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Official JVC RS10/HD350 Owners Thread!

350K views 2K replies 361 participants last post by  bazulkosergey 
#1 ·




JVC LINKS
Product page at Pro.JVC.com
Link To Brochure for the RS10 and RS20
RS10 Manual.PDF
RS-232C and Infrared

Remote Control Guide & HEX Codes (Thanks GaryB-UK)

RS10 Frimware update. This update improves IR sensor detection.
************************************************************
REVIEWS
A first Look by Jason Turk of AVS
Art @ ProjectorReviews.com
CNET UK
Cine4Home Preview of the RS20 with some info from a Pre-Production RS10
Review by Phil Hinton of AVforums
Phil Hinton Video Review
Review by John Archer of TrustedReviews

************************************************************
SPECS
-Enhanced 0.7-inch Full HD D-ILA devices and improved optical engine deliver the

native contrast ratio of 32,000:1 (maximum, depends on aperture setting)

for deep, true black level without a trace of gray.

-Compatibility with the latest HDMI version 1.3 (Deep Color) specifications means that this

projector can reproduce billions of colors and subtler shades of grayscale.

-Full 2.35:1 wide cinematic movie enjoyment via built in vertical stretch capability.

-Ultra quiet 19dB operation (in low lamp mode)

-Two trigger functions (screen or anamorphic lens)

-6 Point Custom Color Management.

-High-performance 2x zoom lens with motorized focus and zoom, enables flexible set-up.

-HQV Reon-VX video processor by Silicon Optix

-1000 lumen brightness with a three step fixed aperture

-Resolution 1920 x 1080 pixels

-Projection size 60 - 200 inches

-Customized gamma control on-screen

-Sleek black cabinet with black non-reflective front panel

-Wide Lens shift function (V: 80%, H: 34%)

-High-performance 2x motorized zoom lens and focus (f=21.4mm — 42.8mm, F=3.2 — 4)

-Easy-to-use self-illuminated remote control

-User Friendly Image adjustment menu

-Built in test patterns

-6 Point Custom Color Management

-Customized gamma control on-screen

-Outstanding Gray-scale reproduction

-Dual 1080p Capable HDMI (ver. 1.3) Digital Inputs

-HD Component Video Input

-RS-232C

-S-Video Input

-Composite Video Input

-D-sub 15-pin PC Input

-Lamp 200W UHP

-480i/p,576i/p,720p 60/50,1080i 60/50,1080 24p/60p/50p

-AC 110 - 240V,50/60 Hz

-Power consumption 280W (Stand-by mode:1W)

-Dimensions (W x H x D) 14-3/8" x 6-1/2" x 18 7/8" (365 x 166 x 478mm)

-Weight 11.0kg , 24.3 lbs
 
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1
#1,753 ·
"It's nearly at 600 hours and I have the iris a little over half way open."


Gosh, I have it all way open to maximise ANSI. It looks good on most well-mastered movies. I also have different gamma settings for day (or ambient light) and nigh watching to raise the whole lower range so shadow detail is visible with the lights on. It looks quite nice, but I wouldn't want it any dimmer. I have about 700hrs on the lamp in high brightness mode.



I have to say - even though the projector is brighter than my previous DLP in very bright scenes - it can SEEM a little dim on mixed scenes. It could be because I'm being blinded by the bright scenes. :p
 
#1,754 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvin1965S /forum/post/19512262


I don't think it's possible to clean inside the lamp, but anyway, I think just cleaning the 'prism' and the lamp face is all most need to do (and for me too).



I set the contrast at the projector, but also make sure my video processor (DVDO Edge) isn't clipping. I don't adjust at the player, or rather I use the default settings 'Standard'. In a different thread it was suggested that unless there is an issue with clipping in the player, it is better to adjust at the display end due to higher bit depth for one.




If the gamma ends up measuring the same, there should be no difference in brightness. I agree that a higher gamma can look darker compared to a lower one of course. I get the feeling that you are just using the controls and believing what they are telling you (like selecting the 2.2 gamma in the HD350 for example). Are you actually using a meter to calibrate with or just using your eyes?



