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Tell Me About Your Projection Room...Light controlled? Dark/Light decor?

30K views 102 replies 40 participants last post by  GrandPixel 
#1 ·
As I'm coming to the end of my home theater reno the standard issues of how far to go with light control are also coming home to roost.


I'm curious about the members in this high-end projector forum: How far have you gone...or NOT gone...in terms of maximising your room for the performance of your projector.


Did you go for really dark decor? Are you in a "Bat Cave?" Or is your projector in more casual settings, lighter room decor etc? Which screen are you using and how well does it work with how you've designed your room in terms of maximising the performance/contrast available from your projector?

And how happy are you with the results?


I'd expect some people are more casual about eking out the last bits of performance, others more determined.


I'll start:


I don't have a finished room, but I'm almost there. I've had the challenge of doing a home theater reno in an existing living room with bay windows etc. The AV-phile in me would do a bat cave because I always want to get the most out of any projector/display I buy. But I couldn't do that in a living room so I've done my best to almost get there. I re-designed the ceiling, dropping a large portion - about 12' square - over the screen/seating area and covering it with dark brown felt (behind which sits acoustic treatments for the room as well).


I went with a fabric ceiling not only for the ability to place acoustic material behind it, but also because the mantra has generally been that a dark fabric will almost always absorb light reflections better than a dark paint.


I got a dark chocolate brown shag rug covering most of the floor, although it does have some sheen to it.


The seating is a very large, dark brown sectional sofa (very light absorptive).


The screen is 125" wide by 61" tall viewable screen area.


I have automated black out blinds for the bay windows - light sealed.


The room has a large opening, about 6 feet wide, to the hallway, which will be closed with curtains when watching a movie (curtains have not arrived).


The one major concession I made was to choose a light colored wall fabric covering. For one, it was just too beautiful to resist. But most of all it is the one element that helps keeping the room from feeling dark and cave-like. It really does strike just about a perfect aesthetic balance at the moment.


This wall covering isn't super bright but it does have a slight sparkly sheen too. My strategy has therefore been to have designed curtain tracks between the edge of the bulk head and the walls (several inches of space), which will hang in a neat, contemporary fashion. They will be a dark chocolate velvet. These will close to cover the room opening. But they will also be on the other side of the screen too. I've even had a roman blind designed with the same velvet fabric, to pull down over the fireplace on one side of the wall. I've also got a curtain in the back corner of the room that can be pulled across one particularly reflective portion of the back wall.


With all the curtains pulled I will have effectively dark brown velvet covering the walls from the screen wall out about 9 feet on either side of the screen, plus some portion of the back wall covered. The black out blinds, when deployed, also add a bunch of black material behind the seating position (the bay windows are behind the viewing sofa).


The room is about 13' wide by 15 feet deep.


So I haven't covered EVERY bit of the walls, but a large portion of them at least.


Like many I've agonized over the choice of screen and ended up with the Stewart ST-130 screen material, which is now up, combined with a Carada Masquerade masking system (for masking top/bottom of image - I'll be using a variable image size, zooming).


I had a big screen so I didn't want to go with a lower gain gray screen. Also, while some of the gray screens with gain could have made my life easier in terms of rejecting ambient/reflected light, I didn't wish to live with some of their compromises after viewing them (e.g. I could still see the coating on the Stewart Firehawk screen overlaying the projected images, as well as it's hot-spotting was very noticeable to me). So I tried to go with the ST-130 for it's more invisible screen coating, mild but useful gain, and wide viewing angles.


RESULTS? Well...the results aren't in yet because I have been using my old Panasonic AE900 projector as a sit-in for my JVC RS20. For various reasons I am keeping the RS20 out of the room until it is entirely ready.


My curtains aren't up so I don't have perfect light control. Nonetheless, the "black levels" of my AE900 projector are so high they are much brighter than any stray light making it on to the screen.


I'm both happy and a tad concerned with what I'm seeing so far. Happy: The Stewart screen strikes me as very high quality, probably the best screen material I've seen. Of course we are always talking about the interaction of any particular screen/room/projector. But in my case the image I'm getting from my AE900 is now sharper, more refined looking, more detailed - especially the level of color detail - than I've ever seen before (which includes seeing it on various screens, including neutral gain, Da Lite High Power etc). Only the Da Lite High Power looked perhaps a bit sharper due to the high brightness of the image, but I didn't like the poorer viewing angles of the HP.


