A bit of a quandry..... - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 15 Old 10-03-2000, 01:00 PM - Thread Starter
KBK
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Here's the problem.

I have this paint which works exceedingly well. If I sell you the paint, it will have to be sprayed to work at anywhere near it's true potential.

HOW GOOD ARE YOU AT SPRAYING?

I am looking at selling the product direct to the public.

I am also looking at selling the product to dealers, so they can spray their own screens for resale and installs.

I found some decent vynil as well.

If you spray the paint badly, and have poor results, am I to blame?

The answer is no. I am not to blame. But some may not see it that way.
(there are some absloutely stunning puns floating about here)

I can either issue FINISHED SCREENS ONLY, or sell the paint to dealers only, or all three.

I am inclined to do all three.

I sell screens at a 'preset' sort of value, so as to not undercut my dealers, which I am supporting. This would be a screen for those who do not wish to attempt their own, and don't or can't deal with the whole thing. Or do not want the attempt at disaster. There will be a preset price for dealers to buy finished screens, if they do not wish to deal with the spraying aspect. Final pricing structure is still in the air. I want it to be fair, and will go far to achieve this. It is a bit complex to deal with being fair to all, but no one said I would get off easy here.

I would sell the paint outright, to the man on the street, with reccomendations for handling and useage. Caveat emptor. (buyer beware) You have been told and warned. Don't come cryin' to me. Hint: buy some and take it to your local car painting shop. Plenty of spraying experts around. These guys spray metallic paints on curved surfaces. A harder task than that is difficult to come by.

Coverage must be PERFECT!!! After all, you are looking at the surface each day, on the most minute level. Surface defects WILL BE NOTICED.

So, you can forgo the risk ot of it, and buy a finished screen....at a substantially higher price, as someone has used skills, and taken the risk, and completed the work.

Or you can take your chances.

I will try all three at first. If the results are that people can't handle the paint, then it will be removed from public sale. It will remain with competent installers and dealers. If that proves to be too difficult a situation, then It will be pulled from that forum as well. I seriously doubt that it will prove to be a problem, though.

The first attempts will be with a few private quiet little sales, and with a few select dealers. Ones with painting backgrounds. Then, the public sale.

Any comments?


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[This message has been edited by KBK (edited 10-03-2000).]

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post #2 of 15 Old 10-03-2000, 01:26 PM
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Hi KBK

What will the viscosity of the paint be? Will one shoot it with an airless sprayer, a Binks-style gun, or HVLP?

Is it thinable? Latex?

Jeff

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post #3 of 15 Old 10-03-2000, 01:55 PM
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KBK,

Sounds Fair to me. Hope it works out well for you. I know people who can do the spraying, but depending on the cost of a completed screen, I might just buy one. One question. Will this paint/screen work well for a LCD Projector (Infocus 735 is what I have.)

Thanks for all the hard work you have put into these endeavors. Also looking forward to buying a modified Zoltrix card.

Adam
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post #4 of 15 Old 10-03-2000, 02:36 PM
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I have been an airbrush artist for 18 years (Iwata, Paache, Badger and others) and have access to a 20' by 30' spray booth. http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

I don't think that selling paint or paint and fabric only will bring about liability. Do paint stores get sued because a customer applied the paint poorly? More of a legitimate concern would be the toxicity of the medium and the proper warnings associated with the product. I know people who have developed permanent lung damage from paint and solvent spraying (not I, thank you). The only way to avoid the whole health concern issue would be to sell painted screens in a roll or stretched, finished screens, as you well know.

--Allen B.

A woman is weeping over shadows on a screen, a man gets excited over ink on a page, a child is frightened over words in a book-
The mind gets caught up in the unreal and people become identified with it. But its power is such that it rules the world.
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post #5 of 15 Old 10-03-2000, 04:44 PM
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You can always find a graffitti artist in the hood.

Or to be safe take the darn thing to the neighborhood body shop.
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post #6 of 15 Old 10-03-2000, 05:34 PM
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KBK,

I think I understand your concerns, and I am taking back a bit by your imphasis of a quailty spray job. As most any Yahoo can eventually learn how to use a cupgun, I assume there are several rules outside of the "expert" level due to the nature of a new product and its mission. I take your warning seriously, and wonder if I have to step back?

My Finishing buddy, whom I consider an expert, last year spent over a month getting his shop ready to spray a Grand piano. I thought this was over the top but when he told me the job was 15K and I watched all the prep work I started to understand. I can shoot a house with my eyes closed, I made high end furniture for a while and finally got to a satisfied place with that.(Dust and fisheyes were killing me) I know some reducer formulas and temp. calculations. Does this make me a contender?

I suppose I could farm it out to my buddy?

I assume were talking quarts. I also assume the source (DLP, CRT, LCD... would have to be known. Whats the optimum # of coats you've found? Am I in the game here?

