Shermer Theater - Page 22 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #631 of 667 Old 05-25-2015, 12:43 PM - Thread Starter
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funny - fortunately for us we just signed another one year lease for our old property so there's no danger of this space actually being needed for construction any time soon.
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post #632 of 667 Old 06-12-2015, 12:23 PM - Thread Starter
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can someone decode this for me? What is this guy selling and why would I want it / not want it?

http://chicago.craigslist.org/nwi/ele/5069468074.html
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post #633 of 667 Old 06-12-2015, 12:37 PM
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Dude - run AWAY from this....quickly. The speakers and subs are still usable and not 'dated' per-se, but the receiver and processor are beyond ancient and would not fit your needs. There are so many ways you can do more with new equipment and just a bit more budget than what is being presented.
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post #634 of 667 Old 06-12-2015, 12:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TMcG View Post
Dude - run AWAY from this....quickly. The speakers and subs are still usable and not 'dated' per-se, but the receiver and processor are beyond ancient and would not fit your needs. There are so many ways you can do more with new equipment and just a bit more budget than what is being presented.
yah I wasn't considering buying it but I'm trying to learn why this is not useful for me?
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post #635 of 667 Old 06-12-2015, 06:57 PM
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The receiver is not useful for any modern or recent sources. It has no digital inputs, and it can't decode any multichannel audio stream. The only way it would be useful for anything other than stereo is if you have a blu-ray player or DVD player with analog multi-channel output - which is a pretty niche feature.

So if you wanted a stereo amp/receiver for analog playback (including phono, which is getting hard to find integrated like this) it's fine. Otherwise, it's pretty much a boat anchor.

I could see how someone would use it to replace the speakers in a TV, but still you could get something a couple years newer (like the ten-year-old HTiB I have) which has Dolby PLII which allows the stereo analog signal - which is easy to get out of any TV - to be spread out into five channels.
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post #636 of 667 Old 06-20-2015, 04:30 AM - Thread Starter
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So just to be clear I'm not buying this - too much money and I'm nowhere near being ready to build my theater but what do the more knowledgable folks say about this?

http://chicago.craigslist.org/nwi/ele/5083060551.html
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post #637 of 667 Old 06-20-2015, 02:57 PM
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Most people in this this forum would tend to suggest getting three identical front speakers to get the best audio. The horizontal center has some performance comprises that you pay for for the convenience of not using an acoustically transparent screen. Second, though those Polks look decent, I think Polks tend to be overpriced for what you get. You end up paying a lot for all of their advertising. Have a look at the DIY Soundgroup offerings for some very good high value speakers.

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post #638 of 667 Old 07-15-2015, 01:51 PM - Thread Starter
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anyone know of any great step by step riser build pages?

we're exploring the idea of a temporary riser for our theater.

so far I've captured some pretty good images from White Oaks and from the Budget Theater thread. Just looking for more.
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post #639 of 667 Old 07-21-2015, 06:36 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm having a riser built - 8' by 5' by 12" tall - anyone know how much insulation I will need to fill it and what kind I should buy?
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post #640 of 667 Old 07-21-2015, 07:35 AM
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Pink fluffy insulation is fine. You won't be able to use it as a bass trap, but it should help in taming some resonances from the riser. Make sure you put roofing felt under the riser to protect the wood from the concrete.

As to how much, I'd say at least R19 but you could fill it if you wanted to. I'm not sure how much incremental benefit you'll get with more insulation. Insulation hangers like these are a good cheap way to make sure you insulation doesn't fall and come in contact with the ground. May not be an issue if your new riser is only temporary, but I'm always concerned about mold.

As an aside, a riser is not that difficult to build. If you have a circular saw and a drill, you can knock it out in an afternoon. It would be a good first DIY construction project.

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post #641 of 667 Old 07-21-2015, 08:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Thank you for your thoughts - much appreciated. A couple things :

Quote:
Originally Posted by BllDo View Post
Pink fluffy insulation is fine. You won't be able to use it as a bass trap, but it should help in taming some resonances from the riser. Make sure you put roofing felt under the riser to protect the wood from the concrete.
1) this is a temporary riser that will sit on an old remnant of carpet so the issues with mold or concrete - seems okay...?

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As to how much, I'd say at least R19 but you could fill it if you wanted to. I'm not sure how much incremental benefit you'll get with more insulation. Insulation hangers like these are a good cheap way to make sure you insulation doesn't fall and come in contact with the ground. May not be an issue if your new riser is only temporary, but I'm always concerned about mold.
2) is it just one layer of insulation I need to throw in there or stack it to the top?

