Stewart vs black diamond .8 gain screen - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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Screens > Stewart vs black diamond .8 gain screen
hrd's Avatar hrd 08:46 AM 09-03-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliffside View Post

I've ordered the 100" screen to go with my Pioneer projector. The dealer I spoke with explained that for my room set and this particular projector that anything larger would be inappropriate. He also said that when you spend a couple of hours or more in front of the screen you don't want to feel like you need to step further back in the room to be comfortable.

I am happy with that size for HDTV. I have a 115" wide 2.35 AR, which gives 100" diagonal at 16:9. 110" looked so much larger from where I sit at 13-14 feet when I tried it out on the wall before I bought the screen, maybe too large. 100" seems like a good compromise. Another thing is, I definitely notice the drop in brightness and resolution when going larger than 110" with HDTV.

smetaxas's Avatar smetaxas 01:37 PM 09-09-2010
I have a .8 Black Diamond screen that I bought off of another AVS guy. The masking is probably better than the 1.4 due to the darker color of the .8. The 1.4 looks grey to me.

I have ripples in my screen though & SI have really been NO help at all. They won't even talk to me about why it is going on because I didn't buy it from them. Doesn't show much empathy for the end user & has definately turned me off to the company for future purchases. I just wanted to know if my problem is unusual.

By the way, the screen was new in the box when I recieved it.
karlsch's Avatar karlsch 02:08 PM 09-09-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by smetaxas View Post

I have a .8 Black Diamond screen that I bought off of another AVS guy. The masking is probably better than the 1.4 due to the darker color of the .8. The 1.4 looks grey to me.

I have ripples in my screen though & SI have really been NO help at all. They won't even talk to me about why it is going on because I didn't buy it from them. Doesn't show much empathy for the end user & has definately turned me off to the company for future purchases. I just wanted to know if my problem is unusual.

By the way, the screen was new in the box when I recieved it.

This problem was discussed in the Black Diamond from Screen Innovations? thread. Starting at post #1132. Somebody posted updated installation instructions.

If I remember correctly, if I followed the instructions that came with the screen, I had vertical ripples, too.
smetaxas's Avatar smetaxas 05:31 PM 09-09-2010
Thank you Karl, I'll look that up. Now why couldn't they have told me this themselves?

As far as masking, it works well with the lights out, ehh with the lights on. I'll try to take some pictures for you.

I would mount the projector as close as possible for the extra lumens. The colors are very rich & the blacks are great.

I'm using a Panasonic 4000 for it's auto zoom settings for a 2.35 BD .8 screen & it looks great.
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 09:51 PM 09-09-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by smetaxas View Post

Thank you Karl, I'll look that up. Now why couldn't they have told me this themselves?

As far as masking, it works well with the lights out, ehh with the lights on. I'll try to take some pictures for you.

I would mount the projector as close as possible for the extra lumens. The colors are very rich & the blacks are great.

I'm using a Panasonic 4000 for it's auto zoom settings for a 2.35 BD .8 screen & it looks great.

THat would be awesome if you could post some pics...
How does the screen handle light scatter?
On there site there is a video that shows the BD Screen and with minimal lite scatter...
Also i got an email couple of days ago that SI was going to send me some pics of the .8 gain screen in action, got a couple of pics but waiting for a few more then i will post all at once..
Also i have screen texture samples comeing from Stewart and SI ...
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 06:26 PM 09-12-2010
okay, got to see the Stewart Lexus Deluxe Fire Hawk screen in action this past week with a Epson 9500 UB projector...
And was very impressed.
The light scatter was very little...
In total dark all i saw was the screen blacks were black really no need for masking..
With dim light settings no effect on the screen
With full lights on still very watchable ...
Also the screen has metal snaps on the back that attach to the frame...
Stewart did send me a sample of the fire hawk screen and will compare the texture to the SI black diamond when the sample from them
Gonna try to go to see a demo of the SI Screen this week
rdjam's Avatar rdjam 10:04 PM 09-18-2010
With that much light, I think you'd be in great shape with the .8 version of the BDII.

