JVC 2011 models & MSRP: RS40 50 60 & HD250. - Page 254 - AVS Forum
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post #7591 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 06:42 AM
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Is there any real difference between these 2 projectors other than who can sell them. The specs look the sme

Thanks
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post #7592 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 07:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krichter1 View Post

For what it's worth we played our first 3D movie last night when the PJ was not warmed up. During the initial menu of DispMe we saw horrible ghosting and then nothing within about 10 minutes into the movie. I purposely went back to that same menu at the end of the viewing and saw no ghosting whatsoever.

In general I have seen very little ghosting, but I did watch Legend of the Guardian last night and saw quite a bit of ghosting throughout the film. Part of this was certainly due to using my new brighter screen, but not all since both Open Season and Deep Sea which I watched right after had very little ghosting.

Going to watch that which shall not be named today Kevin

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post #7593 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 07:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arnies View Post

Is there any real difference between these 2 projectors other than who can sell them. The specs look the sme

Thanks

No differences other than the gold trim ring on the RSxx series.

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post #7594 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 08:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolplazma View Post

An interesting set of glasses you are wearing... definitely polarized.

DirecTV does not advertise compatibility with all 3DTVs, but they do publish a list of compatible display devices for the content they are broadcasting. Likewise they are not claiming 1.4a spec compliance, but they are broadcasting content that a small (and growing) market segment is requesting and they are doing so using firmware-only solution which does not require STB replacement.

As a consumer, where I live I have only 1 choice for broadcast 3D (for which my interest is 1. viewing live events, and 2. previewing various 3D content before purchasing the BD) and that is DirecTV. Based on the requirements to view this content (SbS 720p) I will need to find a compatible display device.

So, should JVC insist on snubbing "valid but optional 1.4a spec formats" then they willingly remove themselves from this market share (ie: consumers are forced to shop elsewhere). Assuming that dumbing down their existing SbS 1080p support to 720p is possible with a relatively simple firmware upgrade, the market strategy for denying this feature would be ludicrous as opposed to lucrative.

IMO JVC would be wise to have themselves added to the list of DirecTV compatible devices, rather than relegating themselves to boutique, niche markets which cannot be used with an expanding broadcast medium. Just my opinion, which is apparently worth... oh, a few $$$$.

I really hate to drag out this finger pointing discussion any longer, but here goes. I do understand that Directv lists the specific makes and models of 3DTVs they support and all of these are in fact from the new generation of 3DTVs (I'm counting the Mits DLP with their 3DTV adapter box in this category) although they are only a subset of the available 3DTVs (e.g., no Toshiba 3DTVs, no Vizio 3DTV and no JVC are currently listed). I also fully understand that since the Directv receivers are not and cannot be certified to comply with HDMI 1.4a spec. they are not obligated to conform to the requirements of that spec. My basic point is that since the vast majority of the new generation of 3DTVs support HDMI 1.4a, and comply with the requirements of that standard, ESPN and Directv could, and should, have provided more universal support for 3D if they would have limited the 3D signal formats used to those listed as mandatory for 3DTVs certified for HDMI 1.4a, since all of these new 3DTVs are supposed to support those mandatory formats. I do agree that if JVC can add support for optional 3D formats via a firmware update then they should do it. I have previously contacted Chris at JVC (USA) and requested that JVC work with Directv for improved support.

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post #7595 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twobeer View Post

I agree that JVC should really try to upgrade the firmware to support as many formats as possible!
But I assume most DirecTV customers have a modern AVR today (or would be willing to upgrade) that could scale the 720 to 1080 by just going trough the AVR for direcTV.

