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post #91 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 01:17 PM
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But there will be no Nvidia involved here at all once I have the adapter. Are you saying I can't just flip the glasses? I have done that and observed the reverse effect.

It will be very interesting to see how this works when the converter comes out. My expiriences thus far are only with an HTPC and only on Bluray 3D and 2D to 3D conversions of SD-DVD.
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post #92 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 01:40 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by JOHNnDENVER View Post

But there will be no Nvidia involved here at all once I have the adapter. Are you saying I can't just flip the glasses? I have done that and observed the reverse effect.

It will be very interesting to see how this works when the converter comes out. My expiriences thus far are only with an HTPC and only on Bluray 3D and 2D to 3D conversions of SD-DVD.

Should be much better since the 3D-XL quad buffer have no interruptions like the ones nVidia quad buffer is having when drectx switches it on and off when transferring from full screen to desktop mode.
May be you will only need to set it when powering up and or when changing disks.

My advice is: buy PC based Blu-ray drive and use software player like PowerDVD 10 or TotalMedia Theater 3 together with your nVidia 3D Vision LC shutter glasses you will be just enjoining the 3D content and not worrying about pseudo stereo.

Mathew Orman
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post #93 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 01:55 PM
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I have that now. I hate the HTPC in the theater, I want it out.

The work around for your suppsed sync issue is much simpler than running the HTPC and Nvidia and the quirks involved with that setup for sure. I'd give the 3D Vision HTPC solution a grade C at best. It has quirks, everybody experiences lots of quirks with the setup running at 120hz including me.
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post #94 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icester View Post

Should be much better since the 3D-XL quad buffer have no interruptions like the ones nVidia quad buffer is having when drectx switches it on and off when transferring from full screen to desktop mode.
May be you will only need to set it when powering up and or when changing disks.

My advice is: buy PC based Blu-ray drive and use software player like PowerDVD 10 or TotalMedia Theater 3 together with your nVidia 3D Vision LC shutter glasses you will be just enjoining the 3D content and not worrying about pseudo stereo.

Mathew Orman

and how would I hook my 360 and directv up to the pc to play those in 3d? I am intersted in MUCH more then just 3d bluray and that is what the 3d-xl provides. if I have to press a button each time I turn the thing on, or switch games so be it, I am not lazy...I have to press buttons to turn the stuff on, so one more function in my harmony remote is not going to kill me.
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post #95 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 02:38 PM
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That's my point too. but the HTPC with either of the two players mentioned has many many more quirks than this sync issue. I guess I should start a thread on how those don't work?

20 quirky issues -vs- one consistant issue with an easy work around

I would still choose the 3D-XL

The Direct TV can be got around on the HTPC, the Xbox really can't without adding a bunch of latency.
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post #96 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 02:59 PM
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Dang there are some reviews on the thing. You have to wonder why they experienced no issues with it as well.

http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/3650...jector-adaptor


First impressions
Here at Pocket-lint, we were treated to an early preview of the 3D-XL. Unfortunately, as it's still a few months away from launching, Optoma's 3D glasses are still in production. As a result, we were only able to see a mock-up version, but they looked very svelte and lightweight, unlike some of those from rival companies. For the demo, we used Xpand's universal 3D specs, but we were still able to get a good look at the new adaptor and what it's capable of.

The 3D-XL performed particularly well with 3D gaming, providing a thoroughly immersive experience that was full of punch and vibrant colours. For gamers, this is a great, affordable way to get 3D and it looks just as good as any dedicated 3D projector. The Sky 3D clips we saw also looked good, in particular the tennis, which seems to be very well suited to 3D viewing. The football clip looked a little shaky, although this was probably due to it being a fairly early demo clip from Sky. Newer broadcasts seem to exhibit far more suitable camera angles, and less fast cutting between different angles.

Although the device doesn't support the full 1080p hi-def offered by 3D Blu-rays, the clip of Monsters V Aliens that we watched looked great at 720p without any noticeable degradation in picture quality.