But I'd urge you to go another size up, if you can fit it - go to the 133" or 134" - whichever is the next "standard" size. And DEFINITELY get the 2.40 aspect ratio at that size. (2.40 is the standard, not 2.35, btw). I think it would be tragic to get this screen and miss the chance to go 2.40. The FIRST time you watch a home movie at 2.4 on this setup you will wet yourself.

I'm using 900 lumens on the BDII 1.4 at that larger size right now, and the image is bright and clear. Beautiful. So don't worry about output if you have 1600 lumens.

The other benefit of the BDII in your comparison, is greatly reduced reflected light glare onto your walls and ceiling and back to the screen. This REALLY makes an additional difference to improving your contrast ratio.

Note - re: picture artifacts - when I get too close to my 1.4 BDII (say 10 or 12 feet) I can notice the screen construction on bright material - but I have not noticed this on the .8 demos that I have seen. The reflective base of the 1.4 is more likely to generate this.

EDIT: just saw the post from Jason regarding brightness. I'm not familiar with your PJ, but to get the same brightness on the .8 material, at the same size as my screen, you would need a projector that is TRULY outputting 1575 lumens. However, there is so much light coming off of my screen its ridiculous - but you should still do your homework..
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 06:07 PM 09-19-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

With that much light, I think you'd be in great shape with the .8 version of the BDII.

But I'd urge you to go another size up, if you can fit it - go to the 133" or 134" - whichever is the next "standard" size. And DEFINITELY get the 2.40 aspect ratio at that size. (2.40 is the standard, not 2.35, btw). I think it would be tragic to get this screen and miss the chance to go 2.40. The FIRST time you watch a home movie at 2.4 on this setup you will wet yourself.

I'm using 900 lumens on the BDII 1.4 at that larger size right now, and the image is bright and clear. Beautiful. So don't worry about output if you have 1600 lumens.

The other benefit of the BDII in your comparison, is greatly reduced reflected light glare onto your walls and ceiling and back to the screen. This REALLY makes an additional difference to improving your contrast ratio.


Note - re: picture artifacts - when I get too close to my 1.4 BDII (say 10 or 12 feet) I can notice the screen construction on bright material - but I have not noticed this on the .8 demos that I have seen. The reflective base of the 1.4 is more likely to generate this.

EDIT: just saw the post from Jason regarding brightness. I'm not familiar with your PJ, but to get the same brightness on the .8 material, at the same size as my screen, you would need a projector that is TRULY outputting 1575 lumens. However, there is so much light coming off of my screen its ridiculous - but you should still do your homework..

The only thing that is stoping me to going to a 2.4 screen is that
1. i have no intention of getting a additional expensive lens...
2. This is for a multi purpose room that does Video Games and Sports
aswell as movies...
I have been told that for video games and sports the 2.40 screen is not advised........?
rdjam's Avatar rdjam 10:01 PM 09-19-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by fraisa View Post

The only thing that is stoping me to going to a 2.4 screen is that
1. i have no intention of getting a additional expensive lens...
2. This is for a multi purpose room that does Video Games and Sports
aswell as movies...
I have been told that for video games and sports the 2.40 screen is not advised........?

I just zoom the projector in to fill the full 2.4 with movies. With the black level on projectors these days, works perfect. No one notices any light spill in the black area above and below. With the JVC, it's hard to find even if you look for it.

About the only reason to use an anamorphic lens is if you are short on light, and need the full production of the pj. And, in fact, the quality (I feel) is better in zoom mode, as you don't re-scale the pixels and create artifacting. rather, the zoom method lets you see pixel-for-pixel, exactly what is encoded on your disc.

I play games on the screen too - the black bars on the sides, when you are running games in 16 x 9, are irrelevant. Your mind blocks them out after a couple minutes. not a factor.

But once you've seen bluray movies at the proper 2.4 up on this big baby, there's no going back.
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 02:07 PM 09-20-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

I just zoom the projector in to fill the full 2.4 with movies. With the black level on projectors these days, works perfect. No one notices any light spill in the black area above and below. With the JVC, it's hard to find even if you look for it.

About the only reason to use an anamorphic lens is if you are short on light, and need the full production of the pj. And, in fact, the quality (I feel) is better in zoom mode, as you don't re-scale the pixels and create artifacting. rather, the zoom method lets you see pixel-for-pixel, exactly what is encoded on your disc.

