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post #91 of 215 Old 02-24-2012, 05:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Don Landis View Post

That's because Cameron understands how stereography works. The formula for positioning an object in the z axis doesn't change based on how big the screen is or how close you sit to a screen. It's kind of like the aspect ratio where a 16 x 9 screen is 16 x 9 whether it is 160 ft. wide by 90 ft tall or 160 inches wide by 90 inches tall. Parallax z-axis positioning is a relative position based on a pyramidal cone where each corner of the base of the cone is an imaginary line from that corner to the center of your head where the apex of the cone passes through each eye lens, to be precise. Objects will always appear to be larger the closer they are, therefore an object must be quite small to be seen inside the frustum of the cone. If it's size extends beyond it will appear cut off. This is why a large image like a car cannot get too close or it will appear chopped off while a sword or cue stick can reach out and poke you in the face. An object will never extend outside that frustum and never pass to your side and behind you. It doesn't matter whether you are watching a big IMAX screen or a little 24" screen. The position is relative to the size of the screen and your distance to the screen. So, if you see an object that is located popout 50% between you and the screen in the theater, it will still be 50% distance on your 32" 3D monitor at home. Comfort zone- This will vary for different individuals but sitting too close to fill your peripheral vision will greatly reduce the popout effect distance, however it will increase eye strain because your eyes will be focusing attention to greatly diverged images, relative to sitting further away where the cone of vision has a narrower angle. A 60 degree angle on the cone is about maximum for 3D stereography.

What may need adjusting for the home theater vs. the big screen is camera motion as shaky cam on a big screen is far more jarring than on a small screen. In 3D this difference becomes even more annoying. Directors need to listen to the people to find out what they feel comfortable with. Personally, I find shooting 3D far more critical as to scene movement and transitions. Too fast and it can cause the 3D effect to come unglued so to speak. It's a tricky juggling act. We really don't know yet how the audience will react to many of the things they accepted in 2D when watching 3D.


If you want to really understand how this works, Get a copy of the text 3D Movie Making by Mendiburu. He has lots of drawings to go with the formulas that explain it all.

Thank you for this post. Very informative. *edit* I read it the first time but after rereading 8 months later it made much more sense.
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post #92 of 215 Old 02-24-2012, 06:21 AM
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Originally Posted by kkpro View Post

Hands down for me is Journey to the Center of the Earth. It had more in your face 3-D than anything I have yet to see. This is a good thing, because the movie could not stand on its own merits with out the effect. The sound was top notch also.
I wish more 3-D could be like this. This is what I think of when some one mentions 3-D. The rest is OK to look at but I would rather watch the 2-D version of a lot of movies. Journey is definetly a demo disc for me.

I just got it yesterday and watched about 15 minutes and the pop outs are awesome. Thanks for the recommendation.
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post #93 of 215 Old 02-26-2012, 06:42 AM
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I am having problems with pop outs on my 1 month old 73" Mitsubishi WD-73c11. I have the Panasonic bdt210 and Dimensional Optics active shutter glasses, I sit around 10 feet away from the tv. The depth on my TV is awesome but the pop outs hardly break the screen. I have watched several movies that should have significant popout (resident evil: afterlife, Avatar, etc...) but nothing really breaks the plane. I adjusted the pop out level on the player to max but it hardly helped. I went to best buy and watched the Potato Cod on a 50" screen and had no problem seeing that pop out and almost touch me in the face. My question is what settings can I adjust to fix this? I know I have a problem, but when I research this, all I see are people saying check your settings, but I have no idea WHAT to check. Any help is appreciated as this is quite frustrating.
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post #94 of 215 Old 02-26-2012, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by buonforte View Post

As far back as the 50's when people went to see 3D movies at the theater, they did so for the fun and excitement of something poping out of the screen and into their face. It caused them to duck, scream, jump out of their seat but most importantly, it was fun.

