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post #211 of 590 Old 01-11-2011, 01:46 PM
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Try google it. Word is, that they go quickly though.

You could start with buy.com
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post #212 of 590 Old 01-11-2011, 05:03 PM
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sold out everywhere. I heard buy.com was 550 delivered. Is that true?
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post #213 of 590 Old 01-11-2011, 07:19 PM
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My ysp-2200 could be faulty. After the power is on, it display the setup menu for 3 sec and the power gone off. Do anyone have similar issue? Thanks.
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post #214 of 590 Old 01-11-2011, 11:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kneman View Post

sold out everywhere. I heard buy.com was 550 delivered. Is that true?

If you take the time to look through this thread then, yes, $550 was the price at Buy.com (retail still $999 though). I think it was for a limited time only but I could be wrong. They've sold out pretty quickly at Buy.com.

I think the $999 asking price is too high. I don't get why they wouldn't drop it to $600-700. Heck, I live in Europe (Denmark), and I would (almost) not mind paying the full retail price in US as it's priced at $1400-1500 where I live.
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post #215 of 590 Old 01-12-2011, 12:12 PM
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Davyo, have you used these particular ones? Are they decent quality and do you think they will hold the 2200 okay? Has anyone else bought these?
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post #216 of 590 Old 01-12-2011, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FunkMasterDex View Post

If you take the time to look through this thread then, yes, $550 was the price at Buy.com (retail still $999 though). I think it was for a limited time only but I could be wrong. They've sold out pretty quickly at Buy.com.

I think the $999 asking price is too high. I don't get why they wouldn't drop it to $600-700. Heck, I live in Europe (Denmark), and I would (almost) not mind paying the full retail price in US as it's priced at $1400-1500 where I live.

I've been looking on buy.com for that deal as well, with no sucsess.

Other yamaha soundbars are available for bigger discounts. The 5100 and 4100 look like around 60% of suggested and the 3050(older) is around 35%. That would make me except the 2200 to head toward 650 in the next couple months.

The real question might be whether to spend 800 now on the 2200 or fork over the extra couple hundred for the 4100.
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post #217 of 590 Old 01-12-2011, 02:04 PM
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Where did u see 5100 60% off?


Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesqong View Post

I've been looking on buy.com for that deal as well, with no sucsess.

Other yamaha soundbars are available for bigger discounts. The 5100 and 4100 look like around 60% of suggested and the 3050(older) is around 35%. That would make me except the 2200 to head toward 650 in the next couple months.

The real question might be whether to spend 800 now on the 2200 or fork over the extra couple hundred for the 4100.


JHT
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post #218 of 590 Old 01-12-2011, 02:43 PM
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Well, I've read that the YSP-2200 should be Yamaha's best soundprojector yet. Seems like the 4100/5100 lacks the lower octaves (no problem if you already own a sub I guess), and that their surround effects aren't as effective as the YSP-2200.
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post #219 of 590 Old 01-13-2011, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jithtproject View Post

Where did u see 5100 60% off?

60% of suggested, so 40% off.
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post #220 of 590 Old 01-13-2011, 05:26 PM
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I've had the 2200 for about a week now. I was very excited to get it after Davyo's review, but now not so excited about it. I am not an audiophile by any means, but the sound quality just isn't that great. I have a terrible set up for the surround effect so I wasn't expecting much on that front, but I am terribly disappointed in the subwoofer performance, and mid range is simply lacking. My advice to anyone looking to buy this bar is to wait until you can hear it in person, then make your own decision about the sound quality. Wish I would have waited to do the same. I did get the buy.com deal, so Im not completely bummed, but for the sound quality I would have bought a samsung, vizio or JVC and saved a couple hundred dollars. Just my 2 cents
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post #221 of 590 Old 01-13-2011, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FunkMasterDex View Post

Well, I've read that the YSP-2200 should be Yamaha's best soundprojector yet. Seems like the 4100/5100 lacks the lower octaves (no problem if you already own a sub I guess), and that their surround effects aren't as effective as the YSP-2200.

Should the 2200's sub(two 4 inch drivers) be more
effective than the 4100s two 4.5 inch drivers that are in the main body?

It seems like the 4100 would be more capable because of the greater number of 1.5" drivers as well.

I just ordered my 2200 and will let you know what I think.
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post #222 of 590 Old 01-13-2011, 07:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by td2243 View Post

Davyo, have you used these particular ones? Are they decent quality and do you think they will hold the 2200 okay? Has anyone else bought these?