I play games on the screen too - the black bars on the sides, when you are running games in 16 x 9, are irrelevant. Your mind blocks them out after a couple minutes. not a factor.

But once you've seen bluray movies at the proper 2.4 up on this big baby, there's no going back.

Okay just measured my wall can go 133 or 142 no problem
Just need to move the prescense channel speakers over a few inchs..
I have dish network, and they have a stretch mode that will put a 16x9 image to 2.40 if i wanted to
But how far back do you sit?
I will be around 16ft...
and the projector will be 14.75 ft lens to screen....
Can an epson 9500ub fill a 133 or 142 screen at that throw distance?
When playing games at the 16:9 on 2:4 do you loose anything top to bottom on the screen?

also can you post some pics?
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 09:28 PM 09-20-2010
Okay found out that the epson 9500 ub has a manual lens..
so if i go this route then i will need to go with a pwred lens..
Mits 6800 has a powered zoom lens and 1500 lumens..
so thats good
did some reading looks like it has a 2:35 feature so no need for an add on lens..
Just dont know if i should go with a 2.35 or 2.40 screen with this projector...
Also will find out if mits has a new projector coming out in the next month...
hrd's Avatar hrd 11:34 AM 09-21-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by fraisa View Post

Okay just measured my wall can go 133 or 142 no problem
Just need to move the prescense channel speakers over a few inchs..
I have dish network, and they have a stretch mode that will put a 16x9 image to 2.40 if i wanted to
But how far back do you sit?
I will be around 16ft...
and the projector will be 14.75 ft lens to screen....
Can an epson 9500ub fill a 133 or 142 screen at that throw distance?
When playing games at the 16:9 on 2:4 do you loose anything top to bottom on the screen?

also can you post some pics?

I have a 115" wide 2.35:1 screen and watch from about 13 1/2 feet. It seems like a perfect match for widescreen fare. Others may want to sit closer, but I have my screen so that I look right to the middle of it vertically - I don't have to look up like everyone else does - which is not only more comfortable, but more immersive and so makes less screen go further. I am happy with the 100" diagonal size the screen allows for 16x9 HDTV, but was okay with the 110" 16X9 size I tested out on the wall before I bought the screen (it was a great deal on a used screen a nearby forum friend had and so that contributed a lot to the aspect ratio and size I ended up with), so I would consider 110" 16X9 if I were replacing it.

Stretching a 16x9 image to 2.40:1 will distort the image somewhat, and you might prefer not doing that. However, my cable provider has some premium movies in the widescreen format. Without any zooming, the movie will show large black bars above and below the movie, but you can stretch those via the projector's zoom to fill up a 2.35:1 screen. It's not going to have the image quality of blu-ray, but it looks way more impressive than a movie in 16X9 or a movie in widescreen format that is not zoomed to fill up a 2.35:1 screen. Maybe Dish shows movies in that format as well.
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 06:00 PM 09-21-2010
Okay got my samples today of the black diamond si .8 and 1.4
and went into my local av shop and put the screen samples on the screen
Definetly 1.4 had better blacks and whiter whites then the .8 screen....
but what concerns me is there is speckal on the samples for both 1.4 and .8 ...
If this speckle is on the screen material thats definetly not good...
Also even as the screen performance was Impressive...
there is limited stock in canada

So for me still havent made up my mind ( Thought i did but still undecided)
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 02:55 PM 09-22-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by fraisa View Post

Okay got my samples today of the black diamond si .8 and 1.4
and went into my local av shop and put the screen samples on the screen
Definetly 1.4 had better blacks and whiter whites then the .8 screen....
but what concerns me is there is speckal on the samples for both 1.4 and .8 ...
If this speckle is on the screen material thats definetly not good...
Also even as the screen performance was Impressive...
there is limited stock in canada

So for me still havent made up my mind ( Thought i did but still undecided)

Spoke with SI today with regards to the speckal pattern on the material,
was told that it is just part of the screen material and the only way you can see it is if you hold it horizontally which you dont watch it that way and therefore its a non issue..

So went into a out of town dealer that has Stewart and SI Black Diamond screens and did a demo test with BluRay Dark Knight...

Wow were my eyes opened.

