 3300 and many DLP units I've seen have offset lens, including the BenQ I think, but most at this price point don't have Lens Shift or high Zoom numbers.

3. All things considered, am I better off with the Anamorphic screen? If so, what would be the biggest logical size for a 12' wall? I like to feel immersed by the image, as most of my viewing consists of BD/DVD movies plus films and sports on cable. No gaming or PC use at all.


Thanks in advance for any ideas or opinions given. They will be greatly appreciated, as I'm itching to get this thing rolling and for my head to stop spinning. smile.gif

Best,
Rich Primo

"I don't think you fully understand, Bigelow... you've been murdered."
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post #2 of 10 Old 07-21-2012, 04:38 PM
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First you don't tilt a projector that will cause keystoning as you mention. Instead you simply use the lens shift to move the image up or down.

I would mount the projector in front of the soffit as low as you can tolerate. Then use the shift to position the image on the wall. A frequent piece of advice to all first time projection users is to not buy a screen until you've hung your projector and experimented with image sizes on the bare front wall. Sit at your planed viewing distances I sit at less than 11 ft in my front row so 12 is not too close. You need 6 1/2 ft of floor length for the second row if they are reclining seats but you could build your riser a 6 and just pull the front row ahead when you are expecting a crowd. Experiment with 16:9 and 2.35:1 images and decide if you want a wide scope screen.
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post #3 of 10 Old 07-22-2012, 08:27 AM
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You didnt mention how far the screen will be from ceiling top- that will be key to determining if the Ibeam will be an issue.

At 14ft back and 4" BELOW the ibeam, I doubt 8" will be a problem. When you add in the mount, it will be another couple of inches, placing the PJ well below the ibeam.

For the epson- http://www.epson.com/alf_upload/landing/distance-calculator/
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post #4 of 10 Old 07-24-2012, 09:57 AM
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Make sure thAt the second row can see the top of the screen below the beam. I have the same situation and it is very very close if I want to do a large 54" high 1.78 image and have the second row be able to see over the heads of the front row to the bottom of the screen and below the beam to the top of the screen. I am assuming that kidssitting in the back row may need a pillow to see over the first row heads. You may also need to pay very close attention to the height of the front row chairs. This makes a big difference and I will be buying chairs that sit low to the ground.
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post #5 of 10 Old 07-24-2012, 03:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the advice, guys. I have the entire room finished, but I did learn it's best to buy the PJ and Screen as the last things.

Calimark and Jedi - My concern was getting the image as high on the wall as possible despite the beam obstruction. When I tested the setup with both rows and the potential screen marked out, the problem was the back seat view of the bottom of the image. That prompted me to add an additional 5 inches to the seat section of the riser, going from 7" all around to 12" along the chair line, which alleviated that issue.

BIG - Your suggestion was what I thought would be best. I've since installed an outlet in the ceiling in front of the soffit and ran 3 HDMI cables to that spot (you never know, so better to be safe than sorry if one goes bad). I used the latest version of High-Speed Ethernet HDMI "Mediabridge" cables from Amazon, which I've used before with good results, but never on a 30' run. I hope these are okay, but that's for a different thread, I presume (unless you know something that I don't about this brand. I can still change them out if I need to).


The main question now is, since I'll be mounting with the lens at approximately 14' from the screen, how much will the zoom range factor on a 120" diagonal image and/or which projector would be best. For a 120" screen - the calculator says 15.8" for the Panasonic, with 11.9" as the shortest throw, and 16.11" for the BenQ, with 14.1" at the shortest end. I'm assuming this to mean that with the BenQ I'll be using the full amount of zoom possible for the screen size from my distance? If this is the case, would this have much effect on the image quality, and am I better off with the higher zoom models?

Sorry if I'm asking the obvious, but at this point I've been afflicted with "information overload" from trying to take in all the variables involved. There's much more to this than I imagined and I'm getting dizzy up here on the fence. I'm in for the ride now, so I really do appreciate the help and want to thank you all for this.

Rich

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post #6 of 10 Old 07-24-2012, 04:01 PM - Thread Starter
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FWIW - I originally wanted to buy the Optoma HD33, as it was well rated and I thought it would be a perfect "entry level" unit for a 1st timer who likes to upgrade pretty often. Much of what I've looked into was regarding this model. The offset, which is 9.4" at my distance for screen size, seemed impossible to ceiling-mount with the I-Beam issue, so I crossed it off my list. Now I'm wondering at what distance to the beam would the offset come into play? In other words, at 9' from the beam, could I mount the unit a bit above the bottom of the beam and have the full image hit the screen at the beam height without Lens Shift? At what distance from the lens would the offset start to descend, and what causes an offset anyway?

