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post #1 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 10:18 AM - Thread Starter
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OK, time to post progress on my theatre... modern style. Target is to get all done in 6 weeks. Plenty of progress so far. I will be posting pics as I go along. Thanks to everyone for providing such useful tips so far. This is coming together quickly.

SPECS:
Dimensions of main rectangle: 13.8 ft x 22 ft
3 row front, 2 row rear.
7.1 system. Front Polks R50, all surrounds are Athena bipolar.
105" diag screen
First row @ 14 ft.
Second Row @ 21 ft.

Insulation:
R13 walls, R50 ceiling.
DW+GG+DW all around.



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post #2 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 10:19 AM - Thread Starter
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This is what we're shooting for...





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post #3 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 10:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Framing!




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post #4 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 10:19 AM - Thread Starter
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More framing etc




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post #5 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 10:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Conduit for PJ, and insulation




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post #6 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 10:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Drywall!!






Paint, stage, riser!


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post #7 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 11:56 AM
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Looks good!

Just a couple of quick questions. What is the width and length (to the second row)?

I wondered why you didn't keep the isle down the left-hand side instead of moving it over to the right? If the drawing is to scale, you could put the seats in the middle and center the screen. In fact the screen could be larger that way.

My 2 cents.
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post #8 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 11:57 AM
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Nice renderings! I recomend getting a photobucket account, real nice stuff. See the third link in my sig (credit Jikkjack).

Might want to think about whether the EQ rack recessed in the utility room will create a lot of noise in the HT, also.
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post #9 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 11:57 AM
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Why is your screen off center in your sketch?

David Forbes

Read excerpts, see cover art and more from my novels at www.davidforbes.net.

My theater
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post #10 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 12:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Good questions...! Everything is off center because on the right hand side (where the 'corridor' is), there is a soffit for the HVAC duct that runs in that direction towards the screen wall. Hence, I decided to go with the offset layout. Screen will be 103" diameter, first seat at 15 feet. I will get the seats closer once I upgrade to 1080p (~8 -10 months or so).

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post #11 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 12:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dc_pilgrim View Post

Might want to think about whether the EQ rack recessed in the utility room will create a lot of noise in the HT, also.

Not sure I understand... why would this create more noise in the HT room? My assumption was that by recessing outside of the HT room and into the utility room, sound would be minimized (if anything).

I did it only to gain easy access to the equipment though

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post #12 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 12:35 PM
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Think of it this way, you will hear the furnace more since there isn't a solid wall inbetween it and the HT. You will hear your HT EQ less, since it isn't fully in the room.


You have a few alternatives (in no particular order):
1. move the rack elsewhere
2. closet the rack in where it is now (consider heat build up and access - either sliding rack or a door behind the rack to access the wires)
3. A half measure - e.g. partially closet the rack, or something like that.

My rack is recessed into my utility room, but I put it just at the entrance to the room. Its a trade off, in that I need to use either an IR extender or RF for my equipment, and I can't see the rack in my seats to monitor the EQ or change the discs - but I don't have the noise polution risk either. Just something to consider.

EDIT - here is a pic of my rack relative to the HT if it helps:
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post #13 of 84 Old 07-25-2007, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dc_pilgrim View Post

Think of it this way, you will hear the furnace more since there isn't a solid wall inbetween it and the HT. You will hear your HT EQ less, since it isn't fully in the room.


You have a few alternatives (in no particular order):
1. move the rack elsewhere
2. closet the rack in where it is now (consider heat build up and access - either sliding rack or a door behind the rack to access the wires)
3. A half measure - e.g. partially closet the rack, or something like that.

My rack is recessed into my utility room, but I put it just at the entrance to the room. Its a trade off, in that I need to use either an IR extender or RF for my equipment, and I can't see the rack in my seats to monitor the EQ or change the discs - but I don't have the noise polution risk either. Just something to consider.

This will be a great theater. Things are looking good already!

I just went through this very same issue. I had a shared wall between the theater and the furnace/laundry room. I needed to cut a hole for my MA rack - access in the theater, and from the theater side access to the back of the rack.

It came down to 2 options: put a plexiglass door on the rack @ $400 or not cut the hole.
I decided to wire the theater for RF and or Infrared and use a Buffalo Electronics or Xantech IR/RF system.

Hope this helps!
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post #14 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 05:50 AM
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OK, I'm going to be direct because I see a ton of problems here. One caveat, you don't share any room dimensions, so I am going to make general statements.

Cool rendering but don't offset your theater - you will have sound issues and it won't look quite right. I had a similar HVAC run down the right hand side of my theater so I build a soffit to match on the left side - now it is symetrical. I gave up some ceiling height but it was well worth it.

