Mitsubishi's 3D Converter is Incompatible with Legacy Samsung 3D TV - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 150 Old 05-07-2010, 11:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Mitsubishi's 3D Converter is Incompatible with Legacy Samsung 3D TV

Samsung offered 3D ready HDTVs in 2007 and 2008. These legacy TVs were designed for 3D PC gaming and use the same checkerboard format. Recently, Mitsubishi decided to modify the 3DC-1000 to restrict compatibility to its own TVs,via the identification data sent along with the HDMI signal called EDID. According to its director of product planning David Naranjo, if a consumer connects a legacy Samsung 3D ready TV to the 3DC-1000 converter, it won't accept the Samsung ID and consequently not pass the 3D signal in high definition.

http://hdguru.com/samsung-legacy-3d-...onverter/1577/

Bad news for those of us with Sammy's.Is there anyway around this or a possible solution besides buying a $500 POD from RealD?
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post #2 of 150 Old 05-07-2010, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Casey_Bryson View Post

Mitsubishi's 3D Converter is Incompatible with Legacy Samsung 3D TV

Samsung offered 3D ready HDTVs in 2007 and 2008. These legacy TVs were designed for 3D PC gaming and use the same checkerboard format. Recently, Mitsubishi decided to modify the 3DC-1000 to restrict compatibility to its own TVs,via the identification data sent along with the HDMI signal called EDID. According to its director of product planning David Naranjo, if a consumer connects a legacy Samsung 3D ready TV to the 3DC-1000 converter, it won't accept the Samsung ID and consequently not pass the 3D signal in high definition.

http://hdguru.com/samsung-legacy-3d-...onverter/1577/

Bad news for those of us with Sammy's.Is there anyway around this or a possible solution besides buying a $500 POD from RealD?

I am thinking that using the Gefen HDMI Detective may be a work-around solution. It stores the EDID of the display to make the HDMI handshake more reliable. What if I used it to grab the EDID off a Mits display and then hook it up to my Samsung...?

I SHOULDNT HAVE TO DO THIS! I am really peeved at Mits if they decide to lock out these TVs. If they DO go through with this lockout, I will NEVER buy, nor recommend another Mits set! This is as bad as Apple's recent behavior!
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post #3 of 150 Old 05-07-2010, 12:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john_nemesh View Post

I am thinking that using the Gefen HDMI Detective may be a work-around solution. It stores the EDID of the display to make the HDMI handshake more reliable. What if I used it to grab the EDID off a Mits display and then hook it up to my Samsung...?

I SHOULDNT HAVE TO DO THIS! I am really peeved at Mits if they decide to lock out these TVs. If they DO go through with this lockout, I will NEVER buy, nor recommend another Mits set! This is as bad as Apple's recent behavior!

I unerstand your position and I too would be upset but really Samsung is the one to be upset with. They sold a 3d dlp with no intention of ever backing it up. And don't be fooled these huge corporations know what they will have on the market years from now, they never really were ever going to back up the 3d on the dlp sets.
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post #4 of 150 Old 05-07-2010, 12:41 PM
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I'd guess you could still hack it using Powerstrip?

"We did not have business relations with that company, Fuh Yuan."
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post #5 of 150 Old 05-07-2010, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curtishd View Post

I unerstand your position and I too would be upset but really Samsung is the one to be upset with. They sold a 3d dlp with no intention of ever backing it up. And don't be fooled these huge corporations know what they will have on the market years from now, they never really were ever going to back up the 3d on the dlp sets.

i had already made up my mind before hearing about the mits converter to never buy another samsung product because of the way they treated their customers.i have purchased three tvs and other products from samsung but never again.as far as mits goes i don't understand their priority position. what harm would there be in allowing us to use the converter on our samsung sets?
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post #6 of 150 Old 05-07-2010, 01:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Okay so maybe the Gefen HDMI detective will work. What about this (copied from another thread)

...Otherwise, you could burn a Mits EDID into the Samsung EEPROM, if their EDID is not write protected and the TVs supports roughly the same video modes....

Can anyone with the tech knowledge look into this?
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post #7 of 150 Old 05-07-2010, 02:23 PM
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I sent emails to both Samsung and Mitsubishi. I am not holding my breath for a response from either company, but hopefully someone will take SOME kind of notice.
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post #8 of 150 Old 05-07-2010, 04:54 PM
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Response from Samsung:

Dear John Nemesh,

Thank you for contacting Samsung Electronics.

With reference to your email, we understand that you want to know whether Samsung provide a 3D adaptor
box to experience 3D on your set.

