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post #2911 of 3676 Old 05-24-2012, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Blackdevil77 View Post

Thanks! Damn! $2900 bucks! That's nearly 3X's the cost I was gonna spend. Is the picture on this screen really 3 times better then a typical screen or does the law of diminishing returns come into play here? Any deals to be had on these screens or are they priced as is?

I'm thinking the 1.4 gain screen should be good for my needs

You can get it elsewhere for less. Look around or talk to your local dealer.
Also, if you have Best Buy nearby or higher end home theater B&M place, go see it for yourself; some places do have it on their showrooms. The BD does work well when conditions are not perfectly light controlled as far as I have seen. I had the opportunity to test one, and it worked fine. Is it worth the money? I am still on the fence TBH.
There are other alternatives as well. There is an article about it on the latest issue of Home Theater Magazine; take a look at their website; those guys also had the BD for a little while and did a short write up on it.

I wish I had more time to enjoy my gear
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post #2912 of 3676 Old 05-24-2012, 04:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isisyodin View Post

You can get it elsewhere for less. Look around or talk to your local dealer.
Also, if you have Best Buy nearby or higher end home theater B&M place, go see it for yourself; some places do have it on their showrooms. The BD does work well when conditions are not perfectly light controlled as far as I have seen. I had the opportunity to test one, and it worked fine. Is it worth the money? I am still on the fence TBH.
There are other alternatives as well. There is an article about it on the latest issue of Home Theater Magazine; take a look at their website; those guys also had the BD for a little while and did a short write up on it.

I have a local dealer that sells these, I'll send him an e-mail.

I just read the home theater article on the Black Diamond screen. The room I'm gonna have it in will be completely light controlled. Maybe OCCASIONALLY there would be some dim lighting. The most light that would be in that room is during super bowl

My only slight concern is off axis viewing. If your not directly in front of the screen, the picture darkens noticeably?
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post #2913 of 3676 Old 05-24-2012, 07:57 PM
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Here is a write up of a test also done recently, so you can get it an idea of the off-axis performance of similar screens (gain-wise).
http://www.hometheater.com/content/s...eens-ht-labs-m
BTW, these screens are also pretty darn good.

I wish I had more time to enjoy my gear
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post #2914 of 3676 Old 05-25-2012, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Blackdevil77 View Post

How much for a 106" BD screen in the HDTV (16:9) format? I can't find a price online. I was looking at other screens in the 1000 dollar range but everyone keeps talking about how amazing this screen is. It would be used with an Epson 6010 in a dedicated room.

Aren't most Blu Ray movies in the 16:9 format? Would there be any benefit of going with the 2:35:1 or 2:40:1?

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post #2915 of 3676 Old 05-25-2012, 07:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isisyodin View Post

For material other than in 16:9 format, you will need an expensive lens system if you want it well done. Some newer projectors have internal masking systems, but they are done at a software level with compromises in overall quality.
Projector People dot com has the BD in the typical 16:9 or 2.35:1. You will have to decide on the gain since there are 3 options today. 0.8, 1.4 and 2.7 if am not mistaken. Since you have light control, maybe the 0.8 or 1.4 would be good depending if you will like to use it with the lights on often. Consider the variables: size, gain, viewing preference (dark or lit room), viewing angle. All the latter are related of course and typically it goes like this:
Bigger size require more lumens out of your projector; higher gain screens will give you higher brightness in front but decreases to half brightness at angles as small as 40 degrees of the main viewing point (dead center); too much gain also increases hot spotting or sparkles in the BD.
Also if your projector does 3D and you think it is a must, you may consider even the 2.7. Active shutter glasses 3D decrease the projector's light entering your eyes by up to 60 percent.
One last item is calibration. I am not completely sure how well you can calibrate the BD since no one has commented on my last post.

Actually some of the newer projectors (Sony VW95, VW1000 and all of the new JVC's) have lens memory. What they are doing is zooming the black bars off of the scope screen. These projectors are able to memorize different focus, zoom and shift postions of the lens. The black bars are still there, you just lose them on the dark back ground. You can also digitally mask the black bars, but that does not have any effect on the image its self. Nothing is being done digitally to degrade the image. Of course like with any image as you make it larger the pixels get bigger and the spacing between the pixels increases. The Panny 7000 is the projector doing it digitally by shifting the image on the chip, but it is not doing any processing, so the image quality stays the same other than the same stipulation of the pixels getting larger. it just severly limits the projector location if you are wanting to use a scope screen with this projector. There are a lot of people using the zoom method for CIH. With all of the above projectors, except the VW1000, everyone would agree that an A-lens is the better method compared to the zoom method. it is just a more expensive route.

