3D Shutter DLP Glasses: REVIEWS? - Page 10 - AVS Forum
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post #271 of 517 Old 08-26-2010, 08:51 PM
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Tom,

I was hoping that you could offer some insight into what many of us refer to as polarization rainbows when wearing X102 or Optoma DLP-Link glasses. The green/purple discoloration in the upper left corner of the screen is actually a little worse in person than what I could capture in the picture. It is always in the same place and is most noticeable on a bright background such as a white backdrop or a sky scene. This also appears on the upper right hand side of the screen as well. They are completely static and can be seen through both my DLP-link glasses whether they are on or off. Seating position makes no difference. It doesn't matter if 3D mode is on or off either. A 45 degree tilt of the head makes them disappear. With the Mits glasses they are nonexistent when viewing normally, unless you tilt your head 45 degrees, then they appear just as in this pic. No idea what component causes this but some members of this forum suggested that the polarization of the Mitsubishi/Samsung glasses must be rotated 45 degrees in comparison to the other glasses to correct for this.

Do you have any insight into this? Would it be possible to ever incorporate this into your glasses? DLP-Link glasses have much better picture quality over the Mitsubishi glasses because the Mits glasses do not block out the DLP-Link flash and it causes a washed out teal color. If it wasn't for these rainbows the DLP-Link glasses would be perfect.
LL
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post #272 of 517 Old 08-26-2010, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

walford, the "issue" is in your mind. People own one type of display or another and will not have a mixed bag of glasses by different manufacturers for their one and only 3D display.

Buzz

There are several people on this forum with this issue. It is not merely academic as you seem to suggest.

For instance, some may prefer the crisp blacks of DLP-Link glasses over the Mits kit glasses, but want their children to wear the Samsung child-sized emitter glasses (which are compatible with the emitter from the Mits kit). That was my situation and I've heard others say the same thing.

So, having the ability to change the sync order of the DLP-Link glasses independently of the TV's setting would be a big plus.
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post #273 of 517 Old 08-27-2010, 05:10 AM
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Update to a previous post: I've tried viewing a checkerboard video clip and that does require a reverse setting for the Optoma glasses. I guess I'll change the XBox settings to reverse so the Mits can stay in reverse mode for both games and video.
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post #274 of 517 Old 08-27-2010, 06:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjknatl View Post

There are several people on this forum with this issue. It is not merely academic as you seem to suggest.

For instance, some may prefer the crisp blacks of DLP-Link glasses over the Mits kit glasses, but want their children to wear the Samsung child-sized emitter glasses (which are compatible with the emitter from the Mits kit). That was my situation and I've heard others say the same thing.

So, having the ability to change the sync order of the DLP-Link glasses independently of the TV's setting would be a big plus.

Great point. I didn't think of that possibility. Now, what to do about my grandchildren when they visit?

I owe walford one too. I read on another thread that he is a retired engineer deeply interested in the evolution of HD and 3D. That explains a lot. (again)

My personal interest in 3D, besides being a viewer who will never get enough 3D sports content, is in display calibration. Placing shutter glasses between the display and the meter is difficult enough, but having to calibrate each different model of glasses could be a nightmare. I now have both the Optoma and XpanD DLP-Links as well as Samsung rechargeable IRs. Rainbows be damned, I've decided to go all DLP-Link because 1) DLP 3D is just plain better, and 2) I want large screens at both my residences. Between the present day high cost of big screen LCD/Plasma and crosstalk issues, I'll wait for technological improvements before replacing DLP with something else.

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post #275 of 517 Old 08-27-2010, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

walford, the "issue" is in your mind. People own one type of display or another and will not have a mixed bag of glasses by different manufacturers for their one and only 3D display.

Buzz

What started part of this mixed glasses discussion was a post bysfetaz on 8-18. He bought the Mits starter kit (2 Samsung glasses) and then bout one pair of X102 to have third pair. They are opposite sync.
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post #276 of 517 Old 08-27-2010, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twoody View Post

What started part of this mixed glasses discussion was a post bysfetaz on 8-18. He bought the Mits starter kit (2 Samsung glasses) and then bout one pair of X102 to have third pair. They are opposite sync.