/T

Lol, I wish it was that easy, there are DTV customers with various AVRs, some even 3D ready (like me who upgrade to an SC-37) that get the same result, just showing 1080i as the only supported 3D format. Another EDID issue added into the chain by HDMI repeater in the AVR. I want to stick to basics first with the JVC and get the direct connection working first. Then we can go chase down the AVR issues

The problem with turning on the video conversion on these AVR's is that it usually has undesirable results in terms of video processing.
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post #7596 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

With my 50, I can not get this title to play ghost free - I agree that, as with all titles, having the projector on for 15 minutes or so reduces ghosting, and most title exhibit very little, but DM is not the greatest for me - the opening sequence in Egypt, with the scaffolding and bodies/faces against the solid blue sky, show some, as do many other shots throughout the movie.

The title screen, the big red "Despicable Me" graphic, is particularly bad...

We watched earlier in the week and did not have any ghosting issues, PJ had been on though for some time. I've seen terrible ghosting issues on DTV 3D broadcast...what is your playback source?
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post #7597 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 11:05 AM
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Still no communication about Jvc shipments, and all these format issues? Would someone like to convince me not to cancel my pre-order on Monday? That's the direction I am heading.
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post #7598 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Gotchaa View Post

Lol, I wish it was that easy, there are DTV customers with various AVRs, some even 3D ready (like me who upgrade to an SC-37) that get the same result, just showing 1080i as the only supported 3D format. Another EDID issue added into the chain by HDMI repeater in the AVR. I want to stick to basics first with the JVC and get the direct connection working first. Then we can go chase down the AVR issues

The problem with turning on the video conversion on these AVR's is that it usually has undesirable results in terms of video processing.

I thought the SC-37 had a pretty decent scaler.. its not like the 640x720 direcTV will be a Bluray-experience anyway :-P

Are you saying you cant get it to work by hooking up the DirecTV to your SC-37 and scale to 1080i and then set SBS in the JVC?

/T
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post #7599 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by mry110 View Post

Still no communication about Jvc shipments, and all these format issues? Would someone like to convince me not to cancel my pre-order on Monday? That's the direction I am heading.

Me too.
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post #7600 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twobeer View Post

I thought the SC-37 had a pretty decent scaler.. its not like the 640x720 direcTV will be a Bluray-experience anyway :-P

Are you saying you cant get it to work by hooking up the DirecTV to your SC-37 and scale to 1080i and then set SBS in the JVC?

/T

I believe this was suggested in post #7485 and answered here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...2#post19731432
-->
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gotchaa View Post

You can go into the DirecTV menu, disable all video resolutions except 1080i, then go into the JVC menu and set 3D mode to SBS, it works this way, but looks horrible


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post #7601 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

I have previously contacted Chris at JVC (USA) and requested that JVC work with Directv for improved support.

Thanks Ron. I'm sure many people hope this issue can be resolved in the near future, or at least a definitive statement from JVC.

It is truly a problem in my household, as I share all this information with my other half. Part of the initial sales pitch to her was that we could watch all the DirecTV 3D stuff on the big screen - especially the live events. Unfortunately (and honestly) now we only have a 50% projector commitment between us while this broadcast issue is unresolved.

Another question I asked earlier and I believe remains unanswered - Does anyone know if and how the RS40 can be firmware upgraded since there is no network or USB, and would it be done by the customer or an authorized service center (likely requiring shipping)?

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post #7602 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 02:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolplazma View Post

Thanks Ron. I'm sure many people hope this issue can be resolved in the near future, or at least a definitive statement from JVC.

It is truly a problem in my household, as I share all this information with my other half. Part of the initial sales pitch to her was that we could watch all the DirecTV 3D stuff on the big screen - especially the live events. Unfortunately (and honestly) now we only have a 50% projector commitment between us while this broadcast issue is unresolved.

Another question I asked earlier and I believe remains unanswered - Does anyone know if and how the RS40 can be firmware upgraded since there is no network or USB, and would it be done by the customer or an authorized service center (likely requiring shipping)?

There is a mini-USB connector on the RS40 that's behind a cover that you must first remove (that's why you won't see the USB connector in the photos). You just connect this to a PC (e.g., laptop) using a mini-USB to a full size USB cable. JVC has already posted the software for the PC and the first firmware update for the RS40.