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post #2916 of 3676 Old 06-06-2012, 03:54 AM
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Hi guys,

My screen is finally here, the whole thing was quite the adventure, the ordering, the delivery and the installation wasn’t easy.

I originally wanted to order directly from SI since the price in Europe were so expensive but obviously they were not so keen on doing so since they had a distributor in my country, after insisting a lot they agreed to exceptionally sell me a screen directly but I had to take care of the shipping from their warehouse to Switzerland and this is when the real trouble began, it seems that shipping a 144inch across the pond is harder than it seems, the usual transporter FEDEX/UPS/DHL where not accepting such large parcel and only some freight transporter would do the trick, I received some estimates around 1’500$ for sea shipping with a transit time of 4-6 weeks and usually above 3’000$ for air freight and even then the price only included transport to closest port/airport.

I spent some time thinking about it and reached the conclusion that first it wouldn’t be much cheaper than buying the screen from the local distributor and second it would save me the headache of having to deal with it myself, so I place the order for a 144inch 2.35 Black Diamond Zero Edge, from there things moved surprisingly fast and in about 2 weeks the screen was ready for install.

This is only when the installer called me with concerns regarding the size of the parcel that I realized there was no way it would go through the staircase, for those who don’t know the zero edge is one solid piece and cannot be folded, I’m living on the 4th and last floor, so I had to contact a company that usually deals with moving piano to come with a crane to get the screen inside through the Balcony, I was a bit worried but in the end they made it look easy and in 30 minutes the screen was in my leaving room, it’s about that time my wife saw the box and almost fainted… good times…

Then even the installation wasn’t easy, installer came with an extra guy but to navigate with a 144inch in a living room was… challenging but I have to say the whole installation was quite straight forward, I went for the ceiling mount and to get it hanging was relatively easy, it’s still a 60kg screen but it went faster than expected,

Here’s a quick picture of the result, with and without curtains, hope you'll like it:

400

400
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post #2917 of 3676 Old 06-06-2012, 04:37 AM
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This Sir, simply looks brilliant! Which country in Europe you are fram in particular? SI qouted me $500 for shipping a 100" Zero Edge to Germany. But I do want to go for the exact screen you have after reconsideration smile.gif

But I won't stand those shipping costs...

What gain is this beauty btw?

Kind regards
Reinhard
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post #2918 of 3676 Old 06-06-2012, 06:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by r4Yn View Post

This Sir, simply looks brilliant! Which country in Europe you are fram in particular? SI qouted me $500 for shipping a 100" Zero Edge to Germany. But I do want to go for the exact screen you have after reconsideration smile.gif
But I won't stand those shipping costs...
What gain is this beauty btw?
Kind regards
Reinhard

Hi Reinhard,

I'm in Switzerland, I think your situation might be different since they don't have a distributor in Germany so they might agree to ship a screen to you directly and take care of the logistic aspect as well, they must have much lower shipping since it's probably negotiated.

I can tell you that if they agree to sell you a screen directly then the additional 500$ for shipping is NOTHING compared to the price you will get an EU dealer, the price I paid for mine was ~8'500$ including the LED kit at the back and the ceiling mount but this is roughly 2 more expensive than some price I was quoted by SI or other US retailer, so at +500$ with US price it's a bargain.

My screen gain is 0.8
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post #2919 of 3676 Old 06-06-2012, 07:03 AM
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Congratulations cR4p.

@ r4Yn, I have the same problem with the expensive shipping charges (I'm from Malaysia). SI screens cost a bomb locally.
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post #2920 of 3676 Old 06-06-2012, 09:05 AM
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Beautiful screen! What projector are you using to drive that beast? I've got a 120" 2.35 1.4 gain BD screen on order and hoping my little HC4000 will be adequate in terms of brightness.
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post #2921 of 3676 Old 06-06-2012, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by speavler View Post

Beautiful screen! What projector are you using to drive that beast? I've got a 120" 2.35 1.4 gain BD screen on order and hoping my little HC4000 will be adequate in terms of brightness.

The beast is driven by a Sony VW-1000ES biggrin.gif
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post #2922 of 3676 Old 06-06-2012, 09:26 AM
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VERY nice. Love the decor too. We're doing a somewhat contemporary re-do of our family room. Should be done in a few weeks. I went with the hanging from ceiling option too. How do you like the LED kit?
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post #2923 of 3676 Old 06-06-2012, 10:15 AM
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the LED kit is nice but at least in Europe it's greatly overpriced, my installer told that the screen size was obviously driving the price up, maybe with some DIY skills the same effect could be reached for a fraction of the price, it looks great but it's a gadget
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post #2924 of 3676 Old 06-14-2012, 05:04 PM
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Hey guys,

I am very interested in a BD 100" 1.4 gain Zero Edge, and I already ordered a few screen samples from SI. When experimenting with the samples, I noticed some very limiting viewing angles on the 1.4. Otherwise, I love the look. Does the viewing angle on a small sample represent the same angle I would get with a 100" screen? Is it more or less noticeable? This is the only thing holding me back.

