Doug's Remodel Build Thread - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 321 Old 05-08-2016, 06:22 PM - Thread Starter
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And if anyone could PLEASE tell me what I can do to keep my pics from being rotated that'd be AWESOME!!
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post #62 of 321 Old 05-09-2016, 05:56 AM
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So much awesomeness in those last two posts. I'm very interested in part numbers...I'm still using the breaker switch to turn my lights on and off, and although I was planning on Insteon (only have the 8-button keypad so far), Lutron is a very real possibility for me after reading this. You should do some instagram video posts on your lighting solutions, man...lots of us can benefit!
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post #63 of 321 Old 05-09-2016, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DougUSMC View Post
- RGB LED strip lights: These are more complicated, because of the need to control the color-changing AND because the RGB driver doesn't like to be dimmed at the controller. We (the guys at FlexFire were super helpful and kicked a$$) worked out a solution where it's FlexFire RGB LEDs to a Multi-zone RGB receiver, to a Mean Well dimmable driver, to a Lutron Maestro switch

Ok, I think that's about enough for now. If anyone's interested, let me know, and I can post part #s for any/all of the components. I can also give more details on the wiring and setup of anything that anyone cares to know. I'll try to get the iRule integration done tomorrow, and post again when it's all working. Lastly, I think I went WAY overkill on the lighting, but I'd dig any more ideas!!
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So much awesomeness in those last two posts. I'm very interested in part numbers...I'm still using the breaker switch to turn my lights on and off, and although I was planning on Insteon (only have the 8-button keypad so far), Lutron is a very real possibility for me after reading this. You should do some instagram video posts on your lighting solutions, man...lots of us can benefit!
I am also very interested in this!!! I like Brolic plan on using Insteon in my home and eventually an iRule or similar interface.
What I am trying to wrap my around is why the dimmer switch to feed the power supply at all? Doesn't the controller have the means of on/off, dimming, color change all built into it?


But then there is the communication between the LED controller and iRule..... most LED controllers are RF and I can't seam to find a way to get this to talk to iRule.... or insteon for that matter....

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post #64 of 321 Old 05-09-2016, 04:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post
So much awesomeness in those last two posts. I'm very interested in part numbers...I'm still using the breaker switch to turn my lights on and off, and although I was planning on Insteon (only have the 8-button keypad so far), Lutron is a very real possibility for me after reading this. You should do some instagram video posts on your lighting solutions, man...lots of us can benefit!
Ok, so here's some part numbers...
All of the LED strip lights are FlexFire
- The SC (Single Color = white) LED roll are CB-WW-12V-REEL
- The RGB (RGB = multi color) are CB-RGB-24V-REEL
I went with 24V for the RGB because the runs to these end up being further from the driver, and power loss could have been a problem with 12V

For the SC, I ended up using 3 different drivers. I only did this for ease of installation and running wiring. There are 3 drivers (2x 150, 1 x 60) that share duties for the soffit lights for the 5x 16ft lengths. There's a separate 20W driver for the riser step lights.
Those are 12v Zurik LED dimmable drivers, part number ZRK-xxx-12VDC, where the xxx = wattage.

The RGB LEDs are all controlled by the same MeanWell driver, a big honker at 240w. That's HLG-240H-24A. The remote unit is two part #s , RGB-MZ-RCVR for the receiver and RGB-MZ-CTRL for the remote itself.

I think that's just about everything other than the connectors.

I'm totally down with videoing the whole thing, but someone is going to have to walk me through the process of finding somewhere to host it (Instagram??) and how to link it here. I've only been consuming your videos Brolic, I have no idea how to make my own! I'm guessing it's as simple as walking around with the phone, putting it up somewhere, and throwing the URL in here? We also have a Nikon D3200 around here somewhere, which I'm sure would make better videos?

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I am also very interested in this!!! I like Brolic plan on using Insteon in my home and eventually an iRule or similar interface.
What I am trying to wrap my around is why the dimmer switch to feed the power supply at all? Doesn't the controller have the means of on/off, dimming, color change all built into it?