At first glance, the 3D-XL looks like a very affordable and effective way of getting 3D at home, without breaking the bank. If you've already got a compatible projector it'll cost you just £249.99, or if you need to invest in one then you could get yourself set up for as little as £649 - a fair bit less than the cheapest 3D TV. We'll bring you a full review as soon as we can.

Read more: Optoma 3D-XL is world's first 3D projector adaptor - Pocket-lint http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/3650...#ixzz17Ym7Rrp5
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post #97 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 03:01 PM
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Another

http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/home-...for-projectors

We viewed demo footage of football on Sky, games on the Play Station 3 and a film. We were impressed with the results and it's possible to argue that screen size is more important than resolution, as having the picture dominate your field of view helps create a more immersive image. Fortunately, for 2D movies, the 3D-XL will pass a 1080p 24/p image, so you don't have to lose resolution when watching non-3D content.

Optoma has stated that the 3D-XL will work with 14 of its projectors, including the new 720p HD67, which costs around £500. Add in the price of the 3D-XL and that's big-screen 3D for around £750. Other manufacturer's DLP projectors are also supported, provided they have the latest firmware and can display a 120Hz image. We'll have review units of the 3D-XL in December, with the product available to buy from January.
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post #98 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 03:02 PM
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My point? This is not the issue it is being made out to be. Either myself or these reviewers would of had it happen.
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post #99 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 03:19 PM
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Summary of thread:
icester > this is bad! box won't work with dlp link!
others > um... yes it will.
icester > i mean it will lose sync!
others > um... no it won't.
icester > but Optoma says it will lose sync, call them!
others > (call optoma) they just told me it won't.
icester > you didn't talk to them! They say it will lose sync!
others > No, here's what they said, it won't lose sync.
icester > they didn't understand you, it will lose sync.
others > I just quoted your statement, they understood fine, it won't lose sync
icester > try this test!
others > Ok, just did it, no problem
icester > you didn't try it right!!!!


Did I miss anything, or is this as silly as it sounds?
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post #100 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by defiancecp View Post

Summary of thread:
icester > this is bad! box won't work with dlp link!
others > um... yes it will.
icester > i mean it will lose sync!
others > um... no it won't.
icester > but Optoma says it will lose sync, call them!
others > (call optoma) they just told me it won't.
icester > you didn't talk to them! They say it will lose sync!
others > No, here's what they said, it won't lose sync.
icester > they didn't understand you, it will lose sync.
others > I just quoted your statement, they understood fine, it won't lose sync
icester > try this test!
others > Ok, just did it, no problem
icester > you didn't try it right!!!!


Did I miss anything, or is this as silly as it sounds?

I think you may have missed some of his "recommendations" but that pretty much sums it up. LOCK, LOCK, LOCK...
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post #101 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 03:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by defiancecp View Post

Summary of thread:
icester > this is bad! box won't work with dlp link!
others > um... yes it will.
icester > i mean it will lose sync!
others > um... no it won't.
icester > but Optoma says it will lose sync, call them!
others > (call optoma) they just told me it won't.
icester > you didn't talk to them! They say it will lose sync!
others > No, here's what they said, it won't lose sync.
icester > they didn't understand you, it will lose sync.
others > I just quoted your statement, they understood fine, it won't lose sync
icester > try this test!
others > Ok, just did it, no problem
icester > you didn't try it right!!!!


Did I miss anything, or is this as silly as it sounds?

I understand exactly what hes saying, now he may have gone about it the wrong way... the glasses can confuse which image to send to which eye and you may sometimes get the left image to your right eye and the right image to your left eye, how often this will happen we wont know until we start using the box and im not sure yet if it is a one button press fix or you have to go into the menu of your projector
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post #102 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 04:19 PM
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If you use a decent remote, you can sure program it as one button no matter how many actual steps there are to do it.

