Defninitive Technology BP-X (BPX) or BPVX, and C/L/R 2000 Center - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 06-27-2012, 05:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi All,
used ot be an addicted (moderated a forum called DigitalTheater about 12 years ago owned by Dean, and I spent 50% of my .com income on HT gear biggrin.gif. Then I got married, my .com company went bust while I was on honeymoon and blew all of my savings, so had to sell most of my gear to survive until reemployed, and am now back to a place where i can spare some $ on rebuilding a good man cave theater. I have already acquired a set of BP2000TLs and C/l/R 2002 ($850 + gas money for the 20 hr round truip to pick them up), Onkyo 3008($850), Panny BDT-500 ($285 BINB, BB192/32 DACs... sweet!), 2x KW-12d's ($299 each), and some BP2X's ($200, haven't decided where I will put the 2X's in the 7.2 config, so many new channels have been added since the last time I was shooting up hifi heroin, front wide, front high, surround back, up my arse(transducer?), I guess I will try them all smile.gif). FInally I am replacig my long belowed Pio SD533-HD5 9" CRT RPTV with a Mits 73740 ($1000), projection is not an option in my room unfortunately, but I am sure the Mits will be fine biggrin.gif.

One left over from my old setup is an Acurus A250 (250x2 into 8ohms, 350x2 into 4 ohms) to power the 2000 BP2000's

The only ones I am having difficultly obtaining with my remaining budget are the side/main surrounds and center to match the BPs. I am looking for a C/L/R 2000 and a pair of of BPVXs(preferred) or a pair of BPXs, or maybe even both.

Anyone out there have these that you haven't gotten around to listing yet or perhaps you are looking for a change?

I will do cash no problem but am open to trades where you may get more for your $, were I have TONS of electronics (computer and consumer, just ask if I have it, you will be surprised, my home is like a warehouse due to my side business), not including tons of current stuff, I also have a couple sets of RCmicro;s, pair of Made in CA Energy C6's, pair of made in CA Energy C2's, Energy Made in CA AC-300 center, Elite 49Txi and 47Ai, Olevia 747i, and hundreds of new computer parts, laptops, and consumer electronics (a few Sandy Bride loaded laptops, SSDs, BNIB power tools of all kinds, all mostly BNIB items. I also have an extensive collection of firearms (hand guns and long guns, I compete in clays and 3 gun), mostly Sig Sauer, Beretta, and Blaser, and about 40K rds of assorted ammo (no reloads). I also have two dogs and/or two children up for negotiation. Please give me a shout if you have what I am looking for (michaeldavidcraft_AT_gmail.com), thanks!
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post #2 of 12 Old 06-27-2012, 07:49 PM
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Hey - just a suggestion for the center, check out the CLR 2000 as well. I've had both the 2000 and 3000 running with my 3000TL's and preferred the 2000. It was too difficult to integrate yet another sub in the center. It seemed to take away from the overall clarity as well.

The BPVX's are great though! I've run the passive and powered versions and again I prefer the non powered.

Good luck!

Andrew
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post #3 of 12 Old 06-27-2012, 10:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

Hey - just a suggestion for the center, check out the CLR 2000 as well. I've had both the 2000 and 3000 running with my 3000TL's and preferred the 2000. It was too difficult to integrate yet another sub in the center. It seemed to take away from the overall clarity as well.
The BPVX's are great though! I've run the passive and powered versions and again I prefer the non powered.
Good luck!
Andrew
Thanks Andrew, I will add the 2000 to my list! I have a 2002 right now, and it is a good speaker, but in my past experimentation with Centers with Veritas and Energy, I found that 6.5" mids were my sweet spot when it comes to getting dialog with the depth and punch that I am looking for, and with the 6.5s and the freq response it looks like the 2000 fits that bill (actually, if I am guessing right, my 2002 was meant for BP2002s, and the CLR2000 was meant for my BP2000TLs).

The one reason I decided instead upon the 3000 was based on reading hundreds (or thousands?) of posts on the Def Tech owners thread and on other forums (audioholics, etc.), many were on the subject of the center, where the vast majority of the time I read that everyone who chose the 3000 (or eventually got there, either moving up the power subwoofer line from the 2300 or 2500, or from the no sub line, like the 2000 and the 2002) stated that even with the additional money spent that they felt that it was a worthy upgrade, due in part to the powered sub-woofer making the low freq effects blend perfect as they panned across the front sound stage(vs. an improvement in dialog), according to what I have read it goes to 19HZ!!!. May I ask how you ran the 3000, i.e. from full range low level input, the amplified full range input, and what bass management you tried to tune the 3000 into your setup? I am not saying that you are wrong as I realize that I think just about everything I have read was subjective and may have been psychological given how much some may have spent on their CLR3000's and they WANTED to hear an improvement, so just trying to gather as much info as I can given I do not have the option to audition both frown.gif.

