Sump Pump Failed - HT 2.0 Theater - AVS Forum
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Old 07-28-2013, 01:43 PM - Thread Starter
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My sump pump failed and water came in between the poured concrete walls and the cement floor. My theater room got it the worst.

The insurance company tore everything out (stage, riser, carpet, columns, and 2' of drywall from the bottom up.

So I get to redo it, but I want to put in more sound treatment this time. I am also looking for advice and comments.

Backgrond:
The room is in the basement. It is 17' 4" wide by 26' 6" long. Soffits are 20" deep from the wall and a height of 7'. Center ceiling is 7' 9"

The walls are 2x4 with two layers of 5/8" drywall. There is a 1/2" gap and then another 2x4 wall outside with 5/8" drywall facing the rooms on the other side. So it is physically decoupled. The ceiling does not touch the joists which are at a height of 8' 11" from the floor. The room phsically touches the rest of the house in 3 points. (2 points on the ceiling that are rubber mounted to help support the ceiling and the door jam which touches the room and hallway. The door is 1 5/8" solid core with weather strip and is the weak spot in the room for leaking out noise. I plan to put a 1-2" panel on the door to reduce lf noise leak.

My riser was 2x12 with 3/4" plywood + 1/2" plywood + 3/4" plywood all glued and screwed. This time I'll make it a broadband base trap. So, I'll ue 2x8 on hangers for the internal part of the riser with 4x14 grills on the perimiter. It will be 10' deep with a slight curve inward and the full 17' 4" wide. It will be filled with Roxul Insulation.

Stage:
It will be curved with a long curved step. It will be the same hight as the riser. I'll have a false wall. My screen is 11' 6" wide 2.40:1 with SMX Material. I have Paradigm Studio CC center and Paradim Studio v2 80's for LR. I have two Klipsch RW-12D subs.

I've read alot about acoustic treatments for this and I'm planning on going 2" on the entire front wall and enclosing the speakers to treat those.

I plan on putting in stained oak columns again and having my speakers in them behind acoustical fabric. I had Polk fxi A4 dipoles for my side and rear surrounds, but I am going to go with monopoles this time. They were filled with Roxul as well.

Walls
I plan on Wainscoting about 44" up and with some cut out in the trim framed with acoustic panels covered by fabric in them. The plan was to come out 1". I was then thinking about whether I would cover from the wainscotting to the ceiling in fabric between teh columns and put acoustic panels behind (ala Denis Erskine's beautiful designs) or if I would paint and put up some framed panels. I'm leaking toward the fabric over the entire wall betwen columns. Columns will be 22" wide and about 8-9" deep. The height of the wainscotting wood and above that wood perimeter but fabric inside.

Soffits: Soffits are filled with Roxul. They have 4" cans under them much like the theater I want to model and there is an extended shelf with crown molding and LED rope lighting in it on a Lutron dimmer.

I'll include some pictures of what it looks like now in aother post.

I'l also include a link to the theater I want to model the look after. The front will be similar except that the front will not have the wood panels below the screen.
http://www.electronichouse.com/slideshow/hoty13/14614/1886

Other than the wainscoting, my theater prior to the flood was very similar to this one. I had curtains where the side door panels are but I like the door panels better.

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Old 07-28-2013, 01:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Also of note: I'm a mechanical engineer. I've taken enough sound control courses that I want to try some things on my own. I do realize my limits thought and may want to draw things out and hire out treatemnt advice from EG.


I had 4" chair rail at the height that the wainscoting would run to. I'll have them reuse the rail on the top of the wainscoting.

Here are some pictures of it now. Back.JPG 1126k .JPG file
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File Type: jpg Back.JPG (1.10 MB, 47 views)

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Old 07-28-2013, 01:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Front.JPG 1343k .JPG file
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Old 07-28-2013, 01:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Corner.JPG 1410k .JPG file
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Old 07-28-2013, 02:12 PM - Thread Starter
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I have calculated some of my reflection points. I found a place near Detroit that has the OC 703 for absorbers.