Center your screen. Make it wider and get the front row closer. Also, someone suggested running your aisle down the left side - I agree it will flow much better. There was also someone that brought up your rack opening in the back to your utility room. You are spending big bucks for green glue then throwing it away by having the room open to your utility room. No matter how you convince yourself, sound will leak in and out of that gaping hole. Just build a sealed closet on the utility room side with a door - leave the rack facing into your theater and you should get little sound leakage. Only other thing to keep in mind is if you are running pro-amps or ever upgrade to them, you will hear the fan noise with your rack so close to your seating position.

My projector is 720p. My screen is 120" wide and my first row is at 11.5'. That put my second row at about 15'. It is perfect for me and I even wish I would have gone a little bigger with my screen. You say you will move closer when you upgrade to 1080p. Ok, does that mean you will tear up your riser and re-build it - just put it up closer now you won't regret it. Also, make sure your riser is high enough. You can look at the riser height calculator, but it told me 11" so I disregarded and made my riser higher at 14". There is no issue with the back row seeing over the front. I was lucky though because I was starting with a 10' tall space. But once I built a room-withing-a-room, that height dropped to about 9.5' in the middle, then the soffits on the sides dropped it to 8.5', then factor in my riser and it is closer to 7.5' on the sides where my aisles are - still no problem with height.
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post #15 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 06:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Video,

Thanks for sharing your experiences and ideas.

Dimensions are 13.8 ft x 22ft (for the main rectangular area).

Few things to mention:

1) I cannot project 'under' the soffit. If I do, then I am forced to bring the screen down below the sofft (obviously). In doing that, there is no way the rear row will be able to see, no matter how tall the riser. Right now, I would be projecting a few inches below the ceiling, and that allows rear row to see over the first row if I use a 6" riser. (Rear row is offset from the front, so this allows for a slightly lower riser than usual). 3+2 configuration.

2)103" at 15 ft is less than ideal, I agree. The riser will be heavy, but moveable. When I upgrade to a 1080, I will move everything closer. Not ideal, I know, and there are a lot of issues with this, but I think it is do-able.

3) I see what you're all saying about the AV rack on that location. And you're of course all correct. Too late to turn back now, so I will have to figure out ways to soundproof the back of it. I think putting a door on the rear of the cabinet would help a lot, but of course ventilation could be an issue.

Thanks for all the feedback. I know you all want me to build the best possible theatre I can. There are quite a few constraints that I needed to work around (space, time, money!) so I did the best I could with what I had, and the little knowledge I have accumulated on the subject by just reading the forums. I know the second time around (next house) I will do better!

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post #16 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 07:31 AM
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I agree with some of what Video says. the screen is way too small. I have a 120" wide 2.35:1 screen seating at 9.5' and 12.5' and a 720p projector. Your seating is too far back for such a small screen. Not to mention you completely miss the wow factor. might as well be in the living room watching a big TV.
I don't agree about the offset. Mine has the door at the back left of the theater and a closet straight ahead of it that was already there, [my stage was already there as well when I converted this building]
I left the closet on the side of the stage, and built the screen wall at the back of the stage in the remaining 12' wide space.
anyway point is it means my seathing and screen are offset by the width of the aisle, though the closet completes the look of the Procenium. You have no closet in that corner but you could put something there to off set the empty corner look.

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post #17 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 08:02 AM - Thread Starter
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My ceiling height (basement) is going to end up being 8 ft. Under the sofft, it will be about 6' 9".

My calculations indicate that I cannot get the rear row to see the entire screen, if I place the top of the screen under the soffit. The riser would have to be incredibly high, so much so, that anyone standing on the riser would bang their head on the ceiling, and MOST DEFINITELY on the soffit which hangs lower on the ceiling. I decided I had to make sure that the rear row had to sit away from the soffit, so there is no change whatsoever of anyone banging their head when they stand up, or walk off the riser. It was not something I was willing to mess with. So the offset was the only solution, and I am OK with it. The aisle completes the look... with the recessed poster on that side...

As far as screen width, I could go up to 120" width in the projection area. I kept it at 103" because I use floor standing speakers, which need to stand on the sides of the screen, hence needed some 8" or so to the sides clearance...

The current 15ft ditance comes from a 2x rule of thumb for the 4805 pj. I can see SDE if I get any closer. No WOW effect here, it's true. I might just put the riser closer to the screen NOW, and live with SDE until I get a new 1080p PJ. Then I won't have to move anything around down the road.

I could go 120" and use other types of speakers in the future. Not hard at all.

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post #18 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 08:23 AM
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One suggestion is a perforated screen so that speakers can go behind it. Another, and maybe not so popular (but it worked for me in my last room), would be to wall mount the floorstanding speaker horizontally just under the screen. To me, any loss in audio quality is surpased by the "WOW" factor of screen size.

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post #19 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 08:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Horizontal speakers... had not thought of that LOL. Would definitely look strange, but who cares. I like the idea, and this would allow me to go much larger from 103 to 120 diag.