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post #7603 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 02:59 PM
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I've updated and expanded the 3D projection screen discussion thread I started last week as a placeholder in the AVS 3D Displays forum. I suggest we move the screen related discussions there as much of what we have to say would also apply to all of the JVC 3D projectors, as well as Sony, Mits, etc. HERE is the link.

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post #7604 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 03:15 PM
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Is anybody else wondering why we have not gotten a review from Jason on the New Rs pj's. I thought he said he was going to do it a while back. Is this something to worry about.
I'm starting

Tony
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post #7605 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolplazma View Post

I believe this was suggested in post #7485 and answered here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...2#post19731432
-->

Yes, but I suspect the SBS is rather lousy HW for scaling.. probably the SC-37 scales much better, and 640x720 isnt that great to begin with :-)

/T
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post #7606 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by tjgar View Post

Is anybody else wondering why we have not gotten a review from Jason on the New Rs pj's. I thought he said he was going to do it a while back. Is this something to worry about.
I'm starting

Tony

I asked him last week if he had had spent enough time with the 40 and 50 to provide an opinion on how they compared and he stated that he hasn't had the time. Given that this is the holiday season I wouldn't fear anything is causing a delay in getting more functional feedback other than time.
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post #7607 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 05:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gotchaa View Post


Lol, I wish it was that easy, there are DTV customers with various AVRs, some even 3D ready (like me who upgrade to an SC-37) that get the same result, just showing 1080i as the only supported 3D format. Another EDID issue added into the chain by HDMI repeater in the AVR. I want to stick to basics first with the JVC and get the direct connection working first. Then we can go chase down the AVR issues

The problem with turning on the video conversion on these AVR's is that it usually has undesirable results in terms of video processing.

I am getting more confused as time goes on to much info for my old brain. Does anyone know for certain if the 3d compatibility issue something that could be circumvented by scaling between the Comcast box and the pj? I have a iscan vp 20 I was planning on taking offline and just a DVD player and Cable straight to the pj since those are the only sources I use it that room. But if it could provide a bridge it is worth considering.
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post #7608 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 07:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolplazma View Post

It is truly a problem in my household, as I share all this information with my other half. Part of the initial sales pitch to her was that we could watch all the DirecTV 3D stuff on the big screen - especially the live events. Unfortunately (and honestly) now we only have a 50% projector commitment between us while this broadcast issue is unresolved.

I haven't followed the whole discussion to check for workarounds, but all may not be lost even as things are now (although a person may have to jump through some hoops to get it to work).

I have an RS40 and had it hooked up through a receiver that is a couple of years old (pre 1.4). I tried playing the football game that is currently on ESPN3D and got an error that my display wasn't 3D. So I disconnected the HDMI cable coming out of my audio receiver and plugged it straight into an HR22. Then I watched a little bit of the football in 3D without even thinking about any resolution issues. The 3D seemed to be working fine, although I didn't test it for long. I then switched over to a Jessica Simpson 3D show I had recorded earlier and watched it for a few minutes (much of it looked like it was 2D without the glasses on and then the image separation would come in and go away sometimes). I switched back to the football game and was surprised to get an error that my display doesn't support 720p 3D (or maybe it said 720p SBS) and I got no picture.

So, I started again with the football game going through the receiver and got back to the error about my display not being 3D. When I moved the HDMI cable to go straight from the HR22 to the RS40 I again got to watch the game in 3D. I noticed that a message came up saying the signal was 1080i SBS and I believe this message was from the RS40. And the light on the HR22 for res said 1080i. Going to the Jessica Simpson concert and then back again resulted in not being able to watch the game, but instead getting the error about not supporting 720p. And pushing the res button on the HR22 did nothing (the light stayed on 1080i).

BTW: I assume I can watch the game this way with TOSLink for audio, but didn't try hooking up the audio for this as I don't really plan to watch the game. I do want to be ready for the national championship game though.

--Darin

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post #7609 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolplazma View Post

Thanks Ron. I'm sure many people hope this issue can be resolved in the near future, or at least a definitive statement from JVC.