I'm looking for Linacoustic or something Similar (Certainteed) @ 2" for the front wall / screen wall.


I'm also looking for a product like Quest Q-Perf or actually looking for someone who sells Quest Q-Perf.

For the diffuser / absorber I believe I need a few panels
1) 2' X 4' @ 3 Panels
2) 2' x 2' @ 4 Panels

Any suggestions on who to use or how I can purchase Quest products?


My preference is 1" for the absorbtion and diffusing panels. For Absorbtion I'll use the OC703 I'm looking at the following for the OC
1) 2' X 3' @ 12 Panels

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Old 07-28-2013, 02:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Here is a veiw of my back wall before I put in the fabric cloth and bought the Lagoon Theater chairs from Roman Back Before.JPG 502k .JPG file
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Old 07-28-2013, 02:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Front Screen with Velvet curtains. Stage is up about 14" with a long curved step. Front Before.JPG 524k .JPG file
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Old 07-28-2013, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff in Canada View Post

Front Screen with Velvet curtains. Stage is up about 14" with a long curved step. Front Before.JPG 524k .JPG file
Do you remember where you got your screen wall curtains as that's something I still want to do smile.gif
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Old 07-28-2013, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff in Canada View Post

I have calculated some of my reflection points. I found a place near Detroit that has the OC 703 for absorbers.

I'm looking for Linacoustic or something Similar (Certainteed) @ 2" for the front wall / screen wall.


I'm also looking for a product like Quest Q-Perf or actually looking for someone who sells Quest Q-Perf.

For the diffuser / absorber I believe I need a few panels
1) 2' X 4' @ 3 Panels
2) 2' x 2' @ 4 Panels

Any suggestions on who to use or how I can purchase Quest products?


My preference is 1" for the absorbtion and diffusing panels. For Absorbtion I'll use the OC703 I'm looking at the following for the OC
1) 2' X 3' @ 12 Panels

 

Jeff,

 

I'm north of Detroit and will likely have some OC703 left over if you are interested.  Also, who did you talk to in Detroit about the OC703.  There is an insulation supplier in Warren that was significantly less than anywhere else I could find.  I don't remember the name off the top of my head, but I can find it if you are interested.

 

Nick

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Old 07-29-2013, 09:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Expat444 View Post

Do you remember where you got your screen wall curtains as that's something I still want to do smile.gif

I actually bought the "velvet" curtains from Target. My mother in law cut and sewed them to the right length. It was very inexpensive. I also bought two extras and had them sewn together and used it at the top of the stage from the curve to the false wall in a water wave effect. It hung lower than the rods of the side curtains so it hid those. It worked and cost under $100 in material.

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Old 07-29-2013, 09:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NGiovas View Post

Jeff,

I'm north of Detroit and will likely have some OC703 left over if you are interested.  Also, who did you talk to in Detroit about the OC703.  There is an insulation supplier in Warren that was significantly less than anywhere else I could find.  I don't remember the name off the top of my head, but I can find it if you are interested.

Nick

I'd be interested in the name if you have it. I called Insulation Sales in Ferndale who sells OC products.

There price was $113.28 for a case of OC703 ....24 sheets of 2x4 1" thick

They also sell OC QuietR duct insulation which he says is comparable to Linacoustic from JM. I need opinions on that from people here on the forum. It was $198 for a 47" high role of 100' with 1" thickness.

Has anyone used the Owens Corning QuietR?

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Old 07-29-2013, 10:42 AM
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I guess this is the "good news from bad news HT" ? biggrin.gif

Jeff - instead of as attachment can you embed your photos so they display directly? Makes it easier for comments
Like this

Quote:
Stage:
It will be curved with a long curved step. It will be the same hight as the riser. I'll have a false wall. My screen is 11' 6" wide 2.40:1 with SMX Material. I have Paradigm Studio CC center and Paradim Studio v2 80's for LR. I have two Klipsch RW-12D subs.