So, anyway, on lots of scenes I'm seeing a more amazing image than I've seen before in my room from this projector.


But my concerns: I'm still hoping I got the balance of screen/light control correct. The "Bad" in this new set up with the Panasonic projector is the black levels SUCK on the Stewart screen, no doubt due to the higher gain.

I thought the black levels looked acceptable on a neutral gain screen, but the image looks even more washed out in this set up. (Having it masked by black now may not be helping either). It really isn't at an acceptable level and I have to assume that all the positives directed toward it's black levels on the old reviews came from people using a gray screen. One thing that kills me is that my friend has an even older Panasonic AE700 projector on a 94" diagonal Graywolf screen, and has done nothing to the decor of his room

(e.g. has a white bulk head over the screen) and yet he seems to be getting BETTER contrast, with punchy intra-scene contrast, than what I'm getting in my multi-thousand dollar room!


Of course I know the RS20 is going to get me much better black levels.

But I also see a sort of "wash out" in lots of the images from the Panasonic projector in the current set up and I'm hoping this is a combination of the fact I still have the bright walls uncovered and it's poorer black levels.

I'm hoping I didn't make a mistake going for the ST-130 screen and that you truly need a full Bat Cave for it to work well.


I should know in a few weeks when my curtains are up, my 4-way masking system is hopefully finished, and the RS20 is put into the mix.


What is your experience?
 
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#2 ·
I've been following your room progress and results with interest. I looked into extending our house earlier this year so we could have a dedicated cinema (which would have been as black as possible), but we wouldn't have got planing permission to do what we wanted. Like you, my setup is in the living room which has lighter coloured walls and a white ceiling
and when I changed from a Greywolf II screen to a 'proper' 2.35:1 screen (Matt White 1.5 gain Beamax) I was also dissapointed with the loss of contrast. Those Greywolf screens may be textured (perhaps it is because of this) but they sure handle cross reflections well.



I had already made my 'Mk 1' Bat Tent but it made little difference with the GW, but with the Beamax I've built 'Mk 2' that comes out much deeper (about 6 or 7' into the room) and lay various bits of velvet on the floor in front of the screen. This arrangement gives me a very good image from my HD350 (long throw so I'm getting the best CR out of it AIUI), but it's a bit messy and takes while to setup.


I've started looking into improving the room to allow hidden 'blinds' that will drop each side of the screen and one across the ceiling using black velvet, but your comments are making me think twice as it will be a lot of mess and hassle, plus if I make it automated it will cost a bit too (but less than the planned extension would have been). I would prefer something that can be setup much easier, not unlike your side curtains, so I'm interested to see how you get on once your RS20 is setup: I'm guessing that you will be relieved and happy as the CR absolutely kills your AE900. If I watch in my room 'as is' then the cross reflections really wash out the image, but the fade to blacks are of course as deep, but it's the lack of depth to the image that I hate, so I end up putting up the tent, etc unless it's casual viewing.


If we have visitors I've put the PJ on just to show them without the tent and everyone of them has been 'wowed' so I suppose we've just got higher standards.
 
#3 ·
Thanks Kelvin. I've often thought about your set up too as I've made decisions about my room.


We are some times reminded that a projector should be able to maintain it's On/Off contrast ratio in pretty much any room decor, so long as one has perfect control of ambient light. You'll get a fade to black as deep as if you had dark decor.


The issue is reflections from bright areas in a room. You may still get the benefits of the On/Off in certain very low APL scenes, but it seems to me light reflections coming back to the screen when you have any bright areas will often ruin those rich black levels in a good deal of the source content.


For instance, I was watching the DVD of 2001 last night. There's a shot of space before a spaceship appears. As soon as some white letters appeared on the screen "Jupiter Mission: Eighteen Months Later" even those white letters were enough to cause an immediate rise in the black of space, due I presume to the light put out into my room and reflected back to the screen.


I previewed my RS20 at a forum member's bat cave. I hope I didn't set myself up for disappointment in my environment. We'll see.


Anyway...I'd love to hear of other people's decisions, set-ups, results on these issues.


Anyone else?
 
#4 ·
I believe that buying an ultra high contrast PJ is wasted money without setting the room up for maximum performance. The average room with light walls and white ceilings is not going to let these PJs work properly, leaving a lot of performance on the table. In the lighter colored rooms brightness will usually work better than ultra high contrast, adding snap and sparkle to the image. Someday I'll be able to have a batcave, but since my HT is in a converted living room right now I can't see spending thousands of dollars for performance that I won't really be able to see.
 