Flash forward to today. We have advanced technology and can have our own 3D theaters in our homes. BUT...we want good 3D movies! Nobody cares about depth. Yes, it's nice but most people want in your face 3D. Watching a 3D movie should, for the most part, take place outside of your TV screen and in your living room. Isn't that what 3D stands for, a third dimension. A dimension that extends beyond the TV and into your living room.

Only a handful of movies at this point can do that. Sammy's Adventure does it best, in my opinion.

So, to the movie studios: make 3D fun and exciting. We don't need conversions of old titles that will never look that good anyway. We want the reason for buying a 3D TV. The 3rd dimension. the out of the screen and in your living room experience. Depth is nice but it is NOT 3D.

I enjoy the 3D pop outs too. But, most of the 50 3-D films released between 1952-1952 did not have a lot of out-of-the-screen scenes. Columbia had the most - (FORT TI, CHARGE AT FEATHER RIVER, MAN IN THE DARK, SPOOKS).
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post #95 of 215 Old 02-26-2012, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by rmag119 View Post

I am having problems with pop outs on my 1 month old 73" Mitsubishi WD-73c11. I have the Panasonic bdt210 and Dimensional Optics active shutter glasses, I sit around 10 feet away from the tv. The depth on my TV is awesome but the pop outs hardly break the screen. I have watched several movies that should have significant popout (resident evil: afterlife, Avatar, etc...) but nothing really breaks the plane. I adjusted the pop out level on the player to max but it hardly helped. I went to best buy and watched the Potato Cod on a 50" screen and had no problem seeing that pop out and almost touch me in the face. My question is what settings can I adjust to fix this? I know I have a problem, but when I research this, all I see are people saying check your settings, but I have no idea WHAT to check. Any help is appreciated as this is quite frustrating.

Have you tried watching the potato cod (under the sea imax) on your TV?

I have the same issue where I see very little pop out in most movies that others have said our great (like Resident Evil Afterlife). But I bought Under the Sea and the potato cod scene looks just as great on my TV (Sony HX800 55") as it did at Best Buy.

So I'm just more confused than ever.
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post #96 of 215 Old 02-27-2012, 07:42 AM
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You can just look at that Potato COD scene as an excellent way to verify your system can produce pop out correctly (no reason it shouldn't) and look for any cross-talk or other issues (hopefully there aren't any). Pausing it will allow you to check different seating positions to find the best and worse positions. From there, any movies without that much pop out you'll know were made that way. For me, most have about a foot or so at their extreme with most depth inward. James Cameron's "good 3D" appears to hold mostly to those ideals: calling TF3 good too. I'm trying to explain this to the family and friends I mentioned in earlier posts about the inward 3D. Still, it's frustrating to have someone come over to watch TF3 or some other movie and put on the glasses (holding them with their hands adjusting them and flipping them up and back down over their eyes) saying "I don't know, I don't see it". I think from now on that I'll just show them the Potato Cod scene, scenes from Journey to the Center of the Earth and call it a day. :-)


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post #97 of 215 Old 02-27-2012, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by johnny905 View Post

Have you tried watching the potato cod (under the sea imax) on your TV?

I have the same issue where I see very little pop out in most movies that others have said our great (like Resident Evil Afterlife). But I bought Under the Sea and the potato cod scene looks just as great on my TV (Sony HX800 55") as it did at Best Buy.

So I'm just more confused than ever.

I have REA and can't remember any pop outs. Avatar is a 3D movie that is about depth and not pop out. Besides Under The Sea, try Final Destination 3D (snake coming out), Final Destination 5 3D and Monsters vs. Aliens.
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post #98 of 215 Old 02-27-2012, 09:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wesley Hester View Post

