New High Contrast High Power Discussion Thread - Page 10 - AVS Forum
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post #271 of 429 Old 01-15-2012, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

In dedicated rooms, most of the time the largest light source in the room is the screen.

If the room is truly 'dedicated' it should have light absorbing material on the side walls and ceiling, at least out ~ 6 ft or more from the screen wall. The ProtoStar material is the best there is, but any kind of black material is useful.
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post #272 of 429 Old 02-16-2012, 03:41 PM
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So I can't decide between the plain High Power, and the High Contrast High Power.

What is the concensus on this HCHP, are the issues with this screen a deal breaker? Have any compared samples to the HP 2.4 and prefered one or the other?

I'm looking to get a 92" screen for 2d/3d to use in a completely light controlled room. Walls are dark grey, however the ceiling is white (I'll install some black felt to cover the portion directly above the screen.

I'll be using it with a Acer 3D DLP. I'm looking a boost for brightness in 3D over my painted wall, but still have a good picture in 2D.

Any suggestions are welcome.
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post #273 of 429 Old 02-16-2012, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xavier1 View Post

So I can't decide between the plain High Power, and the High Contrast High Power.

What is the concensus on this HCHP, are the issues with this screen a deal breaker? Have any compared samples to the HP 2.4 and prefered one or the other?

I'm looking to get a 92" screen for 2d/3d to use in a completely light controlled room. Walls are dark grey, however the ceiling is white (I'll install some black felt to cover the portion directly above the screen.

I'll be using it with a Acer 3D DLP. I'm looking a boost for brightness in 3D over my painted wall, but still have a good picture in 2D.

Any suggestions are welcome.

I got samples of both, putting them up on the wall at the 4 corners of my newly planned screen. In my case I found the HCHP to show noticeably brightness fall off at the extreme sides of the screen. But I sit quite close to a very large screen, so the pj has to be back a ways behind my head; the narrower viewing angle of the HCHP thus really came into play for my configuration, while for the std HP2.4 it did not. And since I have light absorbing material of side walls and ceiling, the wider viewing angle of the std HPhad no down sides for me.

I can only recommend that you get samples of both from Dalite and check it out for your own situation.
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post #274 of 429 Old 02-16-2012, 05:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xavier1 View Post

So I can't decide between the plain High Power, and the High Contrast High Power.

What is the concensus on this HCHP, are the issues with this screen a deal breaker? Have any compared samples to the HP 2.4 and prefered one or the other?

I'm looking to get a 92" screen for 2d/3d to use in a completely light controlled room. Walls are dark grey, however the ceiling is white (I'll install some black felt to cover the portion directly above the screen.

I'll be using it with a Acer 3D DLP. I'm looking a boost for brightness in 3D over my painted wall, but still have a good picture in 2D.

Any suggestions are welcome.

I would go with the standard. You want as much light as possible with 3D from what I am told. You would also want a white screen in a room such as yours not a gray screen. Get the samples and take a look for your self.
I have a small HP 2.8 and have compared the 2.4 and the HCHP 2.4 on my 2.8 and would pick the 2.4 over the HC in a dark room. Fortunately I have the 2.8 which I like better than either of the currently available HP screens.
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post #275 of 429 Old 02-17-2012, 07:18 AM
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I have both the HP2.4 and the HCHP at home. IMO the HCHP is better in a reflective room if you can handle the viewing angles. If your eyes are not more than 3-4 ft away from the lens at my throw (about 12 feet) the image looks absolutely amazing (I have a 3 seat sofa and all seats are in the sweetspot). However, if you are further out than that brightness and image punch/saturation drops rapidly. Also, if you sit far ahead of the projector the image suffer from non-uniformity issues like millerwill reported. Close to the PJ the image looks perfectly uniform though.

Summary. The HCHP will suffer less from reflections and retain a slightly better contrast and color saturation. However, the HP would be a better choice if you have wide seats or the PJ far from the seating position.
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post #276 of 429 Old 02-17-2012, 08:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drexler View Post

I have both the HP2.4 and the HCHP at home. IMO the HCHP is better in a reflective room if you can handle the viewing angles. If your eyes are not more than 3-4 ft away from the lens at my throw (about 12 feet) the image looks absolutely amazing (I have a 3 seat sofa and all seats are in the sweetspot). However, if you are further out than that brightness and image punch/saturation drops rapidly. Also, if you sit far ahead of the projector the image suffer from non-uniformity issues like millerwill reported. Close to the PJ the image looks perfectly uniform though.

