XpanD X103 vs Monster Vision Max 3D Glasses!? - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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3D Tech Talk > XpanD X103 vs Monster Vision Max 3D Glasses!?
neo0285's Avatar neo0285 12:36 PM 02-26-2011
Can someone post their results with plasma tvs. Especially after playing around with the delay cycles. Does it help with ghosting? And how badly does that affect the brightness? Etc...

eurotrance's Avatar eurotrance 03:27 PM 02-26-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by neo0285 View Post

Can someone post their results with plasma tvs. Especially after playing around with the delay cycles. Does it help with ghosting? And how badly does that affect the brightness? Etc...

Not sure what the results would be on plasma, but what I can tell you is that you can crank up the brightness quite a bit and the delay settings offer a wide range. I was actually able on my RS50 to increase the brightness while at the same time dial in the delay and the ghosting is almost non-existent. I would assume that because of plasma technology, the results should be even better or at least equivalent.
jbolt's Avatar jbolt 04:56 PM 02-26-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by eurotrance View Post

Not sure what the results would be on plasma, but what I can tell you is that you can crank up the brightness quite a bit and the delay settings offer a wide range. I was actually able on my RS50 to increase the brightness while at the same time dial in the delay and the ghosting is almost non-existent. I would assume that because of plasma technology, the results should be even better or at least equivalent.

Sweet, now I am convinced that I want to pick up a the MV RF transmitter and few pairs of the MV glasses. Now if only I can find a place that has them in stock. Amazon says 1-2 months.
high def mon's Avatar high def mon 05:12 PM 02-26-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbolt View Post

Sweet, now I am convinced that I want to pick up a the MV RF transmitter and few pairs of the MV glasses. Now if only I can find a place that has them in stock. Amazon says 1-2 months.

Try Vanns:
http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it..._c=site_search
JR01's Avatar JR01 12:28 PM 02-27-2011
For those of us with pre-2010 Mits DLP TVs (I have a WD-65833 and the newest firmware upgrade), the issues when using shutter glasses appear to be two-fold: 1) non-black blacks (due to the dlp flash than cannot be turned off), and 2) the rainbow effect.

Because Monsters glasses are RF rather than IR, are these two problems still and issue? And if so, does anyone know how well these glasses might deal with these?

I am also considering the CE4 because they specificly address these two problems, but I would like to have some options. Plus, the Monster glasses kit which includes the transmitter is a few hundred buck less than going with the CE4s.

I have pre-ordered the new Panasonic 3D bluray player, model 310 from Amazon, and I'd like to have some idea of which glasses I should go with. DLP link, while less expensive, still seem to have too many problems, plus if I ever get a newer, non-DLP TV, DLP link glasses would no longer be useful. I'd rather spend more up front and not limit any future options.

Thanks.
Mikenificent1's Avatar Mikenificent1 08:37 AM 02-28-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by eurotrance View Post

Also, compared to the Xpand 103, after careful adjustment of the MV glasses' LCD brightness, it seems I was able to obtain a slightly brighter picture than with the Xpand.

What type of screen are you using?
Mikenificent1's Avatar Mikenificent1 10:22 AM 02-28-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Stewart View Post

Try calling the company. I am sure they can answer your questions.

So I sent Bit Cauldron an email regarding polarization orientation, and this was their response:

"The glasses are not polarized. The lens is like one large pixel, either clear or dark creating the shutter effect 60 times per second per eye."

What do you guys think? Is that possible?
RonF's Avatar RonF 12:23 PM 02-28-2011
Did you happen to ask them if there is a rated contrast spec they have for them?
Lee Stewart's Avatar Lee Stewart 01:54 PM 02-28-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikenificent1 View Post

So I sent Bit Cauldron an email regarding polarization orientation, and this was their response:

"The glasses are not polarized. The lens is like one large pixel, either clear or dark creating the shutter effect 60 times per second per eye."

What do you guys think? Is that possible?

Bit Cauldron uses Pi-Cell LC glass construction:

http://www.personal.kent.edu/~mgu/LCD/pi-cell.htm
CerberusII's Avatar CerberusII 08:04 PM 02-28-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by eurotrance View Post

Ok, got to play with the MonsterVision glasses on my RS50.

First, I confirm that the transmitter connects directly to the 3D sync port of the JVC projector, no need for the IR transmitter from JVC, unless you want to use both the MV glasses and some IR glasses at the same time.

Second, there are quite a few settings possible and adjusting them are not much fun, but after spending a good 30 minutes on trying to get the best results, I am quite pleased with the 3D picture. It's not fine out of the box, it seems the delay needs to be adjusted the most from any other setting, which I think means the frame switching of the RS50 is actually "slow" compared to what the glasses can do.

