Official JVC RS10/HD350 Owners Thread! - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 2036 Old 12-24-2008, 08:08 PM
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Does the RS10 use the same lens as the more expensive RS20? For those with the RS10, how is the sharpness with your unit?
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post #182 of 2036 Old 12-24-2008, 10:44 PM
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I am pretty sure it is exactly the same components except for the color capabilities of the RS20. If you go to JVC's web site they actually use the same exact flyer for both models and it is titled RS10/RS20. While the RS10 doesn't have all the same abilities to tweak colors, I have found it to be more than acceptable for common color problems like skin tones and the like. Where JVC's technology is different is that it is common for people to say the colors are over saturated. This is going to be true whether you have the RS20 or the RS10 I believe. When you see this thing in 1080P/24 at 12bit color however, the oversaturated primary colors (red's, greens and blues) don't stand out near as much. As an example, I had an upconverting DVD player hooked up to the projector that sent 1080i and the projector picked it up as 8 bit color. Scenes with yellow had a very yellow overall hue, anything red was REALLY bright red and greens (like grass) did not look natural. If I play the same movie on my PS3 that upconverts to 1080P/60 and the projector for some reason picks it up as 12 bit color as well, it looks tremendously better and i have read a few other reviews that also point out that the projector does not do as well with 1080i input. In some cases you don't have a choice (i.e. DISH), but thanks to another person in this thread, they suggested looking at the EDGE device that will upconvert every source to 1080P which the projector likes much better. Mine comes in on Friday and I will let you know how it looks, but the primary points for me are:

1. The RS20 is probably more tweakable as far as getting closer to the right color gamut, but when it comes to saturated primaries I dont' think that is going to help all that much (I could be wrong on this point).
2. If you spend some of that money you save by getting the RS10, you can get things like the EDGE box, which in my opinion is going to give you more bang for the buck anyway because the projector (RS10 or RS20), much prefers a 1080P signal and handles not only color, but the image just looks a LOT better.
3. Unless you know what you are doing with color correction and have the proper equipment, I don't know how much better off you are going to be anyway. I also highly recommend getting a calibration DVD ($30) as it really helps to fine tune your contrast, tint, brightness and color settings for your specific room. I had AVS calibrate mine and even though it was very close, for my lighting and room arrangement I had to tweak a few settings and without some kind of tool to do it, you shouldn't "eyeball" it.
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post #183 of 2036 Old 12-24-2008, 10:46 PM
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I thought I would try the auto turn off feature the projector has which will shut it off after a certain period of activity. The feature works only some of the time and you will fine it turning itself off right in the middle of playing a game and thinking there is something wrong with the projector.
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post #184 of 2036 Old 12-25-2008, 02:02 AM
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Has anyone upgraded to this projector from the Sony VW100 or any other Sony projector? Curious of your thoughts??


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post #185 of 2036 Old 12-25-2008, 09:33 AM
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Finally got my RS10 out of the box and in location. Worked perfectly. Little difficultly reading the menus when they are bouncing off the ceiling (odd set up location). One I got the lens shift where it needed to be everything was perfect. Much easier to set up with the set up patterns then my last projector.

The RS10 replaced a Mitz HC3000. Real nice upgrade. I am not a perfectionist so take it with a grain of salt but the colors seemed fine to me. For me the RS10 is a no brainer at this price.

Compared to the mitz the form factor of the RS10 looks like a jet fighter compared to a cargo/transport prop plane. Also, the RS10 is much quieter then the HC3000.
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post #186 of 2036 Old 12-25-2008, 02:52 PM
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Doesn't the RS10 have a service menu to have it ISF calibrated by a professional if I wanted to? I'm aware the colors are a bit saturated out of the box but does that mean you're stuck with it?


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post #187 of 2036 Old 12-25-2008, 03:13 PM
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Does anyone else find it strange that this thread is significantly less active than the RS20 thread?
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post #188 of 2036 Old 12-25-2008, 04:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnsmith808 View Post

Does anyone else find it strange that this thread is significantly less active than the RS20 thread?