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post #20 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 08:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Guys, for 720p projectors, what is the ideal seating distance for no SDE? Is it 1.5x of the screen width? For 480p I know its 2x roughly. Which I can atest is true.

I think I am going to place the seating forward according to whatever the rule of thumb is for a 720p.

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post #21 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 09:04 AM
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Horizontal speakers unless designed or adapted to be that way is NOT a good idea at all.
However you have the depth in that room to do an AT screen, SMX preferrably. and then you would have a REAL theater like experience there is nothing like your sound coming from the screen, voices coming right out of the actors mouths not from the ceiling or the floor and being muffled by the first row etc.

What is ideal seating for 720p with no SDE? there is none. It it totally projector and screen dependent. As I say for using an SMX screen with an Optoma H77 9.5' is still not too close, no SDE and no seeing the weave of the screen, but if I had a different make or model of projector I might have a problem same with if I had a different screen, Might have a problem.
Yes there are guidelines that say 1 1/2 times screen width. To me they are absurd. but some people don't want to check for themselves what is best so they take the generic chart answer and use it instead of what would be the optimum choice for them.

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post #22 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 09:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Fine. I have decided to do the following...

I will move the seating forward so that the front row sits at 11-12 feet. For the time being, then, I will sit on the rear row for optimum distance with this 480 pj, and when I upgrade I can sit up front.

I'll look into getting a 120" screen from the get go too. We'll see how it turns out.

Thanks for everyone's input!

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post #23 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gnolivos View Post

Guys, for 720p projectors, what is the ideal seating distance for no SDE? Is it 1.5x of the screen width? For 480p I know its 2x roughly. Which I can atest is true.

I think I am going to place the seating forward according to whatever the rule of thumb is for a 720p.

I have none, zero, nada at 11 - 11.5' with a Panny AE900 on a 12' wide screen (not diagonal). The screen is 2.35:1 and it is perforated. I do not see any perforation, screen door, nothing even when I move up to 10.5'.

I have always thought that the bigger the screen the better. To me, it gets my peripheral vision involved so it gets you into the movie better. You just don't want to have to turn your head back and forth to watch the action like a tennis match.

These ratios of 1.5 etc just don't make any sense in my experience. I used to see these back in the mid 80s in buying big screen TVs. The sales person would tell me that a 50" TV is too big for my apartment so I would go one size BIGGER and would still not be happy. FYI, this is the third projection system I have had dating back to 1999. I still don't think it is big enough but I am at a little less than 1:1 width to distance ratio and would keep it that way going forward.
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post #24 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 10:30 AM
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If I was you ,I would put the screen in the center of the room. And let people walk to the left or right to get a sit.
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post #25 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 11:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sax View Post

If I was you ,I would put the screen in the center of the room. And let people walk to the left or right to get a sit.

Well, I'd love to, but as I explained earlier, the soffit hangs low, and I cannot project below it. if I do, no one in the rear will get to see, even with a full height riser. Not possible!

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post #26 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 03:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I put some more thought into this, and have determined that another approach is as follows...

leave everything as is, and when I upgrade PJ, I can put in a 120" diag screen which fits in the back wall. Then instead of moving the seats forward by 2 feet (which would put me at approx 1.5x dist factor), I can instead bring the screen FORWARD by 2 feet, hence achieving the same effect. This would end up being a 120" diag at 13 ft. If I use an acoustically transparent screen, I can even use the 2 ft space to put all my speakers behind.

Comments on this approach?

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post #27 of 84 Old 07-26-2007, 06:03 PM
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Well, I gave it a shot, but I think you have it figured out on your own.

Quote by Mc Call: The screen is way too small. I have a 120" wide 2.35:1 screen seating at 9.5' and 12.5' and a 720p projector. Your seating is too far back for such a small screen. Not to mention you completely miss the wow factor. might as well be in the living room watching a big TV.
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post #28 of 84 Old 07-27-2007, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gnolivos View Post

Well, I put some more thought into this, and have determined that another approach is as follows...

leave everything as is, and when I upgrade PJ, I can put in a 120" diag screen which fits in the back wall. Then instead of moving the seats forward by 2 feet (which would put me at approx 1.5x dist factor), I can instead bring the screen FORWARD by 2 feet, hence achieving the same effect. This would end up being a 120" diag at 13 ft. If I use an acoustically transparent screen, I can even use the 2 ft space to put all my speakers behind.

Comments on this approach?

I think that's a fine way to do it. Just plan on all necessary wire locations for HT version 1.0 AND 2.0. Based on the projector you select, the ideal mounting location may change.

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post #29 of 84 Old 07-27-2007, 07:51 AM
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Nice rendering. Did you do that in Sketchup?

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post #30 of 84 Old 07-27-2007, 09:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Yes, it's sketchup.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee L View Post

Nice rendering. Did you do that in Sketchup?


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