Adapt Seymour XD material to a Stewart Snap frame - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 14 Old 02-03-2014, 01:01 AM - Thread Starter
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I've got a Stewart fixed screen, with the snap based attachment system.

Right now I've got their excellent high gain 2.0 screen material on it.

But I am reworking my system and plan to go for an AT screen, likely from Seymour

Or, rather, screen material from Seymour.....and re-use the Stewart frame.

I have heard about people adding snaps to third party material, to use in a Stewart frame. But after doing some searches, I haven't found anyone that has detailed the process.

Anyone here done this before? Or know of someone who has, and has documented it?

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post #2 of 14 Old 02-03-2014, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan_h View Post

I've got a Stewart fixed screen, with the snap based attachment system.

Right now I've got their excellent high gain 2.0 screen material on it.

But I am reworking my system and plan to go for an AT screen, likely from Seymour

Or, rather, screen material from Seymour.....and re-use the Stewart frame.

I have heard about people adding snaps to third party material, to use in a Stewart frame. But after doing some searches, I haven't found anyone that has detailed the process.

Anyone here done this before? Or know of someone who has, and has documented it?

That will be tough to do, because the XD material has little to no stretch. You can bead the screen in place on the back of the frame. I did that several years ago. Here is the thread: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1180610/screen-conversion-elunevision-frame-with-center-stage-xd-material

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post #3 of 14 Old 02-03-2014, 10:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

That will be tough to do, because the XD material has little to no stretch. You can bead the screen in place on the back of the frame. I did that several years ago. Here is the thread: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1180610/screen-conversion-elunevision-frame-with-center-stage-xd-material

Thanks for the link. What is this 'screen bead'? I followed the link, but it is no longer visible on the Lowes site, and search results don't appear to contain it either.

I was thinking of the snap solution --based on one forum member discussing having done it. But am not confident I am ready to tackle it.

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post #4 of 14 Old 02-04-2014, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by nathan_h View Post

Thanks for the link. What is this 'screen bead'? I followed the link, but it is no longer visible on the Lowes site, and search results don't appear to contain it either.

I was thinking of the snap solution --based on one forum member discussing having done it. But am not confident I am ready to tackle it.

It is called screen tight: http://www.lowes.com/pd_21532-958-BASE18_0__?productId=3024709
Here is the cap: http://www.lowes.com/ProductDisplay?partNumber=21553-958-BRCAP18&langId=-1&storeId=10151&productId=3024741&catalogId=10051&cmRelshp=req&rel=nofollow&cId=PDIO1
Beading the screen in and then snapping the cap in place hold the screen tight as a drum.
You will need this tool: http://www.lowes.com/pd_169387-15369-71459_0__?productId=3138507&Ntt=porch+screening&pl=1&currentURL=%3FNtt%3Dporch%2Bscreening&facetInfo=
You will also need some screen spline: http://www.lowes.com/ProductDisplay?partNumber=42302-15369-70062&langId=-1&storeId=10151&productId=3094495&catalogId=10051&cmRelshp=rel&rel=nofollow&cId=PDIO1 I can't remember what size I used. It may be listed in the thread I posted earlier.

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post #5 of 14 Old 02-04-2014, 02:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Most excellent info! I need to read it closely and digest. Thanks, much.

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post #6 of 14 Old 02-12-2014, 09:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Wondering if anyone has done this with the Falcon material? I've not yet got my Seymour samples, but have been testing out the Falcon material and it looks very promising.

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post #7 of 14 Old 02-13-2014, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan_h View Post

Wondering if anyone has done this with the Falcon material? I've not yet got my Seymour samples, but have been testing out the Falcon material and it looks very promising.

Same system would work with Falcon.

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post #8 of 14 Old 02-13-2014, 04:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks!

I need to pull the Stewart off the wall and remind myself it has the spline-accepting bit.

This may just be the ticket, since I am not able to find a local buyer for the existing Stewart frame and screen. So to keep within budget, buying just material and using the Stewart frame makes the most sense as a plan B. (Plan A of course is to sell the Stewart frame+screen together, which would cover the cost of a Seymour or Falcon solution.)

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post #9 of 14 Old 02-14-2014, 06:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan_h View Post

Thanks!

I need to pull the Stewart off the wall and remind myself it has the spline-accepting bit.

This may just be the ticket, since I am not able to find a local buyer for the existing Stewart frame and screen. So to keep within budget, buying just material and using the Stewart frame makes the most sense as a plan B. (Plan A of course is to sell the Stewart frame+screen together, which would cover the cost of a Seymour or Falcon solution.)


Nathan,

Just a thought!