I think the issue may exist. But 50/50? I don't think so or I would of seen it by now.
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post #103 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 06:11 PM
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I've been using DLP-Link glasses for a while now, source is via a HTPC.

The display can sync the glasses, but it doesn't know which frame is supposed to be first, hence the reason displays (and software players) have the "reverse" mode.

For instance, I can play a stereoscopic clip with Stereoscopic Player under default settings, and I have to set my display to "Mode 2" (which is reverse). Playing the same clip with PDVD10 or TMT3, I set my display to "Mode 1".

With that said, it's always the same. Everything I play with PDVD/TMT3 is always "Mode 1" and vice versa with SP. Also, it doesn't make a difference if I pause a movie or skip ahead or back, I never have to change the original Mode.

This goes for IR glasses also.

And I don't think anyone would be able to watch more than 30 seconds of any 3D video with it being reversed, the viewer can tell right away if it's not correct.

In a nutshell, this isn't a big deal, and it isn't anything new to DLP-Link or IR-based glasses, been this way since the beginning.

The only problem I can see is with PC games that have built-in Stereoscopic support (like the Avatar game). It could vary from game to game.

EDIT:
I'd also like to add, before I got a graphics card that supported MVC hardware decoding, I had to decode via the CPU. Sometimes, a particular scene would be too much for the CPU, and I'd get stuttering. Never once did the glasses lose sync or get things reversed due to this.

Currently testing 3D with Sammy DLP, shutter glasses, and HTPC
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post #104 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 06:20 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by defiancecp View Post

Summary of thread:
icester > this is bad! box won't work with dlp link!
others > um... yes it will.
icester > i mean it will lose sync!
others > um... no it won't.
icester > but Optoma says it will lose sync, call them!
others > (call optoma) they just told me it won't.
icester > you didn't talk to them! They say it will lose sync!
others > No, here's what they said, it won't lose sync.
icester > they didn't understand you, it will lose sync.
others > I just quoted your statement, they understood fine, it won't lose sync
icester > try this test!
others > Ok, just did it, no problem
icester > you didn't try it right!!!!


Did I miss anything, or is this as silly as it sounds?

Yes,
the most important facts.
nVidia has a monopoly on eye phase sync and only outputs it via 3D Vision Kit with it's own glasses
and only recently allowed HDMI 1.4 output for free but only movies and not for games. For games you have to pay
for 3D TV Play.

Peter Wimmer top expert in area stereoscopic content streaming on PC, the author of the famous Stereoscopic Player which light version of, you can download from nVidia's website has publicly confirmed that DLP-Link on DLP-link projectors has no way to get correct eye content
and the random chance of getting it right is 50%.

Here is the link to the message:

http://movies.groups.yahoo.com/group/3dtv/message/26855

Peter Wimmer is the list owner of 3dtv group.
In the thread you will also find another lab experts in are of stereoscopic projection, Werner Bloos who confirmed that he spoke with OPTOMA product engineer and they had admitted that the problem exists.


Mathew Orman
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post #105 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 06:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taz291819 View Post

With that said, it's always the same. Everything I play with PDVD/TMT3 is always "Mode 1" and vice versa with SP. Also, it doesn't make a difference if I pause a movie or skip ahead or back, I never have to change the original Mode.

Not my experience. Mine is a Optoma GT720 with 2 pairs of DLP Link glasses Optoma ZD101. I tried PDVD10, TMT3 and TMT5, and the Stereoscopic Player. Open any of those software player, drag a 3D clips in it to play, bring the player to fullscreen for 3D playback, it can be Left eye first. Bring the software player to window mode, drag another clips to play in fullscreen, it can be Right eye first, or still in Left eye first mode. The L/R eye sequence is simply random with each new playback.

But if I keep the software player in fullscreen mode, and stop/pause, skip, fast forward/backward or whatever, then the L/R sequence will still keep in sync.

When it's in correct L/R sync, BOTH pairs of glasses are correct. When the sync is wrong, both pairs of glasses are wrong.