Also, compared to the Xpand 103, after careful adjustment of the MV glasses' LCD brightness, it seems I was able to obtain a slightly brighter picture than with the Xpand.

All in all, not a bad start, even though I can't stand the way to adjust settings, it seems a bit too complicated for my taste. Hopefully it will be a "set it and forget it affair" once I have it dialed in as close to perfect as I can muster.

Now on to some 3D movie viewing, I think I'll start with Resident Evil apocalypse or whatever it's called...

I picked up a kit today. I am able to get them to work fine when the transmitter is plugged directly into my X7 (RS50), but I cannot get the monster transmitter to sync with the IR signal from the JVC emitter. Have you (or anyone else for that matter) had any luck syncing with the JVC emitter? I need the IR sync as I have 4 pair of the JVC glasses. Also, I would like to do a side-by-side comparison.
Mikenificent1's Avatar Mikenificent1 09:45 PM 02-28-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Stewart View Post

Bit Cauldron uses Pi-Cell LC glass construction:

http://www.personal.kent.edu/~mgu/LCD/pi-cell.htm

That's not the reason, Xpand uses Pi-Cell also. I asked for an explanation, and this was his response:

"Excuse me, I misinterpreted your first question.

TFT PC Monitors are polarized at 45 degrees.

MPA and IPA LCD TV’s are vertically polarized.

Bit Cauldron’s universal product splits the difference with a linear polarization half way between these two angles. This allows our glasses to work both with TVs and PC monitors."



So it's not horizontal or vertical (but closer to vertical), and does have polarization.

I did not ask about the contrast of the glasses.
rkuo's Avatar rkuo 04:10 AM 03-01-2011
If anyone here has the MonsterVision kit and a Samsung plasma (or any plasma for that matter), can you run the crosstalk test located in this avsforum thread?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1291751

Am trying to determine if these glasses will improve the crosstalk situation on my plasma.
knobby's Avatar knobby 09:59 AM 03-01-2011
We are hoping to launch this product soon in Canada through Best Buy / Future Shop – we don’t have an exact date yet but if you keep checking back with our website you will be able to see when the launch has happened.hope i can get my hands on a pair soon.
patyoung's Avatar patyoung 11:13 AM 03-01-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikenificent1 View Post

TFT PC Monitors are polarized at 45 degrees.

MPA and IPA LCD TV's are vertically polarized.

Bit Cauldron's universal product splits the difference with a linear polarization half way between these two angles. This allows our glasses to work both with TVs and PC monitors."

So it's not horizontal or vertical (but closer to vertical), and does have polarization.

So does that basically mean that they are the same as the XpanDs and might cause a problem for JVC projectors and a polarization preserving screen?
craiglc15's Avatar craiglc15 08:08 AM 03-02-2011
Okay. I've had my Monster glasses for the last few days. This is just my opinion.

I decided to go ahead and return them. The main reason is that they make a buzzing sound from both arms when 3d is activated. It's not loud, but the sound bothered me since it is right by my ears. It was louder from the arm with the power button. Once I picked up on the frequency, it was hard for me to forget. I forgot about it playing fast videogames and watching movies with above average sound. Once the sound got quiet, I would hear the buzzing and start focusing on that. I'm not sure if it was just my glasses or all Monster glasses. My other 5 Samsung 3d glasses do not make this sound. Again, it isn't loud, but it sounds like a bee buzzing around my head.

The glasses themselves worked well. I didn't think the picture looked that different from the Samsung glasses. Maybe a very slight increase in brightness. I thought the cross talk looked the same on both. I have a pn63c8000 TV, and the cross talk doesn't bother me anyway. Messing around with lens cycle didn't really help. The default was already on full brightness, and changing it make the picture too dark. So the default for me looked the best.

The glasses look huge when you first take them out of the box, like movie theater glasses. The glasses fit more loosely on the head. I thought they were more comfortable than my Samsung glasses when I was wearing contacts, but not as comfortable when I wore my prescription glasses. They felt like they were being pushed off my nose by my other glasses since they don't fit tight on the sides of my head.

The best thing about the glasses is the syncing. Once you have the transmitter set up correctly, you will not lose sync. I was able to see my TV from about 24 feet away and they were still working. I even walking upstairs to the second floor and went into a bedroom. I could tell the glasses were still syncing with the TV since they didn't turn off and were, unfortunately, producing the buzzing sound.

Overall, I would have probably kept the glasses if it wasn't for the buzzing sound. If I find out later no one else has Monster glasses that buzz, I may end up ordering another pair in the future.
Hyabusha's Avatar Hyabusha 12:29 PM 03-02-2011
I don't hear any buzzing sounds from my glasses. You must of had a defective set.

I love mine!
craiglc15's Avatar craiglc15 01:06 PM 03-02-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyabusha View Post
I don't hear any buzzing sounds from my glasses. You must of had a defective set.

