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post #2041 of 2067 Old 08-05-2014, 05:05 PM
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I looked at one of the ABC warehouse displays

I was working out of town in an area and the closest store was just down the street

First off...appearance looked good and the guy told me up front they had all the accessories
It was "marked" $3419
I asked him if that was the price...he said "no"...and went to the back
5 minutes later he walked out with a sheet of paper and told me $2650..and that he would sell me the 5 year warranty that was normally $699 for 50% off...:-)
While he was talking I was playing with the control and checking for IR/burn
They were playing some golf with scores along the bottom

There was some slight IR from the golf scores...but from my ownership experience Panasonic panels have more tendancy for IR than Samsung
So..I would say what I saw was temporary as it was very light and just across the bottom 2 inches u or so
While I was playing with the remote he went down $200

I told him thanks and said I noticed that several stores had displays left so I was going to check around
He said wait and wanted me to talk to another guy
They raiased up the sales pressure a bit and I told them I was just looking...they pushed a little harder and said they were at their bottom line
Then I went into work negotiation mode and asked him why a person would buy this TV for more( including tax) than Amazon was selling it for 7 months ago?.($2400 landed on my door step)
I then went into the prices that Amazon was charging, in January, on the VT and ZT....$1999 and $2399
They seemed to know what I was talking about. Price came down to $2000 and he stopped pushing the $699 5 year warranty at 50% off

"if" I was interested I would have offered $1700 and been prepared to pay $1800....the same price I paid for my display F8500 8 months ago
I consider the F8500 and ZT to be on the same level...with both having their pluses and minuses and depending on specific needs

BUT....if the had thrown out something like $1500

I would say I would have been very tempted
The ZT is definitely more of a dark room movie watchers TV than the F8500...however for all around I still prefer the F8500
IMO..for bright sporting events and lit rooms it is like no other
But who knows...if they get crazy low on these prices, and the TV is in good shape, I may have to see where I can put a ZT in the house..lol

YIKES....its like when I was younger bringing stray dogs home

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post #2042 of 2067 Old 08-05-2014, 05:22 PM
 
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Originally Posted by turnne1 View Post
dont think so

I can open blinds completely near the TV...and have done so just to test

The F8500 is "LED like" in its ability to watchable in bright conditions
That's because it has a higher brightness baseline. The filter preserves CR on the low end better than the F8500. This was based on my observation of the 2013 shootout where the ZT maintained its low end the best, but this was again with ambient lighting, not sunlight.
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post #2043 of 2067 Old 08-05-2014, 05:31 PM
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That's because it has a higher brightness baseline. The filter preserves CR on the low end better than the F8500. This was based on my observation of the 2013 shootout where the ZT maintained its low end the best, but this was again with ambient lighting, not sunlight.
the lower end meaning darkness...LOL

there was a reason the F8500 won the audience overall award

dont get me wrong...if I had a dark room...ZT all the way

In a room with any light...and I say it again...sporting events
The F8500 is definitely the best all around for my all around viewing style

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post #2044 of 2067 Old 08-06-2014, 12:36 AM
 
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I hear you loud and clear, my only argument is with the degree of ambient light.
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post #2045 of 2067 Old 08-06-2014, 04:12 AM
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I hear you loud and clear, my only argument is with the degree of ambient light.
yes...that one table lamp, with one 40 watt bulb, is a game changer...

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post #2046 of 2067 Old 08-06-2014, 06:47 AM
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Originally Posted by turnne1 View Post
yes...that one table lamp, with one 40 watt bulb, is a game changer...

Warren
The F8500 vs ZT topic has been discussed to death on these forums. I do not think that this thread is a right place for this discussion. To avoid rehashing the same old arguments, here is a fairly recent thread on the subject including a several posts by yours truly (posts 2904 and up).