Then of course there were a few posts and this thread that I found that contradicts my last paragraph of opinions: http://www.hometheatershack.com/forums/home-audio-speakers/9026-definitive-technology-c-l-r-2500-v-s-c-l-r-2000-a.html for example, and I do own a CLR2300 that is in my upstairs setup paired with my B7006's. So in short, until I try the different options, I am not sure what will sound right in my listening environment and match my tastes. As far as my tastes go BTW, in addition to the obvious where I want crystal clear dialog, I also love depth of sound (not from only from an imaging perspective, but also from a freq response perspective). BTW, if they are mutually exclusive, then the clarity of dialog is priority #1.

TBH I have never run a center with a power sub that handled frequencies nearly as low as the 3000 and was never feeling that anything was "missing", but then I am talking about Energy speakers, which have different characteristics on drivers, porting, etc. that contribute to the fullness achieved from their flagship AC-300 center. Who knows for sure though smile.gif. Anyway, For anyone who may read this, please add the CLR2000 to the list of my wanted speakers, I will certainly give it a shot given it at least has the 6.5 mids that I KNOW I want in my center channel.

I admit that I am worried about tuning a system that has 5(!!) extremely capable subs in an extremely irregularly shaped and reflective room, which is one of the reasons that I purchased an Onkyo with MultXT32, which supposedly can define the room tuning even with multiple subs and a terrible room both being in the equation (dunno about 5 subs though smile.gif).

BP3000TLs, very nice, to you still have those? I was originally looking for those but gave up given I hadn't see a pair for sale in a while, nor any evidence of used ones being sold in the past, I assume those are rare beasts! Given their rarity, I was assuming if I did find some, that i would be close in cost to 70000SC's (well not that close, but close enough to consider buying some if I could get them below MSRP given I have seen at least one pair go for more than a thousand less than MSRP). The only problem with that was then the majority of my budget would have been accounted for, and it would have been perhaps another year before I could continue on my quest smile.gif.

as far as the BPVX;s, I considered the powered ones, but 1) they are also rare and very expensive I am guessing, and 2, my two KW012D subs will be going in the rear, so I don't think I will need anymore bass back there as long as the main/side surrounds have decent mids to fill the gap from where the subs stop and the surrounds start, the 31HZ response of the BPVXs and the 2 12" subs in the back should be more than adequate smile.gif.
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post #4 of 12 Old 06-28-2012, 07:26 AM
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Yes, I'm still running the BP3000TLs. They are a true pair of beasts! Ironically, I searched for quite some time for the 2000's when a set of 3000's popped up locally in nearly brand new condition! I'm considering selling them since I'd love to try out a pair of the newer 7000SCs. I have the 7002s in my basement and they are phenomenal speakers. A few pair sold locally for ~2500 not too long ago.

As for the center sub in the 3000 - If you already have 5 subs in your room as of now you're already going to have a heck of a time integrating them all. The XT32 is very nice, but only allows for discrete processing of 2 sub channels. When I ran REW sweeps attempting to integrate my 3000TL subs with my two JTR Captivators it was a mess, haha. Same went for the sub in my CLR3000 - I tried every time of adjustment - phase, crossover points, distance, EQ, different inputs, etc. In my room I just couldn't get anything close to a flat response. IMO, your best bet is to simplify since you already have so many switches to flip, etc. I noticed you said you had 2 12" subs in the rear of the room. What other type of subs are you running? If they are anything of substantial output I can guarantee that the CLR center couldn't keep up anyway. You may be better off with simply 2 higher powered subs so that XT32 can do it's job. smile.gif As much as I like DT products, myself and most others don't have a whole lot of faith in their 'bloated' specs. The 19hz rating on that center is pretty laughable - as are the crazy specs on my 3000TLs.

The same statement held true when I first purchased the BPVX/P's. The small subs in them didn't do much except for muddying the sound. I sold them right away for a pair of the BPVX's and haven't looked back. In this case you get 4 full range drivers instead of 2 passive / 2 'subs' in the /P version.

