Sharp xv-z17000 : New dlp full hd 3d projector - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP > Sharp xv-z17000 : New dlp full hd 3d projector
pteittinen's Avatar pteittinen 12:30 PM 01-10-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

I am hoping you have a hefty video card for this

BD3D playback does not require an expensive video card at all. See 3DTV Requirements.

wnielsenbb's Avatar wnielsenbb 12:41 PM 01-10-2011
The projector has Image-shift, not lens shift. You cannot shift the 16x9 image from it's factory set angle. You can only shift an image that would have black bars on top and bottom, up and down inside that 16x9 frame, so there is no black bar at the top or bottom if you want. This is desirable for people looking to setup a 2.35 fixed screen, or people who want to mask cheaply. You only have to mask the top or bottom on 2.35 movies.
wnielsenbb's Avatar wnielsenbb 12:45 PM 01-10-2011
Petri, no way in heck would I use a htpc to watch 3D bluray movies. I am now, but boy would I love to be able to use my ps3 instead. Plus Motorstorm 3D is pretty amazing on the ps3. World of Warcraft is really amazing in 3D even on my 720p projector, can't wait to see it in 1080p.
Warren.
pteittinen's Avatar pteittinen 12:54 PM 01-10-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

World of Warcraft is really amazing in 3D even on my 720p projector, can't wait to see it in 1080p.

There's a slight problem with that, actually. When you hook the PC up to a HDMI 1.4 compatible 3D display via 3DTV Play, you can kiss the 120fps refresh rate of page-flipping 720p 3D projector goodbye. If you want to play a game in 1080p, your refresh rate is limited to 24p. Is that enough for WoW? Probably not. You can get 60fps by dropping the resolution to 1280x720.
ay221's Avatar ay221 12:59 PM 01-10-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

The projector has Image-shift, not lens shift. You cannot shift the 16x9 image from it's factory set angle. You can only shift an image that would have black bars on top and bottom, up and down inside that 16x9 frame, so there is no black bar at the top or bottom if you want. This is desirable for people looking to setup a 2.35 fixed screen, or people who want to mask cheaply. You only have to mask the top or bottom on 2.35 movies.

Thanks for that info. I most definitely have to scratch this projector from my list, unfortunately.
CosmicF's Avatar CosmicF 11:43 PM 01-10-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

nVidia 3DTV Play
http://www.nvidia.com/object/3dtv-play.html

I am hoping you have a hefty video card for this

I use this every day already with my SLI 580's I've never heard about it supporting frame-packed checkerboard before though...
VuH's Avatar VuH 10:35 AM 01-11-2011
Hi Chris,

I spent a lot of time at both JVC and Sharp booth. The black on the JVC (I think it was X9 unit) was amazing but the 3D demo was not good. It's weird that at the JVC booth, on the 1st day at CES, I could see the ghosting almost through out the 3D demo, worse yet, the red panel was mis-aligned from the center to the left of screen about half or 1 pixel (guessing). It was very easy to see it when the bright white letters against the black background. I told the JVC rep outside the booth about it. On the 3rd day I came back to see it again, this time there was no more of misalignment (I think they corrected it) and I barely see any ghosting...???. I don't know it was caused of the 3D glasses or the location where I sat. The 1st day I sat all the way in the left back corner, the 3rd day I sat in the second row at center.

It's hard to judge for the black level for both unit when the demo content are different but I can tell you that the black looked really good on the JVC. On the Sharp, they put the looping 3D clip Impeccable Me and it did not have much black in it, but the color was good and no ghosting at all.

The 3D demo on the Sony was too dim for my taste but the ghosting was very good. I can only saw it at the board skating scene only. I did not know it was the there in the content or the Sony produced it.
wnielsenbb's Avatar wnielsenbb 12:01 PM 01-11-2011
Cosmic, you are very lucky. The current standard frame packed 3D isn't checkerboard. Checkerboard is only used on old rear projection DLP 3D TVs as the DLP chip itself worked with the checkerboard.
The modern 3D format is both 1080p images in one really big frame.
At least that is what is explained here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1301544

And sadly, Petri is right. 1080P24 That might not be that bad for an RPG like WoW. It would sure suck for anything faster though.
Warren.
wnielsenbb's Avatar wnielsenbb 12:23 PM 01-11-2011
"So no DVI input then? Does that mean that the hunt for a 1080p 3D DLP projector that can handle 60 frames per eye for Nvidia 3D Vision continues?"
Now I understand this comment. To game in 1080p at better than 24 fps, we need a 1080p projector with 120Hz DVI input just like the many 1080p 3D monitors that exist. Grr.
Of course 1080P24 and 720P60 are just the two required formats, there are optional formats which may work. It doesn't seem hopeful though.
Warren.
pteittinen's Avatar pteittinen 01:29 PM 01-11-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

Of course 1080P24 and 720P60 are just the two required formats, there are optional formats which may work. It doesn't seem hopeful though.