You can just look at that Potato COD scene as an excellent way to verify your system can produce pop out correctly (no reason it shouldn't) and look for any cross-talk or other issues (hopefully there aren't any). Pausing it will allow you to check different seating positions to find the best and worse positions. From there, any movies without that much pop out you'll know were made that way. For me, most have about a foot or so at their extreme with most depth inward. James Cameron's "good 3D" appears to hold mostly to those ideals: calling TF3 good too. I'm trying to explain this to the family and friends I mentioned in earlier posts about the inward 3D. Still, it's frustrating to have someone come over to watch TF3 or some other movie and put on the glasses (holding them with their hands adjusting them and flipping them up and back down over their eyes) saying "I don't know, I don't see it". I think from now on that I'll just show them the Potato Cod scene, scenes from Journey to the Center of the Earth and call it a day. :-)

Can someone post what minute/second the infamous Potato Cod scene is in Under the Sea? I just received this 3D Bluray and don't have time to watch the whole thing but do want to go straight to the infamous Potato Cod scene.
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post #99 of 215 Old 02-28-2012, 07:24 AM
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Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post

Can someone post what minute/second the infamous Potato Cod scene is in Under the Sea? I just received this 3D Bluray and don't have time to watch the whole thing but do want to go straight to the infamous Potato Cod scene.

Don't know the minute/second off hand, but it is only a couple (maybe one?) of chapter skips into the movie (even though it's actually towards the end of the movie). Just chapter skip until you see an above water shot of dark rough waters. From there it's only a minute or two before there will be a fish staring you in the face.

This is the only scene that has actually "wowed" me similar to the first time I saw 3D at Disney. Sure there are some other good scenes/movies, but this is the only one that made me stop, rewind, and watch over and over. It's proof that great 3D can be had at home.
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post #100 of 215 Old 02-28-2012, 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted by ray105 View Post

Don't know the minute/second off hand, but it is only a couple (maybe one?) of chapter skips into the movie (even though it's actually towards the end of the movie). Just chapter skip until you see an above water shot of dark rough waters. From there it's only a minute or two before there will be a fish staring you in the face.

This is the only scene that has actually "wowed" me similar to the first time I saw 3D at Disney. Sure there are some other good scenes/movies, but this is the only one that made me stop, rewind, and watch over and over. It's proof that great 3D can be had at home.

The snake scene from Final Destination is just as good. It scared my granddaughter to tears. I also showed ot to some ladies who were at our house for a baby shower. They had never seen 3D before and they got so involved that they ended up watching the whole movie. It made me smile at the joy they got from watching that scene and others.
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post #101 of 215 Old 02-28-2012, 08:35 AM
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I just got out my carpenter's tape measure and checked the amount of pop-out of the potato cod fish.

I paused the movie at the peak of the pop-out; just after Jim Carey said "get" in the line "let's face it, when you're a cod you need all the help you can get". That's around 21:00 minutes into the film.

My eyes were 66" from the screen and the cod's nose was 24" from my eyes. So that means the cod came out 42" from the screen; or 64%.

BTW - The TV is a Sharp 835U with a Panasonic BDT210 Blu-ray player. I changed active shutter glasses from the Sharp model that came with the TV to the iTrek and the pop-out distance did not change.
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post #102 of 215 Old 02-28-2012, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by jbug View Post

The snake scene from Final Destination is just as good. It scared my granddaughter to tears. I also showed ot to some ladies who were at our house for a baby shower. They had never seen 3D before and they got so involved that they ended up watching the whole movie. It made me smile at the joy they got from watching that scene and others.

Was this the original Final Destination or the new part 5? I might have to pick up this title.
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post #103 of 215 Old 02-28-2012, 09:54 PM
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Originally Posted by WynsWrld98 View Post

Can someone post what minute/second the infamous Potato Cod scene is in Under the Sea? I just received this 3D Bluray and don't have time to watch the whole thing but do want to go straight to the infamous Potato Cod scene.