I guess you could call me a DT Guru: To date I've owned more than a dozen of their products, including a few flagships (3000TLs, Trinity sub, BPVX, 3000 center, BP30s, etc). I'd be happy to chat if you wanted to talk setup, etc. Shoot me a PM if interested and I'll give you my number. smile.gif

Andrew
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post #5 of 12 Old 06-28-2012, 09:12 AM
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Craftyhack- As far as the Definitive Tech center channels go, I have personally owned the c/l/r-2002, c/l/r-3000, c/l/r-2500, and the c/l/r-2000. Of those, I much prefered the c/l/r-2000 as to me it sounded the clearest, and also the most accurate. I personally thought that the c/l/r-3000 sounded a bit muddied and bloated, as I could never seem to get the built in sub to play nice with intergrating into the rest of my setup. What I did, and what I think you would be happier with, is use the c/l/r-2000 for the center channel and also add a seperate, smaller subwoofer to the center channel position. I am using an older HSU subwoofer that is connected via the speaker level connections. I used speaker wire to go from the center channel binding post on my receiver, to the speaker level inputs into the HSU subwoofer, then the speaker level outputs from the HSU to my c/l/r-2000. The difference between doing it like this, compared to the c/l/r-3000, is night and day. Much better then using the c/l/r-3000.
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post #6 of 12 Old 06-28-2012, 08:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Wow, complete concensus, will update my title in a sec to change what I am looking for smile.gif. Unfortunately, I haven't seen a 2000 yet (only been looking for a few weeks though), I guess being older than the 3000(?) they might be more rare? But I will update my search agents to start looking, Google search agents are great, I am sure one will pop-up smile.gif.

Also, when I said 5 subs, I was inaccurate, twice, so maybe that evens it out? I have the 2 KW-12D's (where I was planning to put them in the rear based on some posts I read in the DefTech forums for those that had big subs built into their mains), but who knows where they will end up once I get the room reconfigured and start tuning. They may just end up in the classifieds smile.gif. I was also counting the two 15" subs in my BP2000TL's, and finally the sub in the 3000 that I *was* planning on getting. I have several other subs as well at my disposal (I am actually redoing 3 rooms at the same time, the family room, master bedroom, and man cave).

Sitting unused in my man cave (not counting subs bundled in HTIBs I have evolved through over the tight years, those are all going to be sold), I have a Mirage BPS150i (bipolar sub one 8" sub on each side) that I can incorporate, not sure how that would work in the center being bipolar though? In the living room I currently have a SuperCube I, but my family could care less if I swapped it out with whatever, and I have several to swap it out with (I currently have it adjusted to like 10% volume if that, they don't watch the kind of stuff I do where bass matters), and in my bedroom I have an Energy S10.3. I also have several budget subs that I am probably going to sell if I don't swap out the SCI in the living room (Polk 505 type subs).
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post #7 of 12 Old 06-29-2012, 01:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martycool007 View Post

Craftyhack- As far as the Definitive Tech center channels go, I have personally owned the c/l/r-2002, c/l/r-3000, c/l/r-2500, and the c/l/r-2000. Of those, I much prefered the c/l/r-2000 as to me it sounded the clearest, and also the most accurate. I personally thought that the c/l/r-3000 sounded a bit muddied and bloated, as I could never seem to get the built in sub to play nice with intergrating into the rest of my setup. What I did, and what I think you would be happier with, is use the c/l/r-2000 for the center channel and also add a seperate, smaller subwoofer to the center channel position. I am using an older HSU subwoofer that is connected via the speaker level connections. I used speaker wire to go from the center channel binding post on my receiver, to the speaker level inputs into the HSU subwoofer, then the speaker level outputs from the HSU to my c/l/r-2000. The difference between doing it like this, compared to the c/l/r-3000, is night and day. Much better then using the c/l/r-3000.
Sent you a PM with all of my #'s, thanks!
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post #8 of 12 Old 07-01-2012, 09:48 AM
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craftyhack, sent you a PM on the items you are looking for.
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post #9 of 12 Old 07-06-2012, 05:43 PM
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Hi Craftyhack,

With a recent windfall of some lucky investments I've been able to create a high-end home theater and upgraded my speakers to all Aerial Acoustics (20T's, CC5, etc). As such I have a top notch CLR 3000 and some BP2000TL's, two different BPV surrounds (one set of their top end non powered subwoofer surround) and one that is a 1.2x (or something like that) now sitting around in their original boxes. They all are amazing to look and and work in perfect order. Let me know if you haven't already found something. Take care. Matt.
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post #10 of 12 Old 07-07-2012, 08:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by psychdoc View Post

Hi Craftyhack,
With a recent windfall of some lucky investments I've been able to create a high-end home theater and upgraded my speakers to all Aerial Acoustics (20T's, CC5, etc). As such I have a top notch CLR 3000 and some BP2000TL's, two different BPV surrounds (one set of their top end non powered subwoofer surround) and one that is a 1.2x (or something like that) now sitting around in their original boxes. They all are amazing to look and and work in perfect order. Let me know if you haven't already found something. Take care. Matt.
I sent you a PM, I am indeed interested, thanks!!