I understand that Stewart utilizes the snap system for the attachment of their screens to the frame. Are those snaps on the frame attached with screws?

I was thinking that if screws are used to attach the snaps, just maybe you could remove them and replace them with bolts or screws and then utilize the post / o-ring / grommet system like Falcon and Seymour uses.

The Seymour and Falcon screen mounting system is nice because it evenly tensions the screen from all directions in an active constant tension manner. Maybe the Stewart frame snaps could be removed, the remaining holes left could be used for screws or you could maybe even retap the existing snap holes or drill and tap new holes to accept some bolts as posts for a post / grommet / O-ring system ala Falcon/Seymour.

Depending on if there is enough depth on the Stewart aluminum frame extrusion to securely mount bolt/screw posts you could maybe even utilize some sort of hooks to secure the O-rings.

Just some food for thought!


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post #10 of 14 Old 02-14-2014, 06:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Glenn Baumann View Post

Nathan,

Just a thought!

I understand that Stewart utilizes the snap system for the attachment of their screens to the frame. Are those snaps on the frame attached with screws?

I was thinking that if screws are used to attach the snaps, just maybe you could remove them and replace them with bolts or screws and then utilize the post / o-ring / grommet system like Falcon and Seymour uses.

The Seymour and Falcon screen mounting system is nice because it evenly tensions the screen from all directions in an active constant tension manner. Maybe the Stewart frame snaps could be removed, the remaining holes left could be used for screws or you could maybe even retap the existing snap holes or drill and tap new holes to accept some bolts as posts for a post / grommet / O-ring system ala Falcon/Seymour.

Depending on if there is enough depth on the Stewart aluminum frame extrusion to securely mount bolt/screw posts you could maybe even utilize some sort of hooks to secure the O-rings.

Just some food for thought!


...Glenn smile.gif

Not a bad idea. Thanks!

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post #11 of 14 Old 02-14-2014, 06:36 AM
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Here are some links to the Falcon and Seymour Post / Grommet / O-ring mounting systems.

Looks like they utilize some blind nuts that slide along the extrusion for variable adjustability to mount the bolt posts.

http://www.falconscreens.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Falcon-Vision-HD-Screen-Install.pdf

http://www.seymourav.com/screensfixedoring.asp

http://www.seymourav.com/screensfixedjump.asp


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post #12 of 14 Old 02-14-2014, 07:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Baumann View Post

Here are some links to the Falcon and Seymour Post / Grommet / O-ring mounting systems.

Looks like they utilize some blind nuts that slide along the extrusion for variable adjustability to mount the bolt posts.

http://www.falconscreens.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Falcon-Vision-HD-Screen-Install.pdf

http://www.seymourav.com/screensfixedoring.asp

http://www.seymourav.com/screensfixedjump.asp


...Glenn smile.gif

Thanks.

Although I haven't pulled my screen off the wall yet (since it requires dismantling bass traps and moving speakers etc etc) a quick search online found some photos that I think may look like what I remember from five years ago when it went up.

Audioholics, for example:

If this is right, I'm kinda hosed!

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan_h View Post

Thanks.

Although I haven't pulled my screen off the wall yet (since it requires dismantling bass traps and moving speakers etc etc) a quick search online found some photos that I think may look like what I remember from five years ago when it went up.

Audioholics, for example:

If this is right, I'm kinda hosed!


Hosed, Nah!

We just have to think outside the box and get a bit creative... Where there is a will there is a way!

The easiiest and simplest way would be to use the current attachment points which would be the existing snaps. You could take some non streching material and create a very short tab that would have a snap button on one end and a grommet right next to the snap button on the other end and use the appropriate sized O-Ring to attach to an O-Ring installed on the screen material. You would pass the O-Ring through both grommets and then join the O-Ring ends together with something such as a nylon cable tie.

Another way might be to use some inner tube and cut it into strips that would loop through some wide enough grommets that are installed on the screen and then you double up the inner tube at the snap end and install a snap through the two layers joined at the snap end and snap it on the existing frame snap hardware. This would give you a tab for snap attachment and the benefit of constant active tensioning at the same time. You could also maybe use NO Grommet on the screen material and use Snap fasteners on the screen AND the Frame. That way you could experiment easily as you go along and create various inner tube strips of varying lengths and strengths via (1) or if needed (2) layers of material. You can then easily snap the tensioning tabs on and off at will!

Instead of attaching to the thinner horizontal portion of the frame where the snaps are located you could also somehow attach to the thicker vertical boxed portion of the frame with some sort of ring, eye or hook and again use the O-Ring attachment method. If you cant drill and screw or drill and tap you can drill and use pop rivets to attach your attachment hardware of choice. You would probably want to attach as low as possible on the vertical boxed portion of the frame so the screen stays as close as possible to the thin edge of the frame where the screen and frame meet.

