Screen that compliments my Sony HW40ES? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 31 Old 06-15-2014, 08:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Screen that compliments my Sony HW40ES?

I'm in the market for a screen that will compliment my Sony 40ES. I've been looking at the Carada Cinema White because Craig from the Forums suggested it! It seems a bit high in the price range but if it will really make that big of a difference from the typical $200-$400 screens that I see online then I'm all about it. I'm coming from a plasma so if a better quality screen will somehow make the colors/blacks be much better than I'm okay waiting a bit more to save for a nicer screen, if the price is simply the "name" and not the "quality" then I will go with a cheaper screen if there's no notable difference.

Any other suggestions? Stewart is way out of my price range at $1200+ since I do want a 110 inch screen. Nothing higher than a 1.1 gain since the projector will be fairly close to the screen(no zoom)
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post #2 of 31 Old 06-15-2014, 11:14 AM
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You can get an Elite screen with Cinewhite material for less than 400 dollars. I personally owned a Visual Apex 120 inch screen and was very happy with the quality of it. (400 dollars delivered)
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post #3 of 31 Old 06-15-2014, 03:40 PM - Thread Starter
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I had an elite screen before but it was a 1.3 gain on a ridiculously crappy and bright Acer DLP so I kind of want to stay away from that

I'm really looking for fixed only as well.
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post #4 of 31 Old 06-15-2014, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinlg View Post
I had an elite screen before but it was a 1.3 gain on a ridiculously crappy and bright Acer DLP so I kind of want to stay away from that

I'm really looking for fixed only as well.
The Screens I told you about are both fixed screens. I've seen many screens in action over the years, and I can can tell you with no doubts that you can get a low gain white screen that performs very well without spending more than 500 dollars.
I've seen the Carada screen material you're talking about. (a 100 inch I helped a friend of a friend put together and hang. The projector was an Epson 5010) The advantage the Carada screen has is how the screen attaches to the frame. It's a better system than the standard rod and tab system used in the cheaper frames. A better system of frame attachment justifying a doubling in price is a value judgement only you can make. The performance of the material itself is excellent.
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post #5 of 31 Old 06-15-2014, 06:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ben38 View Post
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Originally Posted by kevinlg View Post
I had an elite screen before but it was a 1.3 gain on a ridiculously crappy and bright Acer DLP so I kind of want to stay away from that

I'm really looking for fixed only as well.
The Screens I told you about are both fixed screens. I've seen many screens in action over the years, and I can can tell you with no doubts that you can get a low gain white screen that performs very well without spending more than 500 dollars.
I've seen the Carada screen material you're talking about. (a 100 inch I helped a friend of a friend put together and hang. The projector was an Epson 5010) The advantage the Carada screen has is how the screen attaches to the frame. It's a better system than the standard rod and tab system used in the cheaper frames. A better system of frame attachment justifying a doubling in price is a value judgement only you can make. The performance of the material itself is excellent.
I'll take your word for it! The room will be painted in sherwin williams Duration home interior acrylic latex matte flat (quite the mouthful right?)

I'm actually stepping down to the 100 inch (it's plenty) because the wife said so
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post #6 of 31 Old 06-15-2014, 07:36 PM
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I'll take your word for it! The room will be painted in sherwin williams Duration home interior acrylic latex matte flat (quite the mouthful right?)

I'm actually stepping down to the 100 inch (it's plenty) because the wife said so
You mentioned that the projector will be fairly close. At 10 feet, I think all you can manage is 100 inches anyway. With that combo of screen size and throw you'll get a really bright, punchy image.
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post #7 of 31 Old 06-15-2014, 10:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ben38 View Post
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Originally Posted by kevinlg View Post
I'll take your word for it! The room will be painted in sherwin williams Duration home interior acrylic latex matte flat (quite the mouthful right?)

I'm actually stepping down to the 100 inch (it's plenty) because the wife said so
You mentioned that the projector will be fairly close. At 10 feet, I think all you can manage is 100 inches anyway. With that combo of screen size and throw you'll get a really bright, punchy image.
Oh it will be 12ft+ away not THAT close, I don't want anything more than a 1.1 gain screen for that sole reason since I know the projector is bright and so will the screen, the room will be treated with the matte paint and velvet curtains too anyways so I'm not worried on much light spillage.
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post #8 of 31 Old 06-15-2014, 10:34 PM - Thread Starter
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What about the cinegrey elite screen? What cons and pros would I have with that?
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post #9 of 31 Old 06-16-2014, 12:49 AM
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If you're 12 feet away, you should probably go a little bigger than 100 inches. 120 maybe. Your projector can light up a 120 with no problems.