P.S. Congrats on both your investments panning out and one the fine new acquisitions smile.gif.
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post #11 of 12 Old 10-16-2012, 04:48 PM
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Hello there,

Yes I have a Definitive Technology CLR 2000 in excellent condition, part of my $25k+ sound system that I am able to sell. I just bought the new one for $1000 from Definitive Technology.

Excellent condition, sound, and aesthetics. I can sell you mine for $249.00 plus shipping; I have paypal if you like, and I live in Lutz, Florida 33558 (Tampa FL) My Cell # is 813-528-2976.

I am the original owner, and have cared for all of my equipment as a true audiophile. I just got my new Def tech so I was just getting ready to list mine when I saw your post.

Please call me on my cell or email me at "strummer2@verizon.net" to claim my Def. Tech CLR-2000 as yours. I can send you pictures if you like as well, just let me know your email address, and I will check for the boxes etc.

Here are the specifications and it sounds AWESOME!!!! All my speakers are and will remain Def. Tech's; I am a loyal customer!

Definitive Technology CLR-2000 Center Channel Speaker Piano Blk Gloss Finish

Specifications:

Response: 22 — 30 kHz.
Nominal Imp.: 4 — 8 ohms.
Rec. amp: 20 — 350 watts.
Drivers:
Two cast-basket 6 1/2" bass/midranges
1" pure aluminum dome tweeter.
Finish: Piano-Gloss Black. Bi-wireable.
Approximate Dimensions:

Width: 21-1/2"
Height: 8-5/16"
Depth: 15"

Recommended Amplifier Power: 20 - 350 Watts
Nominal Impedance: 4 - 8 ohms
1" Pure Aluminum Dome Tweeter
Two Cast-Basket 6 1/2" Bass/Midrange Speakers
Piano Gloss Finish
Magnetically Shielded
Non-Resonant Monocoque Cabinet


Additional Specifications

Linkwitz-Riley Crossover Network
Designed for Horizontal or Vertical Placement
D'Appolito Arrays
Butyl Rubber Surrounds
Diffractionless Grill/Baffle Interfaces
Three-Dimensional Pinpoint Imaging
Dimensional Specifications

38 lbs.
21 1/2" W x 8 5/16 H" x 15" D
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post #12 of 12 Old 10-16-2012, 04:51 PM
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Hello there,

Yes I have a Definitive Technology CLR 2000 in excellent condition, part of my $25k+ sound system that I am able to sell. I just bought the new one for $1000 from Definitive Technology.

Excellent condition, sound, and aesthetics. I can sell you mine for $249.00 plus shipping; I have paypal if you like, and I live in Lutz, Florida 33558 (Tampa FL) My Cell # is 813-528-2976.

I am the original owner, and have cared for all of my equipment as a true audiophile. I just got my new Def tech so I was just getting ready to list mine when I saw your post.

Please call me on my cell or email me at "strummer2@verizon.net" to claim my Def. Tech CLR-2000 as yours. I can send you pictures if you like as well, just let me know your email address, and I will check for the boxes etc.

Here are the specifications and it sounds AWESOME!!!! All my speakers are and will remain Def. Tech's; I am a loyal customer!

Sincerely,

Ken Beyer
813-528-2976 (Cell #)

Definitive Technology CLR-2000 Center Channel Speaker Piano Blk Gloss Finish

Specifications:

Response: 22 — 30 kHz.
Nominal Imp.: 4 — 8 ohms.
Rec. amp: 20 — 350 watts.
Drivers:
Two cast-basket 6 1/2" bass/midranges
1" pure aluminum dome tweeter.
Finish: Piano-Gloss Black. Bi-wireable.
Approximate Dimensions:

Width: 21-1/2"
Height: 8-5/16"
Depth: 15"

Recommended Amplifier Power: 20 - 350 Watts
Nominal Impedance: 4 - 8 ohms
1" Pure Aluminum Dome Tweeter
Two Cast-Basket 6 1/2" Bass/Midrange Speakers
Piano Gloss Finish
Magnetically Shielded
Non-Resonant Monocoque Cabinet


Additional Specifications

Linkwitz-Riley Crossover Network
Designed for Horizontal or Vertical Placement
D'Appolito Arrays
Butyl Rubber Surrounds
Diffractionless Grill/Baffle Interfaces
Three-Dimensional Pinpoint Imaging
Dimensional Specifications

38 lbs.
21 1/2" W x 8 5/16 H" x 15" D
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