Moving past 7.1 into 9.1/11.x/3D ObjectAudio in HT via AudysseyDSX/DolbyPLIIz/DTS Neo:X™/Auro-3D - Page 30 - AVS Forum
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post #871 of 893 Old 05-09-2014, 08:29 PM
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What are the pro's and cons of an Altitude vs a Datasat? Have you tried both?
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post #872 of 893 Old 05-10-2014, 02:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Kwikas View Post

What are the pro's and cons of an Altitude vs a Datasat? Have you tried both?



Datasat




Pros: It can do Auro, NEO X and has an open architecture, excellent DACs, great company support. A professional product modded for home. It has a very sophisticated room correction (DIRAC) and from all reviews here at AVS and in various review sites, is the gold standard SSP currently. Easily design/modify target curve
Cons: Price with Auro, mic ($22K) and only 1 HDMI out. Up to 24 channels. Can do active crossovers. Very good mic for auto set up.

Trinnov Altitude




Pros: Uses the most sophisticated room correction - regarded as best my many observers (including myself as I had a 2 month trial or similar Trinnov MC). Will have Auro, NEO X, and will be open architecture (for future Atmos), etc. 8 HDMI 2 Outs. Up to 48 channels. Can do active crossovers. Good mic for auto set up. Most tweakable of any room correction device. Great support and calibration via VNC remotely from Trinnov is included.

Cons: Not yet available (Sept/Oct). Very expensive Price (~$27K but could be more or less) always a worry buying a 1st gen processor (though Trinnov Room Correction has been around awhile and is very stable - HDMI is new to Trinnov).

There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #873 of 893 Old 05-11-2014, 05:07 PM
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Originally posted by thebland

Datasat

Pros: It can do Auro, NEO X and has an open architecture, excellent DACs, great company support. A professional product modded for home. It has a very sophisticated room correction (DIRAC) and from all reviews here at AVS and in various review sites, is the gold standard SSP currently. Easily design/modify target curve
Cons: Price with Auro, mic ($22K) and only 1 HDMI out. Up to 24 channels. Can do active crossovers. Very good mic for auto set up.

Trinnov Altitude

Pros: Uses the most sophisticated room correction - regarded as best my many observers (including myself as I had a 2 month trial or similar Trinnov MC). Will have Auro, NEO X, and will be open architecture (for future Atmos), etc. 8 HDMI 2 Outs. Up to 48 channels. Can do active crossovers. Good mic for auto set up. Most tweakable of any room correction device. Great support and calibration via VNC remotely from Trinnov is included.

Cons: Not yet available (Sept/Oct). Very expensive Price (~$27K but could be more or less) always a worry buying a 1st gen processor (though Trinnov Room Correction has been around awhile and is very stable - HDMI is new to Trinnov).

Thanks for posting such a comprehensive reply and it clears up a number of questions I've had about these two competing technologies.

So, what are you doing as regards readying your cinema for Auro or Atmos in-so-far as speaker placement/addition is concerned?

You've mentioned the 5 Seaton Catalysts which are all fronts - right? What about front heights and surrounds? What are you planning or using for these? Have you got as far as thinking about over heads and rear/side heights for Auro implementation?

Atmos for home is still sometime off I think.......
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post #874 of 893 Old 05-11-2014, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kwikas View Post

Thanks for posting such a comprehensive reply and it clears up a number of questions I've had about these two competing technologies.

So, what are you doing as regards readying your cinema for Auro or Atmos in-so-far as speaker placement/addition is concerned?

You've mentioned the 5 Seaton Catalysts which are all fronts - right? What about front heights and surrounds? What are you planning or using for these? Have you got as far as thinking about over heads and rear/side heights for Auro implementation?

Atmos for home is still sometime off I think.......

Hi.

I have 5 Seaton Submersives. Not Catalysts.

I'm planning an 11.5 set up. Auro set up. 7.1 + 2 front heights and 2 side heights. Using Quested speakers and amps.

Look for Dolby announcement at CEDIA.
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post #875 of 893 Old 05-12-2014, 03:06 AM
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post #876 of 893 Old 05-12-2014, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

Datasat




Pros: It can do Auro, NEO X and has an open architecture, excellent DACs, great company support. A professional product modded for home. It has a very sophisticated room correction (DIRAC) and from all reviews here at AVS and in various review sites, is the gold standard SSP currently. Easily design/modify target curve
Cons: Price with Auro, mic ($22K) and only 1 HDMI out. Up to 24 channels. Can do active crossovers. Very good mic for auto set up.

