Is 10 feet too close for 120 inch screen at 1080p??? - AVS Forum
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Old 07-23-2008, 10:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi guys,

I was just looking for some feedback here. I've recently purchased another home and will be building another theater... The room is already "built". I'll try to explain it as best I can here. The room is on the 2nd floor over a 3 car garage. The floor space of the room is 20'6" wide (across the screen wall) and 19'4" long (from the entry to the screen wall) with a max ceiling height of 11 feet. There is a hip roof that angles in 3 of the walls. The 2 side walls begin a 45 degree slope to the ceiling at about 5 feet high. The screen wall begins a 45 degree slope to the ceiling at about 3 feet high. Now, the angled walls are perfect for the pyramid I plan on turning the room into, but I lose space in the room because of them. The side walls are no issue at all. It's the screen wall that is forcing some issues and decisions. If I leave the screen wall where it is set up for now, using the riser calculator dimensions (my riser is set at 13 inches because of how the entry comes into the room), I lose about 46 inches of depth in the room because of the screen and where it needs to be placed. Which puts the first row of seating about 10 feet from a 120" screen and the second row at 15.5 feet away. The measurements using the calculator are as follows:
Bottom of screen to the floor: 28 inches
Top of screen height: 87 inches
Floor space (depth) lost to the screen and wall angle: 46 inches
Riser depth (to accomodate a couch): 5.5 feet
Distance from screen to first row seated eyes: 10 feet

Is this too close to a 120 inch screen from the first row? I will be utilizing a 1080p projector.
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Old 07-23-2008, 10:48 AM
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Short answer for a long question....not likely. But, it does depend on your projector. Not all 1920x1080 projectors have the same pixel fill so they may become more apparent.

I would be more worried about your source. If you plan to watch a lot of SD, it may not look all that good with that size. If HD, you should be okay (although it will be HUGE).
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Old 07-23-2008, 11:22 AM
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No, it is not too close. I sit 12 ft away in front of a 133" diagonal screen lit by a Sony Pearl PJ. It is, however, BIG and I love it this way.
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Old 07-23-2008, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Todd_zilla View Post

Hi guys,

I was just looking for some feedback here. I've recently purchased another home and will be building another theater... The room is already "built". I'll try to explain it as best I can here. The room is on the 2nd floor over a 3 car garage. The floor space of the room is 20'6" wide (across the screen wall) and 19'4" long (from the entry to the screen wall) with a max ceiling height of 11 feet. There is a hip roof that angles in 3 of the walls. The 2 side walls begin a 45 degree slope to the ceiling at about 5 feet high. The screen wall begins a 45 degree slope to the ceiling at about 3 feet high. Now, the angled walls are perfect for the pyramid I plan on turning the room into, but I lose space in the room because of them. The side walls are no issue at all. It's the screen wall that is forcing some issues and decisions. If I leave the screen wall where it is set up for now, using the riser calculator dimensions (my riser is set at 13 inches because of how the entry comes into the room), I lose about 46 inches of depth in the room because of the screen and where it needs to be placed. Which puts the first row of seating about 10 feet from a 120" screen and the second row at 15.5 feet away. The measurements using the calculator are as follows:
Bottom of screen to the floor: 28 inches
Top of screen height: 87 inches
Floor space (depth) lost to the screen and wall angle: 46 inches
Riser depth (to accomodate a couch): 5.5 feet
Distance from screen to first row seated eyes: 10 feet

Is this too close to a 120 inch screen from the first row? I will be utilizing a 1080p projector.

That setup presents a 1:1 viewing ratio. The PJ should be more than up to task as most don't exhibit objectionable SDE until you are within 5 feet of a screen that size.
But, can YOU handle such extreme 'up close and personal' viewing? Try 1:1 on your TV to get an idea.
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Old 07-23-2008, 12:08 PM
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you could always go to a theater to see if this ratio works for you
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Old 07-23-2008, 12:46 PM
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I prefer 1x for 2.35 material, but it is a little close for 16:9. I also have a 10' wide screen and sit 10' back. But for 16:9 I prefer 16' back. BTW, I'm using and RS1.
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Old 07-23-2008, 12:46 PM
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I think you would be at the min sitting distance.
Some like it and some don't. The pj is another variable.
LCos is more forgiving for close sitting than DLP imo.
I have a CRT and DLP and that ratio (1:1) is just too close for me but again it might be the ticket for you.

It is all about quality...that is the picture

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Old 07-23-2008, 12:59 PM
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I'm with Tryg. Go to a movie theater early. Walk across in front of the screen and count your paces. Then try to 'pace' up the steps until you are the same distance from the screen as the screen is wide. Sit there and see if you feel overwhelmed. If you don't, you are good to go. If you do, back up a bit until you feel comfortable.