Is this what I'm looking at? Will this fill it? I literally have no idea.

http://www.menards.com/main/p-2771806-c-5780.htm

Quote:
Originally Posted by BllDo View Post
As an aside, a riser is not that difficult to build. If you have a circular saw and a drill, you can knock it out in an afternoon. It would be a good first DIY construction project.
3) I appreciate the irony of a guy who doesn't do tools in any way, shape, or form (me) participating in this forum but that's kind of where we're at. We don't even own a circular saw - we do have a table saw that we bought used cheaply on craigslist so that my wife can cut shelves or whatever else. I literally cringe every time she uses it. Not to turn this into a weird psychology session, but I just absolutely hate everything that I make that is DIY - I think it looks like crap and I can't stand to look at it. If someone else does the work and they screw it up, I'm fine with that because I don't know how they screwed it up (unless they did a REAL bad job).

Hey finally, I think this guy's design drawing calls for 1/4" plywood over the top - it really needs to be 3/4", doesn't it?

We're planning on wrapping it with cheap carpet or fabric ourselves.
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post #642 of 667 Old 07-21-2015, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRock3x8 View Post
Thank you for your thoughts - much appreciated. A couple things :



1) this is a temporary riser that will sit on an old remnant of carpet so the issues with mold or concrete - seems okay...?
Carpet on bare concrete can mold too. The carpet should keep the insulation and wood dry, but there is still a risk. How much will depend on your basement and how long you plan to keep it there. I'm not saying don't do it, just keep an eye out for moisture and musty smells.

Quote:
2) is it just one layer of insulation I need to throw in there or stack it to the top?

Is this what I'm looking at? Will this fill it? I literally have no idea.

http://www.menards.com/main/p-2771806-c-5780.htm
R-19 is about 6" thick. For your 12" riser, you could either double up the R-19 or get R-38 which is 12" thick. You could also just put one layer of R-19 and have an air space. You may get an additional benefit from filling it up, but I question how much. The insulation for this purpose will just be to keep the riser from resonating like a drum when someone walks on or when there is big bass notes in the soundtrack. I don't mean this to be insulting, just honest, but with your current setup, I might even skip the insulation altogether. This is a temporary riser and you don't have a stack of 18" subs in your room. I really don't think you'll hear any benefit to it at all.

Quote:
3) I appreciate the irony of a guy who doesn't do tools in any way, shape, or form (me) participating in this forum but that's kind of where we're at. We don't even own a circular saw - we do have a table saw that we bought used cheaply on craigslist so that my wife can cut shelves or whatever else. I literally cringe every time she uses it. Not to turn this into a weird psychology session, but I just absolutely hate everything that I make that is DIY - I think it looks like crap and I can't stand to look at it. If someone else does the work and they screw it up, I'm fine with that because I don't know how they screwed it up (unless they did a REAL bad job).
I can appreciate your point of view. Not everyone is handy. I know a guy that won't even change light bulbs. He just doesn't have sort of mechanical sensibility about him. The guy is unbelievable smart, but give him a screwdriver and blood will be shed. For me, I have to live my Red Green's motto.

Quote:
Hey finally, I think this guy's design drawing calls for 1/4" plywood over the top - it really needs to be 3/4", doesn't it?

We're planning on wrapping it with cheap carpet or fabric ourselves.
You definitely want at least one layer of 3/4". Two with a layer of roofing felt between would be even better. It would be a much firmer top. You can use OSB and save some money. It doesn't need to be actual plywood.

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Last edited by BllDo; 07-21-2015 at 10:51 AM.
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post #643 of 667 Old 07-21-2015, 10:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Again, appreciate the guidance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BllDo View Post
just keep an eye out for moisture and musty smells.
understood - we have white blanket insulation surrounding the entire basement - it is both very comfortable and quite dry down there but I get the point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BllDo View Post
I don't mean this to be insulating, just honest, but with your current setup, I might even skip the insulation altogether. This is a temporary riser and you don't have a stack of 18" subs in your room. I really don't think you'll hear any benefit to it at all.
I assume you meant insulting, not insulating (hee hee!) - if the difference is $20 worth of insulation I think it's worth the added expense / trouble.