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post #2047 of 2067 Old 08-06-2014, 10:09 AM
 
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^It isn't but some live for the argument. That link didn't take me to your post, so I'll link it directly: F8500.. OR .. ZT60 ?????
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Originally Posted by turnne1 View Post
yes...that one table lamp, with one 40 watt bulb, is a game changer...
No way, that won't make the ZT break a sweat and is actually the kind of ambient lighting where the ZT will shine, controlled and minimal.
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post #2048 of 2067 Old 08-06-2014, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by SwiftSweeper View Post
The F8500 vs ZT topic has been discussed to death on these forums. I do not think that this thread is a right place for this discussion. To avoid rehashing the same old arguments, here is a fairly recent thread on the subject including a several posts by yours truly (posts 2904 and up).
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^It isn't but some live for the argument. That link didn't take me to your post, so I'll link it directly: F8500.. OR .. ZT60 ?????

No way, that won't make the ZT break a sweat and is actually the kind of ambient lighting where the ZT will shine, controlled and minimal.
well....then I guess I wont leave the light on in that 40 watt( or lower wattage) lamp and make the ZT sweat...

All kidding aside...this is an extremely subjective type of back and forth and it all boils down to preference
They are different animals

reminds me of me and friends who have gotten into "spirited" conversations over which automobile is superior...BMW or Mercedes
I have owned both and respect both...but I am more of a Mercedes guy
I have some friends who have the opposite opinion
So we have our back and forth

Long story short...if I could not have a Mercedes then I would want a BMW....anything other than that( sans an Audi maybe) would be highly not preferred

Ditto with these Tv's...if for some reason I could not get an F8500...then the ZT would be the go to TV for me...(and maybe the VT)...anything else would be highly not preferred

I do have respect for some items that are a very good value...the LG Plasmas...Hyundai Genesis and Equus

I would also like to see if someone can get one of these 65" displays that is in good shape at ABC for under $1500

I bet someone will

The person who is even interested in those Tv's..I bet..is a rarity in their store

They had to find it for me yesterday and it was in a corner hidden behind some LED's


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post #2049 of 2067 Old 08-06-2014, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by wandering_star View Post
^It isn't but some live for the argument. That link didn't take me to your post, so I'll link it directly: F8500.. OR .. ZT60 ?????

No way, that won't make the ZT break a sweat and is actually the kind of ambient lighting where the ZT will shine, controlled and minimal.
Your link takes me to page 30 in that thread. My posts start at post #2904 on page 97 in that thread. I do not know how to link directly to my post, and I feel that linking to the thread page provides better context anyway.

I agree with you. ZT performs very well in a bright room. My room has a large side window with plenty of sunshine during a day (I live in Houston after all), and ZT looks phenomenal. I also have a bias light on constantly. The TV does not need to be overly bright because it preserves blacks and combats reflections very well due to its excellent filter. Plus, one can calibrate ZT in High panel brightness (45-55 fl) with minimum sacrifice to the picture. The shootout was held before Chad B discovered the High panel brightness method.

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post #2050 of 2067 Old 08-06-2014, 01:20 PM
 
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^I see the problem. I'm using the 100 posts per page setting so the thread has much fewer pages than can be seen on your end. This may work better: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/167-pl...l#post24517037
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post #2051 of 2067 Old 08-06-2014, 02:15 PM
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^I see the problem. I'm using the 100 posts per page setting so the thread has much fewer pages than can be seen on your end. This may work better: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/167-pl...l#post24517037
It works now. Thanks
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post #2052 of 2067 Old 08-07-2014, 08:39 AM
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I recently bought a display model for about 1850 plus tax. All the accessories were there. I probably could have done better, but I didn't really try. That was the first price they said and I basically said "gimme now.. where can I go pay?" The display has around 3000 hours on it, and looked pretty good. The store looks like it runs TV or movie feeds all day, so I can't imagine there will be any significant issues. I was just surprised to see it still there this late in the game, given how any Panasonic plasma has basically become unobtainium for a reasonable price. Had an old LG plasma before, so this should be a nice upgrade. Decided it was stupid for the TV to be worth a fraction of the stuff it was hooked up to...

