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post #3001 of 3023 Unread 05-10-2015, 10:13 AM
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Can you do a trigger? I'd give Seymour a call and see if there is a retrofit option that might work for your siutation.
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post #3002 of 3023 Unread 05-28-2015, 12:27 PM
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Just got my "new" SeymourAV with EN4k up (sorry, not centerstage) up and have been blown away with the performance. I had picked up their Demo MFR screen with masking panels for converting the 100" wide 2.35 format to 16x9. It was one they brought to CEDIA a couple of years back. The beast was over 100 lbs and it was quite a task installing by myself. I will add some pics this weekend to show off the system but was just so pleased with the screen i wanted post about it. The fabric is so fine of a weave that you can not see any weave unless you get right on it. My front seats are about 7 ft away and no sign of weave or texture (screen door effect). I am using a Sony 500es on low lamp setting and the pic is good on the 2.35 zoom setting with no desire to switch to bright cinema setting. I have not tried 3d at 2.35 yet so there might be an issue there but so far, it looks great. I was a little concern over how much light loss i would get and the halo effect behind the screen but the black backing takes care of that well. The material is very thin and flexible so i could see how wrinkles would be concern especially with a big screen but these guys really have this done well. The black velvet borders also are a nice add so a little overspray with the image just disappears. As far as audio transparency, I could not tell any drop in clarity, highs or volume. Finally, working with Chris and his team was very pleasant. He followed up after i got it to see if i had questions or concerns. in the end, i was able to get a great 2.35 screen with masking system and one of the best audio transparent screens for the price many would pay for a standard material retractable.
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post #3003 of 3023 Unread 05-28-2015, 12:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilmanmojo View Post
Just got my "new" SeymourAV with EN4k up (sorry, not centerstage) up and have been blown away with the performance. I had picked up their Demo MFR screen with masking panels for converting the 100" wide 2.35 format to 16x9. It was one they brought to CEDIA a couple of years back. The beast was over 100 lbs and it was quite a task installing by myself. I will add some pics this weekend to show off the system but was just so pleased with the screen i wanted post about it. The fabric is so fine of a weave that you can not see any weave unless you get right on it. My front seats are about 7 ft away and no sign of weave or texture (screen door effect). I am using a Sony 500es on low lamp setting and the pic is good on the 2.35 zoom setting with no desire to switch to bright cinema setting. I have not tried 3d at 2.35 yet so there might be an issue there but so far, it looks great. I was a little concern over how much light loss i would get and the halo effect behind the screen but the black backing takes care of that well. The material is very thin and flexible so i could see how wrinkles would be concern especially with a big screen but these guys really have this done well. The black velvet borders also are a nice add so a little overspray with the image just disappears. As far as audio transparency, I could not tell any drop in clarity, highs or volume. Finally, working with Chris and his team was very pleasant. He followed up after i got it to see if i had questions or concerns. in the end, i was able to get a great 2.35 screen with masking system and one of the best audio transparent screens for the price many would pay for a standard material retractable.
Congrats. What weighed over 100 lbs, the screen? If so is it an automated masking system?
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post #3004 of 3023 Unread 05-28-2015, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post
Congrats. What weighed over 100 lbs, the screen? If so is it an automated masking system?
Sorry, yes it is an automated masking system. The screen is a 100" wide 2.35 screen with a separate roller for the side masking strips that convert to a 16x9. The masking panels are weighted and drop down on top of the screen. In essence its two roller systems. I could not get the full height for a 100" wide 16x9 so this was an elegant way to get a big 2.35 screen but still have a nice 16x9
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post #3005 of 3023 Unread 05-28-2015, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Oilmanmojo View Post
Sorry, yes it is an automated masking system. The screen is a 100" wide 2.35 screen with a separate roller for the side masking strips that convert to a 16x9. The masking panels are weighted and drop down on top of the screen. In essence its two roller systems. I could not get the full height for a 100" wide 16x9 so this was an elegant way to get a big 2.35 screen but still have a nice 16x9
Awesome! How do you like its mechanical operation? PM sent.
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post #3006 of 3023 Unread 05-28-2015, 07:19 PM
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Awesome! How do you like its mechanical operation? PM sent.
The unit is a tank, very well built hence why it weighs so much. The mechanics work well but they are not whisper quiet. Don't get me wrong, they are not real loud, but you will hear it during operation.
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post #3007 of 3023 Unread 06-21-2015, 09:38 AM
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Yes, finally pulled the trigger on the 130" curved Seymour AV premier frame screen with the CenterStage XD screen material!