But then there is the communication between the LED controller and iRule..... most LED controllers are RF and I can't seam to find a way to get this to talk to iRule.... or insteon for that matter....
Sooo, I started the Insteon route too. I even bought one of their dimmers, but couldn't get it to talk to iRule. I already have 3 different media centers linked up to iRule, with about 7 gateways in varying rooms, so I'm pretty comfortable with the technology. I just couldn't find a decently advanced, reasonably priced way for the iRule to talk to Insteon, that's what led me to Lutron. You get what you pay for there, as iRule already supports their protocol. I recognize a lot of the components in Beast's pictures from my own trials, and I just think the way I'm going ends up being cleaner and potentially cheaper.

The reason you dim the power supply is that it's the first thing inline to power from the controller. The short version is that you dim the power to the supply, it dims the power to the LEDs, they get less bright. I dim at the control (Lutron dimmer), which sends less power to the driver (power supply), and the lights get less dim. At least, that's how it works for the SC lights (white). For the RGB it's different.
To clarify definitions: The "controller" is the thing you hit on the wall, and can be a dimmer or a switch. The driver is what most peeps call the power supply.

RGB can't be dimmed at the driver, because they have to be dimmed inline. If you dim at the driver for RGB then the colors don't work right. The driver also isn't smart enough to change colors for you. That's why they're run a little different. You have a switch on the wall (vs dimmer), and that supplies power to the driver. Inline BEFORE the driver (between the switch and it) you have another remote component (the RGB receiver) which is RF, which you use to dim and change colors, THEN the driver (with the smarter instructions for color, brightness from the receiver), then the LEDs.

The main difference for me in this configuration is that the iRule will talk directly to the dimmer for the SC LEDs, but it'll have to talk to the receiver for RGB.

Any of that make sense, or should I just head downstairs and start recording something for Beast's inevitable "Here's how to link your Instagram video"?
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post #65 of 321 Old 05-09-2016, 04:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok, Video recorded, as soon as I figure out how to get it from my phone to Instagram I'll put up a link...
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post #66 of 321 Old 05-09-2016, 04:54 PM - Thread Starter
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I think I got it. It should be about 12-13 mins of me rambling about lights, be gentle...
https://www.instagram.com/p/BFNKJtoi...en-by=doug5766
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post #67 of 321 Old 05-09-2016, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
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Sooo, I started the Insteon route too. I even bought one of their dimmers, but couldn't get it to talk to iRule. I already have 3 different media centers linked up to iRule, with about 7 gateways in varying rooms, so I'm pretty comfortable with the technology. I just couldn't find a decently advanced, reasonably priced way for the iRule to talk to Insteon, that's what led me to Lutron. You get what you pay for there, as iRule already supports their protocol. I recognize a lot of the components in Beast's pictures from my own trials, and I just think the way I'm going ends up being cleaner and potentially cheaper.

The reason you dim the power supply is that it's the first thing inline to power from the controller. The short version is that you dim the power to the supply, it dims the power to the LEDs, they get less bright. I dim at the control (Lutron dimmer), which sends less power to the driver (power supply), and the lights get less dim. At least, that's how it works for the SC lights (white). For the RGB it's different.
To clarify definitions: The "controller" is the thing you hit on the wall, and can be a dimmer or a switch. The driver is what most peeps call the power supply.

RGB can't be dimmed at the driver, because they have to be dimmed inline. If you dim at the driver for RGB then the colors don't work right. The driver also isn't smart enough to change colors for you. That's why they're run a little different. You have a switch on the wall (vs dimmer), and that supplies power to the driver. Inline BEFORE the driver (between the switch and it) you have another remote component (the RGB receiver) which is RF, which you use to dim and change colors, THEN the driver (with the smarter instructions for color, brightness from the receiver), then the LEDs.

The main difference for me in this configuration is that the iRule will talk directly to the dimmer for the SC LEDs, but it'll have to talk to the receiver for RGB.