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Not everyone is handy.
Things like computers, networking, audio/video, speaker wires, etc - I'll do that all day long because either it works or it doesn't. But wood you're dealing with variance allowances where if you're off an eighth of an inch, well that's okay...that stuff makes me nuts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BllDo View Post
You definitely want at least one layer of 3/4". Two with a layer of roofing felt between would be even better. It would be a much firmer top. You can use OSB and save some money. It doesn't need to be actual plywood.
thanks - got it. will discuss with him.
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post #644 of 667 Old 08-09-2015, 02:26 PM - Thread Starter
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My painfully slow theater build took another step today. We had a guy come out and do a riser for us :

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post #645 of 667 Old 08-10-2015, 10:09 AM
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My painfully slow theater build took another step today. We had a guy come out and do a riser for us :

JRock,

It feels good to be moving forward, doesn't it?

As someone who has had to put plans on hold a couple of times, and who also isn't highly skilled working with construction materials, I want to encourage you to keep plugging along.

Regarding purchasing new vs. used equipment, I personally would shy away from second hand electronics, but used passive speakers might be OK, as speaker technology doesn't seem to advance nearly as rapidly as other consumer electronics.

If you're like me and would be satisfied with last year's model of Blu-Ray players, AVR's etc., then model year clearance might be something to consider. Last fall I bought an open box (un-powered floor model) Denon AVR-X4000 for about half the price of the AVR-X4100 that replaced it.

Also, since you're in a location where shipping isn't a problem, check with forum sponsor AVS for great deals on equipment they carry. (I originally planned to go with AVS until my old AVR failed, prompting my search for a quick local bargain.)

Violating my own principle above, we recently bought a second hand projector and motorized screen from a family who were converting their home theater into a homeschool classroom. . We originally answered their ad because we were interested in the home theater sectional thery were selling. My wife thought buying their projector and screen would be a way to jump start our stalled HT project on the cheap. Although I would have preferred to buy a newer, better projector and to build a larger AT screen, at least this will be a step forward. Waiting until I had time and money for the next stage of our project would have meant sticking with our plasma display at least another year. This will be our first front projection system, and I think living with it for a while will help us make better informed decisions on how to pursue our eventual widescreen AT goals.

Good luck!

Kevin
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post #646 of 667 Old 08-10-2015, 10:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M.T.Nest View Post
JRock,

As someone who has had to put plans on hold a couple of times, and who also isn't highly skilled working with construction materials, I want to encourage you to keep plugging along.

Regarding purchasing new vs. used equipment, I personally would shy away from second hand electronics, but used passive speakers might be OK, as speaker technology doesn't seem to advance nearly as rapidly as other consumer electronics.
Thanks for sharing your experiences - would love to hear what your AT story is. The only thing that keeps me from building an AT screen right now is the fact that it will downsize my screen by about 10-20%.

So far the only things that I've been looking at to buy used is furniture and some speaker packages - I struggle mightily with what people on this forum are willing to spend and what I think is fair value. I have no particular desire to drive my sound system over 80 db, so a lot of what people talk about around here just doesn't apply to me.
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post #647 of 667 Old 08-10-2015, 11:11 AM
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AT Screen Advantages

Quote:
Originally Posted by JRock3x8 View Post
Thanks for sharing your experiences - would love to hear what your AT story is. The only thing that keeps me from building an AT screen right now is the fact that it will downsize my screen by about 10-20%.

So far the only things that I've been looking at to buy used is furniture and some speaker packages - I struggle mightily with what people on this forum are willing to spend and what I think is fair value. I have no particular desire to drive my sound system over 80 db, so a lot of what people talk about around here just doesn't apply to me.
I have a few reasons for wanting to do an AT screen:

1. Speaker placement. I'll be able to place my speakers at more ideal locations, with the center channel's tweeter at the same height as the L & R front speakers's tweeters. This will be slightly above ear level of the first row viewers, and a little below that of the second row.

Until then my center channel will have to sit below the bottom of my non-AT screen, which is not good at all for creating the illusion that the dialog is coming from the image on screen. The bigger the screen, the more apparent this discrepancy becomes.

2. Screen size. In my room, not having to allow room to the left and right of the screen for speakers will allow me to have a wider screen. I may decide that a fourteen foot wide screen would be TOO wide for comfortable viewing from my seating distance, but I am pretty sure I'll want to go wider than the ten feet or so that a non-AT screen would allow.

3. APPARENT screen size. Moving the screen wall farther away from the front wall and closer to seating will make the image appear larger than it would farther away.

But don't let me sway you. Almost everone else on this forum is more knowledgeable on this stuff than I am and can probably provide better advice.