The thing is I'm using a ATI 5570 card. I wonder if a nvidia card may perform better in term of L/R sync in DLP Link mode...

regards,

Li On
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post #106 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 06:33 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taz291819 View Post

I've been using DLP-Link glasses for a while now, source is via a HTPC.

The display can sync the glasses, but it doesn't know which frame is supposed to be first, hence the reason displays (and software players) have the "reverse" mode.

For instance, I can play a stereoscopic clip with Stereoscopic Player under default settings, and I have to set my display to "Mode 2" (which is reverse). Playing the same clip with PDVD10 or TMT3, I set my display to "Mode 1".

With that said, it's always the same. Everything I play with PDVD/TMT3 is always "Mode 1" and vice versa with SP. Also, it doesn't make a difference if I pause a movie or skip ahead or back, I never have to change the original Mode.

This goes for IR glasses also.

And I don't think anyone would be able to watch more than 30 seconds of any 3D video with it being reversed, the viewer can tell right away if it's not correct.

In a nutshell, this isn't a big deal, and it isn't anything new to DLP-Link or IR-based glasses, been this way since the beginning.

The only problem I can see is with PC games that have built-in Stereoscopic support (like the Avatar game). It could vary from game to game.

EDIT:
I'd also like to add, before I got a graphics card that supported MVC hardware decoding, I had to decode via the CPU. Sometimes, a particular scene would be too much for the CPU, and I'd get stuttering. Never once did the glasses lose sync or get things reversed due to this.

It will happen every time you restart the Stereoscopic Player.
It will happen every time you restart the DLP-link Projector.
Always with 50% random chance.
Also you have both type of glasses not just DLP-Link
and you can confirm that it does not happen when you
use DLP-Link projector with nVidia glasses.
If fact you can use them both while switching the DLP-Link
projector on and off few times the nVidia will never get wrong eye but DLP-Link glasses will do that guaranteed with 50% random score.

Mathew Orman
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post #107 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 06:35 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Li On View Post

Not my experience. Mine is a Optoma GT720 with 2 pairs of DLP Link glasses Optoma ZD101. I tried PDVD10, TMT3 and TMT5, and the Stereoscopic Player. Open any of those software player, drag a 3D clips in it to play, bring the player to fullscreen for 3D playback, it can be Left eye first. Bring the software player to window mode, drag another clips to play in fullscreen, it can be Right eye first, or still in Left eye first mode. The L/R eye sequence is simply random with each new playback.

But if I keep the software player in fullscreen mode, and stop/pause, skip, fast forward/backward or whatever, then the L/R sequence will still keep in sync.

When it's in correct L/R sync, BOTH pairs of glasses are correct. When the sync is wrong, both pairs of glasses are wrong.

The thing is I'm using a ATI 5570 card. I wonder if a nvidia card may perform better in term of L/R sync in DLP Link mode...

regards,

Li On

Thank You!

Finally someone with eagle eyes.

And yes if continue in full screen the quad buffer does not get interrupted.

Mathew Orman
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post #108 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 06:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icester View Post

Yes,
the most important facts.
nVidia has a monopoly on eye phase sync and only outputs it via 3D Vision Kit with it's own glasses
and only recently allowed HDMI 1.4 output for free but only movies and not for games. For games you have to pay
for 3D TV Play.

Peter Wimmer top expert in area stereoscopic content streaming on PC, the author of the famous Stereoscopic Player which light version of, you can download from nVidia's website has publicly confirmed that DLP-Link on DLP-link projectors has no way to get correct eye content
and the random chance of getting it right is 50%.

Here is the link to the message:

http://movies.groups.yahoo.com/group/3dtv/message/26855

Peter Wimmer is the list owner of 3dtv group.
In the thread you will also find another lab experts in are of stereoscopic projection, Werner Bloos who confirmed that he spoke with OPTOMA product engineer and they had admitted that the problem exists.