Yeah, unfortunately 1080p24 and 720p50/60 are the three mandatory formats. While there are a great bunch of secondary formats listed in the HDMI 1.4 standard, there's really nothing forcing the manufacturers to support them, so few, if any, do. Dual Link DVI and its 120fps page-flipping 3D is being obsoleted fast. DisplayPort allows higher resolutions and framerates for 3D than HDMI so that might be a solution in the long run.
krichter1's Avatar krichter1 05:06 PM 01-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deja Vu View Post

On the JVC thread I mentioned that I thought 1080p DLP 3D would be really good, but was met with lots of resistance - something about double rainbows and so on. I think that was just BS, but who knows? Having seen (and presently own) a 720p 3D DLP, which shows amazing 3D, I'm extremely interested in 1080p 3D DLP and will be watching this thread closely.

I wonder how much flexibility the Sharp will have in 3D mode when it comes to settings, especially gamma? The cheap little 720p 3D DLP Acer has 6 presets for gamma in 3D mode and throws one hell of an image.

I think you've definitely peaked some interest (or why else would I be here!), but I am skeptical on it's more important 2D presentation. Coming from an VXZ20000 that I just sold on ebay (well it's a DT-5000 version sold in S. America but exact machine internally), I just find it hard to believe that this little machine could come close to competing to that machine. I hope I'm wrong because at that price for excellent 3D and 2D that would rival the 20K... I'm in! I really like the JVC RS50 but it's sooo dull compared to my Sharp that I would consider like Chuck moving back to DLP!

Still waiting on my PM too Chuck!

Kevin
Terence's Avatar Terence 05:36 PM 01-12-2011
I'm enjoying my XV-Z15000 but will def be looking into the XV-Z17000, I'm not a huge 3D guy but it has it's moments with certain movies. I would like to have the capability should I choose to view a 3D movie that interest me, so the wait & see process begins.
Deja Vu's Avatar Deja Vu 08:03 PM 01-12-2011
Though not a total endorsement of the Sharp for 3D Evan Powell at Projector Central picked it as best at show (CES). Here's the link.

http://www.projectorcentral.com/1080p_3D_projectors.htm
Deja Vu's Avatar Deja Vu 08:11 PM 01-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by krichter1 View Post

I think you've definitely peaked some interest (or why else would I be here!), but I am skeptical on it's more important 2D presentation. Coming from an VXZ20000 that I just sold on ebay (well it's a DT-5000 version sold in S. America but exact machine internally), I just find it hard to believe that this little machine could come close to competing to that machine. I hope I'm wrong because at that price for excellent 3D and 2D that would rival the 20K... I'm in! I really like the JVC RS50 but it's sooo dull compared to my Sharp that I would consider like Chuck moving back to DLP!

Still waiting on my PM too Chuck!

Kevin

If the 1080p 3D Sharp is similar to the 720p 3D DLPs then it will be extremely good at 3D and the 2D will be somewhat disappointing in comparison - just a guess.

I presently have a tri-projector set up so a dual set up wouldn't bother me in the least. If Epson comes out with an exemplary 2D projector and Sharp has an exemplary 3D projector I might consider going that route.

BTW, Art at Projectorreviews claims that Panasonic will be releasing its first 3D projector in September.
CosmicF's Avatar CosmicF 10:00 PM 01-12-2011
How come there's still no reviews? I thought this projector was available already??
Toe's Avatar Toe 01:07 AM 01-13-2011
No lens shift???? I would actually be open to checking one of these out if it had some basic setup options (lens shift). I am very curious if the reports of RBE not being as noticeable in 3d would hold true for me. WTF?
shinksma's Avatar shinksma 10:33 AM 01-13-2011
Do we know for sure there is no lens shift? I realize the PR describes the digital image shift capability, but without lens shift the placement options are extremely limited for many people.

I've been seriously looking at the JVC RS40, but now I'm starting to consider this model too. I'd really like some actual hard information on availability and these pesky technical features (or lack thereof). If it is supposed to street in February, when should we expect more info from Sharp/retailers?

shinksma
Mendo's Avatar Mendo 11:11 AM 01-13-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by shinksma View Post

Do we know for sure there is no lens shift? I realize the PR describes the digital image shift capability, but without lens shift the placement options are extremely limited for many people.

I've been seriously looking at the JVC RS40, but now I'm starting to consider this model too. I'd really like some actual hard information on availability and these pesky technical features (or lack thereof). If it is supposed to street in February, when should we expect more info from Sharp/retailers?

shinksma

It's the same hardware as the current 15000. It's no wonder it has the same placement limitations -- i.e. 1.2 zoom ratio and no lense shift.

I'm shocked that people consider $5k a bargain considering the current Z15000 sells for under 2 grand. More than double the price just for 3D? That's crazy.
Toe's Avatar Toe 11:31 AM 01-13-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mendo View Post

It's the same hardware as the current 15000. It's no wonder it has the same placement limitations -- i.e. 1.2 zoom ratio and no lense shift.

