Minimalist Approach to Screen Wall - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 406 Old 04-22-2007, 12:34 PM - Thread Starter
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From time to time I've seen builds posted where the screen wall looks like a load bearing wall, so last week when I had mine apart for carpet installation I took a couple of pics to document my approach which is minimal and considering I intend to join the 2:35 club at some point easy to modify.

I started with 2 rectangular frames of finger joined pine trim boards. Connected on the top and bottom with a cross member. I doubled up the outside leg with a space between the two boards.

I stood them in place and screwed through the top into the ceiling and bottom to the stage. Added Linacoustic and some leftover eggcrate from my speaker building projects. Also three blocks on the side walls.



Next built 4 frames and covered with black GOM. Added a few dabs of velcro. A little goes a long way because if you use too much it's really hard to pry off a panel. Paint the visible sides of the frames black before attaching GOM.



Then I put up the two sides, the screen and the top and bottom panels, in that order.

 

 

this is my current screen wall which I describe later in the thread

 

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post #2 of 406 Old 04-22-2007, 04:41 PM
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Thanks for the backstage reveal. I am in the process of trying to redo my AT 2.40:1 setup with a different screen mount and and masking setup. The velcro tip is appreciated!
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post #3 of 406 Old 04-22-2007, 09:22 PM
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Funny, that after I finished building my front false wall, I thought why am I overbuilding this wall. Then you put out this thread.

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post #4 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 05:07 AM
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Nice job. A lot of it depends on the size and weight of the screen as to how 'bare' you can go with the framing.

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post #5 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 02:09 PM
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Is your screen attached via velcro as well?

It is nice to see you finally got carpet... Looks great!

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post #6 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 02:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaron_hinni View Post

Is your screen attached via velcro as well?

It is nice to see you finally got carpet... Looks great!

The screen is a Stewart with the deluxe frame. It mounts with 4 large head screws. The frame has 4 brackets. Each bracket has a slotted hole that fits over the the head of the screw and when you lower it an inch it's locked in place. If you look close at the first pic you will see 4 white spots on the inner vertical supports. That's the screw heads sticking out and the paint roller didn't make complete contact.

With the GOM panel resting on top it's wedged into place and isn't going anywhere.

Bpape: I'd say the design would hold about a 150 lb frame.

As for the carpet, Yes I'm glad it's finally in. Now I just have to finish the bar get the counter tops, do the backsplash and then it's on to the spa bathroom. However right in the middle of the room the carpet has a flaw and tomorrow an inspector from Masland is coming to document the problem and recommend a remedy.
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post #7 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 02:59 PM
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Big, carpet looks great. Is that black on the stage?

When I built my screen wall, I was concerned about twisting/warping 2x4s. I ended up doubling up the 2x4s around the screen to help prevent that.

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post #8 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 03:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chinadog View Post

Big, carpet looks great. Is that black on the stage?
Bud

Thanks. Yes, black, we wanted to duplicate the shape over the top. I think I'll be buying lint rollers by the case. Virtually no reflection from the screen.
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post #9 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 03:34 PM
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It's hard to tell from your pictures: How deep are spaces behind the false walls? How wide an opening should you make for a speaker?

With my ceiling treatment, my false wall can come out about 18". I know that will fit my Paradigm mini-monitors just fine, but is that deep enough to not preclude upgrading my speakers in the future? How deep are good speakers these days? How much space do they need behind them?

How close can the framing of the false wall come to the speakers before you'll start getting acoustic problems? Do you need 2.5' on both sides of the speaker location?

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post #10 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 03:42 PM
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LOL, good speakers is a relative term and one of those ask a hundred people get a hundred answers.
I have 24" from surface of faux wall to treated wall. my REVEL M22's are about 12" deep. The C52 center is a bit deeper but not much.

If your speakers are not rear ported you can get away with less room than if they are. All three of my fronts are behind my Smx screen.

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post #11 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 04:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McCall View Post

LOL, good speakers is a relative term

Yeah, I didn't mean to open up the 'good' speaker can of worms! I'm mostly trying to avoid building a theater that will work with my current speakers but not prevent any reasonable upgrades. To me a reasonable upgrade means <$10k for LCR and surrounds. I'm not looking to get 8ft tall two ton horn speakers.

I guess I'm looking for the answer to this question:

"You won't be limiting yourself much in speaker selection department if you have ___ (fill in the blank) inches of space behind your screen wall. "

Any takers?

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post #12 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

I started with 2 rectangular frames of finger joined pine trim boards. Connected on the top and bottom with a cross member. I doubled up the outside leg with a space between the two boards.

What dimension of boards did you use, and did you use the same boards for your frames that you wrapped the fabric around?

I'm also curious if you needed to make sure these were screwed into a joist on the ceiling, or if just into the drywall was good enough?

I've been admiring your screenwall for almost a year now, it is nice to take a look at the magic behind the fabric. Simple is good.