20m:58s

http://3d-tv-gaming.blogspot.com/201...t-moments.html
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post #104 of 215 Old 02-28-2012, 09:57 PM
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Originally Posted by johnny905 View Post

20m:58s

http://3d-tv-gaming.blogspot.com/201...t-moments.html

Perfect, thanks so much!
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post #105 of 215 Old 03-01-2012, 01:19 AM
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Just after the 44 minute mark of Hugo, Sacha Baron Cohen's character leans toward Hugo, and on my TV his face definitely emerges out of the screen and into the room. I found it to be as impressive as the potato cod.
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post #106 of 215 Old 03-01-2012, 05:41 AM
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Just after the 44 minute mark of Hugo, Sacha Baron Cohen's character leans toward Hugo, and on my TV his face definitely emerges out of the screen and into the room. I found it to be as impressive as the potato cod.

That scene is an excellent example of how to use a pop-out effectively. It naturally brings out the emotion when a confrontational person invades your space and gets in your face.

It makes me think of other ways pop-outs can be used with a similar emotional reaction for the viewer; someone waving their finger inches away from your face, someone moving in close and screaming at you, etc. The TV screen defines the normal distance boundary, and the pop-out simulates someone crossing into your space; causing the brain to generate a natural reaction (annoyance, fear, anger, hostility, etc).
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post #107 of 215 Old 03-01-2012, 06:17 AM
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One thing that makes a big difference is how slow or fast the object breaks the plane and how long the object dallies when it is out. The codfish comes out slowly and therefore the effect much more immersive. The snake in FD 3 comes out quicker but lingers long enough for you to get something out of it. Objects that come out too fast and don't linger are less immersive.
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post #108 of 215 Old 03-01-2012, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by jbug View Post

One thing that makes a big difference is how slow or fast the object breaks the plane and how long the object dallies when it is out. The codfish comes out slowly and therefore the effect much more immersive. The snake in FD 3 comes out quicker but lingers long enough for you to get something out of it. Objects that come out too fast and don't linger are less immersive.

This is what I was trying to explain in another thread when discussing my disappointment with Sammy's Adventure. A lot of the pop-out was quick and some extended beyond the edge of the screen (which distracts me). I wonder if me having Lasik surgery has any effect on my ability to focus on quick objects coming out of the screen?

BTW jbug - you didn't say which Final Destination has this snake scene. I think only the first and the latest (number 5) are available on 3D blu-ray, correct?
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post #109 of 215 Old 03-01-2012, 07:53 AM
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Sorry Ray105 I meant to say FD 3D which is the 4th in the series and a fine representative for live action 3D with it's deep rich colors and nice pop outs as well as depth. I don't go looking for movies that show the numerous ways a person can die but these have nice 3D.
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post #110 of 215 Old 03-01-2012, 10:32 PM
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Holy 3D, Sammys Adventure 3D Bluray showed up today, AMAZING animation, some really great popouts and all of the depth and animation is A+. The people who did this need to be hired by Pixar and teach them how it's done.

I also saw the famous Potato Fish scene from Under the Sea, paused it and it looks like it's nose is 5' in front of the pause button on the screen.

Saw no ghosting whatsoever in any of this with my Epson 6010 with glasses set for highest lumens and in 3D Dynamic mode. Just incredible!!!!
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post #111 of 215 Old 03-12-2012, 08:14 PM
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I own almost every 3D blurays, The only two movie that have good in your face pop out effects.

1. A Turtle's Tale: Sammy's Adventures "best pop out of the screen period" The whole movie is pretty much in your face

2. Avatar "best 3D depth" "Anytime i have friends/family over I pop in the movie and show them the night scene where Jake and Neytiri running on the the tree branch, the part where a bunch of glowing flowers or whatever you call it, flying around and landing on Jake. I can see those all over the room out of the screen.