Trinnov Altitude




Pros: Uses the most sophisticated room correction - regarded as best my many observers (including myself as I had a 2 month trial or similar Trinnov MC). Will have Auro, NEO X, and will be open architecture (for future Atmos), etc. 8 HDMI 2 Outs. Up to 48 channels. Can do active crossovers. Good mic for auto set up. Most tweakable of any room correction device. Great support and calibration via VNC remotely from Trinnov is included.

Cons: Not yet available (Sept/Oct). Very expensive Price (~$27K but could be more or less) always a worry buying a 1st gen processor (though Trinnov Room Correction has been around awhile and is very stable - HDMI is new to Trinnov).

Nice hopefully one day these will come down to earth! I think not but then again, Kaleidescape has in some limited fashion.
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post #877 of 893 Old 05-15-2014, 05:48 PM
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this is cool but the cost alone for a decent 7.1 to 9.1 is at least 1-2k in speaker and amps another 1.2k from 9.1 to 11.1 then if you have a older system timber matching the new speakers plus a new preamp

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post #878 of 893 Old 06-24-2014, 10:38 AM
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Well Atmos has been announced for two days now, products on their way to a Home Theater near you.


What does this mean for DTS? Will MDA be soon to follow? Or will they cling to Neo:X, of which I own a processor using it.


Exciting times indeed gentlemen. These are new water for Home Theater enthusiasts. We are making a giant leap into X,Y,Z.
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post #879 of 893 Old 06-24-2014, 10:44 AM
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post #880 of 893 Old 06-24-2014, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by theirishgonzo View Post
this is cool but the cost alone for a decent 7.1 to 9.1 is at least 1-2k in speaker and amps another 1.2k from 9.1 to 11.1 then if you have a older system timber matching the new speakers plus a new preamp

I fear to say, that those estimates may even be considered low.


Upgrading to more than 7 speakers, required amps per channel, and then processor requires a commitment that is a No Fear level of drive. Of course, much can be done on any budget, but results for which we dream of, take a pound of flesh too.


My buddy reminds me this is a Sport of Kings. Though I doubt many royalty are into Home Theater, I understand the sentiment.


Now, if I could find a way to get my dogs to earn money while I am away at work, I would have another two incomes to count!
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post #881 of 893 Old 06-24-2014, 11:15 AM
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With Atmos now on the field, and my current Neo:X at the plate, how should I be approaching wide speakers?


At current placement, my wides have brought a lot to the movie experience, but will they be adopted by other technologies such as MDA, or Atmos, and Auro-3D?


Not to sure if the investment in wide speakers is necessarily worth while? Thoughts?
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post #882 of 893 Old 06-24-2014, 12:40 PM
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With Atmos now on the field, and my current Neo:X at the plate, how should I be approaching wide speakers?
Looks like "not at all", as the first gen atmos@home seems to support either Neo:X or DSX 11.x speaker placements only, not both at once for 13.x. So you're cool for now.
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post #883 of 893 Old 06-24-2014, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by zuluwalker View Post
Well Atmos has been announced for two days now, products on their way to a Home Theater near you.


What does this mean for DTS? Will MDA be soon to follow? Or will they cling to Neo:X, of which I own a processor using it.


Exciting times indeed gentlemen. These are new water for Home Theater enthusiasts. We are making a giant leap into X,Y,Z.
I personally would wait a little while to buy an Atmos avr. Especially since the only ones out are the Onkyo's. The format might change and those Onkyo avr's that have Atmos don't have auddy xt32. i would wait to see what Denon/Marantz has to offer.
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post #884 of 893 Old 06-24-2014, 09:58 PM
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Originally posted by Pain Infliction.

I personally would wait a little while to buy an Atmos avr. Especially since the only ones out are the Onkyo's. The format might change and those Onkyo avr's that have Atmos don't have auddy xt32. i would wait to see what Denon/Marantz has to offer.