This was discovered way before that.
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post #277 of 517 Old 08-27-2010, 10:36 AM
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OK, that was when I first started looking at this forum due to a link from a customer having that question.
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post #278 of 517 Old 08-27-2010, 10:42 AM
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I believe the X103 design will take care of this. I will forward the issue to mgt.
No plans to modify the X102 for TV as the market is front 3D projection.
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post #279 of 517 Old 08-27-2010, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twoody View Post

I believe the X103 design will take care of this. I will forward the issue to mgt.

Take care of reverse sync relative to other emitter glasses, take care of rainbows, or take care of the blue-green blacks?

If all three, you've got a winner. Tell mgt that.
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post #280 of 517 Old 08-27-2010, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjknatl View Post

Take care of reverse sync relative to other emitter glasses, take care of rainbows, or take care of the blue-green blacks?

If all three, you've got a winner. Tell mgt that.

Tom,

I understand if you don't want to get into in depth discussions on this forum regarding issues with these Mitsubishi TV's. But please pass along the concerns I posted regarding the polarization rainbows several posts back and also regarding the DLP-Link light flashes on these rear projection TV's. I consider this a Mitsubishi issue, not an X102 issue, but your help would be greatly appreciated.

Will the the X103 glasses block out the DLP-Link light flash? Mitsubishi's IR glasses do not and the result is crushed blacks that are cyan in color.

The only pair of glasses I have seen fully block out the light flash is the Optoma BG-ZD101, the X102's do an OK job but the Optoma glasses have black levels in 3D mode that are just as deep as 2D without any overall brightness loss or discolored blacks. But both the X102's and BG-ZD101 glasses are far better than the Mitsubishi glasses.

Your input or just passing along these concerns would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for commenting on this forum.
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post #281 of 517 Old 08-27-2010, 12:36 PM
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Will do
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post #282 of 517 Old 08-30-2010, 09:30 PM
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I have a barely used (<10 minutes) pair of Optoma DLP Link glasses for sale... PM in interested.
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post #283 of 517 Old 08-31-2010, 12:20 PM
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A little off topic here but a idea was brought up earlier in a thread and now I am waiting to try it. I have the xpand x102's and as we all know it is a p.i.t.a. getting the batteries cheaply so I am gonna be a test pilot on this one and will give the results. First of all I have taken the O ring off the the proprietary battery housing and it makes them extremely easier to replace without making them sloppy (way nicer I highly recommend this if you have no worries of getting them wet). I can actually take them out and put them in now without the tool. Secondly I have ordered 2 chargers and 2 LIR 2032 3v batteries. Heres a link ( I used this one because the others on ebay are for 3.6 v 2032's and these said they were 3v and were the only ones I could find that were a exact voltage match).

http://cgi.ebay.com/2-Li-Ion-Button-...item3a5d4cc520

It's a P.I.T.A. as well but I carefully opened the housing on the proprietary batteries (had 2 dead ones) and I plan on putting the LIR rechargeable ones from the link in the housing carefully and gluing them shut (hoping they fit the same). Then I will use alligator clips to attach the posts on the battery to the posts on the charger. And with any luck I will have rechargeable batteries for the xpand 102's and not have to deal with the cost of the batteries or the $20 shipping from xpand for 10 batteries around $45 total(B.S. if you ask me). One thing I feel I should mention is the fact that these LIR 2032 batteries need to be charged 2 at a time to control the voltage while charging(I ordered 2 sets so I could have 4 of the batteries and an extra charger for when I get the next 2 pairs of glasses,will probably try the Optomas or viewsonics this time why not). So anyway the batteries and chargers are in the mail and should see them within the week. I will complete the surgery and let everyone know if it works (keeping my fingers crossed but pretty sure it will work). The total with shipping for 2 sets of these was cheaper (A little over $25 shipped) then a 5 pack of the proprietary 1's with free ship from tru3d so It will be a huge discount if this works. Yet again I will leave my results good or bad once I get them and complete the surgery. Have a nice day all.
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post #284 of 517 Old 08-31-2010, 12:37 PM
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Just got off the phone with a csr from Monster/Bitcauldron and he said late Nov. for a release date.
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post #285 of 517 Old 09-01-2010, 09:08 PM
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Can anyone with a 2010 Mits TV and DLP Link glasses of any brand tell me if you can see the polarization rainbows?

Or, if you have a 2010 Mits TV and the Mits kit glasses, if you tilt your head at 45 degrees, do you see polarization rainbows?

Curious to see if Mits eliminated this issue for the 2010 model.
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post #286 of 517 Old 09-06-2010, 03:45 PM
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I just got my optomas and they run in standard mode 1 NOT mode 2 on my television.