I'm setting my room up for 12' front row from a 10' wide 2.35:1 screen. My wife thinks that might be too close for her, so she can have the back row!

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Old 07-23-2008, 01:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys... In my current theater, my eyes are at 11.5 feet for a 106 inch screen... I guess I could do the math on how far to sit from my current screen to approximate what it would be like at 10 feet for a 120 inch screen... right now, though, it's not overwhelming at all and I use a 720p DLP projector. I watch HD content almost exclusively in the theater... DirecTV (now and there) and Blue Ray in the new place.
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Old 07-23-2008, 01:13 PM - Thread Starter
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If I have to move back, it's either go with a smaller screen, which I don't want to do in a room that size, or change the screen wall, which I had hoped to save due to the pre-wiring in place. Changing the screen wall would also cause some more labor in building the "pyramid" I plan on doing.
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Old 07-23-2008, 01:15 PM - Thread Starter
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According my quick calculations, if I sit at about 8.5 feet away from my current screen, that should approximate the same 1.1 ratio... should I factor any "fudge" for the higher resolution though?
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Old 07-23-2008, 01:17 PM - Thread Starter
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And right now, I'm looking hard at the BenQ W5000 as the projector for the new setup...
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Old 07-23-2008, 01:21 PM
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1:1 is around the optimum recommended by THX (50 degree viewing angle), so you should be fine, but as the others suggest, try it first just to be sure.

You might find this interesting:

http://home1.gte.net/res18h39/allscope.gif

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Old 07-23-2008, 01:55 PM
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I prefer to be a little farther back (as does my wife). Everyone is different. I sit 14' from 106" diag screen (RS-1 @ 1080p)
and wouldn't want to be 1 inch closer.

Another reason I prefer to sit a little farther back is I don't like to be "on top" of my front speakers. They seem to provide better "imaging" from a little farther back.
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Old 07-23-2008, 01:58 PM
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I sit 1:1 on 127 inch wide 2.35 screen - its not an issue for anyone who has sat there. You are projecting 2 rows - sit in the second row if its a problem and stick the kids/bozos like me in the front row.

What would be of concern to me (unless you are planning recliners) is the height off the floor for the first row eyeline. Ergonomically we view objects at about 15 degrees below the horizon. It has been recommended that eyeline for the first row should be about 1/3 of the screen height. I don't like looking up and hate recliners so my screen is lower than even this rule of thumb. This is likely over thinking the process and is likely not an issue for most. As I said I'm with the bozos on this bus.

ted
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Old 07-23-2008, 01:59 PM
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Is that a 120" diagonal or wide screen?

We sit 144" ( 12' ) away from a 118" wide 2.35:1 screen ( about 1.2 + screen widths ) and 139" from the 108" wide 1.85:1 screen ( about 1.3 screen widths ) and it seems about perfect. My fiance got seasick watching 24 in HD when we first built the theater, but shes used to it now!

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Old 07-23-2008, 02:22 PM
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My last set up was around 1.2 x SW with a scope screen and that seemed very watchable. I'll be trying 1:1 in my new cinema room once it's built though.

John brings up an interesting point - some time ago I was wondering how close you had to be sitting before the center speaker started to become noticeable, inasmuch as the audio wasn't coming from the screen but from below it. I've asked here before but no-one had an answer. Even at 1.2 seating distance I never once found the audio/video tie up to be an issue. Perhaps when watching an AT screen the difference will become noticeable and an AT will be preferred, but perhaps at 1:1 you may be at the point where the speaker(s) need to be behind the screen.

Any one any thoughts on that?

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Old 07-23-2008, 02:24 PM
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If you are building a new room you would need to consider the audio consideration for nulls and peaks in regard with where your seats go.

It is all about quality...that is the picture

JVC & NEC 8" CRT with 106" wide Stewart screen. All NHT speakers driven by Pioneer Elite AVR and bluray

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Old 07-23-2008, 02:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Lightfoot View Post

My last set up was around 1.2 x SW with a scope screen and that seemed very watchable. I'll be trying 1:1 in my new cinema room once it's built though.

John brings up an interesting point - some time ago I was wondering how close you had to be sitting before the center speaker started to become noticeable, inasmuch as the audio wasn't coming from the screen but from below it. I've asked here before but no-one had an answer. Even at 1.2 seating distance I never once found the audio/video tie up to be an issue. Perhaps when watching an AT screen the difference will become noticeable and an AT will be preferred, but perhaps at 1:1 you may be at the point where the speaker(s) need to be behind the screen.

Any one any thoughts on that?

