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post #721 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erkq View Post

If I have a Lumagen, what would the RS20 offer this RS1 owner that a RS10 wouldn't, except for the better contrast? I guess there's more flexibility with the 16 step iris. But other than that... ? Looking to possibly upgrade to last year's technology. You know... "buy behind the curve".

Been there done that myself, but because my room isn't a perfect bat cave (despite adding a screen 'Bat Tent' ) when I demo'd a HD750 and HD350 in my room the difference was too small to justify the extra cost. I also have a Lumagen HDQ which hasn't got a 'proper' CMS, but it does allow some gamut 'mitigation' that is good enough to keep me happy.

Be aware that you can access all 16 steps within the service menu on the HD350 (and I'm 99% the RS10 is the same in this regard): Just select the iris setting you want to change (1,2 or 3) then when you're in the SM you can alter the iris setting for that user menu 'preset', if you follow. I have mine set at 14, 11 and 9 IIRC as I have a 1.5 gain screen I find that 14 or 11 is bright enough for most films (at least I can fully darken my room, even if it has some light walls to reflect and wash the image slightly).

You might be able to 'buy behind the curve' and get a setup that will keep you pleased for some time yet (I know I won't be upgrading for a long time unless I can significantly improve my room first and a bargain HD750 turns up).

Zooming: Been there, done that, bought the lens...
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post #722 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Ballentine View Post

Many RS20 owners will disagree.

There are many performance (and ergonomic) improvements (over RS-2) besides the excellent CMS which gives much more accurate colors (once you get used to accurate color - there is no going back):

Also - Greg Rogers mentioned this in his review (I agree):
"The RS20 is significantly brighter and produces higher full-field (on-off) contrast ratios than the RS-2."

I think the increased brightness (+ 300 lumens!) is an extremely important performance upgrade.

Another nicety for me is the handy 16 step adjustable remote control iris so you can fine tune your brightness (and contrast) through out the life of your bulb. The Gamma adjustment menu is much improved (over RS-2).

ZERO light spill was another HUGE plus for me moving to the RS20. Not to mention Stellar shading. And it was nice to lose the clunky RS-2 manual lens shift (replaced by ultra smooth motorized remote control mechanism).

I think much can also be said about the re-designed case and straight-shot light configuration (w/ improved 17 element lens w/ ED glass).

Greg Rogers mentioned this in his review:
“The new RS20 lens provides much better red focus and is a significant improvement compared to the RS-2 lens.”“Sharpness exceeds ANY CRT projector while producing film images that never look edgy & w/ less chromatic aberration than many more expensive DLP projectors.”

The side exhaust and auto lens cover are also nice extras. As is the ability to turn off the green-only crosshatch patterns (for adjusting focus) and added 12-volt screen trigger (handy for us CIH guys).

The new THX mode is very useful too (for calibration comparisons).

Additional Greg Rogers notes:
“The resulting film like motion, coupled with the extraordinary contrast ratio and nearly perfect color accuracy produced some of the most outstanding DVD images I’ve seen."
"Film grain appears natural, and mosquito noise and other compression artifacts are not exacerbated."
"Gray scale pattern demonstrated excellent near-black linearity and was completely free of visible noise - which is Amazing - considering the black fields are so exceptionally dark."
"The best HD film transfers look more like film - than on any other lamp-based projector’s I’ve seen."
"The Holy Grail of home theater is to combine the best qualities of the finest CRT front projectors w/ the advantage of modern lamp-based projectors. The RS20 comes closer to that goal than any projector before it! My new reference projector.”

So you were saying?

I owned a RS-2 for about 3 months and sold for a huge loss to upgrade to the RS-20. The rs-2's lens would vibrate within the case when I watched a movie due to me running a JL Audio F113 Sub woofer that shook the room. I too would have to re align the picture onto the screen every hour or so as it would drift. After I sold it I found out by a JVC Rep that I should've put the little piece of Styrofoam that came around the lens during shipment back in to stop the vibration. I'm not sure that would of allowed the lens shift since I had the pj above the screen height about 12 inches. All in all the RS-20 WITH ADDED LUMENS BLEW AWAY THE PQ OF THE rs-20.
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post #723 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 11:36 AM
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one adam 12 one adam 12 go see the man at the JVC booth.
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post #724 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erkq View Post

If I have a Lumagen, what would the RS20 offer this RS1 owner that a RS10 wouldn't, except for the better contrast? I guess there's more flexibility with the 16 step iris. But other than that... ? Looking to possibly upgrade to last year's technology. You know... "buy behind the curve".

Better lens/optics = sharper picture, no bright corners, much better black levels, increased dimensionality of picture (from higher CR) and the main points that come to mind. And this assumes your Lumagen gives you 11 point custom gamma control and a fully working CMS - if not add that to the list.
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post #725 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 12:30 PM
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You guys are pretty much clueless re show conditions. There is usually a JVC booth with not much there. There is a JVC offsite display. The main exhibit. but it is offsite. One must leave the show and go there. There are several small rooms or areas where one can view each different machine viewing different material. Its not exacly easy to draw conclusions and direct a\\bs are not possible. Enough.