It is truly a problem in my household, as I share all this information with my other half. Part of the initial sales pitch to her was that we could watch all the DirecTV 3D stuff on the big screen - especially the live events. Unfortunately (and honestly) now we only have a 50% projector commitment between us while this broadcast issue is unresolved.

Another question I asked earlier and I believe remains unanswered - Does anyone know if and how the RS40 can be firmware upgraded since there is no network or USB, and would it be done by the customer or an authorized service center (likely requiring shipping)?

Hi Guys,

Just a quick update. I have shared many of the recent comments & feedback from these threads with the factory. Pretty much everyone from the factory is on vacation until next week. Many of those same folks should be at CES starting next week and I hope to be able to follow up with them there.

Regarding the RS40/X3 firmware update process. It is the same as all the other current model JVC projectors. There is a small cover to the right of the HDMI connectors. That cover is secured with a small Philips screw. Remove the screw and the cover, and you will find a mini USB connection, which is used for the firmware update. If you go to www.jvc.com and click on support and then Software Updates, you will find the current firmware updates along with a document that explains the procedure further.

Chris
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post #7610 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 09:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toe View Post

In general I have seen very little ghosting, but I did watch Legend of the Guardian last night and saw quite a bit of ghosting throughout the film. Part of this was certainly due to using my new brighter screen, but not all since both Open Season and Deep Sea which I watched right after had very little ghosting.

Going to watch that which shall not be named today Kevin

Pictures dude!!!

(glad you likey!!)

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post #7611 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 09:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

I really hate to drag out this finger pointing discussion any longer, but here goes. I do understand that Directv lists the specific makes and models of 3DTVs they support and all of these are in fact from the new generation of 3DTVs (I'm counting the Mits DLP with their 3DTV adapter box in this category) although they are only a subset of the available 3DTVs (e.g., no Toshiba 3DTVs, no Vizio 3DTV and no JVC are currently listed). I also fully understand that since the Directv receivers are not and cannot be certified to comply with HDMI 1.4a spec. they are not obligated to conform to the requirements of that spec. My basic point is that since the vast majority of the new generation of 3DTVs support HDMI 1.4a, and comply with the requirements of that standard, ESPN and Directv could, and should, have provided more universal support for 3D if they would have limited the 3D signal formats used to those listed as mandatory for 3DTVs certified for HDMI 1.4a, since all of these new 3DTVs are supposed to support those mandatory formats. I do agree that if JVC can add support for optional 3D formats via a firmware update then they should do it. I have previously contacted Chris at JVC (USA) and requested that JVC work with Directv for improved support.

Your logic is sound Ron and for the most part I agree but I keep going back to the question of why is it that all the other major brands had the foresight to support the optional formats but NOT JVC??!

I was really bummed/pissed I couldn't watch the bowl game tonight in 3D!

I have to rely on Chuck to tell us how it looked on his Sony!

Kevin

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post #7612 of 8828 Old 01-01-2011, 09:38 PM
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Unfortunately it looks like I am going to have to hold off on moving forward with an RS40/50 until we have more information on what if anything will be done to support all of the 3D formats in use by DirecTv and Comcast, and what the time frame for a resolution will be. This is disappointing but I certainly do not want to get a 3D projector only to not be able to watch 3D in its native format.

I still cannot understand why these popular formats were not implemented, especially when other major manufacturers including Sony, Panasonic and Samsung do this just fine.

As a perfect case in point, tonight's hockey game in 3D was carried by Comcast on their special events channel in 720p SbS. I watched it just fine on my Samsung plasma. But from everything I've read here this would not have worked at 720p SbS if I had the JVC...
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post #7613 of 8828 Old 01-02-2011, 12:14 AM
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Originally Posted by krichter1 View Post

Pictures dude!!!

(glad you likey!!)

No camera Kevin or I would

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post #7614 of 8828 Old 01-02-2011, 01:13 AM
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Interesting.