I have the Cinegrey5D in my living room. It's a great screen in a room with ambient light and light walls. Since i moved and now have to contend with ambient light, light colored walls, and a white ceiling, the Cinegrey5D is the perfect screen for my needs.
On the pros side, the screen will help your projector with contrast better than any white screen. When everything is dialed in correctly, the resulting picture looks like a very large LCD panel.
On the cons side, the projector must be placed in the exact right spot in relation to the screen and your seating position. If placed improperly, the angle of reflectivity will be wrong, and result in a strong hotspot in the middle of the screen and noticably less brightness when viewed from a side seating position. It is an angular reflective screen, and absolutely depends on you getting the right angle of projection. I posted a number of you tube videos of the Cinegrey 5D in my living room.

Since you'll have your projector in a light controlled room, I really don't see any need for you to get a specialty screen.
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post #10 of 31 Old 06-16-2014, 10:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ben38 View Post
If you're 12 feet away, you should probably go a little bigger than 100 inches. 120 maybe. Your projector can light up a 120 with no problems.

I have the Cinegrey5D in my living room. It's a great screen in a room with ambient light and light walls. Since i moved and now have to contend with ambient light, light colored walls, and a white ceiling, the Cinegrey5D is the perfect screen for my needs.
On the pros side, the screen will help your projector with contrast better than any white screen. When everything is dialed in correctly, the resulting picture looks like a very large LCD panel.
On the cons side, the projector must be placed in the exact right spot in relation to the screen and your seating position. If placed improperly, the angle of reflectivity will be wrong, and result in a strong hotspot in the middle of the screen and noticably less brightness when viewed from a side seating position. It is an angular reflective screen, and absolutely depends on you getting the right angle of projection. I posted a number of you tube videos of the Cinegrey 5D in my living room.

Since you'll have your projector in a light controlled room, I really don't see any need for you to get a specialty screen.
Thanks for the explanation, yeah the room will be light controlled but that's just food for thought as well.

How well does your cinegrey5d perform when it's nighttime and everything is off?
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post #11 of 31 Old 06-16-2014, 12:30 PM
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In a completely dark room, the Cinegrey5D performs as well as a white screen in most respects. I say "most" respects because an angular reflective screen will never have uniform brightness across it's entire screen like a white screen does.
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post #12 of 31 Old 06-17-2014, 10:24 AM
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If you're 12 feet away, you should probably go a little bigger than 100 inches. 120 maybe. Your projector can light up a 120 with no problems.

Agreed. I recently installed an HW40. My screen is on order, so I have only been projecting onto raw sheetrock so far. Undoubtedly lower gain and quality than a real screen.

My seating distance is 12' from the screen. After testing, I decided on a 120" width screen. The projector had no trouble lighting up that size on the wall in 2D or 3D. I was thinking about a smaller screen until I was the image and realized the larger image worked well for that distance in both viewing and brightness terms.

My room could be considered light controlled. However, all my walls are currently sheetrock (light color) and my subfloor is also white. The light reflecting from the projected image lights up the room fairly well. I expect even better results when I finish the ceiling, walls and floors with less reflective colors/materials.
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post #13 of 31 Old 06-17-2014, 02:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Agreed. I recently installed an HW40. My screen is on order, so I have only been projecting onto raw sheetrock so far. Undoubtedly lower gain and quality than a real screen.

My seating distance is 12' from the screen. After testing, I decided on a 120" width screen. The projector had no trouble lighting up that size on the wall in 2D or 3D. I was thinking about a smaller screen until I was the image and realized the larger image worked well for that distance in both viewing and brightness terms.

My room could be considered light controlled. However, all my walls are currently sheetrock (light color) and my subfloor is also white. The light reflecting from the projected image lights up the room fairly well. I expect even better results when I finish the ceiling, walls and floors with less reflective colors/materials.
what screen did you go for?
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post #14 of 31 Old 06-17-2014, 02:37 PM
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what screen did you go for?
I went with a SeymourAV XD material.

For several reasons, I went with in-wall speakers. The width of my room means the screen will tai up pretty much the entire wall width. That means I needed an AT screen. I also wanted motorized/drop down. Looking around, it seemed Seymour was the best fit for my situation.