I am so excited about its performance. I had ordered the bigger sample piece before, but that did not prepare me for the effect the complete product has...

I am sitting very close, just a little further than the screen width. In consequence, almost the whole field of vision is covered by the screen. It is still far enough for me to not notice the weave of the CenterStage XD screen material.

The increased level of immersion is what really surprised me. I assume, it is the curvature, combined with the short viewing distance and the "field of vision coverage". Only watched 2D so far, but it has a 3-dimensional look. The sound coming directly from the screen increases immersion even further.
Another effect of the "field of vision coverage" is that my D-Box motion system is even more fun when you have no fixed visual reference points. You have the moving picture and you feel the movement of yourself in the D-Box seat... really weird, especially when the camera motion is dubbed by the motion code... now I understand that somebody more delicate could get motion sick in a D-Box set...

Since I am sitting so close now, I now can detect all the deficiencies of the movies in a way I never did before. Especially the level of image sharpness and differences of sharpness/resolution. In the Star Wars franchise, Episodes 1 to 3, e.g. the artificial characters and backgrounds are rendered in a lower resolution than the rest of the picture. But even in movies with no (or not so obvious) digital animation, differences in sharpness within a scene (which could be intended by the director) or between scenes do not go unnoticed by me anymore...

My "old" JVC DLA-RS50 projectors can now show their qualities, as well as the ISCO III anamorphic lenses. Being "only" FullHD, my sharpness observations above bring me to the point where I question the whole 4K debate... anyway, one or two new projectors are not on the short list anyway...

Compared to my former screen material, the DA-Lite DA-MAT High Contrast, a grey screen, that was advertized with a 0.85 Gain, the CenterStage XD has twice(!) the gain. I already discovered this when I was playing around with the sample that I had ordered a few years ago. Although my new Seymour screen has twice the screen surface, compared to my old screen, which was a 80" 16:9 screen, the image is still very bright.

I am so excited about the screen. Of course, everybody is always pointing out how important the screen is, but the increase in immersion of the new setup got my by surprise!

I hope that I will find the time soon to set up the second projector and the Dolby 3D system... I will report back when I managed to do this and give my impressions about the 3D performance.

Thanks to Seymour AV for such a great product!

Markus
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post #3008 of 3023 Unread 06-21-2015, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by mv038856 View Post
...I am sitting very close, just a little further than the screen width. In consequence, almost the whole field of vision is covered by the screen. It is still far enough for me to not notice the weave of the CenterStage XD screen material...
How many feet are you sitting from the screen, and can you every detect any screen texture, perhaps on every bright or even all white scenes?

I've looked at a half dozen (maybe more) AT screens, and measured them for acoustical transparency and screen gain, and so far XD is my favorite. Funny, I say "so far" like I have some additional options - at this point I think I've exhausted the possibilities.
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post #3009 of 3023 Unread 06-21-2015, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post
How many feet are you sitting from the screen, and can you every detect any screen texture, perhaps on every bright or even all white scenes?

I've looked at a half dozen (maybe more) AT screens, and measured them for acoustical transparency and screen gain, and so far XD is my favorite. Funny, I say "so far" like I have some additional options - at this point I think I've exhausted the possibilities.
I am sitting 8 ft 8" (266cm) from the screen and I haven't noticed the weave ever. Now that I have measured the distance for you "forehead to screen", I recognized that I even sit closer to the screen than the screen is wide...

I was also looking around for the best AT screen material for my purpose. Since I wanted to go large and the light output of my JVC projectors is limited, the "real gain" was very important. The CenterStage XD sample from Seymour helped a lot to check the visibility of the weave in my application and as I noted above it helped me to get the "relative gain" regarding my old screen material. I used the colorimeter that I use to autocalibrate my projectors with my Lumagen processors. There I noticed that for all colors, the measured brightness values on the CengterStage XD sample were more than double compared to the values for my old Da-Lite Da-Mat HC Screen. If the "real" gain of the CenterStage is 1.0, then the gain of the Da-Lite Da-Mat HC must be appr. 0.5, despite the 0.85 gain that is advertized. The observation that AT screen materials are usually advertized with a way higher gain than they really have is documented in the report that is available on Seymour AV's web site, where an AV consultant compared and measured a number of screen materials, among them the CenterStage XD for their visual and their audio performance. Living in Germany, I also contacted a German screen maufacturer to get a sample of their AT screen material. They refused to send a sample, as a sample could not convey what a screen can do. While I would support that statement, now that I have experienced my new Seymour AV Screen, a sample still is usefull to check on weave visibility and gain. The latter could be the "real" reason why they would not ship a sample... I found a test on the web where they compared the AT screen material from the said manufacturer with the Studiotek 130 from Stewart screens. While the test sounded quite positive regarding the AT screen material, a look at the measurements revealed that the AT screen material measured more than 2/3rds lower in ft lambert than the Studiotek 130. Assuming the 1.3 gain of a Studiotek is correct (which is supported by the AV consultant's report, mentioned above), then the AT material from the German manufacturer's gain is way below 0.5!

