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post #31 of 241 Old 06-18-2014, 02:55 PM
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I think you'll enjoy the TD1. It's a great camcorder. Be sure to check for focus in both left and right files. You don't want one side soft. One feature I suggest you learn right away is touch select for focus and exposure. It's extremely valuable. Learning how to adjust for manual convergence is also important, although less so IMO.

Barry C uses PowerDirector for his JVC files. He has 3 TD1s, so he'll be a valuable resource for you, too.

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post #32 of 241 Old 06-18-2014, 03:58 PM - Thread Starter
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I think you'll enjoy the TD1. It's a great camcorder. Be sure to check for focus in both left and right files. You don't want one side soft. One feature I suggest you learn right away is touch select for focus and exposure. It's extremely valuable. Learning how to adjust for manual convergence is also important, although less so IMO.

Barry C uses PowerDirector for his JVC files. He has 3 TD1s, so he'll be a valuable resource for you, too.
Thanks for the advice will have a good read of manuals and get some practice in in the coming weeks ready for my trip to spain in august. I have PowerDirector 12 ultimate and was reading you can do avchd 3d which is same format of jvc mp4 though lower bit rate and has menus and encoded into 2stream frame packing.
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post #33 of 241 Old 06-19-2014, 01:50 AM
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Don't worry NTSC is long gone here in the US too. We use ATSC now.

The big issue is the frame rate difference. PAL is 25 FPS and ATSC is 24FPS FILM conversion Or 50 FPS vs. 30 FPS for TV etc.
Don, in the PAL contries 25 fps are still very very common - given the frequency of the power-network.

24p would be nice - sure - but given the outdated 3D-Blu-ray specifications I would like 23,976 fps.

Especially for s3D it would be great to run our shootings with higher framerates like 48p or 50p or 60p - we know that very well today. But even with 4K/UHD that is still outstanding.

And the same old story will continue with 4K/UHD. My new GH4 is equiped for 4K with 24p and with UHD with 23,976p, 25p, 29,97p only. So, and that is my reaction: I have decided to purchase only ONE GH4 today - so I will not use the GH4 for s3D at all. At least not now. Two units will all equipment take some money, and tomorrow we will be faced by 4K 50p/60p maybe. Even if the new Atomos Shogun ends where most of our today exisiting 4k units are today (only the Z100 offers 4K with 50p today).

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post #34 of 241 Old 06-19-2014, 11:31 AM - Thread Starter
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My GS-TD1 arrived today, very happy, ran a firmware update charged battery and took video of my dog playing in the garden a bit in doors. First impressions. Nice build fits snugly in my hands, picture quality certainly good and well worth current price of £549 I paid at amazon. Basic manual not very good so downloaded detailed one from JVC and updated the media browser as well. Going out to local park or somewhere give it a good test, have noticed any problems yet between l/r lens focus. Overall a very happy chap with my purchase just got to get some decent footage to test my editors with.
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post #35 of 241 Old 06-19-2014, 07:53 PM
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The software that comes with the TD1 (MediaBrowser) allows you to do simple editing (with titles) and burn to Blu-ray disc. You can fade, but more complicated editing isn't possible. If you shoot in AVCHD 3D mode, there's very little rendering and the results look virtually identical to the original footage. Blu-ray discs burned using this technique will play on AVCHD 2.0 compatible Blu-ray 3D players at 60i, but not older Blu-ray 3D players (which can't play back 60i 3D). If you shoot carefully, you can get great (and consistent) results. The complete lack of more sophisticated editing capability will prove extremely frustrating when things need to be adjusted, but it works and it's fast. It's as close as you're going to get to maintaining maximum image quality. Unfortunately, it doesn't work with the mp4 shooting modes (low or high bit rate). It has to render mp4 footage and the quality suffers more. The good thing is that the native AVCHD 3D mode (25 mbps) looks very good. It's one more editing option available with the JVCs.

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post #36 of 241 Old 06-20-2014, 04:18 AM - Thread Starter
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I understand that, though when I make a bluray iso that is under 7.5gb in size I burn to a dvd or dual layer dvd with imgburn and they play no problem in my bluray player. What we need is and editor to handle make compilation with 30 - 40Mbps instead of 10 - 25
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post #37 of 241 Old 06-20-2014, 11:44 AM
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I understand that, though when I make a bluray iso that is under 7.5gb in size I burn to a dvd or dual layer dvd with imgburn and they play no problem in my bluray player. What we need is and editor to handle make compilation with 30 - 40Mbps instead of 10 - 25
The software that comes with the JVC burns only to Blu-ray disc, not DVD, and it won't burn an iso file (at least it couldn't do that in the past). If you have BD re-writable discs, you could burn to those. However, AnyDVD HD won't extract and create iso files from those discs. I don't know if DVDFab will, but I doubt it. If you copy the files to hard drive and then burn them to DVD instead of Blu-ray, your player may or may not play them. (Please report back when you find out.) It depends on the player. I've had failures with later model Samsung, Panasonic and Sony players when trying to play back AVCHD 2.0 3D discs. The "standard" is anything but standard.

