Planning to go to 166" scope screen - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 7 Old 01-30-2012, 01:23 PM - Thread Starter
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I'd love some input:
Currently I have a 135" 16:9 Elite screen which is 1.0 gain, I believe. It is 14.5 feet from a JVC HD250 in a light controlled dark room. On low light and with the aperture setting closed to its lowest level, the projector is more than bright enough with about 300 hours on the projector. (As it ages, I will open the aperture.)

I am considering upgrading in the next year to a 166" wide scope screen. The height would be very similar to the current 135" 16:9 screen that I have. I can move the projector, or more likely its replacement, back to about 18 feet to make it capable of projecting 166" scope images. I will plan to manually or automatically zoom to fit 16:9 versus scope films.

I will hope to have the capacity to project 2D and 3D material.

Would the Da-Lite 1.3 gain cinema vision or even lower gain material from Elite have a chance with such a big image? The Da-lite pearlescent at 1.5 gain is also possible.

If I upgrade to a brighter projector such as the new Panasonic/Epson or JVC 45, could I have a bright enough picture with 1-1.3 gain material? I am afraid I will have to go even higher gain and then I run the risk of having a narrow viewing cone when guests come and fill off center chairs in my theater room.

Any thoughts?

Thanks.
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post #2 of 7 Old 01-31-2012, 05:17 PM
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I've been following the JVC RS45 thread, and although it's a fairly bright projector, I don't think it has the lumen output to light up a screen that big, especially once the bulb ages. When you throw 3D into the equation, the projectors you mention won't even come close to lighting up a 166" wide screen. I think for a screen that size with a gain of 1 -1.3, you will need to look at a projector that is a lot brighter than the JVC, Pannasonic, or Epson models. It appears that the new Sony VW1000 will adequately light up that size screen, and for sure the Sim2 Nero will work, but you are looking at spending a lot more money on these projectors than the JVC and Panny. I'm in the same boat as you though, I want a 160" wide 2.35 screen, but I'm not having any luck finding a projector under 15K that will give me the kind of brightness I need. One possible exception might be the BenQ 7000. In torch mode it might give you the lumens you need, but the native contrast on that projector is much less than what I would like.

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post #3 of 7 Old 01-31-2012, 06:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phisch View Post

I've been following the JVC RS45 thread, and although it's a fairly bright projector, I don't think it has the lumen output to light up a screen that big, especially once the bulb ages. When you throw 3D into the equation, the projectors you mention won't even come close to lighting up a 166" wide screen. I think for a screen that size with a gain of 1 -1.3, you will need to look at a projector that is a lot brighter than the JVC, Pannasonic, or Epson models. It appears that the new Sony VW1000 will adequately light up that size screen, and for sure the Sim2 Nero will work, but you are looking at spending a lot more money on these projectors than the JVC and Panny. I'm in the same boat as you though, I want a 160" wide 2.35 screen, but I'm not having any luck finding a projector under 15K that will give me the kind of brightness I need. One possible exception might be the BenQ 7000. In torch mode it might give you the lumens you need, but the native contrast on that projector is much less than what I would like.

Mike

If the w7000 can do it, the epson 5010 can do it even better, and you can run it in living room mode and not the brightest dynamic torch mode. Living room was tested at almost 1900 lumens on a 1.0 gain screen. Even with significant bulb dimming - say down to 1100 lumens or so, you can still have almost 14 foot lamberts on a 166 scope screen. Any additional screen gain only accrues to your benefit.
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post #4 of 7 Old 02-01-2012, 05:19 AM
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In 3D mode the Epson with a new lamp will give you around 7 or 8 Foot Lamberts using a 1.5 gain 166" wide image. High lamp best image mode for 2D is barely adequate with a new lamp. You would have to using living room and dynamic for 2D. Not something that I would recommend. I agree, you need a lot more projector, if you want to light up a screen that size.

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post #5 of 7 Old 02-01-2012, 04:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

If the w7000 can do it, the epson 5010 can do it even better

Not really.....The W7000 will do a calibrated D65 image at about 1500 lumens while the 5010 can only do about 600-700 lumens calibrated to D65. The W7000 will also do almost 2000 lumens in dynamic vs. 1900 on the 5010. According to projectorreviews (Art) the 5010 living room is only 1375. And lastly, I can assure you the W7000 will look much better in those brighter torch modes if you will than any LCD.....