Keep in mind that if you try to use the existing snaps you would be relegated to using only that given amount of tensioning points. Is that enough tensioning points and are they spaced appropriately? Maybe, maybe not... you will have to figure that out. It looks like there are quite a few attachment points on the Falcon and Seymour screens. If you can install your own attachment points you can have as many as needed or the snap points might indeed be enough.

***NOTE: Should you want to ADD any additional Snap Fittings, a company called Sailrite sells a tool called the Snaprite Surface Mount Stud Die ($24.95) that attaches to a Pop Rivet Tool to properly install additional Snap fittings to the frame. Be sure the depth where you want to mount is of course conducive to the use of a pop rivet.

***NOTE: If you should want to REMOVE any of the frame Snap Fittings you can just simply drill them out with the appropriate sized drill bit.

***NOTE: Snap Fastener Kits for screen and attachment tabs here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/190992679159?lpid=82
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Quality-LEATHER-Canvas-SNAP-FASTNER-KIT-W-TOOLS-24-/200227467027?_trksid=p2054897.l4276

HINT: Just be sure that the Snap Fastener Kit you get can handle the thickness of the tab material / inner tube / fabric etc. you will be sandwiching as in 1, 2 or 3 layers etc!



There you go, some ideas to get the creative juices flowing! biggrin.gif

Good Luck!


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post #14 of 14 Old 02-14-2014, 12:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn Baumann View Post

Hosed, Nah!

We just have to think outside the box and get a bit creative... Where there is a will there is a way!

The easiiest and simplest way would be to use the current attachment points which would be the existing snaps. You could take some non streching material and create a very short tab that would have a snap button on one end and a grommet right next to the snap button on the other end and use the appropriate sized O-Ring to attach to an O-Ring installed on the screen material. You would pass the O-Ring through both grommets and then join the O-Ring ends together with something such as a nylon cable tie.

Another way might be to use some inner tube and cut it into strips that would loop through some wide enough grommets that are installed on the screen and then you double up the inner tube at the snap end and install a snap through the two layers joined at the snap end and snap it on the existing frame snap hardware. This would give you a tab for snap attachment and the benefit of constant active tensioning at the same time. You could also maybe use NO Grommet on the screen material and use Snap fasteners on the screen AND the Frame. That way you could experiment easily as you go along and create various inner tube strips of varying lengths and strengths via (1) or if needed (2) layers of material. You can then easily snap the tensioning tabs on and off at will!

Instead of attaching to the thinner horizontal portion of the frame where the snaps are located you could also somehow attach to the thicker vertical boxed portion of the frame with some sort of ring, eye or hook and again use the O-Ring attachment method. If you cant drill and screw or drill and tap you can drill and use pop rivets to attach your attachment hardware of choice. You would probably want to attach as low as possible on the vertical boxed portion of the frame so the screen stays as close as possible to the thin edge of the frame where the screen and frame meet.

Keep in mind that if you try to use the existing snaps you would be relegated to using only that given amount of tensioning points. Is that enough tensioning points and are they spaced appropriately? Maybe, maybe not... you will have to figure that out. It looks like there are quite a few attachment points on the Falcon and Seymour screens. If you can install your own attachment points you can have as many as needed or the snap points might indeed be enough.

***NOTE: Should you want to ADD any additional Snap Fittings, a company called Sailrite sells a tool called the Snaprite Surface Mount Stud Die ($24.95) that attaches to a Pop Rivet Tool to properly install additional Snap fittings to the frame. Be sure the depth where you want to mount is of course conducive to the use of a pop rivet.

***NOTE: If you should want to REMOVE any of the frame Snap Fittings you can just simply drill them out with the appropriate sized drill bit.

***NOTE: Snap Fastener Kits for screen and attachment tabs here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/190992679159?lpid=82
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Quality-LEATHER-Canvas-SNAP-FASTNER-KIT-W-TOOLS-24-/200227467027?_trksid=p2054897.l4276

HINT: Just be sure that the Snap Fastener Kit you get can handle the thickness of the tab material / inner tube / fabric etc. you will be sandwiching as in 1, 2 or 3 layers etc!



There you go, some ideas to get the creative juices flowing! biggrin.gif

Good Luck!


...Glenn smile.gif

Okay, those are some good ideas. Almost makes me not regret the fact that no one wants to buy the Stewart screen and frame and that I need to re-use the frame with new material! biggrin.gif

I think Stewart also keeps track of the snap locations on a per item basis (ie, for each serial number, they have a different record of where the snaps are) which might be useful for me.

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