Yes, I have that soundbar bracket, very happy with it.

Cheers
Davyo
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post #223 of 590 Old 01-13-2011, 07:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigeasy70075 View Post

I've had the 2200 for about a week now. I was very excited to get it after Davyo's review, but now not so excited about it. I am not an audiophile by any means, but the sound quality just isn't that great. I have a terrible set up for the surround effect so I wasn't expecting much on that front, but I am terribly disappointed in the subwoofer performance, and mid range is simply lacking. My advice to anyone looking to buy this bar is to wait until you can hear it in person, then make your own decision about the sound quality. Wish I would have waited to do the same. I did get the buy.com deal, so Im not completely bummed, but for the sound quality I would have bought a samsung, vizio or JVC and saved a couple hundred dollars. Just my 2 cents

I am sorry to hear you are not happy with the 2200,,, perhaps doing some manual adjustments might a difference.

Soundbars can be finicky depending on the room shape and size and the placement of the bar.

Having owned many YSP's I can say sometimes the auto set-up can be improved on greatly with some manual tweeking if needed.

Cheers
Davyo
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post #224 of 590 Old 01-13-2011, 11:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigeasy70075 View Post

I've had the 2200 for about a week now. I was very excited to get it after Davyo's review, but now not so excited about it. I am not an audiophile by any means, but the sound quality just isn't that great. I have a terrible set up for the surround effect so I wasn't expecting much on that front, but I am terribly disappointed in the subwoofer performance, and mid range is simply lacking. My advice to anyone looking to buy this bar is to wait until you can hear it in person, then make your own decision about the sound quality. Wish I would have waited to do the same. I did get the buy.com deal, so Im not completely bummed, but for the sound quality I would have bought a samsung, vizio or JVC and saved a couple hundred dollars. Just my 2 cents

Like Davyo wrote, try to adjust some of the settings manually. I don't think that auto-calibration in these cheaper units are that precise. Especially in difficult rooms. The YSP-2200's auto-calibration might get you 40-80% of the desired performance, depending on your room, but to get the most out of it you may have to adjust the settings manually.

Can you tell us where you've placed the soundbar and sub?

I don't like the "What-Hifi" magazine but they recently gave the YSP-2200 5/5 stars saying that "it is capable of producing realistic surround effects and crystal clear sound".
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post #225 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 11:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesqong View Post
Should the 2200's sub(two 4 inch drivers) be more
effective than the 4100s two 4.5 inch drivers that are in the main body?

It seems like the 4100 would be more capable because of the greater number of 1.5" drivers as well.

I just ordered my 2200 and will let you know what I think.
The two 4" drivers from the dedicated sub with the 2200 should give you deeper and more realistic bass the the two 4.5" drivers from the 4100. The units in the 4100 are set up as a basic woofer and if memory serves correctly begin to roll off at about 120-150hz (mid-bass). The drivers and electronics for the 2200 sub are optimized to go below 60hz which is fairly deep for this type of device. I have a hard time believing they will play anything at 30hz to 40hz but really don't know as I have not had a chance to listen to or take any measurements on the 2200.

David Freeman
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post #226 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigeasy70075 View Post

I've had the 2200 for about a week now. I was very excited to get it after Davyo's review, but now not so excited about it. I am not an audiophile by any means, but the sound quality just isn't that great. I have a terrible set up for the surround effect so I wasn't expecting much on that front, but I am terribly disappointed in the subwoofer performance, and mid range is simply lacking. My advice to anyone looking to buy this bar is to wait until you can hear it in person, then make your own decision about the sound quality. Wish I would have waited to do the same. I did get the buy.com deal, so Im not completely bummed, but for the sound quality I would have bought a samsung, vizio or JVC and saved a couple hundred dollars. Just my 2 cents

To attempt to get your best sound, do your initial optimization as 2.1 / 3.1 system. You are attempting at this point to smooth out the frequency response. Make sure you do not raise the sub-woofer level higher than the soundbar level. There is a tendency for many people to want to hear the bass. With most Yamaha YSP's, the bass level can be set by adjusting the level up until you are just aware that you can hear it, then adjust back down until you just lose it as a distinct sound. Also, try toning down the treble. Previous YSP's had a somewhat rolled off high end and the setup program tended to have users adjusting for increased treble response. This may help the upper two octaves, but can cause some problems with the mid-range.

