RF 3D Glasses?? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 18 Old 08-09-2012, 01:18 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm about to put money down on a WD-92842 that has Full HD 3D RF capabilities and was first looking at matching it up with the Monstervision 3D RF glasses. However since the Monstervisions are discontinued, I'm looking for alternatives. Searching the forums I'm finding that the Optoma's are the same. However which are better...BG-3DRFGLASSES or the BG-ZF2100GLS?

Are their other RF 3D glasses I should be looking at too? I will need 5-6 pairs, so will I need multiple kits or what?

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post #2 of 18 Old 08-09-2012, 03:44 PM
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XpanD has the X-104 Youniversal glasses, but I think the RF is an add-on feature. http://www.xpand.me/products/youniversal-3d-glasses/ They claim to be the lightest Active 3D glasses and have the fastest lenses.

They come in three sizes and are Universal IR as well. http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias=electronics&field-keywords=x104%20rf%20dongle#

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post #3 of 18 Old 08-09-2012, 04:07 PM - Thread Starter
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The RF dongle looks kinda strange as an addon to the arm of the glasses. I'm wondering if I should go ahead and get the MonsterVisions and replace with Optoma glasses if anything happens beyond repair in the future.

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post #4 of 18 Old 08-11-2012, 10:06 AM
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I can't find any reviews or customer experiences with the BG-ZF2100 RF 3D glasses anywhere.

I know they are new, but don't the Gurus get these early releases so they can check them out and post reviews? How a, I supposed to know what to buy without being told?

I am buying a new HD33, but I don't want to buy the old glasses if these are truly a marked improvement. I suppose I can just trust that a quality company like Optoma wouldn't bother updating and upgrading their glasses if it wasn't a significant improvement....that never happens, right?

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post #5 of 18 Old 08-11-2012, 10:16 AM
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OP are your sure that the tv allready has a transmitter for RF glases or does it just have the ability to connect an RF glases transmitter?
Is there any reason that you do not want to use DLP link glases?
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post #6 of 18 Old 08-11-2012, 10:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Someone just posted a review on Amazon yesterday. They are newer, and per the reviewer, they do come with improvements but also with smaller lenses. They are also $40 more per glasses than the MonsterVision. I have only one week to make a decision on what to buy so it arrives with my TV.

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post #7 of 18 Old 08-11-2012, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walford View Post

OP are your sure that the tv allready has a transmitter for RF glases or does it just have the ability to connect an RF glases transmitter?
Is there any reason that you do not want to use DLP link glases?

All 842 series TVs have a built in Bluetooth RF 3D emitter. http://www.mitsubishi-tv.com/

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post #8 of 18 Old 08-11-2012, 10:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walford View Post

OP are your sure that the tv allready has a transmitter for RF glases or does it just have the ability to connect an RF glases transmitter?
Is there any reason that you do not want to use DLP link glases?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Augerhandle View Post

All 842 series TVs have a built in Bluetooth RF 3D emitter. http://www.mitsubishi-tv.com/

Sorry, walford. I somehow overlooked your post. As Augerhandle stated, the 92842 has a Bluetooth RF 3D emitter and can use DLP Link. I am reading that the RF Sync is much better and the RF glasses perform better. Keep in mind that this is all speculations by others as I don't own any...yet.

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post #9 of 18 Old 08-14-2012, 09:57 AM
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Going to the beginning message of this thread where the user wanted to use MonsterVision glasses with his new Mitsubsihi TV. While it is possible, he will not be using the built-in RF transmitter in the TV when he uses the MV glasses.

FYI:
Currently there are two RF systems used for 3D Glasses - think similar to AM and FM radio system. The two systems are NOT compatible with each other.

One system was developed by Bit Cauldron and is used by Monster Vision and Optoma as well. This is based on ZigBee RF protocols. This was the first system introduced. One version has an external RF transmitter (usable on many glasses) that connects to a TV with a VESA Jack for 3D glasses emitters/transmitter and a special IR sensor that can be placed adjacent to an internal IR emitter in some TVs. The sensor then connects to the RF transmitter. That transmitter will convert the IR signal to RF signals for the glasses.

http://www.bitcauldron.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=76&Itemid=37

The other system is based on Bluetooth RF protocols. This is the basis of the new "Full HD 3D Glasses" Initiative.

http://www.fullhd3dglasses.com/

To use the MV/Optoma/Bit Cauldron glasses, you need TVs that fit in one of the three categories:
1. Has ZigBee based compatible RF transmitter built-in. I have never heard of any such TV on the market or in press releases for the future - Technically always possible but not currently on the market that I can find.
2. Has VESA Jack (receptacle) on the TV to plug an external RF or IR transmitter. All Mitsubishi 3D TVs, many 3D video projectors, and the older Samsung 3D Ready DLP RPTVs have this jack.
3. Internal front panel IR emitter for IR glasses and then uses the special IR sensor that comes with the MV/Optoma/Bit Cauldron RF transmitter.