Mathew Orman

You're correct on two points, Peter knows his stuff, and yes, the displays don't know which frame is first, hence my above response.

This is exactly why Peter put all of those options in Stereoscopic Player when you load a media file. It asks "SbS, Left first", "SbS, right first", etc.

Here's the kicker regarding nvidia. What if someone makes a 3D video, but doesn't bother to insert the flag telling the software what's what? Nvidia's software doesn't know what to do with it (not to mention, nvidia's software player is merely Peter's software).

Regarding 3D Blu-Ray, since it's basically a hi-res Top/Bottom format, I believe the studios all do the same thing, whether top first or bottom first, and the STBs follow suit.

Like I said, this isn't really a DLP-Link issue, because if you decide to use IR-based glasses (outside of nvidia's), the display still doesn't know which frame is first.

Currently testing 3D with Sammy DLP, shutter glasses, and HTPC
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post #109 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icester View Post

It will happen every time you restart the Stereoscopic Player.
It will happen every time you restart the DLP-link Projector.
Always with 50% random chance.
Also you have both type of glasses not just DLP-Link
and you can confirm that it does not happen when you
use DLP-Link projector with nVidia glasses.
If fact you can use them both while switching the DLP-Link
projector on and off few times the nVidia will never get wrong eye but DLP-Link glasses will do that guaranteed with 50% random score.

Mathew Orman

First, I will freely admit, I don't have a DLP FP, I have a Sammy DLP RP, but I don't see the difference with regards to this conversation.

Second, while things may work different with the Optima (I have no idea why it would), I can tell you, it's always the same outcome for me. It's never a 50-50 chance, when playing the same media file.

I've been testing this for nearly a year, and it's never happened. Either something is different with my display, or I need to be on the next plane to Vegas.

FWIW, I've tested with an ATI HD2900XT and a nvidia GT240. I don't use the nvidia 3D Vision setup, just Stereoscopic Player, TMT3, and PDVD10.

My glasses are X102s and IO Display IR shutters via 3-pin VESA.

Currently testing 3D with Sammy DLP, shutter glasses, and HTPC
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post #110 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 06:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Li On View Post

Not my experience. Mine is a Optoma GT720 with 2 pairs of DLP Link glasses Optoma ZD101. I tried PDVD10, TMT3 and TMT5, and the Stereoscopic Player. Open any of those software player, drag a 3D clips in it to play, bring the player to fullscreen for 3D playback, it can be Left eye first. Bring the software player to window mode, drag another clips to play in fullscreen, it can be Right eye first, or still in Left eye first mode. The L/R eye sequence is simply random with each new playback.

But if I keep the software player in fullscreen mode, and stop/pause, skip, fast forward/backward or whatever, then the L/R sequence will still keep in sync.

When it's in correct L/R sync, BOTH pairs of glasses are correct. When the sync is wrong, both pairs of glasses are wrong.

The thing is I'm using a ATI 5570 card. I wonder if a nvidia card may perform better in term of L/R sync in DLP Link mode...

regards,

Li On

Li, that's very odd. I can even go from full screen to window mode and it keeps the order correct.

I don't know, maybe there is something different between a 1080p RP DLP and a 720p FP DLP. For the life of me, I can't figure out what would be the difference (other than the obvious ).

Currently testing 3D with Sammy DLP, shutter glasses, and HTPC
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post #111 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 07:05 PM
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hi taz291819, I think I read somewhere that this DLP Link L/R eyes sync problem only occur on Front Projection system. RP using checkerboard format is not affected...

regards,

Li On
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post #112 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 07:13 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taz291819 View Post

First, I will freely admit, I don't have a DLP FP, I have a Sammy DLP RP, but I don't see the difference with regards to this conversation.

Second, while things may work different with the Optima (I have no idea why it would), I can tell you, it's always the same outcome for me. It's never a 50-50 chance, when playing the same media file.

I've been testing this for nearly a year, and it's never happened. Either something is different with my display, or I need to be on the next plane to Vegas.