When setting up the unit, avoid all of the sound processing selections until your basic sound is natural. When you have the YSP where it sounds like you are hearing all of the sound from primarily a center source, leave it that way for a few weeks and let your ears become accustomed to it. At this point, go back to your TV speakers and then you will see how much the YSP is or is not adding to the listening experience. When you are accustomed to the sound, if it is still pleasing, then you can begin to try the various sound processing modes.

Before making any changes, make a written record of your settings to get back to a starting point in the event you screw things up completely. This from a guy who screws things up as a regular job. Since Yamaha prefers to play with phase shift and response patterns to do their surround, this may take a bit of fiddling to find a mode that you like.

Keep us posted as to your progress and your likes on this.

David Freeman
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post #227 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 11:37 AM
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I'm certainly sure that the YSP-2200 subwoofer won't go near 30hz or even 50hz. I think 60hz is somewhat realistic.
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post #228 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FunkMasterDex View Post

Well, I've read that the YSP-2200 should be Yamaha's best soundprojector yet. Seems like the 4100/5100 lacks the lower octaves (no problem if you already own a sub I guess), and that their surround effects aren't as effective as the YSP-2200.

where did you read that from? amazon review?? I spent a good deal of time on the phone with a level 2 yamaha tech support re their wireless subwoofer kit and we were talking about the 2200 vs the 4100 or 5100 and he said there the 2200 is no where near the the latter in sound quality and power...which was not a surprise to me. You're talking about 40 drivers vs what....7? I don't think the 2200 will even compare to ysp-3000...esp when you have the option to pair up with another powerful sub something like Hsu VTF2.3.
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post #229 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FunkMasterDex View Post

I'm certainly sure that the YSP-2200 subwoofer won't go near 30hz or even 50hz. I think 60hz is somewhat realistic.

My guess would be the usuable low end would be in the 50hz-60hz range. Very few of the so called sub-woofers that come with HTIB's or soundbars actually approach sub-woofer frequencies or volumes. Typically when you see a spec sheet that shows 30hz for one of these units, they never give how many db down from the main system this measurement (if they measured) was taken at. However, a lot can be accomplished with electronic equalization of the amplifier. Just not 30hz from a 4" driver at a sound that you can actually hear.

As a note, the 6" sub that comes with the JVC BA1 does not start to roll off until about 45hz - 50hz. This compared to the 10" sub from my Yamaha YSP that only goes to 45hz. The JVC is both faster and tighter and gives a much better presentation than the Yamaha which I still use with a Vizio soundbar in the bedroom.

If anyone remembers the DCM Time Windows from the 1970's and 1980's, these used a pair of 6" bass/mid-range drivers (crossover around 2khz) in a relatively small enclosure and had very usable bass down to about 35hz. Also the absolute fastest bass transducers I have ever heard including a pair of Janis sub-woofers that I later owned with a dedicated bass amp and electronic crossover (total over $4,000). The Janis subs would play lower (18hz) and louder (115db), but did not have the immediacy of the Time Windows. The Time Windows also had a soundstage that extended far beyond the outside of the speakers with tremendous depth and pinpoint placement of musical instruments and voices. They could give much more of a surround experience than any soundbar or HTIB with only two channels playing in the front of the room.

The Time Windows were also one of the great (GREAT) bargains in Hi-Fi history at $660 a pair from introduction in 1977 until the last units were made in the 1990's. Wish I had another pair now.

David Freeman
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post #230 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by zoey67 View Post

where did you read that from? amazon review?? I spent a good deal of time on the phone with a level 2 yamaha tech support re their wireless subwoofer kit and we were talking about the 2200 vs the 4100 or 5100 and he said there the 2200 is no where near the the latter in sound quality and power...which was not a surprise to me. You're talking about 40 drivers vs what....7? I don't think the 2200 will even compare to ysp-3000...esp when you have the option to pair up with another powerful sub something like Hsu VTF2.3.

16 drivers vs 40 or "how many watts" doesn't tell you anything about quality. It's how well they are integrated with each other and implemented. 3-way speakers doesn't necessarily sound better than 2-ways and vice versa.

And no, it was not from an Amazon review. It was from an authorized Yamaha sales person. I've also read about similar views on other forums. It seems that the YSP-2200 integrates better in living rooms than the YSP-4100/5100 but not in all cases. The low-end (bass) is also better in the YSP-2200 because it has a separate subwoofer with two drivers in its own housing/cabinet.
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post #231 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FunkMasterDex

16 drivers vs 40 or "how many watts" doesn't tell you anything about quality. It's how well they are integrated with each other and implemented. 3-way speakers doesn't necessarily sound better than 2-ways and vice versa.