#5 ·
Thanks for starting this thread.


I currently am looking at a swatch full of paint colors, and I wonder which colors will give me a nice setting. I myself like my room to be dark, but that is a matter of taste. Luckily my wife does not mind what color I paint the room or what decor I use, as long as it is pg - rating qualified



I have seen many threads here and on other AV forums and I have observed the so called WoW factor just by looking at construction pics etc. As I observe these pics with the so called "wow factor (my opinion) I see a few things stand out to me. 1) A black or charcoal type gray front wall - painted or GOM material 2) Lighter Grey walls or neutral colors 3) Cinemascope screen 2:35. 4) Furniture.


Now this is what looks pleasing to my eye. I have found another forum that shows a few pics in dark gray's or blacks that I like. Some reference image links:

http://static1.avforum.no/minhjemmek...3369ec46e4.JPG

http://static1.avforum.no/minhjemmek...331def8c6e.JPG


To me the room just looks very pleasing to the eye with these black/gray colors.



The reason for coming up with these two examples is that I heard the color gray is beneficial as a background/wall color etc. Now I am new to this PJ world and dont own a PJ yet, but I am leaning towards a neutral base room strictly for movie viewing. I understand that this color combination is not pleasing to some, because you have architectural features in a living room etc, but I do want to ask a question:


1) Does a black color on the front wall/dark gray front wall enhance the image or make colors more realistic vs a different color? What does it do to image?


2) Has anyone used such darker black paint for front wall and gray combination and seen advantages after such changes were made?


3) Are there any particular paint manufacturers paint you like as far as black and dark gray combination and what would the actual paint numbers be?


Although I am new to the PJ world, I think the greatest enhancement one could make to a room is to get it as contrast friendly as possile if you can allow a light controlled environment. Harkness - With the new PJ's coming out I get very excited. Heck with the older projectors I am also excited as I dont own a PJ yet. I would be happy with an RS-10 or a DLP of some sort, because I think and hope with a decent color room and light controlled room, one could get a fantastic image, however I am now trying to figure out how I want to embed these blacks and grays in my room due to weird ceiling heights/slants and I want it to look pleasing aesthetically, even with lights on. It might seem a little off topic in the over $3000 MSRP thread, but I think you posted it in the right place, because all of us want a good image and it is not just the quality of the PJ in my opinion but as I am learning all this, there is much more involved than just the pj.


Dave
 
#8 ·
I believe that a theater room should be a combination of class esthetics and performance. I know that when the lights go down it's all what's on the screen but when guests come into the room I believe that they should feel that it is a special place and an experience.


I chose to make the room very dark colors but kept some accents above the level of the screen to help avoid the room ending up looking like a projection lab. Fortunately , my favorite architecture is art deco, which is very very simple in design.


My wall are black and a garnet color as is the carpet. The seats are black and the ceiling is flat black with the underside of the soffits covered with the same black fabric as the columns.


I put the stair lights on the sides of the chair arms pointing about 90 degrees from the screen.




Art
 
#10 ·
Rather than create a tome, my HT thread explains it all (with pictures) to anyone who is interested. My HT room is kind of a tweener, I started off wanting a multiuse space and have gravitated to a more dedicated movie viewing HT room. I am still unwilling to commit over 400 sq ft to a full blown dedicated theater (this is California, no basements). Everything I have done to the HT room could be un-done in the space of a long weekend and it could be turned back into a big room for another use. That said, dark decor and paint definitely enhance the viewing experience and although I hate the "Bat Cave" look, I have made the room progressively darker and may go further with this in the future.


If I had unlimited space or a large basement, I may have approached this differently, but as is the case with a lot of people, my home is my single largest asset and I can’t see permanently dedicating the space and resources to such a limited function. Due to this mindset, I have a less than ideal but still very usable HT room.


This limited commitment has created some aesthetic compromises, but I have kept performance (especially audio) a high priority. While I admire some of the well executed dedicated theaters I have seen here and elsewhere, I am comfortable with my decisions.
 