I'm shocked that people consider $5k a bargain considering the current Z15000 sells for under 2 grand. More than double the price just for 3D? That's crazy.

No doubt............1.2 zoom ratio?
Deja Vu's Avatar Deja Vu 09:24 AM 01-26-2011
Does the Sharp disable its Dynamic Black (DI) like the Sony does in 3D mode? I suspect it does. Does anyone know for sure?
wnielsenbb's Avatar wnielsenbb 09:41 AM 01-26-2011
It hasn't been released yet, that I know of.
Frank's Avatar Frank 07:23 PM 01-27-2011
I hope these new 3D DLP projectors support legacy checkerboard format because it is my format of choice.
Elkhunter's Avatar Elkhunter 10:11 PM 01-27-2011
In his first look review of the Sharp, Art posted in his blog that the 3D is quote: "Dim!". He also posted that there's a little crosstalk and other minor artifacts.

Quote: "In other words, I'll go out on a limb to say that in brightest mode, the Sharp does have the muscle to fill a 100" diagonal 16:9 screen with 3D content. (Though not a lot to spare)."

After 100-500 hours (a 20%-30% lumens drop), when what??? An 80" screen??? Accurate colors and great blacks are great, but lumens rules, IMO.

With an MSRP of $500 more than the RS40/X3 (5K vs 4.5K), and no lens shift, will anyone purchase the Sharp over the JVC???

If so, why???

www.projectorreviews.com/blog/
danieledmunds's Avatar danieledmunds 04:07 AM 01-28-2011
If it is anything like the Z15000 then the 'natural' and 'dynamic' modes will be much brighter than movie 1 or 2 modes. If you read on, he says the 'dynamic' mode is better for 3d, which is what I would expect. I would actually like to hear what 3d looks like in 'natural' mode as that mode has great color and brightness on the Z15000
Terence's Avatar Terence 05:52 AM 01-28-2011
I use “Natural” mode over the “Movie 2”(IMO best mode for me) and would like to see the final review of the XV-Z17000 before judging it based on first impressions, Art has not matched it up with different screens, calibrated etc yet. He also had a lot of positives to say and things he is looking forward to observing once he has everything set up properly. Looking forward to the review with great interest!
wnielsenbb's Avatar wnielsenbb 02:33 PM 02-03-2011
Have you seen the Acer 5360? Of course you need an HTPC till the Optoma 3DXL comes out, but I really can't imagine any projector being flat out better than it.
LarryChanin's Avatar LarryChanin 02:43 PM 02-03-2011
Hi,

Thanks for your observations.

What size and type of screen did you use?

What did you think of the 2D performance?

Art Feierman reviewed the Sharp XV-Z15000 projector, upon which this is based, and found that the calibrated brightness in "best" mode was only 355 lumens with a high lamp mode setting. Switching to low lamp mode and the brightness drops by 48.5%.

So that leads me to ask specifically what you thought about the Z17000's brightness in 2D?

Thanks.

Larry

P.S. I notice that the Sharp XV-Z15000 projector is very limited in placement flexibility. The allowable throw distance variation, from minimum to maximum throw, is less than 24". Did you face the same situation with the Z17000?
danieledmunds's Avatar danieledmunds 04:59 PM 02-03-2011
As a projector owner of several years and a Z15000 owner, you will just have to trust me (I did only get 3 wrong on the color test on the 20K forum ) when I say that I think most people would be hard pushed to see the difference between perfect calibration and the 'natural' mode (861 lumens @ 6750). I tried the projectorreviews settings for movie mode 2 and couldn't see any difference and the extra 500 lumens was much needed.
LarryChanin's Avatar LarryChanin 05:22 PM 02-03-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by danieledmunds View Post

As a projector owner of several years and a Z15000 owner, you will just have to trust me (I did only get 3 wrong on the color test on the 20K forum ) when I say that I think most people would be hard pushed to see the difference between perfect calibration and the 'natural' mode (861 lumens @ 6750). I tried the projectorreviews settings for movie mode 2 and couldn't see any difference and the extra 500 lumens was much needed.

Hi Daniel,

Thanks for the response.

Do you usually watch in high lamp mode?

Larry
Deja Vu's Avatar Deja Vu 06:34 PM 02-03-2011
I am using a 720p 3D DLP for 3D and I find that in 3D mode all the artifacts magically disappear - RBE and SDE and one is left with an extremely solid artifact free (no ghosting or flicker) punchy image. If the Sharp adds more resolution (that you can actually appreciate) and more contrast (better black level, which is respectable with glasses on) then I'm interested. How does this projector stack up in 2D mode and does it handle RBE well, or do all the accolades only apply to 3D?
Tags: Sharp He Xvz17000 300 Inch 1080p Front Projector
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