3D Demonstration Disc - Would you be interested? - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 134 Old 04-07-2014, 07:49 AM
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I'm currently looking at both PD and Vegas, I'll probably end up getting both, but neither are ideal for content distribution and I don't mean on high volume either, but with overall satisfactory results. Thanks for the link for the mvc encoder, I'll take a look at that. It's good to know there's development ongoing. I'll likely just have to bite the bullet and pony up at some point if I want it done right. The problem though, 2013 wasn't a great year for 3D, Visio has dropped it altogether, and other manufacturers aren't even mentioning 3D, just leaving it as a carry over feature. For small content distributors it's a larger gamble whether it will pay out. If the next step is to leave 3D off next year's models then 3D is a bust.

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post #32 of 134 Old 04-08-2014, 08:31 AM
 
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I think 3D TVs are getting downplayed in the crossover to 4K video. Who knows, though, it's so arguable and saddening to see no new 3D cameras coming our way. I cherish my Fuji W3 and Panasonic 3D1 more now than in the past. I also have a Sony TD10, but it's such a brick to carry around for casual photo taking.

As for the PD12 and Vegas Pro (or Movie Studio 13), my biggest headache (literally) has been trying to render panned video properly to avoid the judder. I now hold my cameras very steady and do not pan much, but in the past I was all over the place before I realized how bad it was. And, this was done for some of my most prized travel moments in Germany. Watching the clips on my monitor were okay in 2D, but when I finally got around to producing a 3D bluray with MS 13 or PD12, the video has awful judder in 3D. I've spent hours trying different settings, stabilizing, etc., but nothing works. Alas, I'm giving up. The stills are nice, though
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post #33 of 134 Old 04-08-2014, 09:06 AM - Thread Starter
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My personal opinion on 3D - and I'm talking content for commercial distribution such as 3D movies for home viewing. Whom ever is responsible to market and and promote these things had done a terrible job. They could had build a nice additional revenue source for movies and equipment, but no one cared or they really are inept. A considerable number of consumers have 3D TVs and players and they have never tried it or know enough about it. Mos people would tell you -- I just hear is terrible, and you look stupid with those glasses. Even the so called experts don't know enough about 3D.

Now for the consumer type of enthusiast, the one that would like to have 3D cameras, 3D editing software, 3D authoring software etc. There is almost nothing out there, and the software that is out there is limited in one way or another.

There are free tools that do all these, but require a deep learning curve, and most of us just want to be able to shoot, edit and enjoy.

I believe 3D will be here for along time, but will be limited to the true enthusiast, and of course -- the more limited it is, the more expensive it gets. mad.gif

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post #34 of 134 Old 04-08-2014, 09:46 AM
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With 24p in general, panning has to be very gradual. If you want quick panning, 60p is great for that. With 3D, Vegas might be the only solution since it offers the highest bit rate that I've seen yet. From what i've read here from users experiences about PD, it's a very buggy app, the bit rate is unacceptably low and is prone to crash during burning. It offers 3D menus which only appear to work with the built in templates, not custom ones. I can live without the menus, as long as the bit rate is there. If the image is poor then who really cares about a 3D menu? So after all that, I can't really see any reason to buy it even for only 75.00. It is another 3D tool, but one that really needs some improvement before I'd invest any time in it.

I've got two days of shooting this weekend. I'll be taking both my Z10K and 3DA1 and my Bogan tripod and try to get some decent steady shots. I'll have the wide angle on the 3DA1 for most of the day. I'm still really interested to see how well these two look on Blu ray once all is said and done. The imaging straight out of the 3DA1 with it's dedicated 21-24 mbps per eye is vastly superior to the Z10K, but with the same mvc output bit rate it may not be as clear or sharp as from the card.