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post #2053 of 2067 Old 08-07-2014, 08:47 AM
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I recently bought a display model for about 1850 plus tax. All the accessories were there. I probably could have done better, but I didn't really try. That was the first price they said and I basically said "gimme now.. where can I go pay?" The display has around 3000 hours on it, and looked pretty good. The store looks like it runs TV or movie feeds all day, so I can't imagine there will be any significant issues. I was just surprised to see it still there this late in the game, given how any Panasonic plasma has basically become unobtainium for a reasonable price. Had an old LG plasma before, so this should be a nice upgrade. Decided it was stupid for the TV to be worth a fraction of the stuff it was hooked up to...
If you don't mind sharing, where are you located?
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post #2054 of 2067 Old 08-07-2014, 12:08 PM
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If you don't mind sharing, where are you located?
I'm in MI/IN/OH area where abc warehouse still has about 20 floor models, each with probably 3000 hours or so on it. You do have to deal with more aggressive 5 yr $600 extended warranty shilling than any decent human being should ever have to handle. I can't fathom how that makes sense on a TV that has already worked fine for 3000+ hours and is not replaceable anyway. Their sales guys make the NY guys look like a bunch of panty-waisted pikers, and they've been at it for decades. So far as I know, they all make commission and some of them can make quite a bit if they're any good at it. I remember going there 25 years ago.. they had a big chest high square sales corral in the middle of the store, with 7-8 sales guys standing around waiting, all sitting there chain smoking into overflowing ashtrays hawking teevees and hifis. Only thing that has changed is the ash trays are gone and the sales guys chain 'em up outside. If you haven't been in a good, old-fashioned high pressure electronics store before, you'll be sitting there going, "Seriously, what just happened? What was that insansity? Why were there four eerily helpful, generally knowledgeable, but clearly half nuts people chasing me around this store?" We buy stuff there all the time because it's kind of fun if you're up for it. Still, they will bargain, they are authorized dealers, and you will get what you wanted probably less than anywhere outside of some grey market mail order shyster shop. If it's a fixed price item, they'll toss a refrigerator in your trunk just to get you buy something. Why they put one of these televisions in every store is anyone's best guess.

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post #2055 of 2067 Old 08-07-2014, 01:09 PM
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I'm in MI/IN/OH area were abc warehouse still has about 20 floor models, each with probably 3000 hours or so on it. You do have to deal with more aggressive 5 yr $600 extended warranty shilling than any decent human being should ever have to handle. I can't fathom how that makes sense on a TV that has already worked fine for 3000+ hours and is not replaceable anyway. Their sales guys make the NY guys look like a bunch of panty-waisted pikers, and they've been at it for decades. So far as I know, they all make commission and some of them can make quite a bit if they're any good at it. I remember going there 25 years ago.. they had a big chest high square sales corral in the middle of the store, with 7-8 sales guys standing around waiting, all sitting there chain smoking into overflowing ashtrays hawking teevees and hifis. Only think that has changed is the ash trays are gone and the sales guys chain 'em up outside. If you haven't been in a good, old-fashioned high pressure electronics store before, you'll be sitting there going, "Seriously, what just happened? What was that insansity? Why were there four eerily helpful, generally knowledgeable, but clearly half nuts people chasing me around this store?" We buy stuff there all the time because it's kind of fun if you're up for it. Still, they will bargain, they are authorized dealers, and you will get what you wanted probably less than anywhere outside of some grey market mail order shyster shop. If it's a fixed price item, they'll toss a refrigerator in your trunk just to get you buy something. Why they put one of these televisions in every store is anyone's best guess.
I've visited a few of those stores recently, and spoken to several of them on the phone. I'm hoping to find a display set in decent shape for a decent price. I've been quoted some decent prices, but finding a set in good condition seems to be the challenge. Some definitely seem to be in better shape than others.
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post #2056 of 2067 Old 08-08-2014, 02:39 PM
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I'm in MI/IN/OH area where abc warehouse still has about 20 floor models, each with probably 3000 hours or so on it. You do have to deal with more aggressive 5 yr $600 extended warranty shilling than any decent human being should ever have to handle. I can't fathom how that makes sense on a TV that has already worked fine for 3000+ hours and is not replaceable anyway. Their sales guys make the NY guys look like a bunch of panty-waisted pikers, and they've been at it for decades. So far as I know, they all make commission and some of them can make quite a bit if they're any good at it. I remember going there 25 years ago.. they had a big chest high square sales corral in the middle of the store, with 7-8 sales guys standing around waiting, all sitting there chain smoking into overflowing ashtrays hawking teevees and hifis. Only thing that has changed is the ash trays are gone and the sales guys chain 'em up outside. If you haven't been in a good, old-fashioned high pressure electronics store before, you'll be sitting there going, "Seriously, what just happened? What was that insansity? Why were there four eerily helpful, generally knowledgeable, but clearly half nuts people chasing me around this store?" We buy stuff there all the time because it's kind of fun if you're up for it. Still, they will bargain, they are authorized dealers, and you will get what you wanted probably less than anywhere outside of some grey market mail order shyster shop. If it's a fixed price item, they'll toss a refrigerator in your trunk just to get you buy something. Why they put one of these televisions in every store is anyone's best guess.
lol...I love it