At the high end I adjust the 100IRE control in the VEQ to ensure I have 6500K and the HD350 contrast to make sure I'm not clipping below 235 (in fact I allow a bit of headroom to 245), no special trick. The lamp is on high and I've set the iris (in the service menu as it gives finer steps) to give 100 Lux at the screen. Maybe I'm lucky with my lamp, but it's nearly at 600 hours and I have the iris a little over half way open, so I hope I've got a bit of headroom for further dimming.


Yeas i really measure the gamma
! Try to calibrate the gamma just with the projector tools and you will see! (problem is, its almost impossible get flat curve with them... it must have something with how i correct the high end...with VEQ i always only take the brightness down. at 90 IR...maybe you do it differently?)That remains me, you asked about the shifts...i calibrated for flat 2.2 the other day, then remeasured day later and it was flat 2.3!(that happened 2 times....).But it helped to change the preset 2.3 to 2.2 in the projector(and yeas i am sure i calibrated to real 2.2 with the preset on 2.3!). And when calibrating i measured at least on one instance big drop of brightness in matter of seconds (from 80 Y to less than 70). The last time i had the projector on, the picture was pretty dark subjectively(i don´t measured it) even at the high lamp, but after hour and half it got brighter.


And one question more
: how you correct 109 IR with VEQ? or you setting the RGB gain/contrast so that you have 6500K at 109 IRE?
 
#1,755 ·
Yes, I gave up with the fiddly HD350 gamma controls long ago (I used to have a Lumagen HDQ before the VEQ and used that instead for gamma and greyscale). I know what you mean about not being able to get the gamma very flat, the shame is that it's IMHO one of the most important parts to get right for a good image quality.


I adjust the 100IRE using the VEQ's 100 control for best greyscale balance, then I also check with a 109IRE pattern: If I adjust the projector's main contrast beforehand to see upto the 245 bar flashing then the 109IRE 'test' seems to be almost guarenteed to pass within pretty much the same error as the 100IRE. If 109IRE is a little further out I'm not too worried, but it was under deltaE of 2 last time IIRC.


I then check all the IRE points for greyscale first. Then I use the gamma module in Chromapure to check IRE for gamma: After taking an initial reading at 100IRE I can look in real time at the 90 IRE gamma and RGB balance and adjust the RGB at 90 in VEQ, then move down to 80 IRE and repeat down to 0IRE. I even made some very small changes at 0IRE on the VEQ to allow the 17IRE flashing bar to be seen, but not the 16 which is usually not possible on a JVC. This helps with shadow detail and to avoid clipping or a raised black level. I usually then do a final check of the greyscale (and therefore gamma) before I move onto the CMS work (afterwards I do another 'final,final' check of the greyscale for peace of mind).


I've been measuring my lux with my new meter on quite a regular basis (more to do with ANSI contrast measurements as I've added some extra room treatments). My lux readings have been pretty consistant though unlike yours. I usually turn the projector on for 20 minutes or so before I sit down to watch a film and any calibration work is done afterwards, but my peak white is consistant for each square of the ANSI contrast checkerboard (there is some variation across the screen, but always the same small amount). It seems really strange what you are experiencing.
 
#1,757 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by talkron /forum/post/19534446


thanks again, your posts are very helpful! Can you specify what you did exactly with the 0IRE on the VEQ? I have the same problem with the 17IRE...

I moved the values up from the default of 64, 64, 64 once click at a time. I ended up at around 69/70 IIRC. I left the 10% settings alone during this tweak. I would then put up a 0IRE full field pattern and just change the HD350's brightness control up and down one click. If I couldn't see a change when going down from my usual setting (-7 in HDMI enhanced mode), then it confirmed that I wasn't compromising the absolute black level. I think I ended up with raising the black level very tiny amount to see the 17 bar, as I can just about see the difference in brightness between -8 and -7 on the HD350 control. Going up to -6 is clearly much brighter with a 0IRE pattern. I could clip the 17 bar and get maximum black at 0IRE if I lowered the VEQ controls one further click, so as always it's a compromise.