#11 ·
No basements here in Florida either. My HT is in my living room, and it is turning into a dedicated space. I haven't gone the "black ceiling" route yet, but I've reached the velvet drapes/sound panels stage, which just makes the white ceilings stand out more! Next I'm gonna use black sound panels on the ceiling by the screen, to help with audio and light reflections. 2 or maybe 4 feet out from the screen is about all I can do, hopefully it will be enough.
 
#12 ·
I am of the opinion, that you can take a strategic approach to this process. If you stand at the screen, as a white field is being projected, you can look back at the room and see where the problem areas are. Starting with the surfaces that have the most reflection, you can add accents bit by bit, until you achieve a balance between light control, and aesthetics.


I also like to use darker colors, such as browns, instead of black, in less critical areas, and find this more pleasing than going with an all black or grey room. With darker earth tones, you get some warmth, without sacrificing light absorption.


The most critical areas I have found are right around the screen area, on the ceiling, at least a few feet out, the sides, if they are close to the edges of the screen, and on the floor in front of the screen. Using dark colors or velvet in those areas gets you a long way down the path of eliminating reflections. Then you can look at the back wall, and perhaps use a lighter color on the side walls near the back of the theater, and the ceiling over the seating area. Again the best thing to do is to observe from the point of view of the screen and see where your room reflects the most.
 
#13 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Free /forum/post/17130598


I am of the opinion, that you can take a strategic approach to this process. If you stand at the screen, as a white field is being projected, you can look back at the room and see where the problem areas are.

That is an interesting approach (if I get blinded by the projector it's your fault
)... But seriously, that sounds like a good way to determine the most detrimental areas.
 
#14 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! /forum/post/17130763


That is an interesting approach (if I get blinded by the projector it's your fault
)... But seriously, that sounds like a good way to determine the most detrimental areas.

Another way of doing this (and it wasn't my idea, I think it might have been Manni or one of the guys on the UK AVforum) is to stand at the screen (PJ need not be on for this) and use a torch (sorry, flashlight
) to shine back at the room and look for the brightest reflections. It saves lamp hours too.
 
#15 ·
I built a room to try to maximize light control but still maintain aesthetics. I used a dark royal blue paint and velvet fabric for walls accented with dark oak wood in a satin finish. I chose black chairs with blue accents. Originally I chose a light carpet on the floor and around the screen. I was not completely satisfied with the reflection so I modified the room with black carpet nearest the screen, black fabric around the screen and black flat stain for the finish on the woodwork near the screen. This all had a dramatic effect on contrast.


There is a fireplace for the wife - and this does have some reflection - but does not seem to affect contrast as it is far enough away from the screen. I usually have the fireplace off except during winter - and then it only takes 15 minutes to warm up the room.


When watching movies - I prefer totally dark room with lights completely or 98% off. For sports with friends - I have lights on but dim.


While not a complete bat cave -- I tried to get some elements of a complete darkened room without compromising asthetics.


See attached pictures.



 
#16 ·
Great info.


I am getting ready to purchase a PJ in the next couple of months. I want this room to be darkemed although the room is light controlled (covered windows with frame and then curtains), but not necesserilay a batcave when lights are on. I do have some dark charcoal/black acoustic foam on ceiling.



My mind has steered away from going gray or black all the way. I like aesthetic value, but also want good contrast on these PJ's I am thinking a PJ something like JVC RS 10 (used) or new BENQ w6000, Infocus SP8602, Epson 7500 or 8500UB.



Here is a pic of my setup. I find it hard with all the angles that lead up to ceiling. Room dimension is 17X 13. 55" plasma










How would you approach this space? (Color combo etc. To get good contrast and good aesthetic value.)


Dave
 
#18 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by RMK! /forum/post/17130763


That is an interesting approach (if I get blinded by the projector it's your fault
)... But seriously, that sounds like a good way to determine the most detrimental areas.

Well.. you don't have to stand right in the middle of the screen, you can stand off to one side. Really, you can even see which areas are being affected from your seat, but looking back from the front of the theater, it becomes very apparent.
 
#19 ·
I have a one man home theater in a center bedroom in our mobile home. It's quite a small room, (approx. 11' x 10'), with no windows. (Just a skylight that I cover with black fabric.) I have my Mitsubishi 4900 projector on a 4' high stand right behind where I sit. I'm using a constant height set up. My screen is a cut down 16:9 92" masked to 2.40:1. The wall around the screen is painted flat black. In order to cut down reflections, I carried the flat black on side walls and ceiling back toward the projector almost 6'. The rest of the room is painted a dark flat gray. I even went to the trouble of painting my equipment racks flat black to knock down reflections. I find that all of this work has really payed off in a much more dynamic image.
 