FWIW, I've tested with an ATI HD2900XT and a nvidia GT240. I don't use the nvidia 3D Vision setup, just Stereoscopic Player, TMT3, and PDVD10.

My glasses are X102s and IO Display IR shutters via 3-pin VESA.

I have already stated few time in this thread that DLP-Link only does not work with systems that do not use checker board format.

Mathew Orman
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post #113 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 08:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Li On View Post

hi taz291819, I think I read somewhere that this DLP Link L/R eyes sync problem only occur on Front Projection system. RP using checkerboard format is not affected...

regards,

Li On

Gotcha, so if that's the case, why not send a checkerboard signal to the projector, since the DLP projector needs that method anyway (inherit of DLPs). Isn't that basically what this converter is doing?

If one is worried about resolution loss from 3D BD, technically, a 1080p checkerboard signal has more resolution than downconverting 3D BD to 720p, so that issue would be moot.

Also, for 3D, 1080p60 isn't even in the 1.4a spec, it tops out at 24Hz if memory serves me well. Sending a 1080p60 checkerboard signal (which will be downconverted to 720p60) is better than that.

Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on this.

Currently testing 3D with Sammy DLP, shutter glasses, and HTPC
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post #114 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 08:44 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by taz291819 View Post

Gotcha, so if that's the case, why not send a checkerboard signal to the projector, since the DLP projector needs that method anyway (inherit of DLPs). Isn't that basically what this converter is doing?

If one is worried about resolution loss from 3D BD, technically, a 1080p checkerboard signal has more resolution than downconverting 3D BD to 720p, so that issue would be moot.

Also, for 3D, 1080p60 isn't even in the 1.4a spec, it tops out at 24Hz if memory serves me well. Sending a 1080p60 checkerboard signal (which will be downconverted to 720p60) is better than that.

Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong on this.

There is no way to send checker board signal via HDMI 1.4 and 3D-XL box does not have DLP-Link firmware for decoding 1080p much less for converting it into 720p.
Finally I do not think you would like 360 lines of resolution per eye on big projection screen.

It would be good though to see one supplies 120 Hz checker board signal and see if the real DLP-link turns on.

If so then that should be in user manual, but I have have not seen any such info in OPTOMA DLP-Link user manuals.

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post #115 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by icester View Post

There is no way to send checker board signal via HDMI 1.4 and 3D-XL box does not have DLP-Link firmware for decoding 1080p much less for converting it into 720p.
Finally I do not think you would like 360 lines of resolution per eye on big projection screen.

Mathew Orman

What? You can send checkerboard via HDMI 1.4a, as it's backwards compatible with all the other HDMI standards. How do you think the Panny 3D BD players send checkerboard?

And we must have some translation issues, because I have no idea what you mean by the 3D-XL does not have DLP-Link firmware for decoding 1080p. What does 1080p have to do with DLP-Link?

Also, it's not 360 lines of resolution per eye.

EDIT:

Ok, after doing some reading on the Optoma projectors, it seems they don't support checkerboard natively, which is odd, but that's another discussion.

That actually kinda sucks for Opp owners.

Currently testing 3D with Sammy DLP, shutter glasses, and HTPC
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post #116 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 09:12 PM
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Icester, you are making claims based on assumptions and claiming them as truth. TI hasn't released the documentation publically, and having tried to get it myself, was told it was not available without a partnership agreement and nondisclosure agreement, so you or I will not get the chance to see it (in fact, if you had met the requirements and seen it, your comments on this thread would be in violation of your nondisclosure agreement and expose you to very high damages, so i'm pretty sure you haven't). You have no insider information. You cannot say that TI didn't build a method for syncronization into their DMD. It's very possible that they did, and that the 3d-xl box implements that method. The fact is, unless you're violating your NDA or you magically got hold of a 3d-xl early, you're stating your own theories as fact.