Any of that make sense, or should I just head downstairs and start recording something for Beast's inevitable "Here's how to link your Instagram video"?
For sure that makes sense, personally looking at an ISY for my Insteon control through a smartlink that is noted on there "compatible devices" web page

I am looking at just RGB, so just a switch for me. What I am still struggling with is the means of getting the command from iRule to the RGB receiver.
You must have a "device" somewhere in there to send an RF to the RGB receiver

Unfortunately, for me the video got to the dimmers and switch and then loops back

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post #68 of 321 Old 05-09-2016, 07:52 PM - Thread Starter
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For sure that makes sense, personally looking at an ISY for my Insteon control through a smartlink that is noted on there "compatible devices" web page

I am looking at just RGB, so just a switch for me. What I am still struggling with is the means of getting the command from iRule to the RGB receiver.
You must have a "device" somewhere in there to send an RF to the RGB receiver

Unfortunately, for me the video got to the dimmers and switch and then loops back
I dig it, I looked at the ISY as well, and I'm pretty sure I ruled them out because I wasn't crazy with the integration process. I decided against them after much frustration, and just went with Lutron.

If I can get you the video, I'll show you how I plan to just use a GC IP to RF converter, with a blaster, to get the signal to the RGB receiver from the iRule.

I've been playing with Instagram, trying to figure out how to upload the photo. It looks like you can only get up to 60 seconds, according to their FAQ, so I don't know how Beast got his longer?
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post #69 of 321 Old 05-09-2016, 08:17 PM
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I dig it, I looked at the ISY as well, and I'm pretty sure I ruled them out because I wasn't crazy with the integration process. I decided against them after much frustration, and just went with Lutron.

If I can get you the video, I'll show you how I plan to just use a GC IP to RF converter, with a blaster, to get the signal to the RGB receiver from the iRule.

I've been playing with Instagram, trying to figure out how to upload the photo. It looks like you can only get up to 60 seconds, according to their FAQ, so I don't know how Beast got his longer?
Oooh, I've been itching to respond on thos thread all evening, but have been tied up installing lights all evening! Man, on the Instagram, that 1 min is the limit...and it's new! Back when I first started using instagram, the video limit was 15 seconds! Arghhh!!!

I have some questions for you, but am so tired I can barely type...will check back tomorrow man.
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post #70 of 321 Old 05-10-2016, 03:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Hmmm, any ideas for somewhere to host a 12-13 min video?
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post #71 of 321 Old 05-10-2016, 03:07 AM
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Youtuuuuube!!!! I thirst for thy knowledge!
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post #72 of 321 Old 05-10-2016, 04:30 AM
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All these last posts reminded me of the reason why I decided to go with a Philips Color Kinetics RGB LED lighting solution.....seamless control.

5 years ago it was borderline impossible to get dozens of RGB LED light strips to function as one cohesive and easily controlled system. Looking over the parts list it seems things have gotten a bit better, but still a heavy "MacGyver" influence to get everything connected, controlled and operating as it should reliably.

Although my decision has already been made, I'll be very interested to see how these lighting systems using RGB LED light strips and various 3rd party power supplies and controllers come together.
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post #73 of 321 Old 05-10-2016, 05:03 PM - Thread Starter
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YouTube video posted!!

https://youtu.be/fX5QUC8toeA

Let me know what you think!
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post #74 of 321 Old 05-10-2016, 05:25 PM
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Thanks DougUSMC, that helped clear things up for me. Great Job... going to give Brolic a run for his money
You mention Global Connect in the video..... should that have been Global Cache?

Which gateway unit are you looking at and blaster. I didn't see any RF units on Global Cache's website..

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post #75 of 321 Old 05-10-2016, 06:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks DougUSMC, that helped clear things up for me. Great Job... going to give Brolic a run for his money
You mention Global Connect in the video..... should that have been Global Cache?

Which gateway unit are you looking at and blaster. I didn't see any RF units on Global Cache's website..
Ha!!! Thanks for the compliment, but I KNOW you're just being kind! You can tell I'm not in his league when I said "Global Connect" vs Global Cache. I also kept saying switch when I meant controller or dimmer, and I realized the camera wasn't pointed in the right direction a bunch of times!!