Long story short, I suggest you get a sample an check if you can see the weave. I can confirm that the reflective properties are very good. I even closed the IRIS a little on my JVC projector. I also used the tool on projectorcentral.com where you can select your projector, projection distance, screen size and gain and play around a little.

Hope this helps!

Markus

Last edited by mv038856; 06-21-2015 at 02:00 PM.
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post #3010 of 3023 Unread 06-23-2015, 02:51 PM
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I got the Premier Frame--nice velvet all around. Definitely using masking...those panels leaning against the corners are the curved masking panels (they each come in halves) that will magnetically attach to the screen at the top and bottom of the screen to frame 2:35 content. Best of both worlds--this is as wide and as high as my room can handle, so it's not CIW or CIH--it's CIE (Constant Image Excellence!)
I've watched your "Lumagen Radiance 16:9-to-2:35 using NLS (Non-Liner Stretch)" video several times and was going to get the same for my 2.35 screen build out in a few months. Your video is what convinced me to stay away from getting a 16:9 screen. Do you think masking a giant 16:9 is superior to doing NLS on a 2.35 screen now?
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post #3011 of 3023 Unread 06-23-2015, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post
How many feet are you sitting from the screen, and can you ever detect any screen texture, perhaps on every bright or even all white scenes?
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Originally Posted by mv038856 View Post
I am sitting 8 ft 8" (266cm) from the screen and I haven't noticed the weave ever.
Fortunate, because in general most can see the XD weave from a greater distance, and I would suggest that even Seymour would not fully recommend XD for such close seating. Some where between 10 and 12 feet is where it becomes a non-issue for most.
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post #3012 of 3023 Unread 06-23-2015, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mv038856 View Post
...Long story short, I suggest you get a sample an check if you can see the weave. I can confirm that the reflective properties are very good. I even closed the IRIS a little on my JVC projector. I also used the tool on projectorcentral.com where you can select your projector, projection distance, screen size and gain and play around a little.

Hope this helps!

Markus
Oh yes, I'm way ahead there. Have already gathered about a half dozen AT large screen samples and measured them all acoustically and for their gain. As I mentioned earlier, the XD material came out on top for my purposes and seating distance (12.5').

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Fortunate, because in general most can see the XD weave from a greater distance, and I would suggest that even Seymour would not fully recommend XD for such close seating. Some where between 10 and 12 feet is where it becomes a non-issue for most.
I believe their recommendation for the XD is from 11' and beyond.
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post #3013 of 3023 Unread 06-24-2015, 06:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post
How many feet are you sitting from the screen, and can you every detect any screen texture, perhaps on every bright or even all white scenes?