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post #13 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 05:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmeyer View Post

It's hard to tell from your pictures: How deep are spaces behind the false walls? How wide an opening should you make for a speaker?

With my ceiling treatment, my false wall can come out about 18". I know that will fit my Paradigm mini-monitors just fine, but is that deep enough to not preclude upgrading my speakers in the future? How deep are good speakers these days? How much space do they need behind them?

How close can the framing of the false wall come to the speakers before you'll start getting acoustic problems? Do you need 2.5' on both sides of the speaker location?

My false wall is flush with the front of the "stage" with is 2'-0 1/8" deep.
Im using B&W 604's which are also flush with the front of the false wall/stage.
The yellow lines are the 2" OC 703 Bryan (bpape) designed into the room.
The purple box with red speakers is the an IB that will be in the ceiling/attic.

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post #14 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 06:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmeyer View Post

I guess I'm looking for the answer to this question:

"You won't be limiting yourself much in speaker selection department if you have ___ (fill in the blank) inches of space behind your screen wall. "

Any takers?

36 or 48 inches. Keep in mind that if you do an AT screen that there should be some distance between the front of the screen and the speaker. I think it's in the neighborhood of 10 inches. I haven't seen many speakers deeper than 24 inches. Also they recommend having the speaker well in front of the wall so it adds up.

High quality in-walls would solve your 18 inch limitation.
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post #15 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 06:23 PM
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I ended up with about 14 inches due to the limitations of a door to my equipment/concession area. The Ascends are not very deep, maybe 8 inches and port out the back. I've been very happy with the result. You have to do what you what you can within the limitations of the room, obstacles, etc.

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post #16 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 06:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aaron_hinni View Post

What dimension of boards did you use, and did you use the same boards for your frames that you wrapped the fabric around?

I'm also curious if you needed to make sure these were screwed into a joist on the ceiling, or if just into the drywall was good enough?

I've been admiring your screenwall for almost a year now, it is nice to take a look at the magic behind the fabric. Simple is good.

Without taking it apart again, I think the uprights were 1 1/4 x 3 (or 3 1/2)

Here is another shot of the bottom panel.


The smaller pieces were 1 1/4 x 1 1/2
I stuck a couple of pieces of larger stock on the ends for a little stability

Drywall was fine for me. (two layers)

the two side panels actually have pieces that are not square. Since they sit at an angle I cut all the pieces to fit the appropriate angles. If you look carefully at the pic you might spot it. Sorry don't have a close up.
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post #17 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 07:27 PM
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Big,

Carpet looks fantastic. Your wall has me once again chanting the "simple is better" mantra.

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post #18 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 08:34 PM
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Big,

Is the fabric above the chair rail GOM Cement Mix ? How does it look with the lights out and PJ on ?

Ivan
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post #19 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 09:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ifeliciano View Post

Big,

Is the fabric above the chair rail GOM Cement Mix ? How does it look with the lights out and PJ on ?

Ivan

Crystal blue on the top, Baltic blue bottom, paint on trim and ceiling is Lowes Amercican traditions Drizzling Mist. Looks fine but does light up a bit.
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post #20 of 406 Old 04-23-2007, 10:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

Crystal blue.... Looks fine but does light up a bit.

Thanks!! Im looking into using Cement Mix or Steels Harbor and think both those colors will light up also, but we like them.

Great job on your space !
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post #21 of 406 Old 08-22-2007, 03:04 PM
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Big - any problem with your lumber warping? I was trading PM's with another user and he was debating using steel studs for the screenwall (baring rattles or similar)?
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post #22 of 406 Old 08-22-2007, 06:36 PM - Thread Starter
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I used finger joint pine from Chile. HD carries a line of exterior trim boards that are pre-primed finger joined pine. The boards are 1 1/4 thick and come in various widths. at my HD they are easy to spot because they stand the 16 ft lengths on end.

After cutting to size I calculated that it runs 3x the $ of stud grade lumber. It comes straight and stays straight. Also stiffer than studs of equal size.
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post #23 of 406 Old 08-23-2007, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

I used finger joint pine from Chile. HD carries a line of exterior trim boards that are pre-primed finger joined pine. The boards are 1 1/4 thick and come in various widths. at my HD they are easy to spot because they stand the 16 ft lengths on end.

After cutting to size I calculated that it runs 3x the $ of stud grade lumber. It comes straight and stays straight. Also stiffer than studs of equal size.

DC,

Did you use the pine for the top arch of your stage? I saw another pic you posted elsewhere and it appears you used standard 2x4s. if not, would it work with the pine? If a 2x4, how did you bend the wood? I did not think that type of wood would accomodate such a large curve. Also are the bottom and top stage arches the same size?

Finally, is there any reason why your side panels are angled outward versus being on plane with the screen and center panels?

I plan on unabashedly copying your design. Thanks.
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post #24 of 406 Old 08-23-2007, 09:31 PM
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I plan on unabashedly copying your design. Thanks.

me too...I can do this

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post #25 of 406 Old 08-24-2007, 06:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys for the compliments.

