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Old 02-01-2013, 08:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Current Status of The Spud Cellar:


Finalizing Layout




My Home Theater and Game Room Build -- IN PROGRESS
THE SPUD CELLAR

Last edited by sillywilly; 07-06-2014 at 10:26 AM.
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Old 02-01-2013, 08:23 PM - Thread Starter
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INTRODUCTION:

I started the original (but now defunct) Spud Cellar build (As seen HERE) in May 2012 with plans to have a smaller (11' x 17') room be the theater room with a wall-mounted plasma and a retractable AT screen. The larger room (13'6" x 27'3") the basement was going to be used as a play room . It was to have a computer desk/nook and under-stairs play area for the kids and the rest of the room for multi-purpose family use.

Over time, we found that our needs and plans have changed and we have now completely flipped the rooms so now the larger room will serve as the theater room and the smaller room will serve as a game/play room.

So since the previous discussions in the original build thread do not completely apply to the new plan, I started a new thread.

I haven't seen any theaters from Idaho so I decided to represent with THE SPUD CELLAR

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THE SPUD CELLAR
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Old 02-01-2013, 08:23 PM - Thread Starter
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My Home Theater and Game Room Build -- IN PROGRESS
THE SPUD CELLAR
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Old 02-01-2013, 08:23 PM - Thread Starter
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The Space:
Unfinished basement that is 1815 sqft. There are 3 bedrooms, one bathroom, large room (currently 27'-6" x 13'-6") that will become the theater room. In this room there is an under-stairs playspace with a small loft. There is a smaller adjoining room (11 x 17) that will be used for game room, play room, reading room and general TV watching. Behind the theater room is currently a 9'-6" x 13'-6" storage area and an additional 6'-4" x 7'-10" storage space. These will be used as storage and a tanning room respectively.


This is the original layout of the basement



Design Style and Objectives and Family Needs:
While we have changed our plans on where the theater vs. game room will be, we are still firmly committed to having an open plan between the two rooms where they will not be closed off which also exposes the rooms to the stairs and the main floor. Yes, it is well-understood from previous discussion that this will not allow for soundproofing but we actually don't mind if some sound from the theater room and game rooms travel upstairs to the main living area because they are also an open layout and that just fits our lifestyle. What we do not want is the sound traveling to the far end of the basement and main floor where the bedrooms are all located so our soundproofing efforts will be placed within isolating those rooms instead. We will, however, be treating to ceiling in the theater and game rooms to minimize footfalls from above from entering those rooms. We have already begun consulting directly with The Sound Proofing Company on our plans and needs and are looking forward to working with them.

We ultimately want these 2 rooms to be a multi-purpose area that will typically seat 4 - 6 people comfortably. We anticipate that we will want to adapt the area for different entertaining needs and also want to adapted the area over time to the changes in our family. We want the areas to be able to be BRIGHTLY lit when not in use for movies so other activities can be done in the rooms. Most of all, we want it all to be cozy, inviting, free-flowing and still feel like a home.

Here are the design elements that we are looking to incorporate between the Theater and Game Rooms:
  • BRIGHT lighting scheme when projector not in use
  • Fixed AT Screen with masking
  • Projector
  • Sectional style seating (or other style but NOT theater chairs)
  • Riser with additional seating
  • Bar-style seating for rear
  • AV Rack at rear
  • Gaming – Mostly Wii
  • Under-stairs play area
  • Area to play board games, card games when desired
  • Wall-mounted plasma TV (TV/GameRoom)
  • Air hockey table (TV/Game Room)
  • Reading area (TV/Game Room)
    Computer desk with drawers - This is something my wife really wants but I have not come up with a good solution and could use some brainstorming from the forum.
My solution instead of a computer desk is to have a long counter-style bar at the rear of the theater room instead that the kids can do homework and arts and crafts and can place a laptop there for computing but then also be able to clear everything away and use the counter as a serving table for parties and get-togethers in the theater.


So how would YOU incorporate these things into my space if it were you?


The first thing we decided to do is get a little bit more room in the Theater Room so we are going to push the wall back a few feet into the storage area. The starting dimensions now for the theater room will be 29'-1" x 13'-6". We are also planning on changing the original computer nook at the rear and will use this space for the AV rack. So now our room will look like this:







As I thought about all of our needs, I started to wonder if I could make the rooms a little more flexible to accommodate certain entertaining situations. For example: More or less seating if needed in theater; Move the bar seating if not wanted; Place the game table in either room depending on the situation. What I have come up with as a result is a more portable riser option that can be moved in and out of the room, the seating could be moved between rooms as needed, and the bar seating would be 2-piece to where it can be positioned into a square game table and placed in either room. Certainly this is an unconventional approach so I would love to get some input on the whole idea.