Ah, what the He77, I'm game! Put me down for imeadiate shipping. jdb

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post #7 of 15 Old 10-03-2000, 05:41 PM
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Opps, I meant to click spell check and do a final edit on the above post. Instead, I'll let it stand - as is. c'st la ve' http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

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post #8 of 15 Old 10-03-2000, 09:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Believe it or not... One lousy coat is fine, if it is a thick layer. The product will settle of it's own. Additives are STRICTLY VERBOTEN. They are an unknown quantitiy. Experiment with additives on your own.

I am just being cautious, that's all. After all, I have been working in a pawn shop. I have fat lesbians trying to fondle my hairless bean on a daily basis. I tend to be cautious. I am used to being caught off guard. Murphy can't get you if you don't give him a chance. No unopened doors, and no uncovered buttocks.

If you have sprayed furniture, you're laffin'.

pardon me a sec, i'm feeding my dog the ice cubes out of my drink.

One more thing, it takes about 10 days to reach final clairity.

The surface it is placed on is CRITICAL. That is not to be underestimated.

I used a matte finished vynil I found at a fabric store.

It is 54" high by 108" long. I haven't sprayed before, so i didn't get the coverage I needed.(thin spots) (multiple surface caharacteristics) uniformity is key.

I used one liter of paint. I should of went slightly slower, with more output. it should have taken about 1.25-1.3 litres. It covered 40 sq. ft.

1 liter should cover 30 sq. ft. results, will of course, vary. Kinda expensive to be wrong huh? I would hate like hell to not have enough when I was doing a screen, and have the product 'fart' out of the sprayer onto the screen........ There are thinners you can use, and I will find out exactly what they are. Right now, it's like a slightly thick oil base. I used it straight up, in a crummy electric wagner sprayer, just to keep it difficult.

This is an acrylic paint.

I am going to watch a movie right now, the colors, contrast and brightness are amazing, I ain't used to such a picture.


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post #9 of 15 Old 10-04-2000, 05:26 AM
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OK, I have a date with destiny then. I will wear white and bring flowers.

One "thick coat" brings back the fisheye fears.

I do, indeed, recall the Critical fabric escapade. Can pull that info, from the safety of my double secret hard drive, for a shopping list.

I was planning on giving up the morphine anyway, jdb

PS. At this time I would also like to order, your suitiable for framing, "KBK Magic Screen" logo poster. (Is it double sided?)


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post #10 of 15 Old 10-04-2000, 06:26 AM - Thread Starter
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The product aready meets an ASTM(?) rating, or spec, or what ever the ASTM is about. I believe that it is a toxicity and flamibilty rating, solvents, etc.

Also, I have sent someone an e-mail and it bounced back, saying there was some screen saver attached (something about playboy...) and was a virus! I didn't attach any screen saver to anything....

so, for the moment, no e-mails from me, till I get to the bottom of this...
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post #11 of 15 Old 10-04-2000, 07:35 AM - Thread Starter
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I just experimentally tried to send someone an e-mail, and asked that they do not open the attached file, if there is one, and outlook express crashed on the mail attempt. I do not have a cd-rom in this remote box, it is on a server system. It has a underlying layer of some sort of 'assembler-code breaker' as an underlying operation under the whole shebang, as this is also my brother's assembler level de-asembler work machine. I have a feeling I have just lost all my e-mails and email adresses. I have never suffered a virus in over 10 years, and have never used a virus protection system of any sort, as I don't get into 'broadband' communications with large amounts of varying personalities....somone I know, sent me an e-mail, and it was infected, I'm gonna have a word with him about that!

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post #12 of 15 Old 10-04-2000, 07:48 AM
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Wasn't me, man.

Find them and kill them!

Could it be the "big boys" trying to keep their profits by snuffing out the "Lesbian fondled upstart"? How many guns you got in that pawn shop?
Watch your buttocks, eh?

I have some anti-virus on the Dell upstairs if you need a test 'puter to send to...but give me a clue before sending. jdb

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post #13 of 15 Old 10-09-2000, 02:54 PM - Thread Starter
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just in case you folks where wondering, I am reserching vinyl at this time (but am actually typing at this very moment). Still at it....

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[This message has been edited by KBK (edited 10-09-2000).]

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post #14 of 15 Old 10-09-2000, 03:00 PM - Thread Starter
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By the way, what Imean by 'finished sceens, is the raw screen itself, a unspported fabric. I don't think I will ever be making 'Finished sreens'. That's a wokload and hassle I will definitely forgo.

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post #15 of 15 Old 10-12-2000, 01:10 PM
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...looks like Don Stewart may be moving in on the grey screen clientele. At least it may create a reference to define a reasonable price point. KBK- do you have product?

A woman is weeping over shadows on a screen, a man gets excited over ink on a page, a child is frightened over words in a book-
The mind gets caught up in the unreal and people become identified with it. But its power is such that it rules the world.
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