Sorry, but I can't remember the gateway solution off the top of my head, it's been a long day! I talked to the iRule guys about this before I moved forward, and they had an answer for me, I just can't remember. As soon as I find it I'll post it up.
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post #76 of 321 Old 05-10-2016, 06:53 PM
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Doug, your video is awesome! Do I sense the speech patterns of a native New Englander?

I'm going to watch it again, and again.....I like that solution quite a bit. Please, please, please post more videos...especially when you get iRule to do it's thing to control scenes, etc. BTW, your room is massive!
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post #77 of 321 Old 05-10-2016, 06:54 PM
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Ha!!! Thanks for the compliment, but I KNOW you're just being kind! You can tell I'm not in his league when I said "Global Connect" vs Global Cache. I also kept saying switch when I meant controller or dimmer, and I realized the camera wasn't pointed in the right direction a bunch of times!!

Sorry, but I can't remember the gateway solution off the top of my head, it's been a long day! I talked to the iRule guys about this before I moved forward, and they had an answer for me, I just can't remember. As soon as I find it I'll post it up.
You did a great job, clear and articulate and the camera was nice a steady not like the Blair Witch Project.
I only had to go back once in the video for the "Global Connect" LOL
Then I googled it thinking I was missing out on a solution/technology LOL

Cool, I had a day like yours from the sounds of it so I totally relate... when ever you have a chance
Thanks

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post #78 of 321 Old 05-11-2016, 11:50 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm going to try to get a new IRule page set up specifically for lighting in the movie room tonight, and see if I can get the Lutron plug in activated. I suspect it will either take 10 minutes or three hours, if it is the former I will try to video that. Other than that, any other requests Beast?
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post #79 of 321 Old 05-12-2016, 06:23 PM - Thread Starter
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I hate to do it, but here's a teaser:



The Lutron / iRule integration went pretty simply. I created a quick new page (above), added the Main Repeater as a new Gateway, and assigned the Lutron Integration ID to each button in the iRule builder. The longest part of the whole process was knocking the rust of my iRule skilz, since it's been a while since I edited mine.

I didn't have time for the video, but I plan to upload one tomorrow. Any specific questions or anything you want to see, let me know and I'll try to include it!

Short version: Everything works, now to make the scenes and fancy buttons on the new iRule page!
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post #80 of 321 Old 05-15-2016, 04:39 AM - Thread Starter
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As promised, a new video. This one shows a finished product iRule integration with RadioRA 2 controllers. I tried to answer the questions that have come in, and show a little more of the integration. We see the Radio RA 2 Essentials Software, a lighting page for iRule, and how to manage Lutron controllers and a couple of simple scenes.

Feedback appreciated, and any questions for further information!

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post #81 of 321 Old 05-15-2016, 08:50 AM
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Awesome video. Thanks for sharing.
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post #82 of 321 Old 05-15-2016, 09:24 AM
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Yes great job again Doug!
You make a very good case for the RGB control that once you pick a color and brightness you set and forget.....then just control on and off from the Lutron. It does make it a lot simpler.
In my case I would like to control the dimming brightness and speed of the RGB in a scene. When pause pressed, RGB to XX% over X time.

I would love to know what hardware you had come up with in the research stage for RGB RF control.

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post #83 of 321 Old 05-16-2016, 06:25 PM
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Doug, love the video! My wife and I just watched it and chuckled at the 'Homage to beast" comment with the purple lights! Listen, man--I'm going with Lutron. What you just demoed in the video is exactly what i plan to do with the lights. Ceiling lights, wall lights step lights...I'll want to control them all in the exact way you did. Thanks so much for posting!
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post #84 of 321 Old 05-19-2016, 03:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Yes great job again Doug!
You make a very good case for the RGB control that once you pick a color and brightness you set and forget.....then just control on and off from the Lutron. It does make it a lot simpler.
In my case I would like to control the dimming brightness and speed of the RGB in a scene. When pause pressed, RGB to XX% over X time.