Getting back to distribution for small production studio. I would gladly pay between 3 and 8K to author 3D Blu rays with 3D menus but from what I'm finding, there just isn't anything out there and not anytime soon. Most likely Sony will keep it catered to big studios and 3D interest will dry up altogether before we're able to author something with quality and a pro look. With 2D there is Indie support at less than 10K, actually less than 5K for Blu ray, but not for 3D. 3D does have the potential to stick around and the tech will likely merge into something else, so keeping content available will always be beneficial for the future. But without support? I really don't see it. You'll only have a few die hards out there for personal home use. I think now is the time for either a price reduction on their existing tools for pro support or a slimmed-down Indie version at less than 10K.

Any progress on the Demo? What's your ETA for release on this?

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post #35 of 134 Old 04-08-2014, 10:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomtastic View Post

...

Any progress on the Demo? What's your ETA for release on this?

There is no set ETA. But it'll get done.

I have some 3D renderings for the menus, but had not tested them yet, since details for the menus need to be worked out before I spend too much time on menus that need to be redone, so menus are partially worked out. I have so far 12 3D reference type of clips but need at least another 12 or so. In process, and slowly working.

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post #36 of 134 Old 04-08-2014, 11:06 AM
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I'd definitely be interested in the demo, not just for the 3D material but just to see how your finished product works on disc with menu. Aside from PD and commercial software I didn't think it possible. I look forward to hearing your progress!

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post #37 of 134 Old 04-08-2014, 06:50 PM
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Very good and practical idea
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post #38 of 134 Old 04-14-2014, 06:54 PM
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Hey Superleo!

I would be very interested in a 3D demo disc.

Your last two projects were excellent.

How about another get together at Bjorn's "Ultimate Room" once the disc is completed?

The last meet up was fun smile.gif

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk
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post #39 of 134 Old 04-16-2014, 09:13 AM
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I am interested. If the download is torrent based I'll even leave a seed up for the foreseeable future.

I have to check what I have for burning the disc. I may only have a single layer burner. Ever since going to yearly subscribed automatic online back-ups burning discs has been low on my priority list.
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post #40 of 134 Old 04-17-2014, 07:46 PM
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Yes! I use "GRAVITY 3D" to demo for friends. Indeed a demo disc is a good idea.
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post #41 of 134 Old 05-07-2014, 11:59 AM
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Subscribed ! I love your work ! It's outstanding ! And where can i get your "Cinemascope Blu-Ray Demonstration Disc" ! Thx a lot !
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post #42 of 134 Old 05-07-2014, 12:03 PM
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I should have a 3d demo disc ready in a few days time it won't be up to the standard that super leo's will be but will be a half decent stop gap until his is ready smile.gif
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Please Visit My 11.2 3D Home Cinema Shed http://www.readersheds.co.uk/share.cfm?SHARESHED=2744 as featured in home cinema choice magazine! Check out my blu-ray THX WOW! demo disc here
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post #43 of 134 Old 05-07-2014, 01:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tangcoma View Post

Subscribed ! I love your work ! It's outstanding ! And where can i get your "Cinemascope Blu-Ray Demonstration Disc" ! Thx a lot !

http://www.demo-world.eu/forums/topic/1668/cinemascope-bluray-demo-disc/

Post 6 towards the bottom you'll find the torrent link. You need to register to be able to save the link.

And thank you for the compliment.

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post #44 of 134 Old 05-08-2014, 12:26 AM
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This is a great idea. I'd suggest the countdown intro from the Imax docs and Madagascar 3, I use them for my demos all the time. Some classic 3d like Creature From The Black Lagoon or House Of Wax, too would be nice.
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post #45 of 134 Old 05-14-2014, 02:12 PM
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I'm 'ALL IN' for this idea!!!
I LOVE 3D in my theater and a demo disc would be GREAT to have if it was SBS based.
I will also happily seed it for quite a while!!
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post #46 of 134 Old 05-14-2014, 02:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by domz777 View Post

I'm 'ALL IN' for this idea!!!
I LOVE 3D in my theater and a demo disc would be GREAT to have if it was SBS based.
I will also happily seed it for quite a while!!