No. Those guys are more into talking about the projector than watching it

Lee

 


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post #189 of 2036 Old 12-25-2008, 05:33 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W3bbY View Post

after 2 days of tweaking I have this thing looking so sweet and the colors are fine to me. New screenshots coming tonight or tomorrow.

Hey Lee,

Are ya gonna post your settings?

Thanks
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post #190 of 2036 Old 12-25-2008, 06:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W3bbY View Post

Those guys are more into talking about the projector than watching it


Definitely the quote of the day, or perhaps of the year.

Joe
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post #191 of 2036 Old 12-25-2008, 09:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottyb View Post

Hey Lee,

Are ya gonna post your settings?

Thanks

Sure...
I have it in Cinema1, Contrast +16, Color -6, Brightness -2.
I did the gamma twea mentioned earlier (Set gamma to 2.4 the pumped up the 5ire 5 points) and then have my color temp at 7200k. Lens is set at 2.

Lee

 


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post #192 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 05:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adidino View Post

Doesn't the RS10 have a service menu to have it ISF calibrated by a professional if I wanted to? I'm aware the colors are a bit saturated out of the box but does that mean you're stuck with it?

Yes, there is no color management system on the RS10. The RS20 has a THX setting that appears to be reasonably accurate. The CMS on the RS20 appears to be a mixed bag.

Never become so involved with something that it blinds you.
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post #193 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 08:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W3bbY View Post

Sure...
I have it in Cinema1, Contrast +16, Color -6, Brightness -4.
I did the gamma twea mentioned earlier (Set gamma to 2.4 the pumped up the 5ire 5 points) and then have my color temp at 7200k. Lens is set at 2.

Just to double check on your gamma setting. So to move up the ire 5 points did you go into the gamma menu and into the white setting at 5% and move the output from 36 to 41?

Thanks
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post #194 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 10:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phisch View Post

Does the RS10 use the same lens as the more expensive RS20? For those with the RS10, how is the sharpness with your unit?

I think it does, yes
And its sharper than the rs1...

Lee

 


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post #195 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 10:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ksharp4 View Post

Just to double check on your gamma setting. So to move up the ire 5 points did you go into the gamma menu and into the white setting at 5% and move the output from 36 to 41?

Thanks

Yep and the white seemed to move all 4 up with it...
How does that setting look to you?

Lee

 


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post #196 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 10:50 AM
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What's a good price on the RS10? I was going to upgrade from my RS1 to the RS20 but the RS10 may be a better option for what I'm looking for improvement wise. Can someone PM me with an idea as to what the current street price is? Thanks.


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post #197 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W3bbY View Post

Sure...
I have it in Cinema1, Contrast +16, Color -6, Brightness -4.
I did the gamma twea mentioned earlier (Set gamma to 2.4 the pumped up the 5ire 5 points) and then have my color temp at 7200k. Lens is set at 2.

Lee, how much of an effect did the gamma tweak have on the blacks and in providing a 3D effect?
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post #198 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 11:37 AM
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Hi guys,

I'm waiting for my first RS10 to arrive and am installing it on Monday.

The client has her old projector (old DLP) enclosed in the back wall at 21' from the screen. She doesn't want it hanging from the ceiling.

Will changing her screen (120") from a 1.0 to 1.5 gain help or should I try to convince her to hang it closer?

Thanks
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post #199 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W3bbY View Post

I think it does, yes
And its sharper than the rs1...

You're right. I just researched this on the JVC website and they are the same 17 element ED lens.

I will be upgrading from an RS-1 and my first thought was to get the RS-20, but the price saving on the RS-10 is looking more attractive. From what I can tell so far there are two major differences between the RS10 and the RS20. The first is the CMS controls on the RS20 that are absent on the RS10, and the second is the higher native contrast of the RS20.

Having the RS1 for a little over a year and half, I can say that I have never really been displeased with the oversaturated colors of the RS1. This may be because I was not as sensitive to it as others were, or perhaps I had a better than average unit in this regard. At any rate, I think I could perhaps live without this feature.......I think.

In regards to the higher contrast of the RS20, will the higher 50000 contrast of the RS10 be significantly noticable as compared to the 32000 of the RS10? Has anyone seen both of these projectors side by side to give an opinion?

