Infocus IN82/83 vs. benq w5000/20000 - AVS Forum
Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP > Infocus IN82/83 vs. benq w5000/20000
scrubsr1's Avatar scrubsr1 12:48 PM 08-14-2008
Has anyone here had the chance to do a direct comparison between the infocus IN82 and the benq w5000 or w20000? I've found an incredible deal on the infocus and I'm curious how it stacks up to the benq models. I can make either projector work in my (light controlled)environment so that's not an issue...it's simply a matter of performance. Also, I asked this in the IN83 thread but is there an appreciable difference between the IN82 vs. the IN83?

Before anyone asks, there is no place within 300 miles of where I live that have these projectors on display. I'm relying on what you guys have to say. Thanks.

f300v10's Avatar f300v10 01:52 PM 08-14-2008
scrubsr1,

I was in a similar situation as you are, trying to decide between the same 4 projectors without being able to view any of them. I think in the end all 4 would throw similar images with two possible differentiators, light output and black levels. The two infocus models can output over 1000 lumens at D65, while the Benq models are closer to 6/700. Given the Benq W20000 has the same DC3 chip as the IN82, and it has adds a dynamic iris, the W20000 would likely have the best blacks of the group, with the IN83 probably second if you stop down the manual iris. Both the IN82 and W5000 have tested with a max CR of around 4000:1. That is a native number for the IN82, and a DI active value for the W5000. In the end I went with the W5000 as it was available for a little more than 1/2 the IN82 and less than 1/2 of the IN83 and W20000. If you can get an incredible deal on the IN82 and you can handle the high (36%) fixed offset, that is probably the best choice.
scrubsr1's Avatar scrubsr1 07:44 PM 08-14-2008
Thanks for the feedback f300v10. With the DI on the benq thrown in the mix it leaves me wondering how much contrast I'll be missing on the IN82, if any at all. Both are more then sufficient in regards to brightness. I like the fact that the infocus comes with the two year warranty which should be a minimum for all projectors. The price of the IN82 is $200 less then what av science store is asking for the benq w5000. Decisions, decisions...
stanger89's Avatar stanger89 08:02 PM 08-14-2008
The only other objective difference between the two, is Infocus seems to push/bias green toward yellow a bit (undersaturate it) while the W5000 (and presumably W20000) actually have primaries that are closer to correct (though a tad oversaturated).

Going from my IN76 to my W5000, one of the biggest differences was in the "improved" color, they seem much more vivid on the W5000. Note that that's comparing a 720p to a 1080p, though I think they're both DC2 machines.

The only other comment I have is my IN76 was rock solid, while the W5000 seems less so, however I think I had a "late" revision firmware on the IN76 and the launch firmware on the W5000, so I'd be willing to accept that I just got the IN76 at a more mature point in it's life cycle.

If I could have dealt with the offset, I probably would have got the IN83 when I was purchasing, and if f300v10's info is right (I haven't followed that closely) I'd probably lean toward the 4000:1 native contrast of the IN82 vs the ~4000:1 dynamic contrast of the W5000, but I'm not sure how I'd weigh that against the better colors. FWIW, I didn't feel I was missing anything with the IN76's colors, it's just that the W5000's better colors were a nice surprise.

Hopefully that's not more confusing than helpful
coolrda's Avatar coolrda 08:49 PM 08-14-2008
I don't know if native is the proper term anymore, with an iris involved, whether manual, dynamic or both. If you take the iris away its sure to change the CR. How does Infocus get significantly higher contrast with the same chips as the Benq's or Planar's? Are these real #'s?
f300v10's Avatar f300v10 09:12 PM 08-14-2008
Cine4home.de does a very thorough job of testing projectors, and measured 3900:1 at D65 for the IN82. That was with BC off, it would be higher with it on. Keep in mind that the Sharp XZ-20000 has been measured at over 7000 with the same DC3 chip as the IN82 and W20000, without DI. The IN83 has been measured between 5000:1 and 6000:1 with the DC4 chip again at D65.
coolrda's Avatar coolrda 09:36 PM 08-14-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by f300v10 View Post

Cine4home.de does a very thorough job of testing projectors, and measured 3900:1 at D65 for the IN82. That was with BC off, it would be higher with it on. Keep in mind that the Sharp XZ-20000 has been measured at over 7000 with the same DC3 chip as the IN82 and W20000, without DI. The IN83 has been measured between 5000:1 and 6000:1 with the DC4 chip again at D65.

Wow, I guess something can be said for controlling light escaping the lens. Maybe its the position of the iris with having 2. I've noticed when you have the projector close to the screen so you see the edge of the lens outside the chip, it is brighter in relation to the rest of the screen. Guess that can make a difference.
Elkhunter's Avatar Elkhunter 11:51 PM 08-14-2008
scrubsr1,

Before deciding on which projector to purchase, I suggest that you read the InFocus IN82/83 and BenQ W5000/W20000 reviews at www.projectorcentral.com/, if you haven't already done so. Lots of good info to consider before purchasing (hopefully unbiased), e.g., the IN83 review has a shootout between the 83 and the 20000. Also, here's a quote from the review: " The IN83 is InFocus's upgrade to the IN82, which we reviewed last November. The primary difference between these two projectors is the addition of a DarkChip4. This enhancement makes the IN83 a great projector. " Sounds like the IN83 is worth the extra $$$.

I returned a BenQ W5000 due to image noise. Apparently, Evan (www.projectorcentral.com/), Art (www.projectorreviews.com/) and I are the only people on the planet who believe that the W5000 has an image noise issue. Others here on this forum believe that the noise is in the source; not created by the projector itself. I disagree.