Projector was a Runco LS-3 1000 lumens...
First off the Stewart Fire Hawk G3 screen was impressive Decent picture..
Good Detail but poor with reflecting the screen light in the room...

But when we went to the SI Screen it was a definite WoW moment..
The 1.4 gain made gave the blacks the detail and the whites true...
there is actually a scene where they show buildings and on the far left there were cars parked on a side street..
With the Stewart screen i didnt know that there where cars parked there because it was just black...
But the SI screen was vivid in detail to show what the filmaker actually filmed in the scene...

Then the next test Came.....
Hockey Game from Last Night..
Even though the Leafs Lost he put on the game from last night .....

The Stewart was okay but a the whites on the ice where dull..
So switch to the SI Screen.......

Holy Crap you should see the Ice and Blacks on the game...
Unfreakin Believable
Felt like you where in the stands watching the game
The whites where white and unwashed
Very close to matching the plasma in the other room
(Projector mode was for a hd picture and for the black knight mode settings for Film...)

Bottom line is i have been looking for a screen that is to go into a multi purpose Family Room were if you watch Movies ,,.,, lots of Sports and the Kids play the video games, you can do it Lights on or Off....

The black diamond has got my vote...
It is going to be more expensive than the stewart but the quality and detail of the picture is So worth it...

Also will comment on hot spotting ...
I was sitting 13 ft from the screen...( too close for my own taste but wanted to see if i could see any hotspoting..and this also was the show room set up)
And there was no hot spotting...
and with every SI Screen put in by this dealer there has not been one issue with regards to hot spoting...
There installers use the tools from the SI website to caculate throw distance and give and take a Foot +/- either direction
No one has complained with that issue...

I will be ordering the SI screen in 3 weeks and will post pics of the install when done...
and will make sure to have some pics from video games , bluRay, and Don Cherry and hockey night in Canada ........

Thanks for all the comments by those left on this thread...
Cheers...
Kevin 3000's Avatar Kevin 3000 09:33 AM 09-23-2010
:Another happy demo this screen is the dogs dodars

Also budget for lamp replacements being a family room with daytime viewing that 1000 lumens is great at beginning but will dim and need replacing every, in my case JVC RS10. 1000 hours. JVC lamps are reasonable others you need to look into.
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 11:29 AM 09-23-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin 3000 View Post

:Another happy demo this screen is the dogs dodars

Also budget for lamp replacements being a family room with daytime viewing that 1000 lumens is great at beginning but will dim and need replacing every, in my case JVC RS10. 1000 hours. JVC lamps are reasonable others you need to look into.

quote.....Another happy demo this screen is the dogs dodars....
dude i am from Canada so dont really know what you mean by the above.....lol

The Runco was jus the Screen for the demo at the show room and it did have over a 1000hours on it and was still good...

I Right now am considering the Mits HC6800 or the Epson 9700ub ( release date is next week)
Not intrested what so ever in JVC....At this point..
Dont even know of a jvc dealer in my area... so thats why.....not considering them...

As far as replacing the bulb every 1000 hours if i have to i am not going to loose sleep over it....dont think i will but time will tell..
I just am going by my eye and from what i saw on this SI Black Diamond screen from a projector that had over a 1000hrs on it .... Wow moment
is what i walked away with from the SI screen.....
bud16415's Avatar bud16415 06:24 AM 09-24-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by fraisa View Post

So went into a out of town dealer that has Stewart and SI Black Diamond screens and did a demo test with BluRay Dark Knight...

Wow were my eyes opened.

Projector was a Runco LS-3 1000 lumens...
First off the Stewart Fire Hawk G3 screen was impressive Decent picture..
Good Detail but poor with reflecting the screen light in the room...

But when we went to the SI Screen it was a definite WoW moment..
The 1.4 gain made gave the blacks the detail and the whites true...
there is actually a scene where they show buildings and on the far left there were cars parked on a side street..
With the Stewart screen i didnt know that there where cars parked there because it was just black...
But the SI screen was vivid in detail to show what the filmaker actually filmed in the scene...

Then the next test Came.....
Hockey Game from Last Night..
Even though the Leafs Lost he put on the game from last night .....

The Stewart was okay but a the whites on the ice where dull..
So switch to the SI Screen.......