The one thing the 5010 does better and brighter is 3D.

Lastly, if you go to a big screen you will need to make trade offs. If you are one of those inky black level lovers and that is the most important aspect to you then you do not want to go with this large a screen...You will give up black levels for a big screen because you need more light...simple fact....even if you go with a high dollar projector you are going to get a brighter image but not really better black levels. I however love my big screen and live just fine without those "inky" blacks. My black levels are still far better than a commercial theater.

I have a 165" 16x9 screen and now considering the W1000 very seriously.....and yes that projector is a huge price jump from what I normally spend....but I think it may be worth it as it seems to have a lot going for it. Mainly 2000 calibrated D65 lumens, 10,000 to 1 native CR, and sharp as a tack due to higher end optics and 4K. Throw in what is coming out to be good 3D and compatibility with future 4K blu-ray and you have what I think will be my ideal projector. Anyway I digress....
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post #6 of 7 Old 02-01-2012, 06:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dangc View Post

Not really.....The W7000 will do a calibrated D65 image at about 1500 lumens while the 5010 can only do about 600-700 lumens calibrated to D65. The W7000 will also do almost 2000 lumens in dynamic vs. 1900 on the 5010. According to projectorreviews (Art) the 5010 living room is only 1375. And lastly, I can assure you the W7000 will look much better in those brighter torch modes if you will than any LCD.....

The one thing the 5010 does better and brighter is 3D.

Lastly, if you go to a big screen you will need to make trade offs. If you are one of those inky black level lovers and that is the most important aspect to you then you do not want to go with this large a screen...You will give up black levels for a big screen because you need more light...simple fact....even if you go with a high dollar projector you are going to get a brighter image but not really better black levels. I however love my big screen and live just fine without those "inky" blacks. My black levels are still far better than a commercial theater.

I have a 165" 16x9 screen and now considering the W1000 very seriously.....and yes that projector is a huge price jump from what I normally spend....but I think it may be worth it as it seems to have a lot going for it. Mainly 2000 calibrated D65 lumens, 10,000 to 1 native CR, and sharp as a tack due to higher end optics and 4K. Throw in what is coming out to be good 3D and compatibility with future 4K blu-ray and you have what I think will be my ideal projector. Anyway I digress....

Bill at Projectorcentral said the 5010 dynamic mode is 2798 lumens. I don't know there would be such a variance between the two measurements. Art did a quick cal (just to tweak the color) on the 5010 before measuring the lumens in dynamic but hard to believe it would lose 900 lumens in the process.

If one is trying to fill a 166 screen with a "bright" image and spend under 10 grand to do so, one will have to give up a D65 calibration, so I don't think that is even a consideration.

Agree on the tradeoffs - there is no magic bullet for inky blacks on a huge screen at any reasonable price.

I have seen the living room modes on a few epsons and it would be an acceptable tradeoff for me in exchange for a huge screen. Others may not feel the same, of course.
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post #7 of 7 Old 02-02-2012, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

Bill at Projectorcentral said the 5010 dynamic mode is 2798 lumens. I don't know there would be such a variance between the two measurements. Art did a quick cal (just to tweak the color) on the 5010 before measuring the lumens in dynamic but hard to believe it would lose 900 lumens in the process.

Agreed, I don't know how they can be that far apart...strange. Regardless, that 2798 number will not produce any kind of picture you want to watch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

If one is trying to fill a 166 screen with a "bright" image and spend under 10 grand to do so, one will have to give up a D65 calibration, so I don't think that is even a consideration.

If you want a "bright" image I agree. But you can have an acceptable D65 image with something like the W7000 if you also have a room that is a bat cave...or blacked out. I use an Infocus SP8602 on a 165" screen in a blacked out room and my brightness is ok, just need to replace the bulb every 600 - 700 hours (once a year for me).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

Agree on the tradeoffs - there is no magic bullet for inky blacks on a huge screen at any reasonable price.

At any price

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davecraze View Post

I have seen the living room modes on a few epsons and it would be an acceptable tradeoff for me in exchange for a huge screen. Others may not feel the same, of course.

Maybe but again I would go with the w7000 over the Epson for the big screen and replace the bulb every 600-700 hours.
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