Acoustical Treatments Master Thread - Page 54 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1591 of 11982 Old 08-30-2006, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Hornfeck View Post

THANKS for the quick reply!

When you say spike strips, are you speaking of the mending plates they sell in the lumber/truss section or something else?

I'd never seen these Rotofast jobs -- I'm (essentially) attaching one panel TO another, so only the double one would work. That's why I was looking into the spikes or velcro.

Spike strips = I think are used to install carpet and are installed around the room's perimeter.

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post #1592 of 11982 Old 08-30-2006, 02:37 PM
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Kal Rubinson:

The rotofast looks cool -- I like that it can be used THROUGH fabric.

This is what I've done before: http://www.bobgolds.com/AbsorberMount/home.htm

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post #1593 of 11982 Old 08-30-2006, 06:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BasementBob View Post

Kal Rubinson:
The rotofast looks cool -- I like that it can be used THROUGH fabric.
This is what I've done before:

Nice. BTW, I used plastic stand-offs with the Rotofasts to space the panels off the wall.

Kal

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post #1594 of 11982 Old 08-31-2006, 06:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BasementBob View Post

The rotofast looks cool -- I like that it can be used THROUGH fabric.

It looks so cool I emailed the company. Then I got back a Mail Delivery Error for info@rotofast.com, which cools my enthusiasm as I have to question their competence in either putting up the wrong email address or choosing a bad internet provider or, worst case scenario, failure to pay some bills.

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post #1595 of 11982 Old 08-31-2006, 08:39 AM
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That address has worked for me. I understand your feeling but perhaps you might try again.

Kal

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post #1596 of 11982 Old 08-31-2006, 01:18 PM
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Based on what I have read in this thread I was contemplating making sound absorbers by placing a single 2'*4'*2" OC 703 panel in a 3" deep frame so it would be held out from the wall by 1". 3" total depth is as much as I want to go for aesthetics reasons.

However, the first source I have found for OC 703 in Seattle, R-Factor, only has 1" sheets. So, the questions I have are these:

1) If I stack two 1" sheets do I have the acoustic equivalent of a 2" sheet ? Is it necessary for them to be pressed tightly together to achieve this ? I am inclined to think so because, otherwise, some sound passing through the first sheet might reflect off the second sheet and therefore not get absorbed in the second sheet...

2) For a 3" total frame depth, rather than have 2" 703 + 1" back air gap, am I better off using 3" 703 and no air gap ? Use of 1" 703 allows this possibility whereas 2" panels do not.

BTW, here are some sources for unfaced, 2'*4'*1, 3 pfc density, rigid fiberglass in the Seattle area (who will sell to the public):

R-Factor, 16750 Woodinville-Redmond Rd. Woodinville. 425-488-7600.
Owens Corning 703, $145 per pack of 24 sheets (192 sq feet). 75.5 c/sq foot

Bay Insulation, 7043 S 190th St, Kent. 425-251-6750.
Owens Corning 703, Sell by the sheet, 64 c/sq foot.

E J Bartells, 700 Powell Ave SW, Renton, 425-228-8807.
Johns Manville 814 "SpinGlas" (same acoustic specifications as Insul-SHIELD I/S 300 but targeted at duct insulation rather than general construction), $63.36 per pack of 18 sheets (144 sq feet). 44 c/sq foot

Note: "SpinGlas/Insul-SHIELD has nominally better absorption ratings than OC 703, eg:



However, I suspect this might just be measurement variability.

Brent
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post #1597 of 11982 Old 08-31-2006, 01:31 PM
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kiwishread

Quote:
1) If I stack two 1" sheets do I have the acoustic equivalent of a 2" sheet ?

Yes.

Quote:
Is it necessary for them to be pressed tightly together to achieve this ?

No.
However, it's better to have them pressed together so that they are both out from the wall as far as possible within that 3".

Quote:
I am inclined to think so because, otherwise, some sound passing through the first sheet might reflect off the second sheet and therefore not get absorbed in the second sheet...

Don't worry about it.

Quote:
For a 3" total frame depth, rather than have 2" 703 + 1" back air gap, am I better off using 3" 703 and no air gap ?

Yes, but not much.

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post #1598 of 11982 Old 08-31-2006, 02:39 PM
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Hey, guys-

I'm building my dedicated HT room and have a question:

The room is 8 x 12.5 x 17.5 and I am planning to line my side walls with 1" Linacoustic RC (up to ear level). I am also planning to cover the front wall (floor to ceiling) with 1" of the Linacoustic. With a 100' roll, I'll still have about 40' of Linacoustic left over.

My question is this:

Would it be feasable to cut the Linacoustic into triangles and stack them floor to ceiling to provide some rear-room bass absorption?

I am planning some good sized superchunk style front-room bass absorption using 5.5" acoustical cotton.