The angling out was pure cosmetics on my part, It is more noticeable in person than in the Photos. I plan on migrating to 2:35 AT (SMX) in the future so I am not certain that design element will survive.

As for the Marquee over the stage:

the rounded piece was actually a double layer of PVC wood composite which bends pretty easy. The long straight pieces were the finger joined pine. The rest was ripped 2x4's The thing is 2 inches thick. Stuffed with 2 layers of Linacoustic, wrapped in black GOM. It's mounted to the ceiling with 2 screws (through the uprights in the back) and 2 tubes of Lock-tite adhesive (the stuff in the commercial where the guy glues the hammer to the ceiling)

One other little detail, I put a couple of cross pieces of black Gaffers tape (and stapled) across the big sections to keep the linacoustic from sagging the GOM.

here are some construction pics of the details.

details on that Finger joined stuff:



Measure twice cut both sides at once, my template:


Finished frame:




I practiced lifting into place 4 times before I did it for real. I temporally screwed 2 pieces of wood to the side walls to hold the back straight edge. I cut 6 2x4's the exact length to wedge between the floor and the marquee while the glue dried. I wrapped the ends with scrap GOM to protect the GOM on the marquee. I also had a can of Acetone and some clean rags on standby in case I got any glue on areas That I didn't want. And I did, and it cleaned it off. I did have to touch up the paint because it came off too. But the glue on the black GOM came off cleanly.



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post #26 of 406 Old 08-24-2007, 06:55 AM
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Thanks DC. I know I read it somewhere on a couple of methods to get the arc template, can you please let me know the method you used because I cannot find the thread where someone explained it. Thanks.

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post #27 of 406 Old 08-24-2007, 07:05 AM
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An alternative to Big's marquee approach, I asked my carpenters to build a curved marquee, and this is what they came up with (taken from my thread at post #179). Not sure if this is a good recomendation or not, as it wasn't DIY and my carpenters grumbled that it wasn't easy to do. Came out pretty nice though:

Quote:
Originally Posted by dc_pilgrim View Post


Here are a couple of under shots, under construction. The curved part is made of some kind of composite. Like vinyl. It feels plastic to the touch, is meant for outdoor work, and they tell me its paintable. I have some doubts, but worst case I'll remove the trim and wrap it in fabric. I had discussed keeping the portion of the soffit over the stage open, to allow it to be used for bass trapping, if needed. Anyways, some under pics showing the guts.

Another, closer:

A reader in my thread speculated on what the material was:

Quote:
Originally Posted by jtnfoley View Post

The flexible exterior plastic trim is probably this stuff: http://www.komatrimboards.com/
I picked up a 1x12x18' of this from Taylor Lumber in Marshfield ($72) to play with the material and decide whether its' right for a few boat projects. (It is, IMHO, so I bought a 3/8x4x10 sheet of it for $120.)
Can be glued/screwed/cut/machined like wood, is available in several moulding profiles, and being PVC can be solvent welded with PVC/CPVC solvent from a plumbers supply.

Nice matte white by default... Hmmm..... DIY screen fodder? I'll have to check!

I can tell you from firsthand experience that this material has a fantastic affinity for latex based paint.
This is technically an engineering Foam, so cut edges are really porous and must be sealed and sanded prior to painting if the edge is going to be visible.

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post #28 of 406 Old 08-24-2007, 08:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIGmouthinDC View Post

Thanks guys for the compliments.

The angling out was pure cosmetics on my part, It is more noticeable in person than in the Photos.

It looks great in the photo, but not having seen it in person ... if you were doing it again do you think it would look better if the arch were smaller (more similar in size to what DC Pilgrim has) such that the top arch is smaller/shallower than the bottom stage arch?

Also, how high are the two layers of the bottom stage? It looks to be 2x4 for the bottom and 2x8 for the top (or else another layer of 2x4s on top of the bottom layer).
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post #29 of 406 Old 08-24-2007, 10:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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It looks great in the photo, but not having seen it in person ... if you were doing it again do you think it would look better if the arch were smaller
Also, how high are the two layers of the bottom stage? It looks to be 2x4 for the bottom and 2x8 for the top (or else another layer of 2x4s on top of the bottom layer).

One of my motivations on bringing the curve out a bit was to match the bottom and to give a bigger black area on the ceiling since I wasn't planning on painting the ceiling black.

If I were to do it again I might build it taller and put trim molding to match. Also do some kind of lighting.

The bottom turned out to be two 5 inch steps. I would make it bigger the next time. It gave the carpet guys fits.

Here is another arch in the back of my room: Yet to be finished back end.







some constuction details





Using the Flex-trac to create a curved soffit. http://www.flexc.com/products.html?t...x4&mode=simple



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post #30 of 406 Old 08-24-2007, 10:44 AM
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I hate it that work is blocking photobucket
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