I love mine!
That's good to hear. If that's true, I recommend these to anyone fed up with losing sync all the time. I rarely lose sync now after using the tape trick on my Samsung glasses. Even so, the Monster glasses are better. Maybe people should buy them from places that have a good return policy just in case.
krichter1's Avatar krichter1 06:55 PM 03-03-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyabusha View Post

I don't hear any buzzing sounds from my glasses. You must of had a defective set.

I love mine!

Come on my good man . . . review them for us with specifics to your particular setup.
Hyabusha's Avatar Hyabusha 07:09 PM 03-03-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by krichter1 View Post

Come on my good man . . . review them for us with specifics to your particular setup.

My videos are up!

www.youtube.com/user/rvspawn
Mikenificent1's Avatar Mikenificent1 06:21 AM 03-04-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by CerberusII View Post

I picked up a kit today. I am able to get them to work fine when the transmitter is plugged directly into my X7 (RS50), but I cannot get the monster transmitter to sync with the IR signal from the JVC emitter. Have you (or anyone else for that matter) had any luck syncing with the JVC emitter? I need the IR sync as I have 4 pair of the JVC glasses. Also, I would like to do a side-by-side comparison.

How do the Monster glasses compare to the JVC's?
Mikenificent1's Avatar Mikenificent1 06:23 AM 03-04-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by krichter1 View Post

Come on my good man . . . review them for us with specifics to your particular setup.

Ironically he had the first review of them and you even posted the youtube link for it lol
nickels55's Avatar nickels55 09:24 AM 03-04-2011
I'm looking forward to hearing a review from people using these glasses with older DLP sets, like high def mon.

Does it get rid of the red tint on blacks, and are there rainbows? Two major issues with these older sets and current 3D glasses.
CerberusII's Avatar CerberusII 11:28 AM 03-04-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikenificent1 View Post

How do the Monster glasses compare to the JVC's?

They look great on their own. I started The Legend of the Guardians, and there was a lot of ghosting. I want into "programming" mode on the glasses and was able to "tune" the ghosting out. This is coming from someone who has NEVER noticed a bit of ghosting, even on scenes where other people have reported ghosting. You can also tune the delay, which gives you a sense that you are adjusting brightness since all I notice is that the adjustment goes from dim to bright, nothing else. However, I am unable to get the Monster transmitter to IR sync with the JVC emitter so that I can try a side-by side comparison. zombie10k says he will receive his today as reported in the RS50 owner's thread and hopefully he will try the IR sync. Mine just may be defective.

Oh yeah... I find them to be much more comfortable than the JVC glasses. If I can get the IR sync to work and use both types, these will be the set that only I use.
Mikenificent1's Avatar Mikenificent1 01:09 PM 03-04-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by CerberusII View Post

I am unable to get the Monster transmitter to IR sync with the JVC emitter so that I can try a side-by side comparison. zombie10k says he will receive his today as reported in the RS50 owner's thread and hopefully he will try the IR sync. Mine just may be defective.

Oh yeah... I find them to be much more comfortable than the JVC glasses. If I can get the IR sync to work and use both types, these will be the set that only I use.

Did you try taping the Monster IR receiver to the JVC emitter face to face, like the person in the youtube video did?

Other than comfort, which was brighter? Any other differences? What screen are you using? Thanks for your info!
zombie10k's Avatar zombie10k 02:04 PM 03-04-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by CerberusII View Post

They look great on their own. I started The Legend of the Guardians, and there was a lot of ghosting. I want into "programming" mode on the glasses and was able to "tune" the ghosting out. This is coming from someone who has NEVER noticed a bit of ghosting, even on scenes where other people have reported ghosting. You can also tune the delay, which gives you a sense that you are adjusting brightness since all I notice is that the adjustment goes from dim to bright, nothing else. However, I am unable to get the Monster transmitter to IR sync with the JVC emitter so that I can try a side-by side comparison. zombie10k says he will receive his today as reported in the RS50 owner's thread and hopefully he will try the IR sync. Mine just may be defective.

Oh yeah... I find them to be much more comfortable than the JVC glasses. If I can get the IR sync to work and use both types, these will be the set that only I use.

Mine just arrived, I am going to give it a shot tonight after work to compare against the Xpand 103's. I have the RS50 with a 142" Dalite 2.8HP screen.

Any hints on the programming mode? the included 'quick guide' instructions didn't mention anything. I'll try it direct 3 din plug and also with the JVC transmitter to see if we can get both working at the same time.

it looks like it requires USB power... I can't remember if the RS50 has a USB port, but it's worth a shot to try it if it foes.
CerberusII's Avatar CerberusII 02:08 PM 03-04-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikenificent1 View Post

Did you try taping the Monster IR receiver to the JVC emitter face to face, like the person in the youtube video did?