It means that in some scenes, instead of just having a shapeless dark area on the picture, there might be some texture or small variations, which I find less bothersome even if the absolute black level is a tiny bit higher. Going up even one step on the HD350 brightness is too coarse and visibly raises the black level too much.


I still need to double check the 5% and 10% gamma and greyscale to make sure it hasn't unduly effected it, but as these adjustments are at the very dark end, I figure that if there is a slight colour temperature change it is less significant and that having the correct shadow detail seems more important to me anyway.
 
#1,758 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvin1965S
I moved the values up from the default of 64, 64, 64 once click at a time. I ended up at around 69/70 IIRC. I left the 10% settings alone during this tweak. I would then put up a 0IRE full field pattern and just change the HD350's brightness control up and down one click. If I couldn't see a change when going down from my usual setting (-7 in HDMI enhanced mode), then it confirmed that I wasn't compromising the absolute black level. I think I ended up with raising the black level very tiny amount to see the 17 bar, as I can just about see the difference in brightness between -8 and -7 on the HD350 control. Going up to -6 is clearly much brighter with a 0IRE pattern. I could clip the 17 bar and get maximum black at 0IRE if I lowered the VEQ controls one further click, so as always it's a compromise.


It means that in some scenes, instead of just having a shapeless dark area on the picture, there might be some texture or small variations, which I find less bothersome even if the absolute black level is a tiny bit higher. Going up even one step on the HD350 brightness is too coarse and visibly raises the black level too much.


I still need to double check the 5% and 10% gamma and greyscale to make sure it hasn't unduly effected it, but as these adjustments are at the very dark end, I figure that if there is a slight colour temperature change it is less significant and that having the correct shadow detail seems more important to me anyway.
has using enhanced mode some advantages? I was thinking it has sense only for PC imput and not video. With the normal HDMI mode the brightness around 0 should be at about right. Still without raising the brightness in the player or in the VEQ the 17 IRE pattern is barely visible.
 
#1,759 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by talkron
has using enhanced mode some advantages? I was thinking it has sense only for PC imput and not video. With the normal HDMI mode the brightness around 0 should be at about right. Still without raising the brightness in the player or in the VEQ the 17 IRE pattern is barely visible.
I had read that it was recommended by some well respected reviewers/calibrators so that WTW doesn't get clipped. As I made this choice when I calibrated with the rental i1Pro, I'm stuck with it now as I don't want to change without being able to check if it effects my results, so I'll leave it set this way.


If you can just see the 17 bar, then I don't see what the issue is...with mine I could only see from the 19 bar upwards and one click on the brightness lit up 15 bar slightly, so raising the black level. Yours sounds like it's spot on.
 
#1,760 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvin1965S
I had read that it was recommended by some well respected reviewers/calibrators so that WTW doesn't get clipped. As I made this choice when I calibrated with the rental i1Pro, I'm stuck with it now as I don't want to change without being able to check if it effects my results, so I'll leave it set this way.


If you can just see the 17 bar, then I don't see what the issue is...with mine I could only see from the 19 bar upwards and one click on the brightness lit up 15 bar slightly, so raising the black level. Yours sounds like it's spot on.
its more invisible as visible, maybe barely was too positive description
, but 18 is more o less visible in my setting.
 
#1,761 ·
Just posted my RS10 on Audiogon. Curious what the expected resale value is on this projector now? Has about 500 hrs on the bulb. I'm sure I'm going to take beating but in order to get RS50, I have no choice.
 
#1,764 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by adidino /forum/post/19584740


Just posted my RS10 on Audiogon. Curious what the expected resale value is on this projector now? Has about 500 hrs on the bulb. I'm sure I'm going to take beating but in order to get RS50, I have no choice.