I would love to know what hardware you had come up with in the research stage for RGB RF control.
Hey Waterboy, sorry to take a while to respond, but I've been putting up sheetrock like crazy. The controller I'm talking about is called Vera. I found some folks on the iRule forum that use it for Z Wave but they said the principle is similar for RF. Because the Vera device can be controlled via HTTP commands they use it to trigger scenes (lighting scenes) via iRule, and for Kodi start/stop.

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Doug, love the video! My wife and I just watched it and chuckled at the 'Homage to beast" comment with the purple lights! Listen, man--I'm going with Lutron. What you just demoed in the video is exactly what i plan to do with the lights. Ceiling lights, wall lights step lights...I'll want to control them all in the exact way you did. Thanks so much for posting!
I'm glad you dug it Beast! It was a huge PITA to research it all, but once I started assembling the components it started being fun!
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post #85 of 321 Old 05-19-2016, 07:23 AM
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Hey Waterboy, sorry to take a while to respond, but I've been putting up sheetrock like crazy. The controller I'm talking about is called Vera. I found some folks on the iRule forum that use it for Z Wave but they said the principle is similar for RF. Because the Vera device can be controlled via HTTP commands they use it to trigger scenes (lighting scenes) via iRule, and for Kodi start/stop.

That's very unfortunate, I am pretty set on Insteon and ISY (universal devices) I really like the dual band on Insteon especially for my shop that is to far away for Z-Wave and to be a pain to run wire.
ISY's (some with expansion card) can do Z Wave but I have not done a lot of research as of yet..... might have to dig deeper on Wi-Fi RGB controllers in stead of RF. RF seams to be the big stumbling point.
Thanks

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post #86 of 321 Old 05-19-2016, 05:49 PM - Thread Starter
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That's very unfortunate, I am pretty set on Insteon and ISY (universal devices) I really like the dual band on Insteon especially for my shop that is to far away for Z-Wave and to be a pain to run wire.
ISY's (some with expansion card) can do Z Wave but I have not done a lot of research as of yet..... might have to dig deeper on Wi-Fi RGB controllers in stead of RF. RF seams to be the big stumbling point.
Thanks
Yeah, RF is definitely the hard part. Sorry I couldn't offer you a better solution, but I do know that Lutron's RadioRA 2 repeaters can cover each other 60ft apart, if that helps?
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post #87 of 321 Old 05-20-2016, 07:38 AM
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How's drywall coming?
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post #88 of 321 Old 05-21-2016, 03:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sigma722 View Post
How's drywall coming?
It's coming along, just taking a little longer than I originally guessed. We got all the ceiling stuff finished last weekend, and a good running start on the walls. I've gotten a few pieces here and there throughout the week, and I'm *this* close. Just a couple more small pieces today and I'll be done. Some cleanup, a dump run, and I'll try to get pics up today.

Turning a corner to the next phases of the build, I have some questions, if any out there can help:

The front wall will be behind the screen wall, and I don't plan to rock it. I'm planning to paint it black and cover it with a material. Has anyone else done this, and is there a recommended fabric type?

I went to pick up black paint for the server rack the other day, and was going to grab some for the ceiling, and Tragedy!! The guy at Sherwin Williams couldn't find a formula for Mouse Ears!! He looked it up, and said it looked like it used to be a Home Depot color from Disney, but was discontinued! I consider it bad juju (akin to speaking the Bard's name in a theater) to NOT use it, so does anyone have an idea how I can point him to the right formula??
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post #89 of 321 Old 05-21-2016, 10:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Ok, finished putting up the last piece, then about an hour and a half of vacuuming. It's starting to come together and look like a room!

Here's 3 from the front stage, looking around the room towards the back:







The view of the screen wall, from he back:

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post #90 of 321 Old 05-21-2016, 05:30 PM
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Looking great!!! Going to find the pic of the mouse ears formula. It is discontinued , but last year, my guy found someone at home depot who remembered it and dug it up.
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