#20 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn /forum/post/17130233


I believe that a theater room should be a combination of class esthetics and performance. I know that when the lights go down it's all what's on the screen but when guests come into the room I believe that they should feel that it is a special place and an experience.


Art

I've always admired what you've done in your theater. I'd have the same if it weren't for those two limiters I seem to have always had....time and money. So, I've gone the everything's wonderful when the lights go out route.


Two kids through Bachelor Degree's and now helping with my Daughter's Masters short circuited a lot of selfish things I'd have done otherwise.


So let's get this recession thing over and done with so the decent bonus money starts happening again!
 
#21 ·
Before I purchased a projector, my HT room had a white ceiling, Peach Ivory walls (RGB 251 235 210) with a LVR of approx 86.

Once I purchased a projector (Infocus 4805) you could see the relected light on the walls and the ceiling.

It was not too bad but it could have been better.

When I purchased the Infocus IN82, I decided that the room needed a new paint colour.

I eventually chose a Dulux purple colour - Grapeshot, RGB 112 56 77 with an LVR of 9.7 for the walls and a Black RGB 36 35 34 LVR 3.3 for the ceilings.

The carpet remained the same.


This room is where most of the movies and TV are watched.

The Plamsa and LCDs in the other rooms do not get anywhere near the use that this room does


These 3 photos were all taken at 11:30 in the morning (Melbourne, Australia) today.

The 3 photos are

Lights off - 15 second exposure, no lights, no flash and doors closed

Lights off with flash - 15 second exposure with flash at the start

1 light on - 1 center downlight on


 
#22 ·
My theater room is in fact my whole apartment since I live in a one room warehouse. Fortunately, I find dark colours both aesthetically pleasing and good for the theater. I have dark grey walls and ceiling and black concrete floors.






I also have blackout blinds which I pull down when seriously watching.
 
#25 ·
That's a killer pad Steve!


I'm glad people are chiming in with their room/experience. I like to hear if people are satisfied or not with the outcome of their room.


Last night I again did the flashlight test - aiming a flashlight from the screen location around the room and seeing which portions reflected back most to light up the screen and it certainly is illuminating (bada-bing!).


It's somewhat shocking to see how much light reflects back even from a 3 foot wide portion of the back wall, given the wall covering is fairly reflective. The side wall right beside the screen is pretty brutal too. And from the fireplace near the screen too. As well, at the moment my rug ends about 3 feet in front of the screen, leaving the relatively dark wood floor under the screen. But the finish of the floor, typical of wood floors, certainly reflects a lot of light up to the screen too, I found. So does the top of my big center channel speaker right under the screen.


So I can certainly see why, at this point, I would be seeing some wash out effects from reflections in my room. Which makes me glad I have planned to cover most of those surfaces with dark fabric.


As I mentioned earlier I did a large portion of my ceiling in a dark brown felt fabric. I'd done a number of tests with swatches of the fabric before doing the ceiling and the felt seemed to absorb light quite well. But once I had the ceiling covered I was somewhat shocked to see how visible light seemed to be on the fabric. I was actually worrying it was reflecting too much back to the screen. But, while the flashlight test shows it does reflect some light back to the screen, the closest portion, it's nothing near what I get when pointing the flashlight at any non-fabric surface in the room. Pointing the flashlight at the brown fabric and some black painted bulkhead in the room seems to indicate the fabric reflects less light than the matte black paint.


Anyway...I'll know better if I've conquered most room effects in a couple weeks.


I love the way the decor came out and thank goodness my wife seems to approve (to some degree) as well. As I'm told the Chinese (husbands) say "Happy wife; happy life."
 
#26 ·
Thanks Rich.


The performance of my system has improved since I went all dark, but there are diminishing returns so I wouldn't get too anal.


You should remember that the most noticeable degradation caused by room surfaces will be on black levels in very dark scenes. However, by their nature very dark scenes put out much less light to be reflected in the first place.


Bright scenes light up my room, and make the black bars less black but there is nothing I can do about that now short of going to a CIH setup. With the brightness the effect is minor.


Any stray light that can reach the screen has a much bigger effect, IMHO, and that includes LED glows from equipment.


If you have a backlit remote, turn it to face the screen and you'll see what I mean.
 
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