What do you think...?
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post #1599 of 11982 Old 08-31-2006, 02:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanJNielson View Post

Hey, guys-

I'm building my dedicated HT room and have a question:

The room is 8 x 12.5 x 17.5 and I am planning to line my side walls with 1" Linacoustic RC (up to ear level). I am also planning to cover the front wall (floor to ceiling) with 1" of the Linacoustic. With a 100' roll, I'll still have about 40' of Linacoustic left over.

My question is this:

Would it be feasable to cut the Linacoustic into triangles and stack them floor to ceiling to provide some rear-room bass absorption?

I am planning some good sized superchunk style front-room bass absorption using 5.5" acoustical cotton.

What do you think...?

That would be a lot of cutting if you used 1" material as opposed to 4", plus to my knowledge linacoustic is not very dense. You want something more dense that will give you better absorbtion at the lower frequencies such as OC703 or in my case I used Roxul mineral wool. It was only $78 for enough to do 8' high corner traps 24" across. I'm sure others more knowing than I will also pipe in

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post #1600 of 11982 Old 08-31-2006, 03:01 PM
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Thanks for the tip, Jon-

Rockwool seems to be a great solution for my corners. VERY economical!

Great job on your theater, btw!
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post #1601 of 11982 Old 08-31-2006, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanJNielson View Post

Thanks for the tip, Jon-

Rockwool seems to be a great solution for my corners. VERY economical!

Great job on your theater, btw!

Thanks man!!! It's always a work in progress but I'm really enjoying it. Good luck with your project.

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post #1602 of 11982 Old 08-31-2006, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bpape View Post

Remember the title "OPTIMIZED sound" (in their opinion). It says nothing about real world rooms or practical solutions. Unfortunately, there is no one perfect way to set up every speaker in every room.

....

Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

I've never seen a theater where LCR are that far from the front wall. Mostly, they are a few feet out or mounted ON the wall. Mine are like that, but I've treated the front wall with 2" J-M Linacoustic and am planning to add bass traps there as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis Erskine View Post

If your mains are crossed over with the sub(s) at 80Hz, the mains would be about 3.5' from the front wall. Since this isn't a practical solution in most cases, the front wall needs to be treated with a combination of absorption and diffusion to diminish boundary effects.

Thanks Bryan, pepar and Dennis. I knew the 6' from front wall was not realistic for most people. I'm glad to heat the experts have "ways" to compensate.

Todd
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post #1603 of 11982 Old 08-31-2006, 07:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nowandthen View Post

Thanks Bryan, pepar and Dennis. I knew the 6' from front wall was not realistic for most people. I'm glad to heat the experts have "ways" to compensate.

Todd

FYI, the other two are experts.

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post #1604 of 11982 Old 09-03-2006, 09:27 PM
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Can anyone direct me to a diy for an acoustic soffitt??

I am planning to install a 16w x 10 h " soffit made from oc703 material and wrapped in gom. The soffit will wrap across the front stage and then down the two sidewalls.

If I am lucky, I can incorporate a hushbox into an extension of the soffitt across the room at the projector location.

I am having a little trouble determining what the internal structure of the soffit should be. Also having a little trouble with how the edge away from the wall should be supported.

The soffitt will be a little heavier because I am going to install miniature downlights from HD (low voltage).
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post #1605 of 11982 Old 09-03-2006, 09:31 PM
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zductive:

There's a bunch of ways.

Here's one:
- Build a bunch of downward struts on 2' centers.
- Then build a ladder (two 12' 2x2's with 13" 2x2's across on 2' centers)
- add extra cross pieces (ladder steps) where the lights will go.
- Then screw the ladder to the downward struts.
- build wood boxes lined with drywall for the lights, and put them in place
- wire the lights, and run any speaker wire or other wires you intend to use
- run any HVAC ducts you want to run.
- Fill it with 703 (notches optional, duct stocks cuts optional, put them in diagonally, turn them upright).
- Cover it with GoM
- Add trim over the staples.

Another variation:
- build two ladders (two 12' 2x2's with 7" 2x2's across on 2' centers)
- turn it into a box frame by adding more 7" 2x2's to join the ladders
- fasten it to the walls and ceiling.
-

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post #1606 of 11982 Old 09-04-2006, 06:53 PM
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Bob - your on the right track but, I was thinking more about the soffit bass traps that ASC sells http://www.asc-home-theater.com/products-soffit2.htm.

What does the internal structure of that trap look like?

It looks like it is two pieces of oc703 wrapped in cloth. What I can't see is how the two pieces are held together structurually and what the track looks like.

Any ideas?

T
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post #1607 of 11982 Old 09-05-2006, 11:48 AM
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I have a small room in my basement that I am considering adapting to use as a HT. It has sheetrock walls and a drop ceiling. Should I re-sheetrock with green glue? What can be done about the ceiling and floor (carpet over concrete)?