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post #726 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 12:35 PM
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You know... "buy behind the curve".

The best thing about the new JVC lineup will be the fire sale prices of last year's models...I hope everyone rushes out to buy the new models!
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post #727 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

You guys are pretty much clueless less show attendence.

Not trying to be difficult. But, what does this mean? Are there words left out? added? ?
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post #728 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post

Better lens/optics = sharper picture, no bright corners, much better black levels, increased dimensionality of picture (from higher CR) and the main points that come to mind. And this assumes your Lumagen gives you 11 point custom gamma control and a fully working CMS - if not add that to the list.

AIUI he was asking about RS10 vs RS20, so I don't believe that the bright corners, better lens/optics or sharper picture applies in this case, though I'd agree if you were comparing RS1 to RS10/20. The RS10 gives you the custom gamma, so that only () leaves the CMS, which the HDQ/P at least can mitigate against the worse of the OOTB colours of the RS10/HD350. Of course the full CMS of the RS20 allows accurate adjustment of the colour gamut, but I live without it (ignorance may be bliss as my HD750 demo was with the 'broken' CMS and used with one of your early settings). The extra CR may be a benefit, but only if the room is good enough (mine wasn't as the difference was so slight it was only noticable back to back).

Buying a fire sale RS10 now, might leave a bit in the bank to buy a fire sale HD950/990 next year......

Zooming: Been there, done that, bought the lens...
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post #729 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 01:04 PM
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Official JVC Press Release is on their site:

http://www.jvc.com/press/index.jsp?i...&PressKitID=18

No new information though...
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post #730 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 01:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvin1965S View Post

AIUI he was asking about RS10 vs RS20, so I don't believe that the bright corners, better lens/optics or sharper picture applies in this case, though I'd agree if you were comparing RS1 to RS10/20. The RS10 gives you the custom gamma, so that only () leaves the CMS, which the HDQ/P at least can mitigate against the worse of the OOTB colours of the RS10/HD350. Of course the full CMS of the RS20 allows accurate adjustment of the colour gamut, but I live without it (ignorance may be bliss as my HD750 demo was with the 'broken' CMS and used with one of your early settings). The extra CR may be a benefit, but only if the room is good enough (mine wasn't as the difference was so slight it was only noticable back to back).

Buying a fire sale RS10 now, might leave a bit in the bank to buy a fire sale HD950/990 next year......

I thought he was comparing the RS1 to the RS20 - that is what my comment applied to. Thanks.
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post #731 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvin1965S View Post

AIUI he was asking about RS10 vs RS20, so I don't believe that the bright corners, better lens/optics or sharper picture applies in this case, though I'd agree if you were comparing RS1 to RS10/20. The RS10 gives you the custom gamma, so that only () leaves the CMS, which the HDQ/P at least can mitigate against the worse of the OOTB colours of the RS10/HD350. Of course the full CMS of the RS20 allows accurate adjustment of the colour gamut, but I live without it (ignorance may be bliss as my HD750 demo was with the 'broken' CMS and used with one of your early settings). The extra CR may be a benefit, but only if the room is good enough (mine wasn't as the difference was so slight it was only noticable back to back).

Buying a fire sale RS10 now, might leave a bit in the bank to buy a fire sale HD950/990 next year......

Thanks. You are correct in what I was asking. But thanks to lovingdvd too as those are good points on why I should upgrade to the RS10. And, you give me points as to why I should NOT upgrade to the RS20, though I do have a completely light controller theater. But, even so, I think the a used RS10 is the sweet spot for me right now. Thanks again for your input.
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post #732 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 02:51 PM
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There is quite a bit of info on the press release. It says Sept delivery for all models. Where is that US House of Representatives member who shouted at the President last night you lie?

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post #733 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 02:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kutlow View Post

I owned a RS-2 for about 3 months and sold for a huge loss to upgrade to the RS-20. The rs-2's lens would vibrate within the case when I watched a movie due to me running a JL Audio F113 Sub woofer that shook the room. I too would have to re align the picture onto the screen every hour or so as it would drift. After I sold it I found out by a JVC Rep that I should've put the little piece of Styrofoam that came around the lens during shipment back in to stop the vibration. I'm not sure that would of allowed the lens shift since I had the pj above the screen height about 12 inches. All in all the RS-20 WITH ADDED LUMENS BLEW AWAY THE PQ OF THE rs-20.

Yes - I forgot about the lens-sub-shake problem that plagued the RS1/RS2. Thankfully that was fixed w/ the RS20. And Yes you could (I did) place styrofoam around the lens - but then you couldn't use the lens shift anymore.
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post #734 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 02:59 PM
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Well, I think the three year warranty for the 35/990 is new info (to me), but there's no mention of the special wire grid polarizer that I think was mentioned earlier in the discussions.

So it seems hand picked parts, individual adjustments, three year warranty, and higher contrast ratio are the differentiating factors.