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post #38 of 241 Old 06-20-2014, 11:54 AM
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As for higher bit rate exports, that's what we'd all like, but it isn't going to happen at this price level. A very bad thing about these great camcorders is that when you edit, it's virtually impossible to maintain the original recording quality. The authoring packages (Vegas, PD12) limit the bitrate and reduce the quality, and usually quite significantly. They're protecting their higher priced 3D authoring packages. The software included with the JVC gets around the image degradation problem by making an exact copy of the footage (except for the title overlay rendering). And since almost no rendering is involved, it's extremely fast. If you shoot carefully and can make do with mostly cuts-only editing, and no color or convergence correction, you can create great looking discs really fast.

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post #39 of 241 Old 06-20-2014, 12:12 PM - Thread Starter
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The software that comes with the JVC burns only to Blu-ray disc, not DVD, and it won't burn an iso file (at least it couldn't do that in the past). If you have BD re-writable discs, you could burn to those. However, AnyDVD HD won't extract and create iso files from those discs. I don't know if DVDFab will, but I doubt it. If you copy the files to hard drive and then burn them to DVD instead of Blu-ray, your player may or may not play them. (Please report back when you find out.) It depends on the player. I've had failures with later model Samsung, Panasonic and Sony players when trying to play back AVCHD 2.0 3D discs. The "standard" is anything but standard.

you can copy any disc iso with imgburn or the likes of poweriso which can then extract the files, never tried with anydvdhd as its generally for copying encrypted discs, it will extract bd rewritables or do you mean ones written by the camera. I have loads of bluray iso's burnt to normal dvd discs and play no problem on my player even 3d movies ripped then shrunk play okay.
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post #40 of 241 Old 06-20-2014, 01:13 PM
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Sounds like your player doesn't have a problem with Blu-ray content on DVD. If it's compatible with AVCHD 2.0 (60p and 3D), everything might go smoothly for you using the free software that came with the JVC. Most older Blu-ray 3D players won't play the AVCHD 2.0 3D discs, because 1080/60i 3D isn't part of the original specs.

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post #41 of 241 Old 06-20-2014, 03:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Sounds like your player doesn't have a problem with Blu-ray content on DVD. If it's compatible with AVCHD 2.0 (60p and 3D), everything might go smoothly for you using the free software that came with the JVC. Most older Blu-ray 3D players won't play the AVCHD 2.0 3D discs, because 1080/60i 3D isn't part of the original specs.
I copied the avchd folder from sd card/cam memory burned folders with imageburn to rewritable dvd and it played in my player no problem tv switched to multiview 3d got same quality as cam plugged into tv. tried powerdirector supposed to do avchd but only sbs mode, need editor that will do menus and mvc mts for avchd 2.0 3d
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post #42 of 241 Old 06-20-2014, 07:16 PM
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That sounds great. I remember taking an SD card from my TD1 into a Best Buy store and trying it with a Panasonic 3D TV - no problem playing the files in full quality. Unfortunately, I've had plenty of compatibility issues with various Blu-ray players since then. Glad to hear that things are going well for you.

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post #43 of 241 Old 06-25-2014, 04:02 PM - Thread Starter
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How do you render an avchd 2.0 3D with menu with an mvc file only setting I have found in pd11/12 is avchd sbs format without menu
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post #44 of 241 Old 06-26-2014, 09:11 AM
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AVCHD 2.0/3D does not use MVC encoding - but is a multiplex stream that has both streams included. The PD is able to render such a stream with s3D menues too - but with very limited possibilities. Beside that there is no prosumer tool that I know that is able to render AVCHD 2.0 with menus. Without menus such a job can be done for example by Edius 6.5 or higher.

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post #45 of 241 Old 06-26-2014, 04:00 PM - Thread Starter
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AVCHD 2.0/3D does not use MVC encoding - but is a multiplex stream that has both streams included. The PD is able to render such a stream with s3D menues too - but with very limited possibilities. Beside that there is no prosumer tool that I know that is able to render AVCHD 2.0 with menus. Without menus such a job can be done for example by Edius 6.5 or higher.
I understand what you mean, what I meant to ask is where IS THE AVCHD 2.0 setting in PD as I only find normal avchd which produces a single stream sbs + audio in mts stream and doesn't allow menus, I assumed reading the avchd 2.0 specs it produces to separate streams L/R + audio in a mts stream. or maybe I got it all wrong
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post #46 of 241 Old 06-27-2014, 06:16 AM
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Unfortunately, I have deinstalled the PD long time ago from my system. The reason is that it was never capable to work together with my nvidia 3D vision in a good way - what both Vegas and Edius can do. So what I do is to use Vegas to generate 3D-Blu-rays, or use the DVDA 6 to generate 3D-Blu-ray with 2D menus. That is fine for me, the quality is acceptable to me - I do not need more. So I cannot really answer your questions about the PD.