Probably good advice. I'm personally feeling a little underwhelmed by the Atmos receiver offerings that we've just read about. I think there may potentially be some better object based solutions coming from SRS. Time will tell though.....
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post #885 of 893 Old 06-24-2014, 10:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kwikas View Post
Originally posted by Pain Infliction.

I personally would wait a little while to buy an Atmos avr. Especially since the only ones out are the Onkyo's. The format might change and those Onkyo avr's that have Atmos don't have auddy xt32. i would wait to see what Denon/Marantz has to offer.


Probably good advice. I'm personally feeling a little underwhelmed by the Atmos receiver offerings that we've just read about. I think there may potentially be some better object based solutions coming from SRS. Time will tell though.....
You mean, DTS.

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post #886 of 893 Old 06-24-2014, 11:51 PM
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You mean, DTS.

Yeah Dan. DTS it is.


I don't know. After reading about what's been proposed by Onkyo for Atmos equipped receivers, I just expected more. And I don't think Marantz et al will be that much different from Onkyo but of course that's pure speculation on my part at the moment.

Maybe I'd hyped it up in my own mind too much. I really wanted/expected to see a domestic Atmos type configuration with a higher speaker count (like an Auro 13.1 over head lay out).


It seems to me that Dolby have made this as simple an option as possible to get into the domestic market. I just think it could have been so much more - although I do understand the consumer wallet argument.


Anyway, hopefully the other competing technologies are close behind so it's not as though we'll have to choose the Dolby object based technology if we think another offering is better.........rant off.
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post #887 of 893 Old 06-25-2014, 03:50 AM
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OUTPUT REQUIREMENTS OF HEIGHT SPEAKERS?

The way the speakers are described, the heights in particular, they will be low power and low output due to size and the fact that they are in ceiling.

I may've gone over board but all my speakers in my Quasi- 11.5 system will reach over 105 db at the listening position
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post #888 of 893 Old 07-26-2014, 08:26 PM
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I'm surprised this thread hasn't gone nuts after the ATMOS announcement.

Was a definitive choice between heights and wides ever made? If you guys have to give up either rears vs. wides for ATMOS (I assume heights would be redundant), which are you going to give up? It seems the cost differential between 7.2.4 and 9.2.4 is pretty high for the first gen of AVRs.

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post #889 of 893 Old 07-26-2014, 08:38 PM
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If you guys have to give up either rears vs. wides for ATMOS (I assume heights would be redundant), which are you going to give up?
Starting with a 5.1 set-up, I would add speaker pairs in the following order: rears, front heights, rear heights, then wides. I get enough phantom imaging between my fronts and sides that wides would be lowest on my priority list. Not that I wouldn't use them, but there are other locations I would fill in first.
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post #890 of 893 Old 07-26-2014, 08:47 PM
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I assumed the heights would be covered by ATMOS. Is that not the case?

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post #891 of 893 Old 07-26-2014, 08:58 PM
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I assumed the heights would be covered by ATMOS. Is that not the case?
So are wides. But I would give them up for Atmos, since they are low on my priority list.

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post #892 of 893 Old 07-28-2014, 05:43 PM
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I am going to follow Floyd Toole's suggestion and put the Surrounds @ +/-75° and the Rear Surrounds @ +/- 135°. This way, the need for Wides is no longer there. I just tweaked the layout and it seems perfect, no wide gap in front. There's a 90° spacing between both Rears, but that is also in line with what Toole suggests...

This leaves room for 4 Top speakers in 7.2.4 configuration.
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post #893 of 893 Old 07-28-2014, 05:51 PM
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Wowzers?!?!?!


This?


Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post
Quote:Originally Posted by Kwikas

Trinnov Altitude




Pros: Uses the most sophisticated room correction - regarded as best my many observers (including myself as I had a 2 month trial or similar Trinnov MC). Will have Auro, NEO X, and will be open architecture (for future Atmos), etc. 8 HDMI 2 Outs. Up to 48 channels. Can do active crossovers. Good mic for auto set up. Most tweakable of any room correction device. Great support and calibration via VNC remotely from Trinnov is included.

Cons: Not yet available (Sept/Oct). Very expensive Price (~$27K but could be more or less) always a worry buying a 1st gen processor (though Trinnov Room Correction has been around awhile and is very stable - HDMI is new to Trinnov).

or this?

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