With no dealers within 300 miles of where you live, all you can do is read all of the info thats available, both pro and con. Good luck with your purchase.
f300v10's Avatar f300v10 05:56 AM 08-15-2008
Elkhunter, if the W5000 was 'creating noise' wouldn't it do it all the time, and not in a completely repeatable way? What could possibly trigger the noise to be there on some disks, but not on others? Or even in some scenes but not others in the same film, other than the source? I don't disagree that the W5000 shows more noise than other projectors, but it does not 'create' it. It only shows it if it is in the source. Make it more visible than other projectors, sure, but only if it was in the source to begin with. Due to its ultra fast response time, DLP is inherently more capable of rendering high frequency data, which is exactly what 'noise' is.
coolrda's Avatar coolrda 09:56 AM 08-15-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elkhunter View Post

scrubsr1,

Before deciding on which projector to purchase, I suggest that you read the InFocus IN82/83 and BenQ W5000/W20000 reviews at www.projectorcentral.com/, if you haven't already done so. Lots of good info to consider before purchasing (hopefully unbiased), e.g., the IN83 review has a shootout between the 83 and the 20000. Also, here's a quote from the review: " The IN83 is InFocus's upgrade to the IN82, which we reviewed last November. The primary difference between these two projectors is the addition of a DarkChip4. This enhancement makes the IN83 a great projector. " Sounds like the IN83 is worth the extra $$$.

I returned a BenQ W5000 due to image noise. Apparently, Evan (www.projectorcentral.com/), Art (www.projectorreviews.com/) and I are the only people on the planet who believe that the W5000 has an image noise issue. Others here on this forum believe that the noise is in the source; not created by the projector itself. I disagree.

With no dealers within 300 miles of where you live, all you can do is read all of the info thats available, both pro and con. Good luck with your purchase.

Elkhunter
Review sample are bottom of the barrel in quality a lot of times, even pre-production. Believe me the guys here are extremely anal about their W5000. If anything we are ridiculously sensitive to the flaws of the W5000. I've seen just about every home theater projector made with extensive viewing of the RS1 compared to the W5000. Last night I compared it to my 52" Sharp panel. Upon very close observation, at 1/4 screen width, the noise levels were equal and source related. Noise isn't a concern. However its been well documented that the BC feature, as implemented on this projector, is flawed. Even the reviewers mentioned, have brought this out, along with mentioning its one of the sharpest, if not the sharpest projector they've seen. Performance per cost unit is very high.
coolrda's Avatar coolrda 10:15 AM 08-15-2008
You can go on just about any projector forums and here complaints about noise. Once calibrated the W5K is smooth.
stanger89's Avatar stanger89 10:43 AM 08-15-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolrda View Post

I don't know if native is the proper term anymore, with an iris involved, whether manual, dynamic or both.

Native is a valid/proper term for any projector, provided that the IRIS is stationary/constant between light and dark readings. For example even if DI is enabled, if you measure the contrast by using a test pattern such that the IRIS is fully closed (or open) for both white and black readings, then that counts as "native".
scrubsr1's Avatar scrubsr1 10:58 AM 08-15-2008
Well guys, I went ahead and purchased the IN82. With the continuous firmware updates being released on the benq side along with the one year warranty swayed me to the Infocus. Also, being a $100 less then what projectorpeople wants for the w5000 doesn't hurt either. I also talked to Jason Turk and he had a lot of good things to say about the IN82. Here's hoping this projector tides me over for a few years. Thanks for the additional insight guys.
ksharp4's Avatar ksharp4 11:06 AM 08-15-2008
Where is the place to locate the IN82s? Thanks
coolrda's Avatar coolrda 01:51 PM 08-15-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post

Native is a valid/proper term for any projector, provided that the IRIS is stationary/constant between light and dark readings. For example even if DI is enabled, if you measure the contrast by using a test pattern such that the IRIS is fully closed (or open) for both white and black readings, then that counts as "native".

I think of native as a fixed number. Even with a manual iris your CR changes according to the position of the iris, with CR increasing with the closing of the iris. With the DI (DB) off I've read from 600:1 to over 1500:1 with changing only the manual iris. But I understand what your saying.
Ballis's Avatar Ballis 07:45 PM 08-15-2008
Ive had several BenQ`s, and i currently have the W1000. They have all served me well, but if i could live with the ofset of the in83, id probably get that instead. If you really want something nice though, you should get the planar 8150.
bondgregbond's Avatar bondgregbond 01:21 PM 09-16-2008
hi guys, I am very new to this forum reply thing so I hope I am able to ask a quick question..I am close to making a decision on a pj and had decided to go with a mits hc6000 until I heard the hc7000 is going to be available in Canada in another month for apprx the same msrp...there are no reviews as far as I know for this new projector..I have also looked at the infocus 83 and Benq20000 and can get a reasonable deal on both..the whole lcd/dlp thing gets very confusing let alone the multitude of models, but if anyone has some input, which should produce the better picture...I watch 50% movies and 50% sports..thx for your input..
wildingen's Avatar wildingen 02:26 PM 11-03-2010
The InFocus and DLP is for me the only thing to go for, movies or sport. As long as you can live with som fan noice.
wildingen's Avatar wildingen 02:27 PM 11-03-2010
You will find reviews today, no problem. Sorry for this post.
wildingen's Avatar wildingen 02:28 PM 11-03-2010
Again, very sorry, I really need this post. Thank you.
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