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post #47 of 241 Old 06-27-2014, 11:49 AM
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The reason is that it was never capable to work together with my nvidia 3D vision in a good way
Not sure if this will help you, but when I use PD, I have to put the 3D TV in 2D mode and then send the video using Line alternate mode. The 3D is great looking. I still only use PD for projects I want DTS and 3D menus.
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post #48 of 241 Old 06-27-2014, 01:28 PM
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I understand what you mean, what I meant to ask is where IS THE AVCHD 2.0 setting in PD as I only find normal avchd which produces a single stream sbs + audio in mts stream and doesn't allow menus, I assumed reading the avchd 2.0 specs it produces to separate streams L/R + audio in a mts stream. or maybe I got it all wrong
I use PD which works very well with the JVCTD1s that I use. Unfortunately, my recollection is that, PD won't recognized TD1 AVCHD 3d files as 3d only 2d. I recall going round and around with their customer support (in India) a couple of years ago about this, but despite repeated promises, they never corrected this issue. However, I suggest that you use mp4. It works excellently with PD. and can be previewed in 3d while editing.
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post #49 of 241 Old 06-27-2014, 02:02 PM - Thread Starter
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I use PD which works very well with the JVCTD1s that I use. Unfortunately, my recollection is that, PD won't recognized TD1 AVCHD 3d files as 3d only 2d. I recall going round and around with their customer support (in India) a couple of years ago about this, but despite repeated promises, they never corrected this issue. However, I suggest that you use mp4. It works excellently with PD. and can be previewed in 3d while editing.
I emailed cyberlink to complain that they advertise PD 12 as supporting s3d in avchd2.0 when strictly speaking it doesn't. I tried importing jvc mp4 into PD12 which works no problem, its the deinterlacing that's rubbish when making 24p bluray. I downloaded trial of mcv to avi and split file to Left & Right images and paired in vegas 12 and burned bluray and it was pretty good. I think joseph clark mentioned pixela do a utility to split the mp4 except at $800 they having a laugh.
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post #50 of 241 Old 06-27-2014, 02:20 PM
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I emailed cyberlink to complain that they advertise PD 12 as supporting s3d in avchd2.0 when strictly speaking it doesn't. I tried importing jvc mp4 into PD12 which works no problem, its the deinterlacing that's rubbish when making 24p bluray. I downloaded trial of mcv to avi and split file to Left & Right images and paired in vegas 12 and burned bluray and it was pretty good. I think joseph clark mentioned pixela do a utility to split the mp4 except at $800 they having a laugh.
I generally render at 720 60p since most of my work has a fair bit of motion. I have one project with some non moving subjects I plan to to convert to 24p and burn to bluray. In their custom settings, they allow a higher bitrate when producing 24p. I'm not sure what it will actually burn at, however.
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post #51 of 241 Old 06-27-2014, 02:34 PM
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I emailed cyberlink to complain that they advertise PD 12 as supporting s3d in avchd2.0 when strictly speaking it doesn't. I tried importing jvc mp4 into PD12 which works no problem, its the deinterlacing that's rubbish when making 24p bluray. I downloaded trial of mcv to avi and split file to Left & Right images and paired in vegas 12 and burned bluray and it was pretty good. I think joseph clark mentioned pixela do a utility to split the mp4 except at $800 they having a laugh.
I didn't know the Pixela utility was almost $800. I got it free with the HMZ1 (which I paid $850 for - brand new). Unfortunately, that utility won't split TD1 files. It only works with files from the HMZ1. MVC to AVI has worked with TD1 files since the "early days," and it's a lot cheaper. PD12 can create m2ts 3D files from the TD1's mp4 originals. Those files can be used in Vegas.

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post #52 of 241 Old 06-27-2014, 02:56 PM - Thread Starter
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I didn't know the Pixela utility was almost $800. I got it free with the HMZ1 (which I paid $850 for - brand new). Unfortunately, that utility won't split TD1 files. It only works with files from the HMZ1. MVC to AVI has worked with TD1 files since the "early days," and it's a lot cheaper. PD12 can create m2ts 3D files from the TD1's mp4 originals. Those files can be used in Vegas.
I will give PD12 a trial exporting 3D m2ts as vegas certainly rencodes better than PD12 to 24p
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post #53 of 241 Old 06-27-2014, 03:02 PM
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Joe, would you happen to know at what bitrate PD will burn 1080 24p blurays at? In the custom settings for producing, you can set it up to produce it at 34mbps.