I've read alot about acoustic treatments for this and I'm planning on going 2" on the entire front wall and enclosing the speakers to treat those.

So - you are making a Baffle Wall with non-baffle engineered speakers?
I suggest you do discuss this with the EG, as they may give you different viewpoint/specifics to use your existing speakers behind the false wall.
Quote:
Also of note: I'm a mechanical engineer. I've taken enough sound control courses that I want to try some things on my own. I do realize my limits thought and may want to draw things out and hire out treatemnt advice from EG.

Hopefully if you do bring OC703 from Detroit area to Canada, the US Homeland security are not to anal about it.
Might be good to have the material data cert sheet with you to really explain what it is in case you get stopped....and then pay customs on it...
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Old 07-29-2013, 11:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Canadian customs won't care about the import. They will just want a receipt so I can pay taxes on it. I'm in there 2-3 times a week paying taxes as my wife orders a number of things online and I work in the US so I just bring it home.

I didn't specify this earlier, but the back wall will be treated and the speakers will be 18 inches from the wall. They will then be surrounded by a box with 1" insulation like Linacoustic on the inside and ouside of the box I'll leave a 1/2" gap between the insulation and the speakers.

That being said, I'm not certain how the acoustics of the speaker will be interfered with considering they vented in the front. I think it will not be mechanically interfered with and I was debating about whether I would leave the back of the box open as well.

I will research it though. Good point to consider. I had not really considered it and I may have decided to put the box to the wall and caused myself an issue(beyond the one I may still have)

Thanks for the good advice on it.

Also, I will embed the images going forward.

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Old 07-29-2013, 07:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Mike, I think I agree with your point on the diffraction loss. I will likely treat the back wall with 1" It will take out the high And mid reflections a decent amount but will Miimally affect the low frequency 4 pi radiated sound. I know it will affect it, but I will be bass trapping in the corners of the screen wall

I will research more. The front of the speakers will be 3' from the treated wall. 6" form the SMX screen

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Old 07-29-2013, 08:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff in Canada View Post

I'd be interested in the name if you have it. I called Insulation Sales in Ferndale who sells OC products.

There price was $113.28 for a case of OC703 ....24 sheets of 2x4 1" thick

They also sell OC QuietR duct insulation which he says is comparable to Linacoustic from JM. I need opinions on that from people here on the forum. It was $198 for a 47" high role of 100' with 1" thickness.

Has anyone used the Owens Corning QuietR?

That's the same place I went to, but those prices seem a lot higher than what I paid. I will have to go back and look for my receipt. I doubt prices went up that much since last winter. Part of it may have been that I had a contractor friend pick it up and they gave him a discount.
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Old 07-29-2013, 11:09 PM
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was the sump pump a Hydromatic?

MIne failed on Friday, after 2 years and 8 months of service. Luckily, I was home to hear the water alarm and spring into action.
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Old 07-30-2013, 09:14 AM - Thread Starter
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was the sump pump a Hydromatic?

MIne failed on Friday, after 2 years and 8 months of service. Luckily, I was home to hear the water alarm and spring into action.


I am not certain on the original brand. I now have a repalcement in, and I had a water powered backup pump installed.

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Old 07-30-2013, 09:15 AM - Thread Starter
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That's the same place I went to, but those prices seem a lot higher than what I paid. I will have to go back and look for my receipt. I doubt prices went up that much since last winter. Part of it may have been that I had a contractor friend pick it up and they gave him a discount.

Thank you Nick. I suspect he did get a discount. I'm okay with the prices I was quoted.

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Old 07-31-2013, 11:38 AM - Thread Starter
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The front of my speakers will be 3' from the back wall and 5-6" from the SMX screen. I was going to cover the back wall, side walls the back of the false wall (where there is wood...essentially wrapping the framing) as well as the ceiling behind the screen wall in 2" of Linacoustic equiv. The woofer will not be a multiple in distance between the back wall, ceiling or side walls With an 11' 6" wide screen in a 17" wide room the speakers will be spread out decently, but not any where near the side boundaries. In the corners I will have 2'x2' triangle bass traps stage to ceiling behind the screen wall.