Other than comfort, which was brighter? Any other differences? What screen are you using? Thanks for your info!

X7 133" Dalite 2.8 about 16' throw. I did tape the monster IR receiver to the JVC emitter, still nothing. Tried everything I could think of. May give Monster a call.
Can't tell a brightness difference as I have to unplug and plug transmitter/emitter between tests. Sorry, I will have to wait on that one.
wuffzack's Avatar wuffzack 02:49 PM 03-04-2011
Did anyone try to sync the Monster glasses with the Nvidia 3D Vision emitter?
This would be awsome, because the range of the Nvidia emitter is limited in large batcave like home cinema.
zombie10k's Avatar zombie10k 04:56 PM 03-04-2011
well this stinks.. I didn't even get the Monster glasses home and they are broken already. I charged them at work, folded the arms and... CRACK. Split one of the lenses for no apparent reason.

My Xpand 103's and Nvidia glasses have been handled by children without and issue so I don't know what happened as I was very careful with them.

hopefully they still work enough for me to evaluate them before sending them back.
CerberusII's Avatar CerberusII 05:20 PM 03-04-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
Mine just arrived, I am going to give it a shot tonight after work to compare against the Xpand 103's. I have the RS50 with a 142" Dalite 2.8HP screen.

Any hints on the programming mode? the included 'quick guide' instructions didn't mention anything. I'll try it direct 3 din plug and also with the JVC transmitter to see if we can get both working at the same time.

it looks like it requires USB power... I can't remember if the RS50 has a USB port, but it's worth a shot to try it if it foes.
Bummer on the broken glasses. i believe that maybe my monster IR receiver must be broken out of the box.

http://www.monstercable.com/lit/Max_3D_manual.pdf
The programming really isn't too hard. Hold the joystick to the left until you see two green lights and let go. I have the lights all the way to the left for duty cycle (perceived brightness). As for the delay (up/down adjustment) I have either 2 or 3 red lights. You will easily be able to adjust the ghosting out by your own eye.
zombie10k's Avatar zombie10k 09:09 PM 03-04-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by CerberusII View Post

Bummer on the broken glasses. i believe that maybe my monster IR receiver must be broken out of the box.

http://www.monstercable.com/lit/Max_3D_manual.pdf
The programming really isn't too hard. Hold the joystick to the left until you see two green lights and let go. I have the lights all the way to the left for duty cycle (perceived brightness). As for the delay (up/down adjustment) I have either 2 or 3 red lights. You will easily be able to adjust the ghosting out by your own eye.

that's makes 2 of us, my Monster IR sensor doesn't work with my JVC RS50 3D IR emitter. That is a major buzzkill since i'm not giving up using my 103's just to use the Monster glasses. Perhaps there is a 3 pin DIN splitter that might work?

Here's some quick impressions:

Pro's-
  • I like the color of the lenses on the Monster glasses. It's a little more neutral than the Xpand 103's which imo turn whites into a more tanish color. I am always aware of the color shift when putting on the 103's. The Monsters seemed to be more transparent in color shift which I liked.

50/50:
  • In regard to ghosting or brightness, I don't see the real advantage of the Monsters over the 103's. Both seem very similar after adjusting the monsters to the full brightness.

  • Charging - My Nvidia's needed a USB charge. The 103's use the 2032 watch batteries. I prefer the swappable batteries. I often forget to charge things and swapping out that coin battery is quick and easy when I overlook charging a set of the Nvidia glasses. this is just personal preference.


Con's -
  • They seem fragile. I was gentle with them but cracked one of the lens just by folding one of the arms. The entire assembly just seems a bit flimsy for the cost. You can flex most parts of the glasses easily which might explain how I cracked the lens. I would be a little concerned with younger kids handling them.
  • By contrast, the Nvidia 3D vision glasses are quite sturdy. So are the Xpand 103's. They aren't the most stylish looking glasses, but they are solid.


  • Fit - I don't like how they fit with my prescription glasses. The arms are straight and they basically slide off my face. The 1 nose guard might not be the right size for all folks, so that right there could account for some of the loose fit. If I take off my glasses and just put on the monsters, they are very comfortable. unfortunately this doesn't help me since I need the other glasses.

  • Buzzing - BZZZZZZZZ!!! right side is louder than the left side. It's not terrible, but I can definitely hear them slightly when the room goes quiet. Something is buzzing around if you hold it close to your ear. I hope I am not being irradiated.


tough call for me in the end.. I have to send them back anyway. If the IR sensor worked and I could use both glasses at the same time, I would keep them. Hopefully someone will come up with a workaround.

I might keep a single set just for myself since I have a preference for the color of the monster glasses.
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