My Home Theater
Screen: DNP Supernova BLADE (08-85)
Projector: Espon 8350
Receiver: Yamaha RX-671
Speakers: DefTech 8060-ST
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post #2925 of 3676 Old 06-15-2012, 12:41 PM
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The sample is representative of how the whole screen would behave, but it is probably more obvious when placed against a screen that has a wider viewing cone. If your objective is ambient light rejection with a wider viewing cone, take a look at the DNP Supernova. To my eyes there is very little drop-off in the 2.3 gain material (23-23) and seemingly none in the .8 gain material (08-85); plus the off angle view doesn't seem to have any color shift.
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post #2926 of 3676 Old 06-15-2012, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kev1000000 View Post

Hey guys,
I am very interested in a BD 100" 1.4 gain Zero Edge, and I already ordered a few screen samples from SI. When experimenting with the samples, I noticed some very limiting viewing angles on the 1.4. Otherwise, I love the look. Does the viewing angle on a small sample represent the same angle I would get with a 100" screen? Is it more or less noticeable? This is the only thing holding me back.

How wide is your room and how wide is your seating area? Also what size screen are you considering?

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales
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post #2927 of 3676 Old 06-15-2012, 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Will Binegar View Post

The sample is representative of how the whole screen would behave, but it is probably more obvious when placed against a screen that has a wider viewing cone. If your objective is ambient light rejection with a wider viewing cone, take a look at the DNP Supernova. To my eyes there is very little drop-off in the 2.3 gain material (23-23) and seemingly none in the .8 gain material (08-85); plus the off angle view doesn't seem to have any color shift.

I have been trying to find the Supernova. Who sells it? Can I get samples?
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

How wide is your room and how wide is your seating area? Also what size screen are you considering?

I am considering a 100" screen. The room width is about 15 feet, and we sit 13' back from the screen. The problem is, I have an L shaped couch that we use for seating, and the people on the top of the L have a pretty wide angle (about 100 degrees). Now, I know any light rejection screen will suffer at 100 degrees off axis, but the far side of the picture is nearly unviewable, at least on my 1.4 sample material from SI.

My Home Theater
Screen: DNP Supernova BLADE (08-85)
Projector: Espon 8350
Receiver: Yamaha RX-671
Speakers: DefTech 8060-ST
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post #2928 of 3676 Old 06-16-2012, 03:26 PM
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We are a DNP dealer, but getting samples is a problem. A DNP Supernova screen is not like sending out a screen sample from any other company.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales
Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me: Mike@AVScience.com

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post #2929 of 3676 Old 06-16-2012, 11:02 PM
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Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

We are a DNP dealer, but getting samples is a problem. A DNP Supernova screen is not like sending out a screen sample from any other company.

What kind of price am I looking at for a 100"?

My Home Theater
Screen: DNP Supernova BLADE (08-85)
Projector: Espon 8350
Receiver: Yamaha RX-671
Speakers: DefTech 8060-ST
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post #2930 of 3676 Old 06-17-2012, 02:29 PM
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Call us.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales
Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me: Mike@AVScience.com

Brands we sell: http://avscience.com/brands/

 

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post #2931 of 3676 Old 06-17-2012, 09:26 PM
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Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

Call us.

Will do. Since other people may have the same question, what specifically about the Supernova makes it difficult to get samples?

My Home Theater
Screen: DNP Supernova BLADE (08-85)
Projector: Espon 8350
Receiver: Yamaha RX-671
Speakers: DefTech 8060-ST
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post #2932 of 3676 Old 06-18-2012, 06:59 AM
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Unlke Stewart and Screen Innovations, DNP doesn't seem to have small samples of the material to send . The samples I've seen are like minature blackboards, maybe 24" diagonal complete with a frame. I'm lucky in that DNP has facility in Irvine, CA (about 40 minutes south of Los Angeles) so I was able to go have a demo on full sized screens. You could try the DNP site and look for dealers who are in your area; they may have a Supernova set up, or at least have a sample you could borrow.
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post #2933 of 3676 Old 06-18-2012, 02:51 PM
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I ran into the same issue with the "blackboard" samples when I was researching for a screen. The dealer I talked to was across the country and wanted a few hundred dollar deposit on the sample while it was out of his hands! eek.gif Needless to say I didn't follow up. If getting a sample was that hard what kind of service could I expect if something went wrong with the order? SI and especially Tabitha have always been happy to send out samples. GIve them a call.
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post #2934 of 3676 Old 06-20-2012, 03:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kev1000000 View Post