Summary. The HCHP will suffer less from reflections and retain a slightly better contrast and color saturation. However, the HP would be a better choice if you have wide seats or the PJ far from the seating position.

This is very consistent with all my observations.
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post #277 of 429 Old 02-17-2012, 09:49 AM
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Drexler, Millerwill, and airscapes, thank you all for your input. As my room is not reflective, I'll probably end up going with the regular HP. I will try the samples first as suggested however.

Brighter light output for 3D is the main reason for getting a screen, as I've been quite happy with my painted white wall otherwise.
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post #278 of 429 Old 06-22-2012, 10:47 AM
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I've read all posts on this thread and thanks for so much information. I would appreciate any input of my final decision, just in case I missed something.
I've got a 850 ansi lumen 11S2 that will be 14.2 feet away from a 106" x 45" viewing area wide HCHP screen(115" diag). I'm sitting 13.5 feet from the
screen with the projector 2.5 ft up from me. My room is totally light controlled with no light reflections.
I the only thing I'm not to sure of is, would the ftl be the same from a grey screen as a white screen with the same gain?
I think this setup will work but it's my final setup and I want to be sure..Thanks for any thoughts
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post #279 of 429 Old 06-22-2012, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chewbacco View Post

I've read all posts on this thread and thanks for so much information. I would appreciate any input of my final decision, just in case I missed something.
I've got a 850 ansi lumen 11S2 that will be 14.2 feet away from a 106" x 45" viewing area wide HCHP screen(115" diag). I'm sitting 13.5 feet from the
screen with the projector 2.5 ft up from me. My room is totally light controlled with no light reflections.
I the only thing I'm not to sure of is, would the ftl be the same from a grey screen as a white screen with the same gain?
I think this setup will work but it's my final setup and I want to be sure..Thanks for any thoughts


If the gain is the same, the ftL will be the same.

 

One thing I would suggest you be sure of is whether or not the HC version of the new HP2.4 will have a wide enough viewing angle for you.   I got samples of the HC and the std HP2.4, and for my 144"W screen, sitting 11ft away, found that even in the sweet spot--with the projector ~ 3-4 ft behind my head (and a ft or 2 above it)--the HC version gave noticeable brightness fall off at the left and right edges of the screen.   The std HP2.4 was uniform in brightness over the whole screen.

 

Also, if you have good light control as you describe, I don't see the point of going with the HC version.

 

Anyway, just my thoughts.   If you haven't gotten samples of both the std and HC versions of the HP2.4 and put them up at the 4 corners of your screen area, I would strongly recommend that you do so, to verify the uniform brightness issue.

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post #280 of 429 Old 06-22-2012, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post


If the gain is the same, the ftL will be the same.

One thing I would suggest you be sure of is whether or not the HC version of the new HP2.4 will have a wide enough viewing angle for you.   I got samples of the HC and the std HP2.4, and for my 144"W screen, sitting 11ft away, found that even in the sweet spot--with the projector ~ 3-4 ft behind my head (and a ft or 2 above it)--the HC version gave noticeable brightness fall off at the left and right edges of the screen.   The std HP2.4 was uniform in brightness over the whole screen.

Also, if you have good light control as you describe, I don't see the point of going with the HC version.

Anyway, just my thoughts.   If you haven't gotten samples of both the std and HC versions of the HP2.4 and put them up at the 4 corners of your screen area, I would strongly recommend that you do so, to verify the uniform brightness issue.
I thought that would be the case, but the grey vs white material threw me. I have several samples of both versions and I've tested them. I really like the rich color saturation of the HC and the deeper black level, although every thing is calibrated to the 2.8 I taped them to.
I appreciate your thoughts millerwill, the sweet spot will be smaller than I'd like, but then it's seldom more than my wife and I sitting in the middle, but uniform brightness also sound good..food for thought.
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post #281 of 429 Old 06-22-2012, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chewbacco View Post


I thought that would be the case, but the grey vs white material threw me. I have several samples of both versions and I've tested them. I really like the rich color saturation of the HC and the deeper black level, although every thing is calibrated to the 2.8 I taped them to.
I appreciate your thoughts millerwill, the sweet spot will be smaller than I'd like, but then it's seldom more than my wife and I sitting in the middle, but uniform brightness also sound good..food for thought.