In order to use the 3d feature, you need the following things:

1. The 3D ready DLP TV, and your TV is 3D ready.
2. One pair of LCD shutter glasses
3. An IR emitter to send timing signals to the glasses
4. A video source capable of producing images in the 3D DLP image format.
5. A DVI-HDMI cable.

Visit the below link to get the 3D adaptor box:

http://micurl.com/aGwfr

If you require any further information, please feel free to contact us.


Thank you,

Samsung Online support.u,

Samsung Online support.


Apparently they didnt even bother to read my question all the way through....
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post #9 of 150 Old 05-07-2010, 06:15 PM
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Maybe we will get lucky and the ps3 will output 3d in checkerboard. Then both samsung and mitsubishi can kiss all out buts!
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post #10 of 150 Old 05-07-2010, 08:17 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by golferbradbest View Post

Maybe we will get lucky and the ps3 will output 3d in checkerboard. Then both samsung and mitsubishi can kiss all out buts!

What about watching 3D content from CBL or SAT? A PS3 isn't going to help with that.
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post #11 of 150 Old 05-07-2010, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Stewart View Post

What about watching 3D content from CBL or SAT? A PS3 isn't going to help with that.

Well shoot, at this point it looks like we're lucky to even get any 3D BD options. Cable or Sat 3D will just have to come with some as yet unknown converter or a full TV upgrade. That would be a non samsung TV of course.
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post #12 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 12:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Stewart View Post

What about watching 3D content from CBL or SAT? A PS3 isn't going to help with that.

On another forum, this one guy said....

"In fact H5360 can be used for 3D broadcasting. Considering the fact that someone has a set-top box DVB-S receiver with an HDMI output, there is a cheap solution. You can buy an Avermedia HDMI capture card, connect it with the DVB-S receiver and use the "Live Video" function of Stereoscopic Player. Of course that requires a PC. "


Now, in this particular thread, the guy was discussing the Acer H5360 projector. But I'm thinking the same situation would apply to any DLP rear-projection set. He also said this:

"Well, i've seen the Avermedia Capture HD card working with 3rd party application via a live video function such as Stereoscopic Player's function but i haven't tested it live with the Acer and 3D satellite source. Although i remember i saw a post on a forum while searching the net, from a guy who said it worked that way perfectly. I also believe it works because the card has 2 different HD inputs, HDMI and Component which could make an XBOX360 3D too. Of course using the PS3 or XBOX requires the console to output a side-by-side image or above-below otherwise it will not work.

I'm not sure if Direct TV is going to output a side-by-side image or above-below image. If they are, then maybe using a PC, along with the Avermedia Capture HD card, and Sterescopic Player would work? It does require using a PC, but it's better than not getting it to work at all.
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post #13 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 07:52 AM
 
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A PC . . .

That sounds like an expensive option to choose
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post #14 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 10:19 AM
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As best I can tell from the PJ's user manual from the followin link

http://us.acer.com/acer/service.do?L...CRC=2353967722

The1280x720 native resolution PJ only accepts 3D content in a frame sequential 3D format from Nvidia 3D player or equivalent from a PC.
Stereoscopic Player should be able to do the job.
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post #15 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 03:38 PM
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As I posted in another recent topic, I'd bet someone will come up with an adapter that works with the Samsung 3D DLP sets. It may be Samsung themselves.

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post #16 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john_nemesh View Post

I am thinking that using the Gefen HDMI Detective may be a work-around solution. It stores the EDID of the display to make the HDMI handshake more reliable. What if I used it to grab the EDID off a Mits display and then hook it up to my Samsung...?

I SHOULDNT HAVE TO DO THIS! I am really peeved at Mits if they decide to lock out these TVs. If they DO go through with this lockout, I will NEVER buy, nor recommend another Mits set! This is as bad as Apple's recent behavior!

If you don't understand Mitsubishi's reluctance to support another company's product, then you don't understand much how business works.

'Better Living Through Modern, Expensive, Electronic Devices'

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post #17 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken H View Post

If you don't understand Mitsubishi's reluctance to support another company's product, then you don't understand much how business works.

i understand what you mean but i am getting so tired with all this 3d stuff.it just seems like they want it to fail with their priority glasses and everything else involved with this 3d stuff.you would think these companies would try to work with us the consumers who will be the deciding factor if it succeeds or fails.quite honestly i am losing all interest.
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post #18 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken H View Post

As I posted in another recent topic, I'd bet someone will come up with an adapter that works with the Samsung 3D DLP sets. It may be Samsung themselves.

It'd be nice if they dropped a hint somewhere to that effect. My hopes are pretty low, I mean samsung doesn't even make glasses for these TVs anymore. And they didn't bother to include checkerboard output on their (overpriced I might add) 3D BD player. They've totally abandoned the DLP tech, it'd really be an about face to support it now.