Kevin
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post #648 of 667 Old 08-10-2015, 12:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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I have a few reasons for wanting to do an AT screen:

1. Speaker placement.

2. Screen size.

3. APPARENT screen size.
yah I think we're more or less on the same page. One of my bigger issues is that I need a 16x9 screen for video games - if I needed a 2.35 screen I wouldn't have an issue. If only they made spandex in 120" widths in the material we need...
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post #649 of 667 Old 08-10-2015, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRock3x8 View Post
yah I think we're more or less on the same page. One of my bigger issues is that I need a 16x9 screen for video games - if I needed a 2.35 screen I wouldn't have an issue. If only they made spandex in 120" widths in the material we need...
Dang, how big is your current screen?

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post #650 of 667 Old 08-10-2015, 01:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Dang, how big is your current screen?
honestly it's too big - I can't even use all of it because of how my HVAC is structured.

basically it's 12.5' wide by 6.5' tall - not quite 16x9 but it was super easy to get wood in those lengths so we just built it to that size. We didn't even own a saw when we did that.

I like the largest possible image for the immersion aspect which can also be achieved by sitting closer but whatever

My theater is full of dumb tradeoffs that you wouldn't even think about if you were doing a proper build but everything in my theater is built based on what is/was available in that time in that space.
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post #651 of 667 Old 08-13-2015, 06:18 AM - Thread Starter
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taking a serious look at these recliners. Not even sure that I care about the buttkicker.

http://chicago.craigslist.org/nwi/fuo/5170163576.html
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post #652 of 667 Old 08-13-2015, 09:15 AM
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They look a little rough, but that's a good deal. Buttkickers could be fun, just have to watch the amp. Some of those have started on fire in the past.

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post #653 of 667 Old 08-13-2015, 09:16 AM - Thread Starter
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doesn't matter he sold them to someone else.

sigh. patience, patience.
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post #654 of 667 Old 08-13-2015, 09:26 AM
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Not to hijack, but my wife is making me get rid of my 5 year old black version of this in the very near future for quite cheap.

The bonus is you wouldn't have to deal with a Craigslist person, and you could also come provide me input on my build if you decided you wanted it.
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post #655 of 667 Old 08-13-2015, 09:37 AM - Thread Starter
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yah let me know - willing to discuss
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post #656 of 667 Old 08-14-2015, 10:00 AM
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Do you have a community college nearby?

My suggestion is enroll in a cabinet making workshop/class so you can learn the basics and develop ability to make joints, sand, finish and use various tools. If you can build a cabinet.....you can sure as heck build a theater room!

Besides, great hobby to pick up......saves on your home budget along with inceasing ownership pride. Take the bull by the horn and find a class to take!!!!!!!!!!

There........got it off my chest...........
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post #657 of 667 Old 08-14-2015, 10:04 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Do you have a community college nearby?

My suggestion is enroll in a cabinet making workshop/class so you can learn the basics and develop ability to make joints, sand, finish and use various tools. If you can build a cabinet.....you can sure as heck build a theater room!

Besides, great hobby to pick up......saves on your home budget along with inceasing ownership pride. Take the bull by the horn and find a class to take!!!!!!!!!!

There........got it off my chest...........
I appreciate the thought but I leave my house at 6 am every day and on a GOOD day I get home at 6:30 pm. Between dinner, wife and three kids aged 6-13 that leaves me precisely ZERO time for town meetings, church service opportunities and workshops.

Combine that with a total lack of desire to learn and we land with where I'm at today

I appreciate the thought though really. Maybe 10 years from now it will be different...
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post #658 of 667 Old 08-16-2015, 07:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Somewhat unrelated. We have a leather couch which is seemingly breaking down for no reason. Any ideas?
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post #659 of 667 Old 08-16-2015, 09:16 AM
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Looks like bonded leather losing its binding. Bonded leather, as you may know, is bits and fibers of natural leather bound together with resins or plastics or something (vinyl?) and bonded to an underlayment of woven fabric. Quality control can be spotty in manufacturing. This is fairly common, I think; and there's nothing you can do about it from a practical standpoint. Reupholstering would be the only option most likely.

Natural leather upholstery is much more expensive than bonded leather in most cases - especially, I would suspect, in a sofa, where the sections of leather would need to be so large. I would hazard a guess that any leather sofa available for less than $2000 is bonded - and there's a good chance the cutoff price is a good bit higher than that. I just bought bonded leather for my theater - so it's not like I'm judging or something - it just is what it is.
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post #660 of 667 Old 08-16-2015, 10:11 AM - Thread Starter
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