With luck, it should be shipping fairly soon. Now I just have to finish construction on the room. Amazing how framing and the big stuff goes pretty quick, but then the details take forever.
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[QUOTE=kevinlg;24983474]I'm in the market for a screen that will compliment my Sony 40ES. I've been looking at the Carada Cinema White because Craig from the Forums suggested it!QUOTE]

Did you make a decision on the screen yet? I'm also in the market for a fixed-frame screen for the HW40ES, in a light-controlled 25' x 15' room. Thinking of around 130", no need for AT.
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post #16 of 31 Old 07-05-2014, 06:31 PM - Thread Starter
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[quote=dw886;25513762]
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinlg View Post
I'm in the market for a screen that will compliment my Sony 40ES. I've been looking at the Carada Cinema White because Craig from the Forums suggested it!QUOTE]

Did you make a decision on the screen yet? I'm also in the market for a fixed-frame screen for the HW40ES, in a light-controlled 25' x 15' room. Thinking of around 130", no need for AT.
Yes sir, if it's light controlled and at that distance I would do a 1.0 gain cinewhite, I am more than happy with my cinegrey 5D screen, slight uniformity issues at first but now I don't see them, plus it looks elegant when not in use, like a big plasma in a way.

This is my temp set-up

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Is 1.5 too high gain if this projector is about 14-15ft from a 120in screen? I was looking at the stewart screens and they have the ultramatte 150. Alternatives would be the ultramatte 130 or the very popular studiotek 130 with a gain of 1.3. Or as kevin mentioned, the carada seems reasonable with 1.0 gain classic cinema (i was worried that wouldn't be high enough gain) or 1.5 brilliant white. I emailed someone at the AV Science store and never got a reply.
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post #18 of 31 Old 07-06-2014, 02:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Is 1.5 too high gain if this projector is about 14-15ft from a 120in screen? I was looking at the stewart screens and they have the ultramatte 150. Alternatives would be the ultramatte 130 or the very popular studiotek 130 with a gain of 1.3. Or as kevin mentioned, the carada seems reasonable with 1.0 gain classic cinema (i was worried that wouldn't be high enough gain) or 1.5 brilliant white. I emailed someone at the AV Science store and never got a reply.
No because I have this 1.5 cinegrey5d 12 ft away for a 100 inch screen so you will be more than okay with yours, if you're going with a white screen, I would suggest a 1.1 or 1.0 though since theyre not ambient light reflecting screens.
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post #19 of 31 Old 07-06-2014, 03:06 PM
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Is 1.5 too high gain if this projector is about 14-15ft from a 120in screen? I was looking at the stewart screens and they have the ultramatte 150. Alternatives would be the ultramatte 130 or the very popular studiotek 130 with a gain of 1.3. Or as kevin mentioned, the carada seems reasonable with 1.0 gain classic cinema (i was worried that wouldn't be high enough gain) or 1.5 brilliant white. I emailed someone at the AV Science store and never got a reply.
If you're looking at Stewart screens and want to save some money, go with the NEVE material and a CIMA frame. It puts out a real world gain of more than 1.1 across its entire surface.
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post #20 of 31 Old 07-06-2014, 05:25 PM
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If you're looking at Stewart screens and want to save some money, go with the NEVE material and a CIMA frame. It puts out a real world gain of more than 1.1 across its entire surface.
Thanks, I'll get a quote from AVS store tomorrow. I am looking to save some money on the screen since I didn't realize how expensive it is to build a home theater. I think I'll also ask them about the Carada screens. Thanks also to Kevin for your input.
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Originally Posted by bronxkid View Post
Is 1.5 too high gain if this projector is about 14-15ft from a 120in screen? I was looking at the stewart screens and they have the ultramatte 150. Alternatives would be the ultramatte 130 or the very popular studiotek 130 with a gain of 1.3. Or as kevin mentioned, the carada seems reasonable with 1.0 gain classic cinema (i was worried that wouldn't be high enough gain) or 1.5 brilliant white. I emailed someone at the AV Science store and never got a reply.
In all reality, the Brilliant White is only a little more than half a gain more than the Classic Cinema White.

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In all reality, the Brilliant White is only a little more than half a gain more than the Classic Cinema White.

Yeah I didn't realize that until I spoke with Craig at AVS today. To keep it around my budget I've narrowed it down to the Stewart Neve Cima and Carada Criterion Brilliant White.
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post #23 of 31 Old 07-08-2014, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bronxkid View Post
Is 1.5 too high gain if this projector is about 14-15ft from a 120in screen? I was looking at the stewart screens and they have the ultramatte 150. Alternatives would be the ultramatte 130 or the very popular studiotek 130 with a gain of 1.3. Or as kevin mentioned, the carada seems reasonable with 1.0 gain classic cinema (i was worried that wouldn't be high enough gain) or 1.5 brilliant white. I emailed someone at the AV Science store and never got a reply.
Don't know what happened there - feel free to email myself or Mike Garrett directly, any time.

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I went with a SeymourAV XD material.

For several reasons, I went with in-wall speakers. The width of my room means the screen will tai up pretty much the entire wall width. That means I needed an AT screen. I also wanted motorized/drop down. Looking around, it seemed Seymour was the best fit for my situation.