Obviously we can't say with 100% certainty what will happen, but generally the safe bet seems to be that samsung will let the customer down.
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post #19 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 04:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by knobby View Post

i understand what you mean but i am getting so tired with all this 3d stuff.it just seems like they want it to fail with their priority glasses and everything else involved with this 3d stuff.you would think these companies would try to work with us the consumers who will be the deciding factor if it succeeds or fails.quite honestly i am losing all interest.

Fine, then sit it out until you feel more comfortable.

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post #20 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philnerd View Post

It'd be nice if they dropped a hint somewhere to that effect. My hopes are pretty low, I mean samsung doesn't even make glasses for these TVs anymore. And they didn't bother to include checkerboard output on their (overpriced I might add) 3D BD player. They've totally abandoned the DLP tech, it'd really be an about face to support it now.

Obviously we can't say with 100% certainty what will happen, but generally the safe bet seems to be that samsung will let the customer down.

We shall see, but like I said, if not Samsung, I'd bet someone else steps in.

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post #21 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 05:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Ken H View Post

We shall see, but like I said, if not Samsung, I'd bet someone else steps in.

Put me down for one.
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post #22 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 05:34 PM
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Here is a link to a poll regarding whether or not DirecTv should include the Checkerboard Format as an option:

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=176837
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post #23 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 09:26 PM
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^^^

Gotta love how five (weanies) voted NO out of the 14 so far. Including some checkerboard display owners. WTF?? Why? There's source units now with checkerboard, so it can't be rocket science and require a lot of R&D. Seems selfish.....for whatever motivation......the no votes....to choose to not let the "unwashed masses" of Samsung DLP owners take part in the fun as well. As there is no announced converter for them in the works at this point in time.
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post #24 of 150 Old 05-08-2010, 09:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geaux Tigers View Post

Here is a link to a poll regarding whether or not DirecTv should include the Checkerboard Format as an option:

Not as easy as one might imagine.

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post #25 of 150 Old 05-09-2010, 12:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Stewart View Post

A PC . . .

That sounds like an expensive option to choose


Well, it's an expensive option for somebody that doesn't currently own a PC. I'm not sure how many people are posting on here via laptops or netbooks, or maybe a PC at their work, but I'm guessing a good number of people on here have a desktop PC that they could get this capture card for, and possibly be able to view Direct TV 3D broadcasts that way. It's better than nothing, I suppose.
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post #26 of 150 Old 05-09-2010, 04:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RonF View Post

There's source units now with checkerboard, so it can't be rocket science and require a lot of R&D.

But it's done with specialized hardware chips (though I'm not sure of that for the Panasonic 3DBD player). You can't have hundreds of DirecTV technicians running out to install new chips in millions of satellite receivers. It's just dumb. (I voted no.)

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post #27 of 150 Old 05-09-2010, 07:09 AM - Thread Starter
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It doesn't necessarily take hardware. If they can do side-by-side with an update, they can probably do checkerboard just as easy. I am sure Texas Instruments would be more than happy to provide the resources.

Ever play Avatar on Xbox 360/PS3/PC ? All of these have a checkerboard (software implemented) option for us "legacy" peeps.
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post #28 of 150 Old 05-09-2010, 08:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Casey_Bryson View Post

It doesn't necessarily take hardware. If they can do side-by-side with an update, they can probably do checkerboard just as easy.

But it does. The side-by-side format will not be created by video processing in the set top boxes -- it will come down in that form from the satellites. Of course, as walford noted, it might be technically feasible to send a checkerboard signal down, as well, but that is just as ridiculous, in a different way, since there would have to be a separate set of 3D channels for those few viewers with checkerboard sets.

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post #29 of 150 Old 05-09-2010, 08:26 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Casey_Bryson View Post

It doesn't necessarily take hardware. If they can do side-by-side with an update, they can probably do checkerboard just as easy. I am sure Texas Instruments would be more than happy to provide the resources.

Ever play Avatar on Xbox 360/PS3/PC ? All of these have a checkerboard (software implemented) option for us "legacy" peeps.

Yes - it does. it has to be part of the SoC in the STB. That is where the conversion from SbS to CB would take place.

Are there additional license fees for this?
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post #30 of 150 Old 05-09-2010, 08:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Stewart View Post

Yes - it does. it has to be part of the SoC in the STB. That is where the conversion from SbS to CB would take place.

Are there additional license fees for this?

I can't imagine their being a licensing fee for 3D Checkerboard. I remember people stating as that the DirecTv receiver could never output 1080p due to hardware limitations but they have been proven wrong.
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