.
Exactly. I have a YSP 4000 ( that I love), but 'sound'wise, it can't touch the soundbar in my Mitsubishi Unisen. The fact that Martin Logan had a hand in designing the Mitsubisihi is just utterly clear
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post #232 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FunkMasterDex View Post
16 drivers vs 40 or "how many watts" doesn't tell you anything about quality. It's how well they are integrated with each other and implemented. 3-way speakers doesn't necessarily sound better than 2-ways and vice versa.

And no, it was not from an Amazon review. It was from an authorized Yamaha sales person. I've also read about similar views on other forums. It seems that the YSP-2200 integrates better in living rooms than the YSP-4100/5100 but not in all cases. The low-end (bass) is also better in the YSP-2200 because it has a separate subwoofer with two drivers in its own housing/cabinet.
Sorry but no yamaha sales person has the knowledge and know how as a level 2 tech support ok, don't even go there. Their job is to sell, level 2 are even higher then the tech support you call in for help. They are prob the designers and engineers of yamaha. Call in your self and talk to any tech support, they are more knowledgeable with the ins and outs of these diff models. The level 2 tech sd while the 2200 is a good intended for tight small spaces, the 4100 & 5100 are in a different league, quote... unquote.

Their job is to sell new current models, not discontinued ones selling on ebay & amazon for less than 2200. Of course they're going to push the 2200
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post #233 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by frostylou View Post
Exactly. I have a YSP 4000 ( that I love), but 'sound'wise, it can't touch the soundbar in my Mitsubishi Unisen. The fact that Martin Logan had a hand in designing the Mitsubisihi is just utterly clear
Frosty cmon, they have the displays at all the Fry's and yes it's good and much better than tv speaker but cmon now...can't touch the 4000? no way, not in this lifetime. Maybe without a sub, but paired up with a decent sub is like killer whale vs seal.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoey67
Frosty cmon, they have the displays at all the Fry's and yes it's good and much better than tv speaker but cmon now...can't touch the 4000? no way, not in this lifetime. Maybe without a sub, but paired up with a decent sub is like killer whale vs seal.
Yep. I own both. With good subs on both.
Both set up to the nnnnnnth degree.
And I love my ysp 4000. But the Mitsubishi wins.
And no.. Of course not on output.
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Originally Posted by frostylou View Post
Yep. I own both. With good subs on both.
Both set up to the nnnnnnth degree.
And I love my ysp 4000. But the Mitsubishi wins.
And no.. Of course not on output.
Alright frosty, I believe you and totally respect your opinion. But I think we're touching on something really subjective now. What I mean is we're talking about a speaker bar built in the tv with how many drivers? 12x 2w vs 40 x2w with sound EQ calibration that's capable of 7.1 sound of the 5100. Do you see how that's comes across as unfair. That's more than 3 x the amount of drivers. Those numbers are too much to ignore or overcome
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post #236 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoey67
Frosty cmon, they have the displays at all the Fry's and yes it's good and much better than tv speaker but cmon now...can't touch the 4000? no way, not in this lifetime. Maybe without a sub, but paired up with a decent sub is like killer whale vs seal.
And I have been to 3 different Frys, and have yet to hear 1 Unisen set up propery.
(Or for that matter even set up at all, really)
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post #237 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 08:31 PM
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Originally Posted by frostylou View Post

And I have been to 3 different Frys, and have yet to hear 1 Unisen set up propery.
(Or for that matter even set up at all, really)

I hear ya, they do sound pretty dang good though for something that is attached to the tv. And their picture quality is miles better than what it was just about a year or 2 ago. Man that 75" Unisen is insanely good.

I think LCD's is really peaking now and everything looks great from all the mfg's. I think by this coming black friday there will be amazing 32"-40" deals with 1080p PQ from the non big boy brands like Apex, Insignia, Westinghouse, Dynex, etc. for even less.
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post #238 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 09:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoey67 View Post

Alright frosty, I believe you and totally respect your opinion. But I think we're touching on something really subjective now. What I mean is we're talking about a speaker bar built in the tv with how many drivers? 12x 2w vs 40 x2w with sound EQ calibration that's capable of 7.1 sound of the 5100. Do you see how that's comes across as unfair. That's more than 3 x the amount of drivers. Those numbers are too much to ignore or overcome

Actually Frosty is right on the money,,, I have owned many YSP's and also owned (for a short time) the Mitsubishi Unisen flat panel, (50 incher)

The Mits really does sound better than any of the YSP's I have owned or any other soundbar for that matter.