Holy Crap you should see the Ice and Blacks on the game...
Unfreakin Believable
Felt like you where in the stands watching the game
The whites where white and unwashed

Did they give you any information on what screen the projector was calibrated with of the two? Or would anyone familiar with these two screens venture a guess as to how much difference the calibration might be?
R Harkness's Avatar R Harkness 08:03 AM 09-24-2010
Not to pour water on the enthusiasm, but in the interests of accuracy....

Quote:
Originally Posted by fraisa View Post

Okay got my samples today of the black diamond si .8 and 1.4
and went into my local av shop and put the screen samples on the screen
Definetly 1.4 had better blacks and whiter whites then the .8 screen....

If by "better blacks" you mean deeper black levels it is by definition impossible that the 1.4 gain screen has deeper black levels. That's what the gain numbers mean - the base level of the projector (it's "black" level) will be reflected at a higher gain on the 1.4 so it will by lighter. That's physics.
I've compared full size .8 and 1.4 BD screens and the .8 version definitely could portray darker black levels.


Quote:
Originally Posted by fraisa View Post

but what concerns me is there is speckal on the samples for both 1.4 and .8 ...
If this speckle is on the screen material thats definetly not good...

The speckling comes from the gain coating applied to the screen surfaces of both the .8 and the 1.4 screen. Almost all screens with optical gain coatings will have speckling if you look for it. The speckling caused by the gain of some screens are more obvious than other screens, and people's sensitivity to this issue varies. Some get along fine, for others it drives them up the wall, once they start seeing the speckled coating over lots of the images.

In my experience the BD screens have quite visible optical coating (speckling as you call it) so they wouldn't be for me. If you think it might be a concern for you make sure you check it out.


Quote:
Originally Posted by fraisa View Post

Spoke with SI today with regards to the speckal pattern on the material,
was told that it is just part of the screen material and the only way you can see it is if you hold it horizontally which you dont watch it that way and therefore its a non issue..

Not true. The screen coating is quite visible when viewing the screen "normally" from a viewing seat. The question is whether you personally notice it much.


Quote:
Originally Posted by fraisa View Post

The 1.4 gain made gave the blacks the detail and the whites true...
there is actually a scene where they show buildings and on the far left there were cars parked on a side street..
With the Stewart screen i didnt know that there where cars parked there because it was just black...
But the SI screen was vivid in detail to show what the filmaker actually filmed in the scene...

Then the next test Came.....
Hockey Game from Last Night..
Even though the Leafs Lost he put on the game from last night .....

The Stewart was okay but a the whites on the ice where dull..
So switch to the SI Screen.......

Holy Crap you should see the Ice and Blacks on the game...
Unfreakin Believable
Felt like you where in the stands watching the game
The whites where white and unwashed
Very close to matching the plasma in the other room

That's interesting. Really the only thing likely to cause the differences you saw are differences in screen gain (and to a minor degree, color shift of the screens). The BD 1.4 is rated higher gain than the Stewart Firehawk (1.25), so if the BD gain ratings are accurate (Stewart's numbers are accurate) then there is going to be a brightness increase on the BD. Also, were you looking at the Stewart Firehawk G3 material, or the SST Firehawk, which is rated at even lower gain (1.1) and hence the difference would have been even more obvious when switching to the BD screen?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fraisa View Post

Also will comment on hot spotting ...
I was sitting 13 ft from the screen...( too close for my own taste but wanted to see if i could see any hotspoting..and this also was the show room set up)
And there was no hot spotting...

Again, in the interests of accuracy, the better way to express this is that you didn't notice any hot spotting. There is definitely hotspotting with these screens, as there is with the Stewart. It's physics. I find the hotspotting on both the Stewart Firehawk G3 and both Black Diamond screens very pronounced (especially the .8 version), so much so I could never use them in my set up.

When you checked for hotspotting were you sitting in the middle seats, or did you move toward one side of the screen? Moving to the side seats you see the hot-spotting much more easily (the far side of the screen will go darker than the side closer to you). Personally I can see the hotspotting drop off from the central seats as well, with these screens and the Stewart.