I've looked at a half dozen (maybe more) AT screens, and measured them for acoustical transparency and screen gain, and so far XD is my favorite. Funny, I say "so far" like I have some additional options - at this point I think I've exhausted the possibilities.
XD is a good choice as long as the viewing distance is 11' and greater. Some use it with closer viewing distances, but the trade off is seeing the weave more often.
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post #3014 of 3023 Unread 06-25-2015, 08:46 PM
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The increased level of immersion is what really surprised me. I assume, it is the curvature, combined with the short viewing distance and the "field of vision coverage". Only watched 2D so far, but it has a 3-dimensional look. The sound coming directly from the screen increases immersion even further.
Another effect of the "field of vision coverage" is that my D-Box motion system is even more fun when you have no fixed visual reference points. You have the moving picture and you feel the movement of yourself in the D-Box seat... really weird, especially when the camera motion is dubbed by the motion code... now I understand that somebody more delicate could get motion sick in a D-Box set...
I love my curved XD screen (it's a DIY using XD material, but I still love it!). The picture is great, of course, but to me the greatest benefit was the audio immersion. I had my speakers below the screen previous to this. When I moved them to ear level and had them dialed in (L/R toed in to the MLP) the sound became so crisp, clear and had impact. I'm glad you are liking your screen.
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post #3015 of 3023 Unread 06-27-2015, 11:40 AM
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I picked up some Center Stage XD at Seymour AV in Ames earlier this week and didn't remember to ask if the XD has a side that needs to be on the projector side.
I emailed them, but since it's the weekend I don't expect to hear back until Monday.
When unrolling the fabric roll on a table the side that is up seems to be a finer pattern, I would think this is the projector side but it may be just my eyes.
Does anyone have info on this, I'm ready to mount the screen to the frame tonight, hoping not to have to wait until Monday.
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I picked up some Center Stage XD at Seymour AV in Ames earlier this week and didn't remember to ask if the XD has a side that needs to be on the projector side.
I emailed them, but since it's the weekend I don't expect to hear back until Monday.
When unrolling the fabric roll on a table the side that is up seems to be a finer pattern, I would think this is the projector side but it may be just my eyes.
Does anyone have info on this, I'm ready to mount the screen to the frame tonight, hoping not to have to wait until Monday.
There is no "good side". One side is inspected before delivery (iirc it's the inside of the roll) but either side should work equally well.
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post #3017 of 3023 Unread 06-27-2015, 12:47 PM
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There is no "good side". One side is inspected before delivery (iirc it's the inside of the roll) but either side should work equally well.
Thanks for the quick response ScottJ!
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post #3018 of 3023 Unread 06-28-2015, 01:10 PM
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I got my electric xd screen this past week...screen is great picture beautiful...the motor is horrible...when I drop screen I hear the screen material bunching up and then motor makes a high pitch sound..then material drops quickly and it sounds normal again...the backing black material seems to be causing this problem...very weird...is it possible it's new and needs to be broken in?

Should it not move at constant speed and sound the same from when it's dropped up until it's alll the way down?

Sorry for bad English and spelling...on iPhone now
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post #3019 of 3023 Unread 06-29-2015, 07:24 AM
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I got my electric xd screen this past week...screen is great picture beautiful...the motor is horrible...when I drop screen I hear the screen material bunching up and then motor makes a high pitch sound..then material drops quickly and it sounds normal again...the backing black material seems to be causing this problem...very weird...is it possible it's new and needs to be broken in?

Should it not move at constant speed and sound the same from when it's dropped up until it's alll the way down?

Sorry for bad English and spelling...on iPhone now
Without a video of what you're talking about, it's difficult to advise you. While the 230v motors are louder than the 120v motors, I don't know what constitutes your description of "horrible". What SPL are you measuring?

The speed will not be constant, as the roll diameter and loading changes. The black backing is independent of the screen, as they cannot roll up with the same diameter since they are dissimilar materials. A video could also make sure your black backing layer is free to drop as it's supposed to and not getting caught on something.

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I just want to clarify my posting. I did it on my iphone and i am not a great typer so i kept it short and sweet. It was not my intention to bash the screen or the company. I spoke with Chris at Seymour today and he was friendly and helpful. When I get home, i will call him and he will walk me thru a series of adjustments if they are neeeded. I will post more after we hammer out a few kinks.

I can tell you so far that the screen and housing are a tank. very solid and well built. Picture is to die for. Had neighbours over yesterday for demo and they were amazed. The black material they use if phenomenal. I have the projector overshooting screen a bit (havent had calibrator over yet) and u dont see any of it.

Will post more as i said...dont read into my post as it was not my intentions to make harsh statements.. Sorry Chris and thanks for the help

Peter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mv038856 View Post
Yes, finally pulled the trigger on the 130" curved Seymour AV premier frame screen with the CenterStage XD screen material!



I am so excited about its performance. I had ordered the bigger sample piece before, but that did not prepare me for the effect the complete product has...

I am sitting very close, just a little further than the screen width. In consequence, almost the whole field of vision is covered by the screen. It is still far enough for me to not notice the weave of the CenterStage XD screen material.

The increased level of immersion is what really surprised me. I assume, it is the curvature, combined with the short viewing distance and the "field of vision coverage". Only watched 2D so far, but it has a 3-dimensional look. The sound coming directly from the screen increases immersion even further.
Another effect of the "field of vision coverage" is that my D-Box motion system is even more fun when you have no fixed visual reference points. You have the moving picture and you feel the movement of yourself in the D-Box seat... really weird, especially when the camera motion is dubbed by the motion code... now I understand that somebody more delicate could get motion sick in a D-Box set...