Curious if anyone who's there has been able to see both the 25 and 35, and if they are showing any sports content for their ClearMotion technology.
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post #735 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:06 PM
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I'm going to the 550/950 demo at PJ Hifi in Guildford (UK) next week, I'll post my thoughts on the new JVCs. I'm interested to see if there are any improvements in motion artefacts (not counting fi).
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post #736 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffY View Post

I'm going to the 550/950 demo at PJ Hifi in Guildford (UK) next week, I'll post my thoughts on the new JVCs. I'm interested to see if there are any improvements in motion artefacts (not counting fi).

Me too (if I'm working close enough to call in)....I really don't want to buy any of the new models, but I'd still like to see where the state of play is (plus their room is sooo much better than mine I wouldn't get the benefit anyway).

Zooming: Been there, done that, bought the lens...
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post #737 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JeffY View Post

I'm going to the 550/950 demo at PJ Hifi in Guildford (UK) next week, I'll post my thoughts on the new JVCs. I'm interested to see if there are any improvements in motion artefacts (not counting fi).

Is the event mid week this time? if so i cant make it but would be very interested in your thoughts (esp, motion related improvements if any)

Dustin
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post #738 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:16 PM
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Yes, it's an awesome demo room. Are you going on the Thursday or Friday? Unusually for me these days I'm working on the Thursday so it will have to be Friday for me.
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post #739 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by gandley View Post

Is the event mid week this time? if so i cant make it but would be very interested in your thoughts (esp, motion related improvements if any)

It's 17th and 18th September.....next Thursday and Friday: I'm working in Cardiff on the Thursday so I'm hoping for something nearer to Guildford on Friday and I'll call in. If not, I'm sure we'll get plenty of info from JeffY and the rest of the UK guys.

Zooming: Been there, done that, bought the lens...
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post #740 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kutlow View Post

All in all the RS-20 WITH ADDED LUMENS BLEW AWAY THE PQ OF THE rs-20.

Really
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post #741 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:21 PM
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Really

Well maybe he turned the lamp up...or has two RS20s.

Zooming: Been there, done that, bought the lens...
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post #742 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:23 PM
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ah cool i can do the friday.

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post #743 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:39 PM
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Joe AVS usually won`t get to Cedia until Friday or Sat. The JVC party is Sat night. Do not rely too much on any press release. Its a press release, not a court affidavit. My info, which could be wrong, is that the 990 uses a better performing wire grid polarizer and that is the component mainly rersponsible for the increase in on\\off. over the rs25.

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post #744 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noah katz View Post

You forgot about the 4th panel option.

Yeah, what happened to the mysterious / super secret "Eclipse" technology a bunch of forum members were raving about and hyping several years ago?
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post #745 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:49 PM
 
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The best thing about the new JVC lineup will be the fire sale prices of last year's models...I hope everyone rushes out to buy the new models!

thats if you can find any. Unless someone has some in inventory, you are out of luck. However, I am sure there will be used ones to be found

Quote:
Yeah, what happened to the mysterious / super secret "Eclipse" technology a bunch of forum members were raving about and hyping several years ago?

Its gone and buried
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post #746 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 03:52 PM
 
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If I have a Lumagen, what would the RS20 offer this RS1 owner that a RS10 wouldn't,

Yeah, I am not sure you would get that much for your money if you upgraded to the RS10. It may be slightly superior, but not sure if the money would be worth it
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post #747 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 04:16 PM
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Its gone and buried

Not surprising considering it was the projector equivalent of Duke Nukem Forever.
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post #748 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 05:23 PM
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This last page was full of comparisons between the RS 20 and older JVC's models. There is one truth: The RS 20 , 10 , 350, 550 will be gone this september. The talk right now is the RS 15, RS 25, and RS 35 and its not pro division similars.


Jason Turk, who has a name on the forum, reviewed the RS 25 and the RS 15 pre models, and his conclusion showed not a night and day increase in performance of the new models over the up to date ones. But his trained eyes, with equipment support, revealed a real increase of performance in the the RS 15 and RS 25. And he added that the units that will be released tend to be even better. That means in ansi contrast, 120 hz cleaning image, whatever the name JVC gives to it. He even said that he really found pleasure using this specific feature.


It's up to consumers decide which model to take. But, by Jason's review, certainly these new models will perform sensibly better than the present ones.


The prices of the new pjs, already reported in JVC's pro division site, upper than the last year's, is another point that goes directly in this direction.

Let's wait and see.
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post #749 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 05:47 PM
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No Offense, but Jason isn't exactly an unbiased party - he gets paid to sell these projectors.
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post #750 of 1602 Old 09-10-2009, 07:03 PM
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Quote:


Well, I think the three year warranty for the 35/990 is new info (to me), but there's no mention of the special wire grid polarizer that I think was mentioned earlier in the discussions.

So it seems hand picked parts, individual adjustments, three year warranty, and higher contrast ratio are the differentiating factors.

Curious if anyone who's there has been able to see both the 25 and 35, and if they are showing any sports content for their ClearMotion technology.

They told me today that the only difference with tjhe 35 over the 25 is
1 - hard picked components
2 - more careful assembly and mating of parts.
3 - three year warranty as opposed to a two year warranty.

It's like a " blueprinted engine " compared to a regularly assembled engine.

All the new JVC projectors looked great, especially the RS 25 and 35 !!

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