Thanks,

Scott
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post #1608 of 11982 Old 09-05-2006, 11:57 AM
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zductive:

I don't know. You could buy 2' of them and find out.
I'm guessing it's foam; eor two pieces of 703, each fully wrapped in GoM, with 90 degree bent clothes hangers, and glue on the join.

However, if you want to build it that way (hollow inside), you could try a variation on this with sheet metal or aluminum guttering as framing: http://www.recording.org/ftopict-26889.html

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post #1609 of 11982 Old 09-05-2006, 11:58 AM
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Scott Mat:
That sounds to me like a question for your own separate thread.

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post #1610 of 11982 Old 09-06-2006, 12:33 AM
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Is speaker cloth (specifically the black polyester variety that can be had from Joann fabrics for about $7 per 60" wide yard) sufficient to contain all the nasties that might potentially flake off rigid fiberglass ?

I have seen some people add a layer of batting but then others just wrap their naked OC 703 in nothing but burlap. So I am wondering if the batting is really necessary or just an extra precaution for the sake of peace of mind ...

TIA,
Brent
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post #1611 of 11982 Old 09-07-2006, 03:56 AM
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IMO it is just a extra precaution. I have never heard of fiberglass even leaking out of burlap. Now if you HIT the panel with a bat I am sure something would come out.

Glenn

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post #1612 of 11982 Old 09-07-2006, 06:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwishred View Post

Is speaker cloth (specifically the black polyester variety that can be had from Joann fabrics for about $7 per 60" wide yard) sufficient to contain all the nasties that might potentially flake off rigid fiberglass ?

I have seen some people add a layer of batting but then others just wrap their naked OC 703 in nothing but burlap. So I am wondering if the batting is really necessary or just an extra precaution for the sake of peace of mind ...

TIA,
Brent

I have had success using the very thin, dark gray fabric similar to what you will find covering the bottom of upholstered chairs and sofas. I attach it to the fiberglass using 3M Super 77 spray adhesive. The fiberglass panel is then inserted into a GOM wrapped wood frame. This provides one more containment for the fibers if you are concerned. On the other hand, I've also applied GOM directly to OC705 and I haven't seen any evidence of fibers coming through.
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post #1613 of 11982 Old 09-07-2006, 04:54 PM
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I need to buy some 1" Linacoutsic...how much is that stuff for a roll?


chillinintheoc
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post #1614 of 11982 Old 09-08-2006, 12:37 PM
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Was it ever really decided if a corner bass trap Floor to ceiling is better as a:

1. 24 inch triangle filled with wedges of acoustical cotton from top to bottom

or

2. Roughly 3-4 " thick just across the face and a 45 degree angle, a space from there to the wall corner.


In my room I wanted to do 4 corner base traps floor to ceiling but I can only do the back two walls. The front corners have a corner trap, floor up to 52" then a tri corner by the ceiling.

I still have to do the back corners and wanted to know the best solution.

Room is 13 x 17

thanks
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post #1615 of 11982 Old 09-08-2006, 04:10 PM
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Good question...I don't recall any definitive comparisons. I am eager for a reply as well.
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post #1616 of 11982 Old 09-09-2006, 05:38 AM
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If all else is equal, the solid ones will reach a bit deeper into the bottom end more effectively. In effect, you'll use the same amount of material to do a solid one as you would to do a 6" thick straddling panel.

Bryan

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post #1617 of 11982 Old 09-10-2006, 05:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bpape View Post

If all else is equal, the solid ones will reach a bit deeper into the bottom end more effectively. In effect, you'll use the same amount of material to do a solid one as you would to do a 6" thick straddling panel.

Bryan

And you will take up far less room.

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post #1618 of 11982 Old 09-10-2006, 10:48 AM
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Can you elaborate, I'm not following. Do you mean the solid triangle literally in the corner is more effective than the panel straddling the corner? If it's less material and more effective, why wouldn't everyone do it that way?
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post #1619 of 11982 Old 09-10-2006, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GetGray View Post

Can you elaborate, I'm not following. Do you mean the solid triangle literally in the corner is more effective than the panel straddling the corner? If it's less material and more effective, why wouldn't everyone do it that way?

I think I picked up that the same amount of material is used as in a 6" "straddling" type. Previously, the cross-corner style with a 3"-4" thick panel had been discussed.

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post #1620 of 11982 Old 09-11-2006, 04:32 AM
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Yes. If you do the solid chunk, you're going to have a 17x27x24" corner with the farthest part being out 12" from the corner at 45 degrees.

If you have a 6" thick panel (2' wide and framed so about 25.5") straddling the corner, the BACK of that panel will be at 17" (along the wall) from the corner - 12" out at 45 degrees. From there, it will stick out another 6".

In addition, for the same amount of upper bass, mid and HF absorbtion, you'll get slightly better really deep bass control.

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