Sounds like you've already considered everything I mentioned!    With your viewing distance and screen size the I agree that the smaller viewing angle of the HC screen will probably not be an issue as it was for me.    Also, with a JVC RS20 before, and now a Sony SXRD (1000ES), the o/f CR is higher than for a dlp, so again the HC screen may be a better choice for you than for me.

 

Good luck; sounds like it's going to be a beautiful setup!

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post #282 of 429 Old 06-22-2012, 11:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post


Sounds like you've already considered everything I mentioned!    With your viewing distance and screen size the I agree that the smaller viewing angle of the HC screen will probably not be an issue as it was for me.    Also, with a JVC RS20 before, and now a Sony SXRD (1000ES), the o/f CR is higher than for a dlp, so again the HC screen may be a better choice for you than for me.

Good luck; sounds like it's going to be a beautiful setup!
Thanks so much. I've tried to do my homework before posting, but it's good to talk with folks with the same interests and air out your thoughts. I'm pretty excited, a little bit of remodeling and the I'm jumping into the fire!! biggrin.gif.
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post #283 of 429 Old 06-26-2012, 10:45 AM
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Hi Guys,

I'm in the preliminary planning stages of a quasi dedicated Home Theater Room in a loft conversion. A Murphy Bed needs to go in the room and it can only be on the wall the projector needs to be on. I want a High Gain screen like the 2.4 HP's for use with 3D and a PTAE7000. These means I want the PJ as close to eye level as possible. Table or ceiling mounting is not possible. Centering the AE7000 lens in relation to the screen is not possible as that point is within the foot print of the Murphy bed in the Folded away position. Giving away some Gain to enable mounting the PJ higher on top of the Custom Murphy Bed wall to wall unit is not possible because that puts the PJ Lens out of the Vertical foot print of the screen which prevents the Auto Aspect ratio switching for my 100" Wide Cinemascope screen.

After some research I see that the Horizontal lens shift of this PJ is +or- 26%. I assume this means 26 inches on a 100" wide screen. If my assumption is correct this means I could mount the PJ on a shelf of the unit just above head height and offset from the centre line of the screen 26 inches which is outside the foot print of the Murphybed. While I need to ask the guys in the AE7000 thread whether this horzontal lens shift offset will affect the Auto aspect ratio switching, you are the guys to ask about the affect on gain.

The room is 124" wide. The large couch that butts up against the murphy bed is 122" wide. The screen is 100" Wide. The PJ lens will be about 15' back from the screen. The eye position seated is about 14" back from the screen. In short, the seating area is within the boundaries of the screen width and 14' back.

I did a previous test using the gain calculator which I have since lost on my PC and can't find which gave me 2.2 gain for the hot seat with a centered PJ over the head. Inputting that into the Projector Central calc gave me approx. 32 foot Lamberts with the AE7000. Thats pretty amazing !! eek.gifbiggrin.gif

However, what effect would moving the PJ 26 inches offset from the centerline have on gain. Does the hotseat just shift to the outside seat of the couch on that side but the far side still stays within the 30º cone. Or does the cone shift with the PJ (even though the screen didn't move in relation to the seating) which puts the seat on the far side of the couch outside of the cone??
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post #284 of 429 Old 06-26-2012, 11:12 AM
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LOL. No sooner do I post than I find the gain calculator. I've inputted the HP2.4 figures. What should I change for the HCHP. Actually do I need the HC or would it siut the room. Screen is mounted 1ft from the floor so top of screen is about 4ft away from the bulk of the ceiling except for the top left side due the the sloping loft ceiling. Walls probably will be coffee coloured.

anyway, here is a screen shot of the calc for my room. Have I input everything correctly and what inputs should I change for the HCHP.

7449221930_f503ab1c23_b.jpg

Its certainly lookin' good. 2.14-2.01 gain from one side of the couch to the other with the PJ offset from the centreline by 26"
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post #285 of 429 Old 06-26-2012, 10:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by calibos View Post