And the slick thing on the Mits is the on-screen menu to adjust the soundbeams.

With a sub hooked up to the Mits sub output and the built in soundbar on the panel itself,,, the Mits blow's EVERYTHING else out of the water,,, including the YSP's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by frostylou View Post

Yep. I own both. With good subs on both.
Both set up to the nnnnnnth degree.
And I love my ysp 4000. But the Mitsubishi wins.
And no.. Of course not on output.

Hey Frosty,, a funny story you might like,,,,,,, when I went to CES last week I stopped by the Mits booth to check out their demo of the new'est Unisen panels,,, the demo was in a sealed perfect room,,,, they did the demo and the sound coming from the new'est Unisen sucked,, very little surround effect at all,,,,,,, after the demo was over I started talking to the Mits rep and told him the UNisen I had at my house sounded ten times better than the demo I just listened to.

I asked the Mits rep, and suggested to him, that they had not calibrated the panel and if they had they might want to do it again because their demo was truely not reflecting (pun intended) how good the Unisen really sounds.

The Mits rep looked a bit confussed and I could tell he was wondering if they had set the panel up properly.

I had also demoed the same Unisen at BestBuy a few weeks before CES and even in BB it sounded way way better than the demo at CES,,,, WTF was up with that ???

Anyhow,, the Unisen is a killer panel and I would have one if they made a 65 incher,,, 55 inches is just to small for me.

Cheers
Davyo
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post #239 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by davyo View Post


Actually Frosty is right on the money,,, I have owned many YSP's and also owned (for a short time) the Mitsubishi Unisen flat panel, (50 incher)

The Mits really does sound better than any of the YSP's I have owned or any other soundbar for that matter.

And the slick thing on the Mits is the on-screen menu to adjust the soundbeams.

With a sub hooked up to the Mits sub output and the built in soundbar on the panel itself,,, the Mits blow's EVERYTHING else out of the water,,, including the YSP's.

Hey Frosty,, a funny story you might like,,,,,,, when I went to CES last week I stopped by the Mits booth to check out their demo of the new'est Unisen panels,,, the demo was in a sealed perfect room,,,, they did the demo and the sound coming from the new'est Unisen sucked,, very little surround effect at all,,,,,,, after the demo was over I started talking to the Mits rep and told him the UNisen I had at my house sounded ten times better than the demo I just listened to.

I asked the Mits rep, and suggested to him, that they had not calibrated the panel and if they had they might want to do it again because their demo was truely not reflecting (pun intended) how good the Unisen really sounds.

The Mits rep looked a bit confussed and I could tell he was wondering if they had set the panel up properly.

I had also demoed the same Unisen at BestBuy a few weeks before CES and even in BB it sounded way way better than the demo at CES,,,, WTF was up with that ???

Anyhow,, the Unisen is a killer panel and I would have one if they made a 65 incher,,, 55 inches is just to small for me.

Cheers
Davyo

Davyo,
That is hysterical. But this is what Kills me about the Mitsubishi and even the YSPs. They are 9 tens out of ten
1. Not in a room with ANY walls
2. If they are, they are almost NEVER calibrated or set up at all.
3. No subwoofer.

Total 100% non starter, and ALL of the magic that these things do..useless and not hearable.

I was in Frys a few days ago. Ysp 4100 in a good room, no subwoofer, utterly not set up(NO surround effect at all), and to top it off the blu ray player was set up incorrectly
so the amazing uncompresed dts-ma 5.1 in the blu ray disc wasn't even coming in as 5.1,
but a 2.0 The YSP then turned it out with Dolby Prologic 2.
And this is what people, buyers are hearing. That is just insane.
I think Yamaha and Mitusubishi should pay you and I to go around the country and set their things up properly!
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post #240 of 590 Old 01-14-2011, 10:36 PM
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Ok, ok Unisen bros I got it. Now I may consider one for my bedroom now but what about the living room with a front projector? can't buy a 50" just for the sound...it's too bad if it is truly good as you guys say then Mits should come out with their own sound bars if they are that good.

Davyo did you go into the subwoofer floor or does anyone know where the CES subwoofer report is at? anything cool or worth talking about with subs for next year?
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