Having said that, your theory seems LIKELY. Here's some actual documentation- This was previously on their web site (though has since been removed):

"The 3D-XL is compatible with the following third-party projectors:

Brand Model Resolution Test Date Notes
Acer H5360 720p 09/2010 FW: A04
BenQ MP626 XGA 09/2010 FW: 101 - No Audio heard from projector speakers in 3D mode
BenQ MX750 ST XGA 11/2010 FW: 0.54
Viewsonic PJD6251 XGA 11/2010
Viewsonic PJD6531W WXGA 11/2010
Vivitek D510 SVGA 11/2010 No "3D Sync invert" option in OSD - you have to keep enabling/disabling 3D until sync is correct
"

The interesting part is the the note about compatibility with the Vivitek D510- It says that since the vivitek doesn't have a sync invert option in the menu, the only solution is to enable/disable 3d until the sync is correct. This clearly implies that the box cannot syncronize with this projector, and that it relies on sync inverting for most projectors. Certainly not clear proof of your claim, but strong supporting evidence for your theory.

Still, maybe you should avoid stating your unproven beliefs, however likely, as irrefutable fact.
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Originally Posted by taz291819 View Post

What? You can send checkerboard via HDMI 1.4a, as it's backwards compatible with all the other HDMI standards. How do you think the Panny 3D BD players send checkerboard?

And we must have some translation issues, because I have no idea what you mean by the 3D-XL does not have DLP-Link firmware for decoding 1080p. What does 1080p have to do with DLP-Link?

Also, it's not 360 lines of resolution per eye.

EDIT:

Ok, after doing some reading on the Optoma projectors, it seems they don't support checkerboard natively, which is odd, but that's another discussion.

That actually kinda sucks for Opp owners.

TI DLP-Link specifies two masks one is 1080p and the other is 720p and you can download it from DLP-Link website.
There is no problem sending it via HDMI 1.4 but 3D-XL box is not going to recognize it as valid HDMI 1.4 stereo format.
Also the checker board firmware code it not something that any manufacture can use.
3D Blu-ray players do not output checker board format.


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post #118 of 311 Old 12-08-2010, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by icester View Post

TI DLP-Link specifies two masks one is 1080p and the other is 720p and you can download it from DLP-Link website.
There is no problem sending it via HDMI 1.4 but 3D-XL box is not going to recognize it as valid HDMI 1.4 stereo format.
Also the checker board firmware code it not something that any manufacture can use.
3D Blu-ray players do not output checker board format.


Mathew Orman

Umm, you may want to let Panasonic know their 3D BD players are performing magic then.

Currently testing 3D with Sammy DLP, shutter glasses, and HTPC
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One other inquiry to those that may know.

If these projectors can't accept the checkerboard format, why is that? Was it somehow locked out via firmware?

The reason I ask is because just like DLP rear-projectors, they have to use the checkerboard method to produce a 3D image, via wobulation. The only possible way not to use checkerboard is via a 3-chip projector.

And if these projectors could get a firmware update to unlock it's ability to input a checkerboard signal, than this whole issue would be done with.

Mitsubishi didn't have any problems with their converter, regarding DLP-Link anyway.

Currently testing 3D with Sammy DLP, shutter glasses, and HTPC
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post #120 of 311 Old 12-09-2010, 12:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taz291819 View Post

One other inquiry to those that may know.

If these projectors can't accept the checkerboard format, why is that? Was it somehow locked out via firmware?

The reason I ask is because just like DLP rear-projectors, they have to use the checkerboard method to produce a 3D image, via wobulation. The only possible way not to use checkerboard is via a 3-chip projector.

And if these projectors could get a firmware update to unlock it's ability to input a checkerboard signal, than this whole issue would be done with.

Mitsubishi didn't have any problems with their converter, regarding DLP-Link anyway.

AFAIK all current 720p dlp front projectors accept 120hz frame sequential input and output full frame 120hz frame sequential output. No wobulation.

Checkerboard is/was only used with rear projection.
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