Hi Guys,
I'm in the preliminary planning stages of a quasi dedicated Home Theater Room in a loft conversion. A Murphy Bed needs to go in the room and it can only be on the wall the projector needs to be on. I want a High Gain screen like the 2.4 HP's for use with 3D and a PTAE7000. These means I want the PJ as close to eye level as possible. Table or ceiling mounting is not possible. Centering the AE7000 lens in relation to the screen is not possible as that point is within the foot print of the Murphy bed in the Folded away position. Giving away some Gain to enable mounting the PJ higher on top of the Custom Murphy Bed wall to wall unit is not possible because that puts the PJ Lens out of the Vertical foot print of the screen which prevents the Auto Aspect ratio switching for my 100" Wide Cinemascope screen.
After some research I see that the Horizontal lens shift of this PJ is +or- 26%. I assume this means 26 inches on a 100" wide screen. If my assumption is correct this means I could mount the PJ on a shelf of the unit just above head height and offset from the centre line of the screen 26 inches which is outside the foot print of the Murphybed. While I need to ask the guys in the AE7000 thread whether this horzontal lens shift offset will affect the Auto aspect ratio switching, you are the guys to ask about the affect on gain.
The room is 124" wide. The large couch that butts up against the murphy bed is 122" wide. The screen is 100" Wide. The PJ lens will be about 15' back from the screen. The eye position seated is about 14" back from the screen. In short, the seating area is within the boundaries of the screen width and 14' back.
I did a previous test using the gain calculator which I have since lost on my PC and can't find which gave me 2.2 gain for the hot seat with a centered PJ over the head. Inputting that into the Projector Central calc gave me approx. 32 foot Lamberts with the AE7000. Thats pretty amazing !! eek.gifbiggrin.gif
However, what effect would moving the PJ 26 inches offset from the centerline have on gain. Does the hotseat just shift to the outside seat of the couch on that side but the far side still stays within the 30º cone. Or does the cone shift with the PJ (even though the screen didn't move in relation to the seating) which puts the seat on the far side of the couch outside of the cone??


I suggest that you get some 4 screen sample pieces (about 1 ft sq) of the HCHP and also of the regular HP.    Put them up at the 4 corners of where you plan your screen to be and see how it looks with various pj locations that are possible for you.     It's good to try to do it all via theoretical calculations, but to be SURE do the experiment!

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post #286 of 429 Old 12-01-2012, 02:01 PM
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I have a 120" 1.85:1 brilliant white Carada (1.3 gain) in my living room which has absolutely no light control and a massive bay window that runs the length of the 20' room. Main viewing is 20' from the screen with the projector 3' above our head. I'm going to swap out my screen for a 2.35:1 screen because I'm not always in the mood to watch movies in my theater. I need all the brightness I can get in my living room, so was looking at going high power. Would you suggest the HCHP or the regular HP?
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post #287 of 429 Old 12-01-2012, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malichai View Post

I have a 120" 1.85:1 brilliant white Carada (1.3 gain) in my living room which has absolutely no light control and a massive bay window that runs the length of the 20' room. Main viewing is 20' from the screen with the projector 3' above our head. I'm going to swap out my screen for a 2.35:1 screen because I'm not always in the mood to watch movies in my theater. I need all the brightness I can get in my living room, so was looking at going high power. Would you suggest the HCHP or the regular HP?

It depends on the the viewing angles that will be relevant in your situation.   I sit ~ 1.0 SW for my screen (~12 ft for a 12 ft wide screen, with the projector lens at ~ 16 ft from the screen and projecting just above my head), and from the a center seat I found (from samples I got from Dalite) that the HPHC material showed a noticeably dimmer image at the extreme edges of the screen, while the normal HP2.4 showed no such dimming.    I thus got the std HP2.4 material and have been extremely pleased with it.

 

I note, though, that I have no external light coming into the room.

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post #288 of 429 Old 12-01-2012, 03:01 PM
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First off neither of these is magic.. gota loss the window light or you won't get much improvement over your current screen.
That said, you gota lower the projector to gain anything much more than you currently have.
Order samples of the 2 fabrics and see which one is brightest in your room.
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post #289 of 429 Old 12-13-2012, 09:11 AM
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I ended up purchasing a 106" High Contras High Power screen after reading through this thread. I have some general questions about my new theatre room setup. To avoid getting this thread off-track, I started a new thread:
New Epson 5020 owner, Da-Lite HCHP 106" screen w/room, zoom, offset & placement questions

If anyone has the time or interest, please take a look at my thread and provide feedback.

Thanks!
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post #290 of 429 Old 12-13-2012, 04:40 PM
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Anyone have the gain curve of the HCHP or the adjustments for the gain calculator spreadsheet?

"A wide screen just makes a bad film twice as bad. "
-Samuel Goldwyn

I wonder what he'd think about 3D IMAX?
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post #291 of 429 Old 12-13-2012, 05:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dougri View Post

Anyone have the gain curve of the HCHP or the adjustments for the gain calculator spreadsheet?