Unfortunately your Samsung 55D8000 has none of the above which means you cannot use the MV/Optoma/Bit Cauldron glasses with that model of TV.

Your model of Samsung TV is "Full HD 3D Glasses" compatible - Bluetooth.

This protocol includes RF glasses by Samsung, Panasonic, Sony (possibly in the future), and Xpand. I am sure that in the future there will be more brands of RF glasses for this system. There are currently on the market compatible TVs with compatible built-in Bluetooth RF transmitters by Samsung, Panasonic, Mitsubishi, and in the future possibly Sony and several others. The "Full HD 3D Glasses" Imitative also include standards for IR glasses which cover several additional brands so if or when these other brands move to RF, most likely they will go with the "Full HD 3D Glasses" RF glasses.
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post #10 of 18 Old 08-14-2012, 02:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GEP View Post

Going to the beginning message of this thread where the user wanted to use MonsterVision glasses with his new Mitsubsihi TV. While it is possible, he will not be using the built-in RF transmitter in the TV when he uses the MV glasses.
FYI:
Currently there are two RF systems used for 3D Glasses - think similar to AM and FM radio system. The two systems are NOT compatible with each other.
One system was developed by Bit Cauldron and is used by Monster Vision and Optoma as well. This is based on ZigBee RF protocols. This was the first system introduced. One version has an external RF transmitter (usable on many glasses) that connects to a TV with a VESA Jack for 3D glasses emitters/transmitter and a special IR sensor that can be placed adjacent to an internal IR emitter in some TVs. The sensor then connects to the RF transmitter. That transmitter will convert the IR signal to RF signals for the glasses.
http://www.bitcauldron.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=76&Itemid=37
The other system is based on Bluetooth RF protocols. This is the basis of the new "Full HD 3D Glasses" Initiative.
http://www.fullhd3dglasses.com/
To use the MV/Optoma/Bit Cauldron glasses, you need TVs that fit in one of the three categories:
1. Has ZigBee based compatible RF transmitter built-in. I have never heard of any such TV on the market or in press releases for the future - Technically always possible but not currently on the market that I can find.
2. Has VESA Jack (receptacle) on the TV to plug an external RF or IR transmitter. All Mitsubishi 3D TVs, many 3D video projectors, and the older Samsung 3D Ready DLP RPTVs have this jack.
3. Internal front panel IR emitter for IR glasses and then uses the special IR sensor that comes with the MV/Optoma/Bit Cauldron RF transmitter.
Unfortunately your Samsung 55D8000 has none of the above which means you cannot use the MV/Optoma/Bit Cauldron glasses with that model of TV.
Your model of Samsung TV is "Full HD 3D Glasses" compatible - Bluetooth.
This protocol includes RF glasses by Samsung, Panasonic, Sony (possibly in the future), and Xpand. I am sure that in the future there will be more brands of RF glasses for this system. There are currently on the market compatible TVs with compatible built-in Bluetooth RF transmitters by Samsung, Panasonic, Mitsubishi, and in the future possibly Sony and several others. The "Full HD 3D Glasses" Imitative also include standards for IR glasses which cover several additional brands so if or when these other brands move to RF, most likely they will go with the "Full HD 3D Glasses" RF glasses.

So if I go with the 92840, then I will go with the Monster/Optoma/BC RF glasses. If I go with the 92842, then I will go with the Xpand YOUniversal IR/RF glasses which claim to be the fasted shutter lenses now. I wonder how they compare with the Bit Cauldron (BC) glasses? Can you provide any advice for me? I have to decided ASAP. TIA

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post #11 of 18 Old 08-15-2012, 09:22 AM
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You can use the MV glasses on the 842 series but you just need to connect the MV RF transmitter to the TV and turn off the internal Bluetooth RF transmitter. I looked at the OG on line on the Mits site and you do have this option.

I cannot judge between the MV glasses and Xpand RF glasses - I have never used the Xpand RF glasses. I have used the Xpand IR glasses and I like their performance (a little heavy in weight). The Xpand IR glasses are bit darker than the MV glasses but I like the dark blacks this gives. I have also tested on a friend's TV the MV glasses and they are lighter and a bit (not alot) brighter. I also like them but I did not do the set up, my friend did.

I doubt you can get an accurate answer to you questions about "which are the best glasses". Nobody here has done formal and extensive testing of all options available. Without that testing, all answers will be like mine, limited and of little value.
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post #12 of 18 Old 08-15-2012, 04:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GEP View Post

You can use the MV glasses on the 842 series but you just need to connect the MV RF transmitter to the TV and turn off the internal Bluetooth RF transmitter. I looked at the OG on line on the Mits site and you do have this option.
I cannot judge between the MV glasses and Xpand RF glasses - I have never used the Xpand RF glasses. I have used the Xpand IR glasses and I like their performance (a little heavy in weight). The Xpand IR glasses are bit darker than the MV glasses but I like the dark blacks this gives. I have also tested on a friend's TV the MV glasses and they are lighter and a bit (not alot) brighter. I also like them but I did not do the set up, my friend did.
I doubt you can get an accurate answer to you questions about "which are the best glasses". Nobody here has done formal and extensive testing of all options available. Without that testing, all answers will be like mine, limited and of little value.