With luck, it should be shipping fairly soon. Now I just have to finish construction on the room. Amazing how framing and the big stuff goes pretty quick, but then the details take forever.
Just curious if you've received and have the Seymour motorized screen up yet? I would love to get a retractable screen, but just haven't found any that seem as reliable as a fixed on until I came across the Seymour. Seems like about the only option where I could fit the size retractable screen I want in the space I have and still have a quality picture.

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Just curious if you've received and have the Seymour motorized screen up yet? I would love to get a retractable screen, but just haven't found any that seem as reliable as a fixed on until I came across the Seymour. Seems like about the only option where I could fit the size retractable screen I want in the space I have and still have a quality picture.

Yes, I received the screen. It is getting installed at a second home and the shipment timing was a little off... it arrived almost three weeks ago. I finally had a chance to bring it to the install location this weekend.


Problem is that I ordered the H120. It weights about 80-90 pounds. While I thought about it, there is no practical way to install it alone. You definitely need at least two people to lift it near the top of a 9.5ft wall.

The installation process is pretty easy. The mounting bracket is up and ready to go.

With any luck, I will be able to recruit some help for this or the next weekend. Will definitely post back here when I have more detail.
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Yes, I received the screen. It is getting installed at a second home and the shipment timing was a little off... it arrived almost three weeks ago. I finally had a chance to bring it to the install location this weekend.


Problem is that I ordered the H120. It weights about 80-90 pounds. While I thought about it, there is no practical way to install it alone. You definitely need at least two people to lift it near the top of a 9.5ft wall.

The installation process is pretty easy. The mounting bracket is up and ready to go.

With any luck, I will be able to recruit some help for this or the next weekend. Will definitely post back here when I have more detail.
Awesome, thanks for the response and I'll look forward to your thoughts!

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No because I have this 1.5 cinegrey5d 12 ft away for a 100 inch screen so you will be more than okay with yours, if you're going with a white screen, I would suggest a 1.1 or 1.0 though since theyre not ambient light reflecting screens.

Actual gain on the Cinegrey5D has been measured at 1.0 gain.

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Actual gain on the Cinegrey5D has been measured at 1.0 gain.
Perfect! whatever it is, I love it.
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Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post
Actual gain on the Cinegrey5D has been measured at 1.0 gain.
As great as the ACCUCAL screen tests are, the Gain numbers for the High Gain Retro-reflective and Angular Reflective screens are a little misleading if you don't take Jeff Meier's explanation into account. All of his tests were done with a ceiling mounted projector. To Quote: "The gains shown here are for a ceiling mounted unit. A dramatic increase in gain is likely if the unit is mounted lower."





Retro-reflective and angular reflective screens are dependent on light hitting the screen at the proper angle in relation to the viewer. So placement of the projector other than the standard ceiling mount are the key to getting good performance. In his evaluation of the High Power 2.4 material, he points out, Quote:
"The projector should be mounted around head height for maximum gain."





When the High Power 2.8 material tested at 1.8, he explains, Quote:


"This is a retroreflective material that works best when the projector is mounted near the viewer’s head. The ceiling mounting in this theater is more common and shows the reduction in performance from this orientation."





As invaluable as these tests are, the gain numbers for the specialty screens might well be exactly as advertised once the projectors are mounted to take full advantage of the screen's properties. Just wanted to throw that out there.
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post #30 of 31 Old Today, 08:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ben38 View Post
As great as the ACCUCAL screen tests are, the Gain numbers for the High Gain Retro-reflective and Angular Reflective screens are a little misleading if you don't take Jeff Meier's explanation into account. All of his tests were done with a ceiling mounted projector. To Quote: "The gains shown here are for a ceiling mounted unit. A dramatic increase in gain is likely if the unit is mounted lower."

Retro-reflective and angular reflective screens are dependent on light hitting the screen at the proper angle in relation to the viewer. So placement of the projector other than the standard ceiling mount are the key to getting good performance. In his evaluation of the High Power 2.4 material, he points out, Quote:
"The projector should be mounted around head height for maximum gain."

When the High Power 2.8 material tested at 1.8, he explains, Quote:

"This is a retroreflective material that works best when the projector is mounted near the viewer’s head. The ceiling mounting in this theater is more common and shows the reduction in performance from this orientation."

As invaluable as these tests are, the gain numbers for the specialty screens might well be exactly as advertised once the projectors are mounted to take full advantage of the screen's properties. Just wanted to throw that out there.

Good points Ben. I'm sure Jeff tested these screen samples this way because most folks do ceiling mount their projectors, and they should know what real world gain to expect. If you can mount your projector lower, you could get closer to the advertised screen gain.

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