On a side note, the shark video I was hoping for didn't work out this year. But, I did get some other decent stuff- I think. In particular, I got a nice clip of a moray eel charging right into the camera with mouth open and teeth showing. Major popout!
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post #54 of 241 Old 06-27-2014, 08:41 PM
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I wasn't aware that you could adjust the bit rate of 24p exports in PD past the preset limits. I've gotten very good results with Blu-ray 3D 24p output in Vegas, so (like Wolfgang) I've been content to use DVD-Architect and 2D menus, or not to use menus at all. Ironically, I don't care for Vegas' exports of 720/60p to Blu-ray 3D. I've had mixed results, but there have been too many anomalies for me to feel comfortable using it. Not that I've done many, but PD programs burned at 720/60p have been better than Vegas at the same resolution.

Even without sharks, Barry, I still look forward to seeing your diving footage.

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post #55 of 241 Old 06-28-2014, 12:13 AM
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I wasn't aware that you could adjust the bit rate of 24p exports in PD past the preset limits. I've gotten very good results with Blu-ray 3D 24p output in Vegas, so (like Wolfgang) I've been content to use DVD-Architect and 2D menus, or not to use menus at all. Ironically, I don't care for Vegas' exports of 720/60p to Blu-ray 3D. I've had mixed results, but there have been too many anomalies for me to feel comfortable using it. Not that I've done many, but PD programs burned at 720/60p have been better than Vegas at the same resolution.

Even without sharks, Barry, I still look forward to seeing your diving footage.
In PD, when producing, you can choose Custom under the Profile Types tab. Then with the + sign, you can create custom configurations. I've been playing around with them recently.

Joe, definitely agree that the PD 720 60p is really good. Perhaps you could try making a couple of custom 24p files with PD and see if they look better than Vegas. It wouldn't surprise me if they are quite good.
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post #56 of 241 Old 06-28-2014, 04:32 AM
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Not sure if this will help you, but when I use PD, I have to put the 3D TV in 2D mode and then send the video using Line alternate mode. The 3D is great looking. I still only use PD for projects I want DTS and 3D menus.
Don, I have acted as betatester also for that software - and my findings were never incorporated as far as I know. But may PC is complex, since I use both a nvidia Quadro 2000D and a nvidia GTX570. Maybe too komplex for the PD that is focusing itself to video beginners. So I have decided to continue with Vegas but also Edius - both fits better my needs and are fine for me.

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post #57 of 241 Old 06-28-2014, 07:51 AM - Thread Starter
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I went to a local park and filmed the lake and waterfall and my dog playing around, about 20mins long in mp4. Created bluray with PD 12 and made an m2ts to use in Vegas 12 Pro, and created bluray with Vegas. I then played back both on my setup and compared to original played back by TD1 on TV. PD was very good as was Vegas except Vegas seemed to have turned the saturation/contrast as colour seemed deeper turned dog from tan to ginger where as pd12 and original clip was correct and looked the same, checked m2ts file I exported to vegas and it was correct so vegas has done something to the colour setting.
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post #58 of 241 Old 06-28-2014, 09:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Joe, would you happen to know at what bitrate PD will burn 1080 24p blurays at? In the custom settings for producing, you can set it up to produce it at 34mbps.

On a side note, the shark video I was hoping for didn't work out this year. But, I did get some other decent stuff- I think. In particular, I got a nice clip of a moray eel charging right into the camera with mouth open and teeth showing. Major popout!
The produce can use custom settings but not when creating a 3DBD its preset at 28mbps max average 26 when reading info on a created disc
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post #59 of 241 Old 06-28-2014, 09:40 AM
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Sounds like the custom option would be an advantage for 1080 24p since the maximum PD default setting for producing 24p is 16mbps. 28 mbps bluray burning of a custom at that same bitrate should definitely be an advantage

Last edited by Barry C; 06-28-2014 at 09:53 AM.
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post #60 of 241 Old 06-28-2014, 10:57 AM - Thread Starter
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[QUOTE=Barry C;25333354]Sounds like the custom option would be an advantage for 1080 24p since the maximum PD default setting for producing 24p is 16mbps. 28 mbps bluray burning of a custom at that same bitrate should definitely be an advantage


Cyberlink got back to me and said either next update or version of PD will comply fully with avchd 2.0 3D and they looking into making all templates have customisable bit rates.
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