Gary

Your imaging would change with where you sit and will degrade if too close due to much angle with the fronts. But what is more important are the nulls and peaks in the room which can be corrected by damping and traps and EQ only to some extent. You hardly can ever flatten an in-room response so make sure sitting distances are correct.
As a general very basic rule one should avoid the 1/2,1/4 ..etc. in either orientation.
AFA imaging that has also to do with the speakers/pro/amp and source as well and need experimentations to get it right.

It is all about quality...that is the picture

JVC & NEC 8" CRT with 106" wide Stewart screen. All NHT speakers driven by Pioneer Elite AVR and bluray

Custom dedicated 8 seat theater

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Old 07-23-2008, 02:37 PM
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One thing that I have found from being in the business for so long...most people underestimate the impact of a large screen. What do I mean? Well, when one says a 10' screen, it doesn't sound that big in a way. But when they actually see one that size in their house...often it is more impactful (is that a word?) then they thought. So, in a nutshell...try to get an idea before you jump in to be safe. Screens are almost always final sale as they are custom.
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Old 07-23-2008, 02:44 PM
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One also has to consider the seating. We have one row of seating 16 feet wide. Any closer and the folks sitting on the ends would not have as good a viewing experience due to the angle. As it is, every seat is a good seat at our current eye to screen distance. If your seating is not as wide, you could probably move a little closer. But beware of eye fatigue etc. from sitting too close. Some people complain about headaches and fatigue from DLP's, but i think that sitting too close to too big a screen can produce the same negative effect no matter what the projector. Especially with " run and gun " shot movies with too much hand held camera work!!

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Old 07-23-2008, 02:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Turk View Post

So, in a nutshell...try to get an idea before you jump in to be safe. Screens are almost always final sale as they are custom.

I always suggest using painter's tape to outline exactly where the screen would be mounted. It helps in a variety of aspects including sight lines.
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Old 07-23-2008, 02:55 PM - Thread Starter
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The room is already built, I'll just be modifying it. The front row will be theater recliners (probably 6) and the second row will be a couch and 2 individual, non-reclining Egyptian "throne" chairs. 7 feet high Egyptian columns all around the room complete with hyroglyphics, two 8 feet high statues of Anubis and two 6 feet high sarcophagi of King Tut (which I use for DVD storage). Above the height of the columns, I plan to build a "pyramid" to make you feel as though you are actually in a pyramid. The top of the pyramid will house an opening for the IB sub (although I may have to move this closer to the screen depending on the final placement) and a fiber optic starfield. Definitive Technology bi-polar speaker towers for the front left and right... Def Tech CLR 3000 for the center.. Def Tech BPX surrounds. 7.1 configuration. Infinite Baffle Subwoofer installation (Eight 15" Dayton IB drivers driven by a Behringer EP-2500). Pioneer Elite receiver. Acoustical treatments throughout hidden behind fabric. I don't think the speaker proximity will be an issue, especially with bi-polars.
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Old 07-23-2008, 03:07 PM - Thread Starter
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What would be the ramifications if I "cheat" the height of the screen closer to the floor about 6 inches? That would get me to 10.5 feet from the screen. That would put the bottom of the screen 22 inches from the floor and the first row eye line at about 1/4 of the way up the screen with the back row eye line at about the midway point of the screen.
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Old 07-23-2008, 03:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Here is the existing theater... using the Egyptian stuff in the new room, and one of the couches.

http://s8.photobucket.com/albums/a21...heater%20Room/
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Old 07-23-2008, 03:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Could I get away with placing the bottom of the screen 16 inches from the floor? That would place the eye line of the first row of seating about 1/3 of the way up the screen and the 2nd row would be just higher than midway up the screen... And give me 11 feet from the screen to the first row, moving me up to a 1.3 ratio... Is that screen too low? especially for the back row?
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Old 07-23-2008, 03:39 PM
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Lower isn't a problem PENDING that the back row is as clear a view as possible. I myself like it lower rather than high. There are a lot of "rules" out there, but a lot really comes down to personal preference.
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Old 07-23-2008, 03:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Jason... the back row riser is 13 inches high, so as long as I didn't pick any really tall theater seats, I would think it should be ok. I was concerned about the angle of view from the back row being slightly higher than mid-screen, but looking at my monitor, I don't think that will be an issue either... actually, gonna go home and figure out where my back row eye level currently is...
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Old 07-23-2008, 04:02 PM
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If not going with perf then center spk sits on the floor literally.

It is all about quality...that is the picture

JVC & NEC 8" CRT with 106" wide Stewart screen. All NHT speakers driven by Pioneer Elite AVR and bluray

Custom dedicated 8 seat theater

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Old 07-23-2008, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
If not going with perf then center spk sits on the floor literally.

Unless you can mount it above the screen. That's where mine is.

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