As in the prior demo discs, the idea is to have untouched audio and video, thus it would be a MVC video format, the same as a commercial type discs.

The MVC format is actually the encoded portion of the 3D video inside a m2ts file. It will have a BDMV structure with a STREAM and SSIF folders, just like a regular commercial disc.

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post #47 of 134 Old 05-14-2014, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superleo View Post

As in the prior demo discs, the idea is to have untouched audio and video, thus it would be a MVC video format, the same as a commercial type discs.

The MVC format is actually the encoded portion of the 3D video inside a m2ts file. It will have a BDMV structure with a STREAM and SSIF folders, just like a regular commercial disc.

Your past work has been fantastic, so I'm sure whatever you do will be amazing, and ENORMOUSLY appreciated by pretty much everyone.
You should run for public office, you'd be a shoe in!! Hand out demo discs instead of buttons, you'll be making laws in a week LOL biggrin.gifbiggrin.gifbiggrin.gif
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post #48 of 134 Old 05-15-2014, 06:32 AM
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does anyone know if there is any possible way to perform any of this archiving on a MAC? I was going to install Windows 8 on a partition on my new iMac but don't know if I want to allocate that much of my SSD to that right now. I would love to just be able to do it on my mac but through all my investigations it doesn't seem this is possible.
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post #49 of 134 Old 05-15-2014, 06:44 AM
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it will work on the Mac for storing the files. You can probably burn it to disc using Dvd Fab.

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post #50 of 134 Old 05-15-2014, 06:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomtastic View Post

it will work on the Mac for storing the files. You can probably burn it to disc using Dvd Fab.

i will give that a shot. I also have Adobe Encore, I just started playing around with it. I wonder if that can burn 3d?
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post #51 of 134 Old 05-15-2014, 07:01 AM - Thread Starter
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In order to burn a Bluray, 3D or 2D, the burning software needs to be able to use UDF 2.5. There is FREE software for Macs that do this. There is a HOW-TO in the Reference 2 Demo Disc thread that someone (can't remember who) posted on what software to use and how to do it.

Is not the type of files is the type of file system that is used for the BD players to recognized the files.

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post #52 of 134 Old 05-15-2014, 12:23 PM - Thread Starter
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I found mookieb post regarding software for the mac.


Originally Posted by mookie b View Post

Total Newbie here to bit torrent and all of this stuff. Leo was nice enough to give me a little private tutoring via PM and BAM it worked tonight on my first try burning. I'm using a fairly new Mac and thought I'd pass out what I did if there's anyone else like me that's "never done this before".


My Blu Ray player is an Oppo BDP-93.


First off, I found using Google Chrome to download the files worked better than Apple's Safari as Safari was saving the Target files as a text file. Chrome left it as a torrent file.


After that, I downloaded uTorrent at:
http://www.utorrent.com/downloads/mac

Used that program to download the big torrent files related to the downloaded target file.

They download as .rar files. From there I downloaded UnRarX at:
http://unrarx.en.softonic.com/mac

Used that to extract them to useable files for the burning.


Mac's default burning software as far as I can tell didn't have an option for UDF so I have no idea if it would do it correctly. I don't think so, but maybe. Anyway, I gambled and downloaded a burning program that ended up working so lucky me. Burn Program was at:
http://burn-osx.sourceforge.net/Pages/English/home.html


Selected "DVD (UDF)" as the option at the top, dragged the BDMV folder from the extracted RAR files to the Burn program window and that was it. I used a Verbatim DVD+R DL at 6x burning speed. Threw the finished product in the oppo, Menu screen popped right up.


I only did the LFE one, as the animation one is on my work computer and I did this LFE one at home. My son and I had a kick out of the bass scenes, and it was fun to see a few I hadn't seen the movie but had read on here people recognized the scene as good for LFE.