Since I am sitting so close now, I now can detect all the deficiencies of the movies in a way I never did before. Especially the level of image sharpness and differences of sharpness/resolution. In the Star Wars franchise, Episodes 1 to 3, e.g. the artificial characters and backgrounds are rendered in a lower resolution than the rest of the picture. But even in movies with no (or not so obvious) digital animation, differences in sharpness within a scene (which could be intended by the director) or between scenes do not go unnoticed by me anymore...

My "old" JVC DLA-RS50 projectors can now show their qualities, as well as the ISCO III anamorphic lenses. Being "only" FullHD, my sharpness observations above bring me to the point where I question the whole 4K debate... anyway, one or two new projectors are not on the short list anyway...

Compared to my former screen material, the DA-Lite DA-MAT High Contrast, a grey screen, that was advertized with a 0.85 Gain, the CenterStage XD has twice(!) the gain. I already discovered this when I was playing around with the sample that I had ordered a few years ago. Although my new Seymour screen has twice the screen surface, compared to my old screen, which was a 80" 16:9 screen, the image is still very bright.

I am so excited about the screen. Of course, everybody is always pointing out how important the screen is, but the increase in immersion of the new setup got my by surprise!

I hope that I will find the time soon to set up the second projector and the Dolby 3D system... I will report back when I managed to do this and give my impressions about the 3D performance.

Thanks to Seymour AV for such a great product!

Markus

I have the same experience as you Markus.

I simply love the XD curved screen.

BTW: You mentioned questioning 4K... have you had a chance to demo the Sony 4K projector? On the XD screen, the 4K projector shows every pore on a person's skin, every hair, (including hairs on hands and legs, and body), and sharpness is nuts... sometimes i feel like the people on screen is really standing there. (and this is with upscaled 4K from HD materials).
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Below are some comments on the Seymour Precision framing, as well as a brief comparison (with respect to my viewing environment) of the Phifer Sheerweave, Seymour XD, and Seymour UF screen material. My screen is 95 inches wide. I sit about 9.5 feet from the screen. The projector sits about 11 feet from the screen at roughly the top edge of the screen. I have viewed the Phifer with the Panasonic 900 and 4000, the XD with the 4000, and the UF with the 4000 and Panasonic 8000.


Seymour is very easy to work with and has excellent customer service.


The Seymour frame and screen came securely packed, with the screen itself in an inner mailing-type tube. The frame is easy to assemble and the o-ring and grommet system works well with tensioning. The top and bottom parts of the frame came in two pieces each. There is a very slight notch in the top of the frame at the join, visible only in very bright scenes and only if I am looking for it. It doesn’t really bother me, but some might wish to pay extra for one-piece construction just in case. The velvet border works well at soaking up any spillover. I got the frame with the eyelets for hanging. Placing eyelets is tricky. If they are too close to the center, the screen bows up from its weight; too close to the edges and the frame will bow down. Seymour places them well, but I still decided to support the frame on the bottom.


I originally ordered an XD screen, but switched to the UF material. Seymour made the swap out easy and painless.


On to the screen comparison.


The Phifer had a tendency to bloom, which would often result in a somewhat washed-out picture. Neither the XD nor UF exhibit this tendency; colors really pop on both. Indeed, the UF and the Panasonic 8000 produce an image very close to my Samsung LCD’s.


I never saw any sparklies with the Phifer. Both the XD and UF material occasionally sparkle, the UF material less so.


For a weave-visibility test, I use the opening sequence of (the original) “Ice Age.” From my 9.5 foot vantage point, the Phifer weave is noticeable and can be distracting. The XD weave also can be seen, but it is less intrusive than the Phifer. The UF weave per se is not visible, but I occasionally can see a faint sort of banding that follows the angled weave pattern. Do I wish there was no evidence of texture at all? Yes. Do I believe that is possible with my eyesight at 9.5 feet? No, and I am not going to let perfection be the enemy of the (very) good.


Final comments on the UF’s gain. For 2D, the 8000 on Cinema 2 and eco mode is plenty bright. For 3D (with the Sony PlayStation glasses), dynamic and normal mode works just fine.

Last edited by simon_templar_32; Today at 09:32 AM. Reason: More information
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Originally Posted by simon_templar_32 View Post
...I originally ordered an XD screen, but switched to the UF material. Seymour made the swap out easy and painless...
Thanks for the report. Can you please elaborate in detail as to why you switched from XD to UF? Also out of curiosity did you make any observations on how these various materials looked further away, like say from 12 feet?
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