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-   -   Glass beaded with gray backing= better than Grayhawk? (http://www.avsforum.com/forum/23-screens/19661-glass-beaded-gray-backing-better-than-grayhawk.html)

Rgb 05-08-2001 01:19 PM

I use a 600 lumen XGA LCD projector, the Mits X100.

What I want is a gray screen (improved perceived blacks), but with some additional *postive* gain, like 2.0-2.5-ish to improve the overall brightness on a 7-8 foot wide screen.

The gray screens discussed here, either home brew or commercial materials like the Grayhawk, seem to all be lower than 1.0 gain.

Does physics allow a > 2.0 gain gray screen that raises the foot lamberts overall, but still improves perceived black level through the gray color?

My thoughts were- what if Da Lite sprayed their normal glass beads used in their glass-beaded white screens (~2.5 gain) onto a gray colored backing material rather than the stock white material? Wouldn't this give a proper "gamma-corrected" surface for the reflected image? i.e. blacks should be perceived blacker, but mid and white tones should appear brighter due to the increased gain of the glass beads (?).

Essentially, what digital projector owners need is a screen material that reacts to the projected image light according to an optimal gamma-curve- i.e. for a light level at or below the black level light output of the projector, the screen reflects nothing. At mid and peak light levels, the screen material reflects an optimum ft-lambert light level, calibrated to ISF standards.

Of course, a material that could react in this fashion probably would cost more than the projector shooting images onto it http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/wink.gif...




[This message has been edited by Rgb (edited 05-08-2001).]

MrWigggles 05-08-2001 10:39 PM

Sounds like a cool idea.

If you have a horrible HT room, I think that this idea has a good shot of working.

-Mr. Wigggles

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The Mothership is now boarding.

LeeAntin 05-09-2001 12:08 AM

You might want to talk with Don Stewart at Stewart Filmscreen. They maKe a screen material call PLATINUM 300 which has a 3.0 gain and a slight grey tint to it as opposed to the SILVER 400 which is a 4.0 gain silver finish.

I had someone bring over their Sony 10XX LCD PJ to my house a few weeks ago. I have a SILVER 400 microperf screen and the image looked terrific. Much better than both of us expected. The black levels improved and the white scenes were so bright, I felt we needed sunglasess's.

Lee

car_rod 05-09-2001 07:18 AM

Lee, viewing angle of those Stewart "affordable" fabrics?
Probably very narrow.

Well, Da-Lite has its own grey-high-gain fabric, the SuperWonder Lite, but they don't want to promote it as a home theater screen maybe because it's too cheap. Also, the max width available is 70" because Da-Lite don't want (can?) use a wider tool to make it.

Carlos

REW 05-09-2001 06:14 PM

Lee,
Can you tell me about the pros and cons of your silver 400 screen and what PJ you use(or have used)
I have several (white )screens and a curved silver that I am directly a/b comparing.All mute color and turn whites into grey/white except the silver which shows great results with 8in CRT.Peter M(space orbit)says no to silver but pearlescent(yes).Whats your take?

http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/smile.gif

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Ron
"Your priorities will be different-its the weighting that counts!"

Rgb 05-09-2001 09:59 PM

Mr Wigggles-

re: "If you have a horrible HT room..."

Do you mean poor light control (too much ambient light), too much reflected light or...?


MrWigggles 05-10-2001 02:56 PM

RGB,

Yes you are correct. A bad HT room would be one with poor lighting control. If lighting isn't that bad for you, I would consider just using a Da-lite HC or Grayhawk to help avoid potential hot spotting and poor viewing angle.

Also, this conversation has taken a little bit of a turn. Please be advised that a glass beaded surface is retroreflective (better for table top projector's) while a silver surface is normal reflective (better for ceiling mounted projectors).

-Mr. Wigggles

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The Mothership is now boarding.

Rgb 05-11-2001 05:18 AM

Yes, I have 100% light control in my dedicated basement home theater.

My concern with the Da Lite HC material is its low gain and Da-Lite's recommendation for 1000 lumens or greater output from a projector (mine is 600 lumens).

Perhaps the perfect light control (and heavy use of black felt borders http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/wink.gif ) in my HT would make the Da Lite HC material work on an 8 foot wide screen/ 600 lumens (?).


LeeAntin 05-11-2001 08:17 AM

REW,

I currently use a Zenith PRO900X with my Silver 400. Previous to that I used a Panasonic PT101Y.

The pros of a Silver 400 are much increased Contrast Ratio, high light "throwback"

The only con is that the silvering is not 100% uniform which means that on the screen there is an small section that becomes noticable when a very bright image is shown like a beach scene.

I would talk to Don Stewart about the Platinum 300. It doesn't have the problem with the non-uniform "look." When I ordered my screen (60x107) 3 years ago, I was not aware that this screen material existed.

The viewing angle really doesn't come into play because no one has a big enough HT to have to deal with the problem.

Silver screens are used in 3D applications like IMAX 3D where all the screen brightness is needed.

Lee


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