I saw the X7 (RS50) last weekend in a proper black demo room and own a fully calibrated (external CMS) HD350. I didn't think that there was much improvement, certainly enough to justify the cost in the UK which would amount to around £5k selling my HD350 for £1,200 (what they seem to sell for over here) or so and the X7 being over £6k. While the demo model wasn't calibrated so the blacks were crushed, unlike mine, it was only smoother motion on the X7 that I noticed. I went home afterwards and watched some films on mine and didn't feel I was watching a poor relation, so IMHO you do have a choice.


PS. The 3D stuff was too dim even on a small 8' wide screen and gave me a huge headache afterwards.
 
#1,765 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvin1965S /forum/post/19586438


I saw the X7 (RS50) last weekend in a proper black demo room and own a fully calibrated (external CMS) HD350. I didn't think that there was much improvement, certainly enough to justify the cost in the UK which would amount to around £5k selling my HD350 for £1,200 (what they seem to sell for over here) or so and the X7 being over £6k. While the demo model wasn't calibrated so the blacks were crushed, unlike mine, it was only smoother motion on the X7 that I noticed. I went home afterwards and watched some films on mine and didn't feel I was watching a poor relation, so IMHO you do have a choice.


PS. The 3D stuff was too dim even on a small 8' wide screen and gave me a huge headache afterwards.

I agree . About 4 weeks ago i saw the X7 in action. I own the RS 25. I did not see improvement to upgrade. Yesterday i saw someone posting that it was a big improvement from the RS20. If you own the RS20/25 don,t upgrade is wasting money, believe me only if you want 3D. 3D looks very nice on the X7.
 
#1,767 ·
Quote:
Originally Posted by rollon1980
Well, there are differences in brightness between X7 and HD350 and I think you will probably get slightly better sharpeness and possibly motion noticable on larger (110"+) screens. It didn't wipe the floor with my HD350 by any means. I was there with Kelvin.
Good comparisons, guess I'll sit this upgrade out also and see what happens with the next.
 
#1,768 ·
Hello,


I've just bought a new HD350, and have been using it for the last week. I was wondering if anyone has seen the problem I'm having with a warning shutdown just after startup; (3x) blinking red WARNING light and (3x) blinking orange LAMP light, which translates to 'Abnormal drive circuit of image'..


That doesn't mean much to me, but if I power down at the plug, and power up again, the projector fires up to the DILA image and I can watch a movie.


This only seems to happen after the projector has been in standby for some time. If I shut the projector down after watching a movie, and then start it up again, the problem is not there....


Only using a HDMI cable, and it's not that, as I've tried a few - same problem.

It's not the player, as I get the same problem if it's on or off....

Same problem for either of the HDMI inputs...


If no one has seen this problem, then I'll put a call in to JVC support.


Thanks.
 
#1,771 ·
definitely try reseating the lamp. Mine just acted up today for the 1st time in over 200 hours and would not throw a picture, blinking lights, etc...... so I reseated the lamp and all is well .



Good luck.
 
#1,772 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvin1965S /forum/post/19586438


I saw the X7 (RS50) last weekend in a proper black demo room and own a fully calibrated (external CMS) HD350. I didn't think that there was much improvement, certainly enough to justify the cost in the UK which would amount to around £5k selling my HD350 for £1,200 (what they seem to sell for over here) or so and the X7 being over £6k. While the demo model wasn't calibrated so the blacks were crushed, unlike mine, it was only smoother motion on the X7 that I noticed. I went home afterwards and watched some films on mine and didn't feel I was watching a poor relation, so IMHO you do have a choice.


PS. The 3D stuff was too dim even on a small 8' wide screen and gave me a huge headache afterwards.

Nice take. This is consistent with other feedback I have seen and heard. Funny to me how the last two generations come out touting substantial increases in sharpness and ANSI - and are marginal at best. 3d seems to be the only compelling reason to upgrade from the rs10/350 as far as I can see.