Here are some sample floor plans and renderings of how this might work and look:


Theater Room








Game Room with Portable Riser






Theater Room: 2-Piece Bar seating(3rd Row), Portable Riser with 2nd Row Seating, Front Row seating.
Game Room: Seating and Air hockey









Theater Room: Bar Seating, Front Row Seating.
Game Room: Air Hockey on Portable Riser, Seating in Front









Theater Room: 2-Piece Bar turned together into Game Table, Front Row Seating.
Game Room: Seating with Air Hockey on Riser.










Theater Room: 2nd Row seating on Portable Riser, Front Row Seating.
Game Room: 2-Piece Bar turned together into Game Table, Air Hockey







Theater Room: 2nd Row Seating on Portable Riser, Front Row Seating.
Game Room: Air Hockey in center and 2-Piece Bar Seating moved to rear of room.


My Home Theater and Game Room Build -- IN PROGRESS
THE SPUD CELLAR
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Old 02-01-2013, 08:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Old 02-02-2013, 06:02 AM
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Woot....First poster...Subscribed!

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I never know what to put here.<---- Soon to be build thread.
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Old 02-02-2013, 12:01 PM - Thread Starter
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To clarify before someone posts commenting that I don't know what an Air Hockey table is - my program didn't seem to have a model for an Air Hockey table so I substituted with a pool table to the measurements of our Air Hockey table. I certainly wouldn't want to move a pool table off and on a riser from time to time!

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Old 02-02-2013, 07:45 PM
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Wow, cant wait to see this come together!

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I never know what to put here.<---- Soon to be build thread.
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Old 02-04-2013, 06:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Here are photos of the physical space I have to work with. Are my plans practical? What would you do with the criteria I have?


Theater Room Toward Screen Wall






Theater Room Toward Rear






Theater Room (Left) and Game / TV Room (Right)

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Old 02-05-2013, 07:27 PM - Thread Starter
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With the Theater room dimensions and proposed layouts, where would speaker placement be recommended? I assume 7.1 would be the right configuration. Does placing the sofa/sectional against the wall cause any problems? Where would rear speakers go in a room like this -- Can they go all the way back on the rear wall 27 feet back or so without problem?

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Old 02-06-2013, 09:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Here is a rough conceptual drawing of how the Bar-into-Game Table would work.
The pieces would be Bar height of somewhere between 36 - 43" with bar stools so it can be placed at the rear of the theater and watch/eat from the long bar or watch while playing from the game table at the rear. Again, the main idea here is to be able to adapt to different entertainment scenarios and to save space by not having additional furniture in the room if not needed.




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Old 02-07-2013, 10:07 AM
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I am looking forward to watching this build come together! I like the first layout with the portable riser and the bar seating the best. Having just removed a computer desk and replaced it with a second row bar I can tell you that keeping non theatre room type stuff out of the theatre room really makes the space feel more complete, the desk was just never right and I think a game table would be the same distraction. Other with more knowledge will chime in, but I think the rear speakers would be fine on the back wall, if not then in ceilings as rears. I would definitely plan for 7.1 but also while your in there pre wire for 11.2 for front wides and heights in case that's were you go later. Also I would really look at from the beginning planning for acoustic treatments. Good luck!

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Old 02-08-2013, 06:12 AM
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Looks really well laid out.

I really like the "flex" table/bar. I would be tempted to build your bar in-wall, in the the back wall niche, eliminating the back counter. Then move the av rack,
to the upper area, under the stairs. Not sure if your equipment count will be large, but a small rack could be in the upper section under the stairs, with a drop down section for
rear access. Looks like you should be able to get two rows of seating, and the bar/table. You'll want to choose front speakers so they can handle the throw distance.
I'd be tempted to use in wall speakers for the rear surrounds.

The media room looks incredible. I would use a low couch for the seating and skip the riser entirely. Simpler, cheaper, and you could still move the air hockey out
and a second row of seats in, when needed.

As for a computer area, the hall closet area might be put to work, A shallow depth desktop and wall mounted lcd monitor could increase the width. A bank of
drawers could be recessed into the bedroom closet behind. A nice rolling chair would complete the area.

I'd be tempted to simply use a curtain between the storage and suntanning area. Looks like a U of shelves would give you the same storage and a simpler, wider
aisle. And maybe add a little more room width to the suntanning area. When the day comes that you decide suntanning is history, then the whole space could easily
be given over to storage.

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Old 02-09-2013, 02:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cheezit73 View Post

I am looking forward to watching this build come together! I like the first layout with the portable riser and the bar seating the best. Having just removed a computer desk and replaced it with a second row bar I can tell you that keeping non theatre room type stuff out of the theatre room really makes the space feel more complete, the desk was just never right and I think a game table would be the same distraction. Other with more knowledge will chime in, but I think the rear speakers would be fine on the back wall, if not then in ceilings as rears. I would definitely plan for 7.1 but also while your in there pre wire for 11.2 for front wides and heights in case that's were you go later. Also I would really look at from the beginning planning for acoustic treatments. Good luck!