I completely agree with your analogy of ABC warehouse

from the pressure to pushing the warranty,the "value" that it is...LOL

I had the same experience the other night there at a store in northern Indiana

You probably could have done better on the price...but hey it sounds like you are happy with the Tv and that is what is important

I dont know why they put the ZT in every store either...but hey it just means the more they have are going to have to deal to get them off their floor

They remind me of some high pressure cars dealers which can be a very good place to buy price wise
They feel like they have to sell you something...so they rake some over the coals and others they practically give it away to more savvy( and patient) customers


But...everybody is buying something...


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post #2057 of 2067 Old 08-08-2014, 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by B T C View Post
I've visited a few of those stores recently, and spoken to several of them on the phone. I'm hoping to find a display set in decent shape for a decent price. I've been quoted some decent prices, but finding a set in good condition seems to be the challenge. Some definitely seem to be in better shape than others.
what is your "buy price" for a decent set?


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post #2058 of 2067 Old 08-08-2014, 05:31 PM
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what is your "buy price" for a decent set?


Warren
I'm really not sure what my go price would be. I think it would depend on the set, but cheaper is always better. I'm actually kinda concerned by the susceptibility these sets seem to have to IR/Burn.

Speaking of their salesmen, one of them told me that Panasonic quit making plasma sets because their plant was destroyed by a tsunami. When he quoted me a price, I figured that added to the collectability.
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post #2059 of 2067 Old 08-09-2014, 05:15 AM
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I'm really not sure what my go price would be. I think it would depend on the set, but cheaper is always better. I'm actually kinda concerned by the susceptibility these sets seem to have to IR/Burn.

Speaking of their salesmen, one of them told me that Panasonic quit making plasma sets because their plant was destroyed by a tsunami. When he quoted me a price, I figured that added to the collectability.
hmmmm...

I think that tsunami he was talking about was their profitability

well..I dont know your urgency , but if needed a Tv and found a good one it might be a good idea to even pay a little more than you wanted to get a good one
As you have stated before what is a good set before might be in poor condition in 30 days due to misuse at the store level

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post #2060 of 2067 Old 08-09-2014, 07:09 AM
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Understood. I don't really "need" a TV as I just bought a 55" VT60. I just wish it was bigger. The prospect of finding a 65" ZT60 at a good price is very enticing. I just wish these places took better care of their floor models. That makes the whole situation a bit frustrating.
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post #2061 of 2067 Old 08-09-2014, 07:57 AM
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Understood. I don't really "need" a TV as I just bought a 55" VT60. I just wish it was bigger.
Know the feeling. I went with a 60" ZT. Kinda wish I had spent the extra money and got the 65". And I didn't need a TV when I bought mine. The grass is always greener it seems!
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post #2062 of 2067 Old 08-10-2014, 06:24 AM
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Know the feeling. I went with a 60" ZT. Kinda wish I had spent the extra money and got the 65". And I didn't need a TV when I bought mine. The grass is always greener it seems!
join the club...LOL