Please understand I'm not writing this to dissuade you from buying the BD screen. EVERY screen involves compromises of some sort: if you get a screen that is made to combat ambient light it's going to have certain issues and limitations in terms of image neutrality. If you get a screen that is extremely neutral (e.g. a 1.0 gain Stewart ST-100) the issues are going to switch to how compromised your room is - reflective surfaces in your room will play a more deleterious role. So there are always issues.

Rather, on this forum especially given people come here to get information, we strive for accuracy as much as possible (which is why it's called AVScience forum), so people reading threads like these can be well informed.

But of course it's always great to share our subjective reports, like you just did, because those are valuable as well. Thanks! I hope you end up with a screen you like. The Black Diamond 1.4 looks very promising for you at this point.
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 10:42 AM 09-24-2010
Hey Harkness,,,
ya the Stewart was the Firehawk G3 Material...

My main goal is to have a screen that looks amazing from Movies to Sports to Video Games...
The Blacks on the SI screen where deep and the whites where not washed out...
A Hockey game is what i watch to judge whites because i know what the ice looks like when i am in the stands watching the game and thats what i try to recreate on the screen..
I am not trying to give the most Theory style scientific review but just a guy who loves a big screen and wants it to give that WOW Factor when watching...
Thanks for you comments i really apprieciate them...
cheers...
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 10:45 AM 09-24-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by bud16415 View Post

Did they give you any information on what screen the projector was calibrated with of the two? Or would anyone familiar with these two screens venture a guess as to how much difference the calibration might be?

No clue as to the calibration..
This is a high end AV Custom Theater store and this was there main show room.....
Sorry i know it was calibrated but just dont know to what...
bud16415's Avatar bud16415 11:28 AM 09-24-2010
Rich is very correct on all his points, and the reason I mentioned calibration is that it is very hard to do A vs B comparisons because our eyes are also an adjustable device and they take in all the information in front of them and adjust aperture to display the greatest contrast ratio to the brain they can. There is contrast and then there is perceived contrast.
With a darker pigmented screen that is neutral in its ability to send back equal amounts of the colors of light works just like a white screen would except it absorbs some of that light also equally. When ambient is around it absorbs some of that also and that’s a good thing. In order to get the light back to our eyes required we ether need a brighter projector or a surface like Rich described that has gain, that takes light from the side seats and puts it to the center seats. And that’s the nature of what causes hot spots.
Ambient light in the room or ambient light caused by the projector bouncing light off walls, ceiling and objects is always going to be there to some extent. Brighter projectors and darker screens or darker screens with more gain aid in restoring perception contrast.

Like the white ice it looks white in comparison to what is dark in the image and the state your eye is in while watching.

It’s kind of a hard concept to get your mind around at first that all these different levels of black we see are really the same on the screen. I have a picture I edited that kind of helps explain it. I cut and pasted the same building below several times across this image where the surrounding background changed. I didn’t alter the color of the black at all, and the deepest black that can be projected is the black the projector is self masking around the border, even though our eyes see much darker blacks in the image. If you don’t believe your eyes use a color picker tool and measure the RGB number of the image at several places.




Kevin 3000's Avatar Kevin 3000 05:57 AM 09-29-2010
http://www.avforums.com/tv/index.php

A Black Diamond in action at CEDIA.
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 08:28 AM 09-29-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin 3000 View Post

http://www.avforums.com/tv/index.php

A Black Diamond in action at CEDIA.

Nice,,,
SI 2.35 screen is one of the best on the market...
I personally believe that the 2.35 or the 2.40 is the way of the future and will be the common size in about 2-3 yrs...
With this video showing an actual 2.35 projector eliminating the need for a add on lens is also i think the future for projectors.
When they come out i will be ready to get the wifes approval to upgrade again,
just glad its a few yrs away...
....

So looks like for my Room i am going to go with the Epson 9700ub and
a 113 inch 1.4 gain screen from SI.
Also going to upgrade my speakers to paridigm CC390 for Center and Tower 9 series for left right...
this will match my adp 390 in that same monitor series..
i will keep my energy Maple C-R3 for Left,Right Presence Ch.
and will sell my Maple/Silver C-R3 2 pairs on this site or Ebay...