Where the Xpands you tested the newer YOUniversal line or the original 103/104s?

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post #13 of 18 Old 08-16-2012, 09:41 AM
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The YOUniversal are the X104 according to the Xpand web site http://www.xpand.me/products/youniversal-3d-glasses/list-of-compatible-devices/#mitsubishi.

I have not used the YOUniversal, only the X103.
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post #14 of 18 Old 08-16-2012, 10:04 AM - Thread Starter
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Yes, it is a newer line of the 104's with a different model#. I spoke yesterday with a dealer who had just finished his updated training on the Mits 842 series and the Xpands (YOUniversals and changes with the original 104s with the 842s). Some will not be happy with the changes. I will have more when my glasses and 842 arrives.

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post #15 of 18 Old 08-16-2012, 01:36 PM
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From what I understand, the X104 are not new but the RF dongle that adds to the X104 is new. Without the dongle they are IR glasses, with the dongle they become RF glasses (Bluetooth).

Since Xpand is one of the founding companies for the "Full HD 3D Glasses" standard, I assume that the dongle is to that standard (I could be wrong). If it is, then the glasses with that dongle should work with the internal Bluetooth RF emitter in the 842 series.
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post #16 of 18 Old 08-16-2012, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GEP View Post

From what I understand, the X104 are not new but the RF dongle that adds to the X104 is new. Without the dongle they are IR glasses, with the dongle they become RF glasses (Bluetooth).

Since Xpand is one of the founding companies for the "Full HD 3D Glasses" standard, I assume that the dongle is to that standard (I could be wrong). If it is, then the glasses with that dongle should work with the internal Bluetooth RF emitter in the 842 series.

http://www.xpand.me/products/youniversal-3d-glasses/technology/
Quote:
XPAND 3D is launching RF dongle device that plugs into the USB port of the XPAND YOUniversal Electronic 3D Eyewear and enables the glasses to communicate with RF devices using the widely available FULL HD 3D protocol. The RF dongle enables the XPAND YOUniversal Electronic 3D Eyewear to become the world’s first and only IR/RF hybrid 3D glasses. The RF dongle will be sold separately, but also bundled with YOUniversal Electronic 3D Eyewear.

The X-104s were originally promised to be universally compatible with IR, RF, and DLP-Link™. They were about ten months later than planned coming out, and the DLP-Link feature was not included, with the RF promised as a future dongle attachment available later. DLP-Link™ may or may not be forthcoming as a future upgrade.

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post #17 of 18 Old 08-17-2012, 05:37 PM - Thread Starter
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I ordered 5 of the X104LX1 YOUniversal 3D glasses. They just arrived via UPS. Unfortunately the dongles and TV have yet to arrive. They should be here next week. I opened one of the boxes and they feel like the glasses I wear all of the time. They fit nicely over my glasses. In the box are the glasses, two nose guards, microfiber cloth, case and charging/upgrade USB cable. The glasses came with fw v1.0.0. The PC app immediately noticed that v2.01 had to be uploaded...so I allowed it.
Quote:
Changes from last version:
V2.0.1
- RF expansion dongle support added
- 96, 100, 120 and 144 Hz frame rate support added for XPAND Cinema Sync
- Minor bugs fixed

V1.5.3
- Philips 2k11 IR sync support added.
- Dual view functionality added.
- Shutter delay control enabled.
- PC application support enabled.
- Improved shutter timings for the Sony, Samsung and Panasonic IR sync.
- Improved charging indication.
- Minor bugs fixed.

Release date: 26 March 2012

It takes a few minutes, but not too long. I am now upgrading the other 4.

...The application appears finicky if your battery is drained too low. It may take a few seconds for it to recognize the connection as it waits for them to reach a certain power level. My phone/tablet are the same way so no biggie. There is a cute gif action to let you know when the connection is made. I will let them charge more next week when it is closer to when I can test them out. I have to do the same to some Samsung glasses for a brand new 51" 3D Plasma (gave it to wifey for the bedroom) I just got free today with 4 prs of glasses. I went from no 3D (minus my EVO3D) to two 3D displays and 9 prs of glasses. Funny how that works out.

I will try to do a more detailed review later with pictures incase anyone is interested in these and how they work...RF only as I will not have IR.

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post #18 of 18 Old 08-17-2012, 06:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GEP View Post

From what I understand, the X104 are not new but the RF dongle that adds to the X104 is new. Without the dongle they are IR glasses, with the dongle they become RF glasses (Bluetooth).
Since Xpand is one of the founding companies for the "Full HD 3D Glasses" standard, I assume that the dongle is to that standard (I could be wrong). If it is, then the glasses with that dongle should work with the internal Bluetooth RF emitter in the 842 series.

XPAND emailed me today and confirmed that the RF dongle is indeed compatible with the internal RF emitter in the 842 series. I'm also being told that we should start seeing these more prevalent in other sets soon.

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