Quote:
Originally Posted by darinp2 View Post
I haven't followed the whole discussion to check for workarounds, but all may not be lost even as things are now (although a person may have to jump through some hoops to get it to work).

I have an RS40 and had it hooked up through a receiver that is a couple of years old (pre 1.4). I tried playing the football game that is currently on ESPN3D and got an error that my display wasn't 3D. So I disconnected the HDMI cable coming out of my audio receiver and plugged it straight into an HR22. Then I watched a little bit of the football in 3D without even thinking about any resolution issues. The 3D seemed to be working fine, although I didn't test it for long. I then switched over to a Jessica Simpson 3D show I had recorded earlier and watched it for a few minutes (much of it looked like it was 2D without the glasses on and then the image separation would come in and go away sometimes). I switched back to the football game and was surprised to get an error that my display doesn't support 720p 3D (or maybe it said 720p SBS) and I got no picture.

So, I started again with the football game going through the receiver and got back to the error about my display not being 3D. When I moved the HDMI cable to go straight from the HR22 to the RS40 I again got to watch the game in 3D. I noticed that a message came up saying the signal was 1080i SBS and I believe this message was from the RS40. And the light on the HR22 for res said 1080i. Going to the Jessica Simpson concert and then back again resulted in not being able to watch the game, but instead getting the error about not supporting 720p. And pushing the res button on the HR22 did nothing (the light stayed on 1080i).

BTW: I assume I can watch the game this way with TOSLink for audio, but didn't try hooking up the audio for this as I don't really plan to watch the game. I do want to be ready for the national championship game though.

--Darin
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post #7615 of 8828 Old 01-02-2011, 10:35 AM
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I believe there is a two fold issue going on here as I've had a similar experience to Darin. Issue one that I believe JVC is aware of is an EDID issue on the JVC. The other is the supporting of the optional formats which Gary at JVC seemed to indicate in Sam's 40 thread, would not be added for supporting any additional formats than what was originally released ("highly unlikely they'll be able to add any additional 3D modes beyond those that are in the spec").

This is bad news for US customers indeed.

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post #7616 of 8828 Old 01-02-2011, 01:52 PM
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Okay, so I have my RS60U installed and the 2d picture on my behr silverscreen painted wall is absolutely phenomenal. But, the Pk-EM1 emitter only comes with an 8 foot cable - which is nowhere near long enough to reach the front of the room. Where is the optimal placement for the emitter so that I can watch some 3D?

Thanks!
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post #7617 of 8828 Old 01-02-2011, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Silver5thGen View Post

Okay, so I have my RS60U installed and the 2d picture on my behr silverscreen painted wall is absolutely phenomenal. But, the Pk-EM1 emitter only comes with an 8 foot cable - which is nowhere near long enough to reach the front of the room. Where is the optimal placement for the emitter so that I can watch some 3D?

Thanks!

You only need to place it on the projector and point the emitter towards the screen wall. It will bounce off and sync with your glasses without issue.
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post #7618 of 8828 Old 01-02-2011, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by adidino View Post

You only need to place it on the projector and point the emitter towards the screen wall. It will bounce off and sync with your glasses without issue.

Well, leave it to me to make something simple into difficult. Thank you very much!
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post #7619 of 8828 Old 01-02-2011, 04:29 PM
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Well, leave it to me to make something simple into difficult. Thank you very much!

Actually its not your fault at all. The included instructions do not state to do this. In fact conversely they tell you direct line of sight is needed!! I guess that some materials may not bounce well and they didn't want to get pulled up on it.
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post #7620 of 8828 Old 01-02-2011, 07:22 PM
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Actually its not your fault at all. The included instructions do not state to do this. In fact conversely they tell you direct line of sight is needed!! I guess that some materials may not bounce well and they didn't want to get pulled up on it.

Yes, you are right. That "line of sight" thing is what got me. So I've been searching high and low for an extension, etc... Ugh!
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Closed Thread Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP

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