Going to upgrade the Popcorn hour a-110 to the C200 and
upgrade my Dish 722 to the Dish 922 receiver..
just need to add a popcorn machine in the back of the room and the make over will be complete...
rdjam's Avatar rdjam 12:48 PM 09-29-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by fraisa View Post

Okay got my samples today of the black diamond si .8 and 1.4
and went into my local av shop and put the screen samples on the screen
Definetly 1.4 had better blacks and whiter whites then the .8 screen....
but what concerns me is there is speckal on the samples for both 1.4 and .8 ...
If this speckle is on the screen material thats definetly not good...
Also even as the screen performance was Impressive...
there is limited stock in canada

So for me still havent made up my mind ( Thought i did but still undecided)

The 1.4 gain SI BD II does have some more structure to it, from the reflective backing. Any closer that 12 or 14 feet and I do notice it in the bright parts of the picture. But at 16 feet I think you'd be safe. I'll measure my sitting distance tonight and give you some more feedback.
rdjam's Avatar rdjam 12:56 PM 09-29-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by fraisa View Post

quote.....Another happy demo this screen is the dogs dodars....
dude i am from Canada so dont really know what you mean by the above.....lol

I heard a bunch of phrases like this when I lived in England.

If something is really great, as in "da bomb", it can be referred to as "the bee's knees", or, in this case, "the dog's b*ll**ks"

Your moment of revelation upon seeing the Black Diamond II screen in action, was the same feeling I got when I first saw it. I just had to have it immediately. I've never looked back - it is an awesome upgrade to my home theater. Plus I generally watch the news and TV with the lights on, just fine.

The only downside, is that I'm not using the regular TV so much and am putting WAY too many hours on my bulb as a result!
fraisa's Avatar fraisa 05:07 PM 09-29-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

I heard a bunch of phrases like this when I lived in England.

If something is really great, as in "da bomb", it can be referred to as "the bee's knees", or, in this case, "the dog's b*ll**ks"

Your moment of revelation upon seeing the Black Diamond II screen in action, was the same feeling I got when I first saw it. I just had to have it immediately. I've never looked back - it is an awesome upgrade to my home theater. Plus I generally watch the news and TV with the lights on, just fine.

The only downside, is that I'm not using the regular TV so much and am putting WAY too many hours on my bulb as a result!

did you measure your seating distance?
send's Avatar send 07:41 PM 09-29-2010
Here are several Black Diamond screen videos including the one from AVS!

NOTE: you will see the Black Diamond Motorized screen prototype in action on the CEDIA 2010 trade show floor. The light on the show floor was a measured 28 foot-candles of ambient light coming from all directions.

http://www.screeninnovations.com/cat...iamond-videos/
bud16415's Avatar bud16415 08:19 AM 09-30-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by send View Post

Here are several Black Diamond screen videos including the one from AVS!

NOTE: you will see the Black Diamond Motorized screen prototype in action on the CEDIA 2010 trade show floor. The light on the show floor was a measured 28 foot-candles of ambient light coming from all directions.

http://www.screeninnovations.com/cat...iamond-videos/

I just watched the videos and I always have the same few questions maybe someone could answer.

When they compare their screen with the white screen, what screen was the projectors gray scale calibrated to?

How can a screen improve the contrast ratio 900% ? Are they saying it improves what the projector is capable of doing? Or is it comparing contrast ratio off a highly dispersive white screen compared to a directional dark screen, being subjected to side angled ambient light.

I'm a proponent of dark screens, I just think some of the comparisons are smoke and mirrors. The images look amazing given the ambient light why not just turn it on and let people see for themselves without the tricks and hype?

Last question: Does anyone know how many lumens they were hitting the screen with, or better incoming foot lamberts?
Kirnak's Avatar Kirnak 05:27 PM 05-19-2011
Fraisa,

It's been my understanding--though I could be wrong--that you are a Black Diamond dealer. In fact In a post I made directed at you I stated that you were a dealer. You did not confirm that you were, but neither did you deny it. So, for the record, are you a dealer or do you sell Black Diamond screens? Thanks, I think it's important to know where people are coming from.
Benito Joaquin's Avatar Benito Joaquin 05:50 PM 05-22-2011
I do believe it's been confirmed that he is a dealer and a strong supporter of Screen Innovations.

Benito
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