Trying to find PDF file of owners manual for Samsung BD-C6900 3D Blu Ray player... - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 9 Old 03-10-2010, 10:48 AM - Thread Starter
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This player is supposedly available for sale today, but I went to Samsungs website to try to find a PDF of the owners manual, but there isn't anything in the support area for the BD-C6900 yet. I'd really love to take a look at the owners manual, because I'm very interested to see if Samsung took into consideration the folks that bought their "supposedly" 3D Ready plasmas that were available in 2008 and 2009. They stopped putting 3D support in those 3D plasmas, imho more because they want to only sell high-end 3D ready models in the beginning.

Still, I can tell you that if Samsung's own 3D Blu Ray player doesn't work with their previous 3D ready plasmas I'm going to be pretty pissed. Obviously, if it did work with those plasmas, it wouldn't work as well as it would on their brand new displays, but I would think they could have some type of circuitry inside the player that would basically downcovert the 3D signal to something their older plasmas could understand. We wouldn't be getting the full resolution or anything, but it would be better than nothing. If the BD-C6900 doesn't support Checkerboard, or doesn't support an output resolution of 1360 x 768, then I know I'm screwed. I'd love to see a PDF of that manual to find out one way or the other....
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post #2 of 9 Old 03-10-2010, 12:46 PM
 
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Not the manual - that hasn't been made available at Samsung USA or Samsung UK's websites. But it does have some info - not what you are looking for though.

Just keep checking their websites. It will get posted sooner or later

http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-BD-C69.../dp/B00365EVWO
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post #3 of 9 Old 03-10-2010, 07:59 PM
 
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The BD-C6900 is now on the Samsung website but no downloads (manual) yet:

http://www.samsung.com/us/consumer/t...l&tab=features
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post #4 of 9 Old 03-16-2010, 10:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Well, the manual is available now, but doesn't give very much information in regards to the 3D formats.

http://downloadcenter.samsung.com/co...A-ENG-0311.pdf


The manual doesn't mention the exact format of 3D output. There is no mention whatsoever of Checkerboard support. Also, I was a bit surprised that it doesn't specifically address compatibility issues with any particular TV's. When you read the manual, it's almost as if the 3D part of the equation is just a footnote.

3D Mode in the menu gives you 3 options:

Auto - You can choose whether to watch 3D Blu-ray disk in 3D or 2D mode before playing the 3D Blu-ray. It is automatically played in 2D mode if your TV cannot support 3D contents.


3D - The 3D Blu-ray disk is played in 3D mode at all times. If a TV cannot support 3D Blu-ray disks, the playing screen can be black.


2D - The 3D Blu-ray disk is played in 2D mode at all times. Choose this to view a picture without 3D effect or when a TV cannot support 3D Blu-ray disks.


TV SCREEN SIZE

Let's you enter the actual screen size of your TV so that the player can adjust the image according to the screen size and display an optimal 3D image. (The maximum allowed screen size is 116 inches for this player)

* All 3D signals are output only using the HDMI cable and through the HDMI OUT port.

* As the video resolution in 3D play mode is fixed according to the resolution of the original 3D video, you cannot change the resolution to your preference.

* Some functions such as BD Wise, or setting the screen size or resolution may not operate properly in 3D mode.

*You must use a high-speed HDMI cable for a proper output of the 3D signal.

* If the product is connected to some 3D devices, the 3D effect may not function properly.


---------------------------------------------------------


Well, after looking at all this, I can't say definitively that this Samsung won't work in Checkerboard mode, because it doesn't mention it whatsoever, but I'm guessing that it won't. Also, it appears that the Samsung plasma owners are screwed because of the resolution requirements. The resolution cannot be adjusted while in 3D mode, so I'm guessing this basically eliminates any possibility of this working with previous 3D Samsung plasmas. It would also eliminate it from working with any 720p based 3D Rear-Projection DLP's or 720p 3D front projectors.

One other thing I was kinda surprised by, was the fact that the maximum screen size you can set is 116 inches. The 16:9 screen in my projector room is 122 inches, and the full 2:35:1 screen area in my room is even bigger than that. I wonder if this screen size thing is going to be a problem for projector owners?
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post #5 of 9 Old 03-17-2010, 03:16 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony1 View Post

The manual doesn't mention the exact format of 3D output.

To qualify as a 3D BD player - it has to conform to the specs laid down by the BDA as they pertain to 3D BD.

3D Format = frame packed 1080x24P

Quote:


The Blu-ray 3D specification calls for encoding 3-D video using the Multiview Video Coding (MVC) codec, an extension to the ITU-T H.264 Advanced Video Coding (AVC) codec currently supported by all Blu-ray Disc players. MPEG4-MVC compresses both left and right eye views with a typical 50% overhead compared to equivalent 2-D content, and can provide full 1080p resolution backward compatibility with current 2-D Blu-ray Disc players. The specification also incorporates enhanced graphic features for 3-D. These features provide a new experience for users, enabling navigation using 3-D graphic menus and displaying 3-D subtitles positioned in 3-D video.