I'm running a Samsung HL-T6176s. I think its an 07. PS3 with Avatar. Everything is set to standard not inverted. I don't have emitter glasses to compare, but mode 2 looks absolutely terrible. Mode 1.

So anybody having trouble with dlp links, don't just goto mode 2

I've yet to see the rainbows either. I'm really happy that I don't have all the issues everybody complains about with these setups...
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post #287 of 517 Old 09-07-2010, 10:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Illogical_Mind View Post

I just got my optomas and they run in standard mode 1 NOT mode 2 on my television.

Try a different 3D source. You may find that the mode is content specific. Others have commented that some PS3 games are opposite mode from other sources.
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post #288 of 517 Old 09-07-2010, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjknatl View Post

Try a different 3D source. You may find that the mode is content specific. Others have commented that some PS3 games are opposite mode from other sources.

Between avatar, Directv, video clips from my pc, and the 3d ps3 games on PSN, I have found that avatar syncs opposite of all others. You can change the sync in game though to match the others.
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post #289 of 517 Old 09-07-2010, 03:40 PM
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ya. I figured it was the software. But my gefen hasn't gotten here yet so i can't check the others.

Its probably because its software driven from the game and not the system firmware
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post #290 of 517 Old 09-15-2010, 08:57 AM
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Looks like the x104 will be the glasses to get. It supports everything. Hopefully it'll be the ultimate buy. One good thing if you have a DLP is you can buy it and if you don't like the DLP Link look you can use the same glasses with the emitter which is way cool!
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post #291 of 517 Old 09-15-2010, 11:13 AM
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Certrainly the X104 glases will be an improvement but if they don't have a switch in them to reverse the eys signals like the Viewsonics do then you won't be able to always use them in your neighbors home.
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post #292 of 517 Old 09-15-2010, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walford View Post

Certrainly the X104 glases will be an improvement but if they don't have a switch in them to reverse the eys signals like the Viewsonics do then you won't be able to always use them in your neighbors home.

Well all I really care about is that they work in my home.

Are the Viewsonic's better? The thing I like about the x104 is it states that you can use it with emitter OR dlp link, so I can get just the glasses and no emitter and if I don't like it, I can pick up the emitter separately and still have usable glasses.

Are there any other mfg that also have this kind of interoperability?
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post #293 of 517 Old 09-15-2010, 11:41 AM
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Unless you have a 2010 DLP, you'll want to go with DLP Link glasses as pre-2010 TVs display the DLP Link flash whether you're using an emitter or not... and from what I've read the Viewsonics and Optomas are far superior to the X102s (which I assume the X104s will be comparable to pertaining to DLP Link functionality). If you have a 2010 DLP, you might as well buy the X103s since they'll look good with your setup and be compatible with your friend's/your next TV.

Another thing to consider is price. If you have a pre 2010 DLP, you can buy the Optomas for half the price of the X104s.
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post #294 of 517 Old 09-15-2010, 12:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin-Dawson View Post

Unless you have a 2010 DLP, you'll want to go with DLP Link glasses as pre-2010 TVs display the DLP Link flash whether you're using an emitter or not... and from what I've read the Viewsonics and Optomas are far superior to the X102s (which I assume the X104s will be comparable to pertaining to DLP Link functionality). If you have a 2010 DLP, you might as well buy the X103s since they'll look good with your setup and be compatible with your friend's/your next TV.

Another thing to consider is price. If you have a pre 2010 DLP, you can buy the Optomas for half the price of the X104s.

I have both 102s and Optomas and cannot see any difference.

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post #295 of 517 Old 09-15-2010, 01:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bcterp View Post

I’ve had some time to compare the Mitsuhishi glasses, Xpand X102’s, and Optoma BG-ZD101 glasses side by side on my Mitsubishi WD-73837 (2009 model). I used directv content, downloaded movie trailers and PS3 games.

Let me make it clear that the worst picture quality clearly belongs to the Mitsubishi glasses, it’s not even close. The blacks are lighter and cyan, some users may not notice it if they aren’t viewing in a dark room or have nothing to compare them to but when compared side by side to DLP-Link glasses it is unmistakable. They also dim the picture more than the DLP-Link glasses and the colors are skewed to the blue side. The only positive I can think of is that they are much lighter and more comfortable than the other glasses and do not have the polarization rainbows. A 2010 Mitsubishi owner will likely have better results with these glasses as they can turn off the DLP-Link light flashes that cause the crushed blacks and cyan tint, I however have no firsthand experience with this.