I know it would be trial and error and take some testing out, but at this point I'm beyond the option to floor mount (which would have been perfect). It's just that the Optoma is the best projector for my distance, as the suggested throw distance is almost exactly where I need it to be, and based on many opinions, it's a damn good projector for the price. Sorry to babble on, but I really want to get this thing up and running. mad.gif

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post #7 of 10 Old 07-25-2012, 08:39 AM
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Without adding more info overload.....there are tons of things to consider in the PJ. you are only scratching the surface (placement). You have to consider lighting conditions, screen gain, pJ brightess in given 'modes'.

You dont want to get a PJ that just qualifies (throw/zoom etc), because if you do replace it, you may be hard pressed to find the same specs.

Remember the closer the mount, the brighter the image. The amount of zoom used also affects the brightness. I personally have not seen any quality issues with zoom, but check the PJ sections on the board for more info.

Also the PJ section may be better able ot advise on this specific problem. or just buy and try :-) 30 day return policy is nice feature.
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post #8 of 10 Old 07-25-2012, 01:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by calimark View Post

Without adding more info overload.....there are tons of things to consider in the PJ. you are only scratching the surface (placement). You have to consider lighting conditions, screen gain, pJ brightess in given 'modes'.
You dont want to get a PJ that just qualifies (throw/zoom etc), because if you do replace it, you may be hard pressed to find the same specs.
Remember the closer the mount, the brighter the image. The amount of zoom used also affects the brightness. I personally have not seen any quality issues with zoom, but check the PJ sections on the board for more info.
Also the PJ section may be better able ot advise on this specific problem. or just buy and try :-) 30 day return policy is nice feature.



Thanks, Calimark... what I've highlighted in your post is exactly what I'm going to do. I think I've figured out my mistake on the zoom issue that I asked about. Based on the possible projectors and screen I'm considering, I've already factored in the other aspects you mentioned, through endless reading of reviews and users' thoughts on these forums. This is all fine for a "newbie" like me on absorbing the technical information, such as (true) lumens, black levels, screen gain, etc.

What I did notice was that many swear by the particular brand/model that they own, (even reviewer Art admits a bias toward Epson and black levels), which is okay for their own preference, but doesn't equate to what I would like. What opinions I did take away from all this on the models I've boiled it down to are (along with a need for flexible placement) that I would like high contrast levels, nice out-of-box calibration, plus a CMS and basically the best possible image for what I pay.

I'm pretty certain I would prefer a DLP-based unit, but most I've looked into lacked the features for my setup restrictions. Like I said earlier and you expounded on, it'll be trial and error for me and the 30-day return policy is a nice feature. Thanks again for taking the time to lend your advice, as it's much appreciated.

Best,
Rich

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post #9 of 10 Old 07-25-2012, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richieprimo View Post

Thanks, Calimark... what I've highlighted in your post is exactly what I'm going to do. I think I've figured out my mistake on the zoom issue that I asked about. Based on the possible projectors and screen I'm considering, I've already factored in the other aspects you mentioned, through endless reading of reviews and users' thoughts on these forums. This is all fine for a "newbie" like me on absorbing the technical information, such as (true) lumens, black levels, screen gain, etc.
What I did notice was that many swear by the particular brand/model that they own, (even reviewer Art admits a bias toward Epson and black levels), which is okay for their own preference, but doesn't equate to what I would like. What opinions I did take away from all this on the models I've boiled it down to are (along with a need for flexible placement) that I would like high contrast levels, nice out-of-box calibration, plus a CMS and basically the best possible image for what I pay.
I'm pretty certain I would prefer a DLP-based unit, but most I've looked into lacked the features for my setup restrictions. Like I said earlier and you expounded on, it'll be trial and error for me and the 30-day return policy is a nice feature. Thanks again for taking the time to lend your advice, as it's much appreciated.
Best,
Rich

Pardon me for not reading all of the thread, but what are you looking for in a projector, besides what you stated above. In other words is the primary focus of the projector movies or sports or gaming or TV. I somewhat know your budget, since you have listed several projectors. If you would like to shoot us an email, we would be happy to make recommendations that would fit your situation.

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post #10 of 10 Old 07-25-2012, 09:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

Pardon me for not reading all of the thread, but what are you looking for in a projector, besides what you stated above. In other words is the primary focus of the projector movies or sports or gaming or TV. I somewhat know your budget, since you have listed several projectors. If you would like to shoot us an email, we would be happy to make recommendations that would fit your situation.


PM has been sent, Mike.

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