There is no mention whatsoever of Checkerboard support. Also, I was a bit surprised that it doesn't specifically address compatibility issues with any particular TV's. When you read the manual, it's almost as if the 3D part of the equation is just a footnote.

Quote:


Notably, the specification allows every player and movie supporting it to deliver full HD 1080p resolution to each eye. Moreover, the specification is display agnostic, meaning that Blu-ray 3D products will deliver the 3-D image to any compatible 3-D display, regardless of whether that display uses LCD, plasma or other technology and regardless of what 3-D technology the display uses to deliver the image to the viewer's eyes.

http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=3924

It is up to the display CEM to deal with the 3D BD signals. This has been demo'd as:

PDP and LCD = Shutter glasses FH3D/eye frame sequential 3D format

DLP RPTV = converter box - Shutter glasses HHD/eye - checkerboard 3D format

LCOS PJ = dual engine - passive 3D glasses + silver screen - FH3D/eye
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post #6 of 9 Old 03-17-2010, 06:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Stewart View Post

To qualify as a 3D BD player - it has to conform to the specs laid down by the BDA as they pertain to 3D BD.

3D Format = frame packed 1080x24P

There is no mention whatsoever of Checkerboard support. Also, I was a bit surprised that it doesn't specifically address compatibility issues with any particular TV's.

There is no mention of the output format, checkerboard, frame packing or otherwise, or even the interface, HDMI, VGA, or component, because this is not within the scope of the BD spec.

The 3D BD delivers 2 pictures of 1920x1080 pixel, 23.97 or 24 times per second.

How this gets transported over an HDMI cable to a display device is the responsibilty of the HDMI spec.

How the display device renders the left eye view to the left eye, and the right eye view to the right eye of however many viewers, is entirely up to the display manufacturer, and not part of the BD, the HDMI or any other spec.

A BD player might choose to downgrade the dual 1080p24 signal from the disc, and output side-by-side half 1080i, or frame packing 720p, or DLP checkerboard, or anaglyph, or 2 2D 1080p24 signals on two independent HDMI outputs, or 1024x768 frame flipping on a VGA port, while controlling shutter glasses over IR, or 2D 480i if that's all the TV can do. It can retain 1080p24 per eye with the frame packing, side-by-side(full) or line alternative formats from HDMI, if the negotiation with the TV via EDID revealed a support for those formats.

The HDMI and BD specs are just there to mandate certain minimum requirements, so that devices from different manufacturers can operate with each other. There is no minimal quality requirement. Luckily, 1080p24 frame packing is mandatory in a display, so that is a good common denominator.
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post #7 of 9 Old 03-17-2010, 07:07 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scarabaeus View Post

There is no mention of the output format, checkerboard, frame packing or otherwise, or even the interface, HDMI, VGA, or component, because this is not within the scope of the BD spec.

The 3D BD delivers 2 pictures of 1920x1080 pixel, 23.97 or 24 times per second.

How this gets transported over an HDMI cable to a display device is the responsibilty of the HDMI spec.

How the display device renders the left eye view to the left eye, and the right eye view to the right eye of however many viewers, is entirely up to the display manufacturer, and not part of the BD, the HDMI or any other spec.

A BD player might choose to downgrade the dual 1080p24 signal from the disc, and output side-by-side half 1080i, or frame packing 720p, or DLP checkerboard, or anaglyph, or 2 2D 1080p24 signals on two independent HDMI outputs, or 1024x768 frame flipping on a VGA port, while controlling shutter glasses over IR, or 2D 480i if that's all the TV can do. It can retain 1080p24 per eye with the frame packing, side-by-side(full) or line alternative formats from HDMI, if the negotiation with the TV via EDID revealed a support for those formats.

The HDMI and BD specs are just there to mandate certain minimum requirements, so that devices from different manufacturers can operate with each other. There is no minimal quality requirement. Luckily, 1080p24 frame packing is mandatory in a display, so that is a good common denominator.

So what about this from the BDA:

Quote:


Notably, the specification allows every player and movie supporting it to deliver full HD 1080p resolution to each eye. Moreover, the specification is display agnostic, meaning that Blu-ray 3D products will deliver the 3-D image to any compatible 3-D display, regardless of whether that display uses LCD, plasma or other technology and regardless of what 3-D technology the display uses to deliver the image to the viewer's eyes.

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post #8 of 9 Old 03-17-2010, 08:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Stewart View Post

So what about this from the BDA:

Exactly my point. No mention of the video interface (HDMI), the timing format (frame packing), and specifically no firm display technology.

It states just that the spec allows full high-definition delivery to each eye. No mandate for that, though.
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post #9 of 9 Old 03-18-2010, 12:53 PM
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Since the Consumer Reports blog reported that either the Samsung or the Panasonic player output connected to either the Samsung 3DTV or the Panasonic 3DTV has the same 3D images when playing the disk that came with the Samsung kit I assume that the Samsung is in fact outputting the correct dual frame packed buffer. And since no other ouptut format is stated as optional there are none.
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