The Xpands and Optomas both have fairly good 3D picture quality however the Optomas are IMHO the better choice for a few reasons. Both of these glasses eliminate the cyan tint of the blacks, the Optomas however have noticeably deeper blacks. The blacks are quite amazing actually with these glasses yet they do not dim the overall picture more than the Xpands. I also like the colors slightly better with the Optomas, the Xpands seem to have a very slight green skew when compared side by side, this is very subtle however and shouldn’t be a concern. The Optomas also have use a standard battery as compared to the proprietary one in the Xpands. Both glasses are fairly bulky and heavy. It’s kind of a tie when it comes to comfort as the shape of your head will likely determine what fits best.

Both of the DLP link glasses use the reverse mode while the Mitsubishi pair uses normal so they can’t be used together. With both DLP link glasses I can see the polarization rainbows (looks like a purple/green streak in the upper corners of the TV). This is not present at all on the Mitsubishi glasses. These are mostly visible in whites and blues, such as a white backdrop or sky scene. They are virtually invisible at all other times. While this is a concern for me, I consider this to be much more tolerable than the problems presented by the Mitsubishi glasses. If the manufacturers of these glasses would rotate the polarization of the lenses about 20 degrees or so the rainbows would be completely gone. I have not gotten a chance to try and contact Xpand and Optoma about this but I will soon.

In my opinion an owner of a pre-2010 Mitsubishi DLP should get the Optoma BG-ZD101 glasses. They have the best picture quality and are the cheapest.

I was just going by this review (as well as a few other comments in this thread). I have the Optomas on the way and haven't actually used the Xpands so I can't provide my personal opinion. I have read a number of posts complaining about sync issues with the X102s however. That, price and the proprietary battery led me to recommend the Optomas. The Viewsonics are suppose to be the same as the Optomas with the additional capability of being able to reverse the sync order (which comes in handy if you're mixing and matching brands of glasses). As with anything though, I'm sure it comes down to personal preference.
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post #296 of 517 Old 09-16-2010, 04:51 PM
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Do the Optomas have an auto-shutoff?????
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post #297 of 517 Old 09-16-2010, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonys10 View Post

Do the Optomas have an auto-shutoff?????

Data sheet: http://marketing.optomausa.com/PDFs/..._Datasheet.pdf

User Manual: http://marketing.optomausa.com/PDFs/...ZD101%20UM.pdf

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post #298 of 517 Old 09-17-2010, 06:50 PM
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Well my Optomas finally got here... and don't work very well at all. I shouldn't say that - the picture quality is great, the 3d blew me away... but the glasses won't stay sync'd with my TV. I was a little weary about DLP Link and now I'm reminded why. I used the glasses with the Avatar game and from what I've read, if they don't stay sync'd with Avatar, you'll have issues with most 3d content. If they stay sync'd for you I'm jealous but mine are on their way back. I have a HLT5687S which is an LED based DLP so I can't even blame an old bulb.

Looking at the other options out there for glasses, I think my next pair are going to be the x103s. I'm definitely going with IR based glasses and I like that the x103s wrap around to block light coming from the side.

Will post results whenever I get the x103s... I am choked.
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post #299 of 517 Old 09-18-2010, 12:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin-Dawson View Post

Well my Optomas finally got here... and don't work very well at all. I shouldn't say that - the picture quality is great, the 3d blew me away... but the glasses won't stay sync'd with my TV. I was a little weary about DLP Link and now I'm reminded why. I used the glasses with the Avatar game and from what I've read, if they don't stay sync'd with Avatar, you'll have issues with most 3d content. If they stay sync'd for you I'm jealous but mine are on their way back. I have a HLT5687S which is an LED based DLP so I can't even blame an old bulb.

Looking at the other options out there for glasses, I think my next pair are going to be the x103s. I'm definitely going with IR based glasses and I like that the x103s wrap around to block light coming from the side.

Will post results whenever I get the x103s... I am choked.

Do you have florescent or cfc light bulbs in the same room as your TV?

Dave

Uxbridge, MA.

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post #300 of 517 Old 09-18-2010, 09:24 PM
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I do not. In fact, at one point I was actually sitting in the dark and still couldn't get them to stay sync'd. I'm sure it was an issue with my TV but either way, looks like I'm going with the IR based emitter route.
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