3. Journey to the center of the earth "It have good amount of pop out moments, like one of scene i can see water splash in my hometheater room. :-)

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post #112 of 215 Old 03-13-2012, 06:23 AM
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What about the snake in Final Destination 3D, the cod fish in one of those Imax features, and Susan's hand, and the paddle ball in Monsters vs Aliens to name a few. Those are among the best and well known.
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post #113 of 215 Old 03-14-2012, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by buonforte View Post

To further add confusion and dissapointment to the consumer, let's take the manufacturer's 3D TV ads. I've posted a few of them below. Every one of them shows a picture expanding beyond the screen. But in reality, that is not usually what you're going to get with the majority of the current crop of 3D movies. So, the customer doesn't really see what's being advertised on their sets like they thought they'd get in the picture and they certainly not going to spend 30 to 40 dollars of more for a 3D movie that falls short and doesn't live up to all the hoopla. So, 3D could fail unless studios start releasing quality out of the TV and in your Living Room 3D movies and at reasonable prices.

I dont want to rehash this topic and this is not an attack to your comment.

But I think you guys were forgetting something. The advertisements are done in 2D. How else would you expect them to simulate a 3D image on a 2D media? They cannot show depth or they cannot show "popout." They have to make that astronaut come out of the screen and pass the borders of the TV in order to show you this TV is 3D.

I am not affiliated with any manufacturer or ad companies.

I challenge someone to show the Potato Cod scene on a magazine ad
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post #114 of 215 Old 03-14-2012, 10:12 AM
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By the way, a great show off scene is the short movie they play at the and of Despicable Me. Where 2 of the minions are playing who can pop out of the screen further game

The ladder and the tape measure slapped me in the head a couple times
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post #115 of 215 Old 10-30-2012, 10:03 AM
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I too have been struggling getting pop out on my new panasonic ST50 Plasma. I found getting better depth by calibrating the display using the game mode. Suprisingly enough the game mode has better brightness than the custom mode and handles motion and crosstalk better.

I have screened a bunch of movies and the pop out is a bit lacking on this set. On my old sony bravia LED certain scenes in Avatar and Alice in Wonderland were floating in the room and poking you in the face. The TV is very good at the window effect. But not much actually pops out. Maybe very little. I am using a PS3 so perhaps using a real 3d player would yield different results. Just sharing my 2 cents.
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post #116 of 215 Old 10-30-2012, 04:57 PM
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Pop out -- At the end of Imax Space Station where the astronauts toss fruit at the camera and it floats out of the screen at you. There's a scene in M vs A where Susan has the ray gun and turns with it and it pops way out of the screen. Most movies have very little pop out -- I think the directors are showing a lot of restraint because of all the accusations about 3D and gimmicks. If used once in awhile I think the "pop out" is very effective. The "cod scene" is used in the stores as a demo all the time because it is one of the few effective "pop out" scenes and it wows.
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post #117 of 215 Old 10-31-2012, 01:41 AM
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Watch my Youtube 3D video on your TV and if you don't get popout from this your TV has problems!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wf97-rsZa_I

3D items I own:

Sony 46" LX900 active 3D set

Sony HMZ-T3 (Cushion pads and light blocker mod)

LG LW6500 passive 3D set

PS3 & PS4

Sony BDP-S570 BD3D player

JVC-GS-TD1 (with Cyclopital base extender)

Fujifilm W3

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Quadcopter + Zenmuse and GoPro Hero 3 (Filming...


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post #118 of 215 Old 11-08-2012, 01:41 AM
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I challenge someone to show the Potato Cod scene on a magazine ad

Easy, just make the picture inside a TV and have the image go beyond the TV screen. I've seen it in ads before and you get the idea that it's in 3D.



I think there just needs to be more popout 3D period. I am a little disappointed in not finding more. So far I've only seen it once, the potato cod. I have around 15 3D movies now. If there have been other scenes, they were just too fast to be noticed which means they weren't done right and I don't consider them pop out. When I bought my TV I expected to see it in every movie but I'm learning it just isn't done that much. I like it, I want more of it, I think if they're going to bother with 3D at all, every movie should have some popout effects. If not, I'll just get the 2D version.

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post #119 of 215 Old 11-08-2012, 04:54 AM
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Which 15 movies do you have? Some 3D movies don't have pop outs but most have at least some and others have lots of it.
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post #120 of 215 Old 11-08-2012, 08:51 AM
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