I agree with you about the computer desk. I would prefer to keep it out of the theater area, even if it is just at the very rear, but that is one that my wife really wants to have there. Maybe the build will have to go on another hiatus for her to change her mind ..... The last time we took a 7 month break, she finally ended up agreeing that the theater and game rooms could/should be switched.

Thanks for the reminder about future pre-wiring. I will plan for 11.2

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Old 02-09-2013, 02:19 PM
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Maybe I missed it, but what is that little doggie door pass through into the space under the stairs for in the theater room?
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Old 02-09-2013, 03:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ADDUpstate View Post

Maybe I missed it, but what is that little doggie door pass through into the space under the stairs for in the theater room?

That area under the stairs has been claimed by the kids since we built in 2005. It is an arched entry to an under-stairs play area. You can see in some pictures/mockups that it is also open at the far end. I wonder if the space where the stairs start to reach the bottom would be a place to possibly put a sub.

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Old 01-05-2014, 11:59 AM - Thread Starter
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After a long break, the build is back on! Unfortunately I haven't been able to do any further work on the theater during that time, but it's good to be able to start moving again

CURRENT NEEDS:
I need to finalize my layout design so I can actually begin to do work on the theater.


CURRENT DESIGN ROADBLOCK:
I am planning on wiring for 7.1 or 7.2 sound. How deep am I supposed to make the speaker columns (Or rather, what I really want to know is how far do speaker columns typically extend INTO the room)?

With my dimensions and planned layout, will I have enough walkway room if I put in columns? The seating will be pretty close to the east wall to allow a necessary walkway on the west side of the room for access into storage and tanning room.
If I don't do columns, what other options are there? Am I doomed to just having 5.1 with just fronts and rears?

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Old 01-11-2014, 06:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Bump for ideas

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Old 01-11-2014, 07:32 PM
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Have you selected the type of speaker you intend to hide inside the column? Here is a link to a space-saving approach.

And some pics of my columns that hide some Triad in-walls. I wound up with a 24-26" wide aisle between corner of column and corner of adjacent seat.




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Old 01-11-2014, 09:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Spaceman ---

Thanks for the reply! Your theater has always been one I've enjoyed.

I have not decided on or purchased any speakers or equipment yet. Yours columns are great! It looks like I could get by with columns that only protrude a small amount like that. Do you find that there is enough room for an aisle that is 24-26"?

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Old 01-11-2014, 10:09 PM
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I don't think I would go much narrower than that, but it certainly doesn't seem tight walking to the back row. The 24" dimension is measured perpendicular to the chair and would be the clearance if the column was directly beside the chair, but since the column is slightly behind the chair, the pinch point is actually 26".
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Old 01-12-2014, 08:18 PM - Thread Starter
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No, I can't go any narrower than that.

I think this is the layout I'm going to do. Where should I do speaker placement for surrounds?


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Old 01-28-2014, 09:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Based on my room measurements, can I center all of the seating and riser in the room and make aisles on each side?

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Old 01-28-2014, 10:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sillywilly View Post

Based on my room measurements, can I center all of the seating and riser in the room and make aisles on each side?

Depends on your final furniture selection, but if you go with a narrow model, you shouldn't have any trouble centering a row of 3 theater recliners in a 13-6" wide room. The finished width of my room is 12'-4" and I have an aisle on each side of 3 seats. I don't have bar seating, so I'm not sure how much room is needed to comfortably fit 4 bar stools.
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Old 02-01-2014, 03:07 PM - Thread Starter
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I need some help understanding sound setup with regard to side surrounds.

Am I correct to understand that in surround setups that you will have a front stage (that is the only place what/where it a 9.x or 11.x becomes more extensive and not elsewhere in the room), rears and just ONE set of surrounds regardless of the number of rows that I have?

If I have a second row and a rear bar seating I don't install more side surrounds for those extra rows, right?

If it is just one set of side surrounds for the whole room like I believe, do I understand correctly that the surrounds are to be either at or slightly behind the my planned main seating area? In my setup I expect the main seating area to be the front sectional seating rather than on the riser. So in my layout, that seems like the correct placement would be about at the walkway space behind the main seating and in front of the riser seating. Am I understanding this correctly?

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Old 02-01-2014, 03:46 PM
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If you go with one set of surround loudspeakers, which is what 99% of everyone does, you have the layout correct, IMO. Put it just behind your main listening position. Everyone else just gets what they get, in terms of sound quality.