700

Here is the gain curve for the old 2.8 HP compared to the new 2.4 HP, but not the HC version.    The HC2.4 has a much narrower viewing cone than the standard 2.4.    I got samples of both of these new 2.4 screens and found that the HC version showed noticeably fall off in brightness on the L and R sides of the screen.    This is probably because I have a pretty large screen, 12 ft wide, and sit pretty close, 12 ft.     

 

For this reason, though, I got the std 2.4HP and have been delighted with it; it gives an even smoother pic than my older HP2.8 screen, which was already very good in this regard.    However I have external light in the room, and light absorbing material on ceiling and side walls around the screen.

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post #292 of 429 Old 12-13-2012, 06:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

700

Here is the gain curve for the old 2.8 HP compared to the new 2.4 HP, but not the HC version.    The HC2.4 has a much narrower viewing cone than the standard 2.4.    I got samples of both of these new 2.4 screens and found that the HC version showed noticeably fall off in brightness on the L and R sides of the screen.    This is probably because I have a pretty large screen, 12 ft wide, and sit pretty close, 12 ft.     

For this reason, though, I got the std 2.4HP and have been delighted with it; it gives an even smoother pic than my older HP2.8 screen, which was already very good in this regard.    However I have external light in the room, and light absorbing material on ceiling and side walls around the screen.

Where'd you get those curves & does one exist for the HCHP? Did you generate these yourself?
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post #293 of 429 Old 12-13-2012, 07:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarangiman View Post


Where'd you get those curves & does one exist for the HCHP? Did you generate these yourself?


From post #482 in the thread "Da-lite Hi Power New or Old what did you get?" in the 'Screens' forum.   I've not seen such a curve for the HCHP.

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post #294 of 429 Old 12-13-2012, 08:46 PM
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Dalite today told me they'd email the chart to me. If they come through, I'll post it here.

"A wide screen just makes a bad film twice as bad. "
-Samuel Goldwyn

I wonder what he'd think about 3D IMAX?
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post #295 of 429 Old 12-13-2012, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dougri View Post

Dalite today told me they'd email the chart to me. If they come through, I'll post it here.


Thanks!   Will be interesting to see it in comparison to the others.

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post #296 of 429 Old 12-18-2012, 02:11 PM
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Thanks to the fine folks at Da-Lite for providing the gain curve:


"A wide screen just makes a bad film twice as bad. "
-Samuel Goldwyn

I wonder what he'd think about 3D IMAX?
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post #297 of 429 Old 12-18-2012, 02:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dougri View Post

Thanks to the fine folks at Da-Lite for providing the gain curve:

Jeez. The HCHP levels off at half the gain of the HP? Seems a little unbelievable, given the measurements I made of HCHP (grey) vs HP (black) vs. Elite 1.1 matte white (dotted black) material from my seating position ('Position on Screen' axis indicates the portion of the screen I'm viewing from my sitting position... -10 is actually upper left corner and +10 is upper right corner):



I'll try & quantitate some off axis viewing gains though later tonight.
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post #298 of 429 Old 12-18-2012, 03:22 PM
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Are we sure those other charts came from Da-Lite? I guess I could ask for the regular (2.4) HP chart since this one was a bit surprising.

"A wide screen just makes a bad film twice as bad. "
-Samuel Goldwyn

I wonder what he'd think about 3D IMAX?
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post #299 of 429 Old 12-18-2012, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by dougri View Post

Are we sure those other charts came from Da-Lite? I guess I could ask for the regular (2.4) HP chart since this one was a bit surprising.

Yeah the other ones (HP & original HP 2.8) look like they were plotted in Excel & don't look like they came from Da-Lite. Could you ask for a HP trace straight from Da-Lite?

The one I posted was my own; I made measurements shooting RAW with my Canon 5D Mark III.

I'm making some measurements right now from fairly off-axis. My previous chart measured the difference in gain at the extreme corners from the center seating position, which might not be that off-axis (hence the HCHP may not look so bad in my experiment).

Now that I'm shooting well off-axis, the HCHP does look like its gain drops a lot. I'll have some actual numbers momentarily.
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post #300 of 429 Old 12-18-2012, 03:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarangiman View Post

Yeah the other ones (HP & original HP 2.8) look like they were plotted in Excel & don't look like they came from Da-Lite. Could you ask for a HP trace straight from Da-Lite?

Done... Will post when I receive it.

"A wide screen just makes a bad film twice as bad. "
-Samuel Goldwyn

I wonder what he'd think about 3D IMAX?
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