I'm looking for opinions on the Allison effects or other acoustica effects. I understand 3' is not really far, but I'm thinking it is far enough to minimize most bad effects....and be less of a problem than building a flush baffle wall with these speakers. (I do understand that at 3' I'm still building a baffle wall......I just believe that the effects are small enough for me to feel it is acceptable.

I'm open to couterpoints, opinions and suggestions on any and all of this.

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Old 08-06-2013, 06:45 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm looking to buy a stapler for attaching GOM to wood frames. I was thinking to buy porter cable upholstery stapler us58. Do people recommend this one? What staples do you suggest with it?

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Old 08-06-2013, 06:52 PM - Thread Starter
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I thought I'd also update my equipment list, as I just bought a new Amp that was posted in the Great Found Deals.

Just bought a Sherbourn PA 7-350 for $999.

Receiver - Denon 3311
Projector - Panasonic
Speakers - Paradigm Studio 80 and CC
Surrounds Polk fxi A4
Screen SMX 11' 6" wide 4' 10" high
Sub: Klipsch RW-12d X 2
Darbee Darblet Vision

Chairs: Fusion Lagoon Brown Leather IOVOOVOI configuration

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Old 08-09-2013, 11:04 AM - Thread Starter
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I need to redo the walls and I need advice. Should I go double drywall again (5/8") or should I go drywall and 5/8" OSB like Mario did on his Cinemar build? Would I then want to use acoustical caulk between the drywall and the OSB where they join and where the OSB touch?




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Old 08-09-2013, 12:19 PM - Thread Starter
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What brand of acoustical caulk do people suggest?

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Old 08-10-2013, 07:02 AM
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OSI SC-175 is cheap and effective. I picked it up locally for $6/tube.
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Old 08-10-2013, 01:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the information.

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Old 08-12-2013, 08:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Well work work is going to become insane now. (Promotion). So the insurance company will need to find a high end person to redo my theater I think. I rally like Jeff's work. The Ny Giants fan theater turned out great as has his other builds. I like the Cinemar build but in stained Oak, but I just need to find someone. Any suggestions for people near Detroit?

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Old 09-30-2013, 09:03 AM
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I don't know what its like in Windsor, but in Barrie I haven't found anyone competent that I would trust with my theater which is a bummer because I'm now doing 80% of it myself.

The Big Bay Home Theater Build Thread
My personal theater build on Kempenfelt Bay, Barrie Ontario Canada
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Old 09-30-2013, 11:13 AM - Thread Starter
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I don't know what its like in Windsor, but in Barrie I haven't found anyone competent that I would trust with my theater which is a bummer because I'm now doing 80% of it myself.

I'm moving forward myself. I have a very skilled carpenter for some of the woodwork and a really good painter/stainer for the Oak. I've ripped the drywall all off and I am putting up OSB and drywall soon.

I'm going to order puddy pads and should have the last bit of wiring I want done soon. I think that in two weeks I'll have all OSB/Drywall done and be at the point of putting in the Riser and first part of the Stage.

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Old 10-04-2013, 09:41 PM
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How's your build been going? I'm nearby and curious if you have any local resources you'd recommend?
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Old 10-04-2013, 09:47 PM - Thread Starter
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All of the drywall is torn out. Wires are pulled. I need to finishe the electrical and then put up the OSB and then drywall. I should post pics soon. I can recommend a trim/wood working guy, drywaller, electrician. What do you need?

Equipment: Denon AVR-4520, Fusion Tempest (LCR), Fusion Alchemy (4xSurrounds+Wides+Heights),15" Dayton Ultimax X 4, SMX 2.35:1 Screen
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