If you want to get into using more than the standard set of surround channels, you have some reading to do. First, http://www.avsforum.com/t/1455111/when-are-multiple-side-surrounds-necessary a thread where J_P_A asked basically the same question you did and got some good answers. A few days later another thread was posted and got some more good feedback, especially from Roger Dressler, here: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1488704/having-four-speakers-as-surround-for-two-row/30#post_23771038. A few months later, it came up again. Finally, Nyal Mellor gave what I think is the most clear explanation of what to do to get mutliple side surround channels calibrated properly, here http://www.avsforum.com/t/1493743/processing-for-multiple-surrounds#post_23814755


You can do it however you want, but doing it "right" comes with a pricetag. smile.gif
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Old 03-01-2014, 09:57 PM - Thread Starter
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If you go with one set of surround loudspeakers, which is what 99% of everyone does, you have the layout correct, IMO. Put it just behind your main listening position. Everyone else just gets what they get, in terms of sound quality.

If you want to get into using more than the standard set of surround channels, you have some reading to do. First, http://www.avsforum.com/t/1455111/when-are-multiple-side-surrounds-necessary a thread where J_P_A asked basically the same question you did and got some good answers. A few days later another thread was posted and got some more good feedback, especially from Roger Dressler, here: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1488704/having-four-speakers-as-surround-for-two-row/30#post_23771038. A few months later, it came up again. Finally, Nyal Mellor gave what I think is the most clear explanation of what to do to get mutliple side surround channels calibrated properly, here http://www.avsforum.com/t/1493743/processing-for-multiple-surrounds#post_23814755


You can do it however you want, but doing it "right" comes with a pricetag. smile.gif

Thank you for those links. They were each helpful reading.

I wish "right" didn't always have that darn price tag.

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Old 03-23-2014, 11:16 AM - Thread Starter
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I know people put wood sheets on their theater room floors to lower the room's noise floor levels but don't know much about how this is done and if there is other reason and value in doing it.

Do you use OSB or is it some other material? My room is in the basement so it is concrete base. Do you just cut it to fit and lay it in or do you affix it to the concrete with something like liquid nails or place Green Glue to add more dampening? Is there any other reason other than improving noise floor that I should do that underlayment? -- For example, I imagine it would also help prevent conduction of cold from the concrete into the carpet which would help make the room not feel so cold and "basement-y"

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Old 03-23-2014, 12:16 PM
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aside from any acoustic value, the increased warmth and improved feel underfoot makes installing a raised subfloor over your concrete one of the best upgrades you can make to your remodel. There are several ways of going about it: The "mike holmes" method involving 1" rigid sheet insulation laid down first, then covered with 5/8" underlayment, screwed into the concrete floor with Tapcon screws. The Dri Core method which uses 2' square tongue and groove tiles made up of a plastic cleating sybstem attached to a 5/8" OSB layer. Or a hybrid of the two using Delta FL or Planton underlayment covered with a layer of 3/4" T&G screwed in place The DriCore system can be floated, unlike the other tweo which involve mechanically fastening the flooring down, which is less likely to "click" or "squeak" when walked upon. (Not saying it's impossible to have a silent DriCore floor, it just seems it would take some patience to shim everything perfectly if your floor isn't very level, especially since you have far more joints to deal with)
Advantages and disadvantages to each, depends on your particular install and abilities. How likely is water ingress a problem? How many odd angles and obstacles do you have to shape pieces to conform to? How much do like to deal with full 4'x8' sheets of subflooring versus lots of smaller tiles? How level is the existing floor?

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Old 03-23-2014, 05:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weaselfest View Post

aside from any acoustic value, the increased warmth and improved feel underfoot makes installing a raised subfloor over your concrete one of the best upgrades you can make to your remodel. There are several ways of going about it: The "mike holmes" method involving 1" rigid sheet insulation laid down first, then covered with 5/8" underlayment, screwed into the concrete floor with Tapcon screws. The Dri Core method which uses 2' square tongue and groove tiles made up of a plastic cleating sybstem attached to a 5/8" OSB layer. Or a hybrid of the two using Delta FL or Planton underlayment covered with a layer of 3/4" T&G screwed in place The DriCore system can be floated, unlike the other tweo which involve mechanically fastening the flooring down, which is less likely to "click" or "squeak" when walked upon. (Not saying it's impossible to have a silent DriCore floor, it just seems it would take some patience to shim everything perfectly if your floor isn't very level, especially since you have far more joints to deal with)
Advantages and disadvantages to each, depends on your particular install and abilities. How likely is water ingress a problem? How many odd angles and obstacles do you have to shape pieces to conform to? How much do like to deal with full 4'x8' sheets of subflooring versus lots of smaller tiles? How level is the existing floor?

Water ingress is not a problem, floor is relatively level, minor number of angles if it is just in my theater room... if it is done throughout the basement, then there would be a large amount of angles. Is this something people would do for their complete basement to increase the warmth and feel underfoot?

What is the difference in cost of each method you mentioned? Which is easier to do? Which is considered more preferable or standard?

My Home Theater and Game Room Build -- IN PROGRESS
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