I didnt need the Samsung F8500 either...I had an E8000 that was still in the factory warranty
but came across the Conn's deal and I couldn't pass it up

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post #2063 of 2067 Old 08-10-2014, 08:34 PM
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Anybody near South Bend, IN want to check out the condition of the ZT60. Guy quoted me $2200 on the phone. I'm 4-5 hours away and don't want to drive to a bad condition tv. Think I could get a better price in person?
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post #2064 of 2067 Old 08-11-2014, 09:18 AM
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Anybody near South Bend, IN want to check out the condition of the ZT60. Guy quoted me $2200 on the phone. I'm 4-5 hours away and don't want to drive to a bad condition tv. Think I could get a better price in person?
Beat them down and then just drive there and buy the thing. Contrary to popular opinion, I think the odds of significant issues are low. The problem is you called them on the phone looking for the set... they know you want it. They will likely unload it for $1800 or less, but you'll probably have to do some wheeling and dealing. I paid a bit more than that, and probably left a little in the tank. They already know you want this specific set, so you're stuck with the good old, "Well, I talked to the XYZ store and they offered to sell it for $xxxxx, but your store is a little closer".

My own floor model set has been "breaking in" now for a few days (more like my eyes breaking in to the set... since the set has 3000+ hours). Is it absolutely perfect? Probably not. The glass itself is perfect, minus a small edge scratch. There seems to be a bit of horizontal banding, barely noticeable, about 3" off the bottom of the screen. Probably from bright horizontal scoring/info bands on sports/news channels. Or it's just a normal screen issue. Hard to tell. It's only visible at all when running RGB slides or the screen wiper. It does not affect normal viewing, and certainly not on an anamorphic movie--the black bars are just black, black, black. We really only watch TV shows, Netflix and movies, so as far as I'm concerned, it is perfectly fine for our program material. Under $2k, for arguably the best set ever produced--and now gone forever--for normal program material. And it has 3D, which is a great party trick. The cheapest new 65"+ TV with 3D will run you about $1800 delivered, and it's a POS. Seriously, way too much hand-wringing going on... Want something without any risk, pony up another $1300 or so for a NIB F8500.
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post #2065 of 2067 Old 08-11-2014, 10:46 AM
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Understood. I don't really "need" a TV as I just bought a 55" VT60. I just wish it was bigger. The prospect of finding a 65" ZT60 at a good price is very enticing. I just wish these places took better care of their floor models. That makes the whole situation a bit frustrating.
I feel the same about my 60" ST60. The more I watch it, the more I want to go bigger in screen size. That screen just keeps getting smaller & smaller every day. I had thought this might happen before I purchased the display. Future plans for my next TV have me moving the 60"er into the bedroom, and getting an 85+" OLED 4K display as its upgrade replacement. I've got a few years before that becomes a real possibility. If I were to luck-upon a super eye-popping deal on a 65ZT60 in my area, I'd be sincerely tempted to jump on it providing it was pristine.
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post #2066 of 2067 Old 08-12-2014, 09:50 AM
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Anybody near South Bend, IN want to check out the condition of the ZT60. Guy quoted me $2200 on the phone. I'm 4-5 hours away and don't want to drive to a bad condition tv. Think I could get a better price in person?

if it was the store on Grape Rd...I was in there last week

they offered me a $2000 price....and as I said earlier in this thread I would have offered them $1700 and might have come up to $1800..had I been really serious

Having the F8500 already they would have to make me a crazy deal...like $1200 to get me to bite

btw...the Tv was in very good shape last week

if this is the store you are talking about send me a PM and I will give you the details of what the salesman told me

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post #2067 of 2067 Old 08-12-2014, 09:56 AM
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Under $2k, for arguably the best set ever produced--.
I would not say that
I paid $1799 for a 64 F8500...a store display because they were sold out of the $1999 NIB units by the time I could get to the store

it really depends on what you are using it for as to what set is better

for darker room movie watching..I would tend to agree

for sports or daytime viewing..not so much

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