Are there any other significant differences between the RS10 &20 that I am missing?
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post #200 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 01:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobZ View Post

What's a good price on the RS10? I was going to upgrade from my RS1 to the RS20 but the RS10 may be a better option for what I'm looking for improvement wise. Can someone PM me with an idea as to what the current street price is? Thanks.

If someone could PM on this as well I would appreciate it.
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post #201 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 02:33 PM
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If someone could PM on this as well I would appreciate it.

I would recommend calling our forum sponser AVScience. They are highly competitive in terms of price. I purchased my RS10 from them and I am very pleased.

I also purchased an extended warrenty and bulb warranty from Texas Tapeworks.
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post #202 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 03:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phisch View Post


Are there any other significant differences between the RS10 &20 that I am missing?

The RS20 also has more stops on the manual iris as the RS10 only has 3. To be candid I can live with three. I go wide open for sports and in the middle for movies. I am also running in low lamp mode.
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post #203 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 03:08 PM
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What I don't understand is.. If colors are oversaturated then why can't you back off the main color control? Does it not have that???
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post #204 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 03:41 PM
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Originally Posted by tds1 View Post

I would recommend calling our forum sponser AVScience. They are highly competitive in terms of price. I purchased my RS10 from them and I am very pleased.

I also purchased an extended warrenty and bulb warranty from Texas Tapeworks.

AVS is a great place to purchase from. I bought my last projector from Jason (an RS1). Great price and great service.
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post #205 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 03:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paradigm View Post

What I don't understand is.. If colors are oversaturated then why can't you back off the main color control? Does it not have that???


That is what owners of the RS1 did to tame the colors. The RS10 should be the same.
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post #206 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 03:53 PM
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It would be good to see an image quality shootout between the RS10 and RS20 to see if the contrast ratio differences & CMS makes a difference in a real world situation (light controlled theater).
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post #207 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 04:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deandob View Post

It would be good to see an image quality shootout between the RS10 and RS20 to see if the contrast ratio differences & CMS makes a difference in a real world situation (light controlled theater).


AVForums launch event: JVC HD350 and HD750 projectors.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8L1l0...e=channel_page


IMO, There is a noticeable difference in picture quality between the RS10 & RS20, if you don't have a batcave or 100% light controlled room you may not see the contrast improvements on the RS20 so the RS10 maybe the better way to go. The gray scale and secondary's on the RS10 are very good but the primary's (red, blue, green) are over saturated and without a good CMS (color management system) there is nothing that can be done. You can turn the color control down in the menu to make the picture look less saturated but that can throw off other colors. A good video scalier with CMS can be 3 to 4 thousand dollars +. If you require accurate colors the extra money for the RS20 is a lot cheaper then current external solutions. RS20 owners have then having a hard time with the CMS on the RS20, it's not perfect but with some work you can get the primary's very close if not perfect. The RS20 is the better unit of the two IMO but it's up to you if the extra money for an RS20 is worth it. With a good setup and calibration on the RS10 it could get you 85- 90% of the way to an RS20.
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post #208 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 06:32 PM
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Thanks for that explanation. Doesn't the ISF calbiration help at all with the oversaturation?
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post #209 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 06:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paradigm View Post

Thanks for that explanation. Doesn't the ISF calbiration help at all with the oversaturation?

You can have the RS10 ISF calibrated and it will help get the secondary's close to perfect and the primary's less saturated but without a color management system there is no way to get the primary's perfect.


If you haven't already watched it check out AVforums.TV's review the of JVC HD350/RS10. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxNGn...e=channel_page
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post #210 of 2036 Old 12-26-2008, 08:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zip3kx07 View Post

You can have the RS10 ISF calibrated and it will help get the secondary's close to perfect and the primary's less saturated but without a color management system there is no way to get the primary's perfect.


If you haven't already watched it check out AVforums.TV's review the of JVC HD350/RS10. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxNGn...e=channel_page


Thanks for the link. Well the guys on that video definitely think there is a noticable improvement in pq with the RS20. It appears the greater native contrast of the RS10 does make a difference.
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