Will do. Since other people may have the same question, what specifically about the Supernova makes it difficult to get samples?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Will Binegar View Post

Unlke Stewart and Screen Innovations, DNP doesn't seem to have small samples of the material to send . The samples I've seen are like minature blackboards, maybe 24" diagonal complete with a frame. I'm lucky in that DNP has facility in Irvine, CA (about 40 minutes south of Los Angeles) so I was able to go have a demo on full sized screens. You could try the DNP site and look for dealers who are in your area; they may have a Supernova set up, or at least have a sample you could borrow.

Correct. A dealer has to place a healthy deposit to get a sample and it comes in a protective hard case. That is why the dealer wanted a deposit to send you the sample screen.

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post #2935 of 3676 Old 06-22-2012, 06:34 AM
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Guys I have a Q for u: have the largest BD screen in 2.35:1. I am looking for a masking system for it. My installer said he does not know of any that works with the BD screen. I was wondering if anyone is using a masking system and if so which one...thanks in advance.

For anyone just considering the screen, for me it was a huge improvement in PQ compared to the regular white screen, specially if there is ambient light in the room...
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post #2936 of 3676 Old 06-22-2012, 09:21 AM
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For anyone just considering the screen, for me it was a huge improvement in PQ compared to the regular white screen, specially if there is ambient light in the room...

That is good to hear. Which gain do you have? How is the hotspotting and off-axis viewing? Those are my main two issues I am still hung up on after receiving my sample.

My Home Theater
Screen: DNP Supernova BLADE (08-85)
Projector: Espon 8350
Receiver: Yamaha RX-671
Speakers: DefTech 8060-ST
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post #2937 of 3676 Old 06-22-2012, 01:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Kev1000000 View Post

That is good to hear. Which gain do you have? How is the hotspotting and off-axis viewing? Those are my main two issues I am still hung up on after receiving my sample.

Mine is 1.4. I have not noted any hotspotting yet. Paired with RS55. As far as off axis viewing: my room is pretty rectangular. So the seating arrangement is not too far from the center....I or anyone who has spent time watching stuff in the HT have not noticed any drop off from the center....hope it helps.
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post #2938 of 3676 Old 06-24-2012, 02:39 PM
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Originally Posted by stlcity View Post

Mine is 1.4. I have not noted any hotspotting yet. Paired with RS55. As far as off axis viewing: my room is pretty rectangular. So the seating arrangement is not too far from the center....I or anyone who has spent time watching stuff in the HT have not noticed any drop off from the center....hope it helps.

I hate to ask, but is there any way you could take a picture of some off-axis shots? I want as much info as I can before I pull the trigger on something I can't physically see in person. If not, no worries.

My Home Theater
Screen: DNP Supernova BLADE (08-85)
Projector: Espon 8350
Receiver: Yamaha RX-671
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post #2939 of 3676 Old 06-25-2012, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kev1000000 View Post

I hate to ask, but is there any way you could take a picture of some off-axis shots? I want as much info as I can before I pull the trigger on something I can't physically see in person. If not, no worries.

Unless he is very good with a camera, the picture will probably turn you off, regarding that screen. Hot spotting is a matter of screen size, lumen output and throw distance. When set up correctly the Black Diamond screens throw a nice image especially for rooms with ambient light.

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post #2940 of 3676 Old 06-25-2012, 03:51 PM
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Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

Unless he is very good with a camera, the picture will probably turn you off, regarding that screen. Hot spotting is a matter of screen size, lumen output and throw distance. When set up correctly the Black Diamond screens throw a nice image especially for rooms with ambient light.

Well regardless of setup, off-axis viewing should remain about the same, or am I mistaken?

I won't judge the overall quality of the picture. I would just like to see how much the picture brightness drops off from one edge of the screen to the other while viewing off-axis (around 90 degrees).

The problem with my setup is, I have a lot of ambient light, but also a wide-seating layout. I realize I will have to have some sort of tradeoff, but I am wondering whether to trade off some ambient light rejection or quality image from the side. If the off-axis viewing isn't too bad, then I can sacrifice some image quality for those guests. But with my sample, at the position where they would be seated, it looks nearly unwatchable. But then again, I only have a very small sample to make that assumption.

My Home Theater
Screen: DNP Supernova BLADE (08-85)
Projector: Espon 8350
Receiver: Yamaha RX-671
Speakers: DefTech 8060-ST
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