Imo, contrast increases from 30k to 50k don't make a huge real world difference as going 10k to 30k. Every year I look into upgrading but I am still looking for dlp ansi and sharpness, with JVC blacks and ease of use...
 
#1,773 ·
I reckon I'll likely only upgrade when I can go to around 70,000:1 CR as that would be a significant increase over what I have now. Even then it'll probably be used so I await the next range with interest as if they improve 3D significantly or go to LED then an X7 (RS50) might de-value enough to make it a worthwhile purchase.
At the moment I'm not interested in 3D so that could work in my favour.


I made some minor adjustments to my HD350 last night after reading in the Spears and Munsil thread (calibration section) about how adjusting the contrast control to give the smoothest result with a grey ramp pattern. I found that I could optimise the setting to get rid of 2-3 'stripes' I could see on a grey ramp, so this should help with banding on skies and other large areas of colour. So after nearly 2 years, I'm still tweaking and squeezing the most out of my HD350: I've got some room improvements to do soon as well which will help maximise ANSI contrast even more, which is much cheaper (and maybe more effective) than a projector upgrade.
 
#1,774 ·
Kelvin


I just bought a rs10 last week and have been trying to figure out the best user settings.


Could you post your settings (or anyone for that matter)? I am currently using cinema 2 @ 6500k and it looks good to me, but I was hoping someone who has had this projector for longer could weigh in. I know every projector is different, but it would be nice to be able to try some different settings and see how they look to me. Thanks
 
#1,775 ·
My setup is calibrated, but mostly using the external VideoEQ Pro as I find it much easier to adjust gamma using that rather than the fiddly JVC built in version. Therefore my settings aren't really much use as they're all at default apart from contrast. However, for starters using 6500K might be a good begining, but you'll need to set your brightness and contrast to suit your video playback chain, though in practice with HDMI normal the default settings are often correct anyway. I'd try using either gamma 'A' or trying a custom gamma set to 2.2 or 2.3 (don't bother trying to edit individual points unless you have a meter and software though).


Using a gamma of 2.3 will give the image more depth, but you will need a very dark walled room to benefit otherwise 2.2 or even 2.1 might be better for a lighter walled room.


Don't ramp up the sharpness and/or detail enhance either: If you look at a test pattern then you'll see that adding sharpness just 'draws' a white line round a black edge (and visa versa) which isn't adding anything apart from false edges IMHO. Likewise detail enhance seems to add a kind of moire effect on the spoke pattern on AVS HD709 or other patterns with converging lines.


I have observed a kind of 'twitter' most visible on end credits (but which must also effect moving parts of 'proper' video too) caused by having these controls too far up. A simple way to check this is to set up two identical User memories with only the sharpness and detail different: Playback some end credits (Casino Royale definately does this) and flick between the two settings and you'll see what I mean. I have mine at '0' for sharpness and '10' for detail, though some have these as high as 30/30, but I guess they don't realise the noise/twitter issue or just prefer this oversharpned effect.


See also my comments about setting the contrast first for clipping and second for smoothest greyscale ramp in the above post.


This two user memories check is useful to compare gamma settings as well, as it will help you understand better what the controls do if you pause an image and flick between two settings. You'll get an idea of what each control does this way.
 
#1,777 ·
All,


just an update. After getting worse (and redder) I ended up dropping off the projector in Cypress. Got it back with 'optical block' exchanged and problem is solved. It was handled under warranty for me.



Quote:
Originally Posted by wolferl99 /forum/post/19137854


Hi,


after being a happy camper with my RS10 for around 7 months, I just noticed a slight 'red cloud' on the right side from top to button. Its roughly as wide as the standard windows scroll bar and is visible independent of input or user settings. It is only there in 16:9 not in 4:3. I even tried my spare bulb, but same effect there. Nothing obvious in the light path, mirrors or lense. Here some pictures:


Somehow that doesn't look healthy ... And while it's not really noticeable while watching a movie, knowing that it is there, is annoying enough!


Hope someone here has a good idea.


Thanks

wolf
 
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