All in all, thanks Leo. Easy, painless and fun. Nice touch too with the Avatar THX trailer playing as the background menu, DTS-HD MA and all!

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post #53 of 134 Old 05-15-2014, 01:20 PM
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i have successfully burned BD's using Adobe Encore with no problems at all (after sketchy results with Toast). i use Make MKV to extract material and Handbrake to re-encode for burning scenes for compilation. I know none of this will work for 3d.

I still have yet to find any clues about extracting the 3d file on a mac... i was interested in helping to compile the best-of 3d disc straight from the sources, i'm not at all interested in burning 3d content downloaded from the internet.

I will look at those other programs mentioned above, though - and report my results!!
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post #54 of 134 Old 05-15-2014, 03:17 PM
 
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Try TSmuxer
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post #55 of 134 Old 05-15-2014, 04:45 PM
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If you just want to extract 3D from a Blu ray disc, use DVD Fab's 3D ripper, only it will be in side by side half resolution. You will have to set your screen to side by side. I was never happy with it for watching 3D from Blu ray so I don't use it anymore. The quality loss plus and it also creates a large overlap on the left and right side of my screen. All side by side does for some reason, doesn't appear to be a way to adjust it. But for editing all of those together, you might be able to use mkvmerge, I haven't tried it on 3D stuff, only 2D. My guess is, it wouldn't work or it won't recognize the file.

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post #56 of 134 Old 05-15-2014, 04:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superleo View Post

In order to burn a Bluray, 3D or 2D, the burning software needs to be able to use UDF 2.5. There is FREE software for Macs that do this. There is a HOW-TO in the Reference 2 Demo Disc thread that someone (can't remember who) posted on what software to use and how to do it.

Is not the type of files is the type of file system that is used for the BD players to recognized the files.


How's the 3D demo coming along? Are you doing this on Mac or Windows? I've been shooting some 3D for the past few weeks and would love to get a higher bit rate for my content, since my camera captures each left/right frame separately at 21 abr, so a 40 abr mvc would be great.

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post #57 of 134 Old 05-16-2014, 07:02 AM - Thread Starter
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The 3D demo disc is moving along, very slowly though but progress is being made.

I use windows software for everything that is needed, but there is mac software that would do the same. For example, there are ripping software for mac, TsMuxer has a mac version, the menus are created in Photoshop, you get the idea.

The disc will be an identical copy of the original -- MVC high bit rate. smile.gif

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post #58 of 134 Old 05-17-2014, 08:50 AM
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I would be very interested in a 3D demo disc.

 

Although I have the latest Power Director and use it for home movies from our Sony HD Camera, I don't have the experience to demux and re-author in 3D. A long time ago (in my Pinnacle Days - it was bad software I used and grumbled about for 5 years...but that's another story) I made a greatest hits package from some of the DVD Concerts I have. It too was impressive to those I showed it to, but a Blu-ray full of cool 3D clips would be awesome!

 

As far as downloading a 25 Gig file, I hope someplace could host it, or place it on Rapidgator (we have an account).  This looks like an interesting project.
 


Regards,


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post #59 of 134 Old 06-18-2014, 11:57 PM
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Any news for us? I could loan you Madagascar3 or an IMAX title for the excellent intro if you're interested. These two are my demo scenes. Thanks really looking forwards to this.
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post #60 of 134 Old 06-19-2014, 07:41 AM - Thread Starter
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I've divided the disc in two segments, live action and animated scenes to give the disc some organization and an easier way to navigate. So far I have 6 animated demo worthy clips and 6 live action clips, although one of the live action I'm not to sure about.

I would like to add two or so more clips per segment if possible.

As far as the menus go, I'm waiting for some "very nice" home theater pictures from a member so I can render these for 3D and use them as backgrounds.

There is progress being mad, just at a very slow pace.

Thanks for the offer DeepSky, I'll send you a PM.

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